I did not read through this entire post. As a matter of fact I stopped at the first sentence of the first post and feel that i have to make this correction as it applies to the entire thread.

'It's common knowledge that the body uses a self-defense mechanism when it is not given adequate carbs."

You are partially correct. Your body does use a self-defense mechanism, but it is when it is not given adequate CALORIES. Carbs has nothing to do w/ the self-defense mechanism.

Just my input.

fodus8 maybe you should look at The Scwarzbein Principle I or II before you make up your mind about low carb being bad or not. She does NOT advocate ketosis, but her plans are definitely carb restricted. She offers some very good medical reasons for why she recommends the amounts she does.

Well I must add my two cents here... I have tried my share of truly low carb Atkins and Protein Power... They, however, felt the same to me... After stalling on Protein Power I decided to go on a quest to find the eating plan that was right for me. I enjoy fruit, bread, and cereal.. I like convenience foods.. I like yogurt and milk...

So after some searching, I stumbled upon Sugar Busters and The Insulin Resistance Diet... Both diets advocate whole foods...and good complex carbs.. I don't count carbs, although I watch them.. I eat less fat than on the other plans and my meals are much more balanced.. I enjoy eating on these plans and could do this for life... Whenever I decide to treat myself with a dessert, I simply balance it and have it immediately after my meals...

With these plans I broke my 6 week stall and lost 5 pounds to date.. What's more important is that it doesn't feel like a diet.. My blood sugar levels stay much more stable and I don't focus on food as I did on the other plans... Strangely enough, I was always hungry on the other plans...waiting for my next meal or snack... Now I eat when I am hungry...

Basically Sugar Buster's recommends eliminating sugar...nothing more than 3 grams per serving... Also eliminating processed foods... Insulin Resistance advocates balancing carbs with proteins...15 carb grams to 7 protein... Also, no more than 30 grams of carbs in a 2 hour period.. With balancing, I can pretty much eat what I want... If having dessert, I save it for dinner... I eat sweet potatoes, whole wheat products, fruit, yogurt, milk, etc...

The best thing is I don't worry about ketosis...and when I do decide to treat myself...I don't gain 5 pounds in 1 day...!!!

TJ

This way of eating only SEEMS odd to people because it is so different.
However, before the advent of agriculture, we couldn't eat grains or sugar...so what did we eat for a very long time?
And fruit was only in certain seaons.

Applebum....VERY important with diarrhea that you get your water. And see a doc if it lasts more than a day or so.....or happens more than once or twice a week.

Can I just say that I think that Fredricks analogy was great! LOL

"if you could only choose one, would you opt to place your two-year old boy on an all bacon diet? Or, an all granulated sugar diet?"

I would opt for the bacon...

I'm know I'm a bit late for this discussion, but I couldn't help but notice Fodus8's diet in his/her's profile is Atkins. Now, (asking myself) why would someone trash the very diet they are on, especially since if you look a little closer, have lost weight on it. I'd say 4lbs.?

School me if I'm wrong.

Dear list,

It just occurred to me that many misunderstandings of the Atkins diet could be cleared up if it were referred to as the "normal-carb" instead of the "low-carb" diet. It is only a low-carb diet relative to the excessive carb diet that is the modern norm.

Here is a point no one has mentioned... even if we accept for a moment that the low-carb diet isn't the most healthy eating pattern, particularly in the induction phase, that still needs to be balanced against the health risks of being obese. In other words, which is worse for you... a relatively short period of time with extremely limited carb intake followed by a lifetime of "normal" carb intake on the maintenance level, or... being overweight for a lifetime and subjecting your body to diabetes, heart disease, stroke and all the other things that are proven to be results of being overweight?
For me, I will take the former. Bottomline is the health benefit to losing and maintaining an ideal weight greatly outweighs (excuse the pun) the minimal danger of low-carbing. Now you have my 2 cents... Mike

I am reading the atkins diet, as I am looking for a way to lose some extra weight without losing muscle. I think the only problem with the diet is that certain people see it as an excuse to exclusively eat meat and fatty foods. However the range of food available when you reach the weight maintenance level are very broad, including fruit, veg, meat dairy, some sweet treats etc.

I think this is a good diet for short term weight loss, but once you reach your goal weight the old adage of a balanced diet should come into effect. And certainly we should all eat less processed food, like flour, sugar, sweetners and other manufactured foods.

I found this page looking for info on Diets which are natural and season based.
Man as a hunter gatherer animal would not eat processed foods, and would only eat the foods availale in certin seasons. Eggs usually only available in spring, fruits available in summer, root veg only available in autumn, and mostly meat in winter. Can anyone direct me to a book or website that can expand upon this, as I only have limited knowlege of it.

Here are some links to hunter-gatherer information:

http://www.rawpaleodiet.org/
http://www.beyondveg.com/cat/paleodiet/index.shtml
http://www.healingcrow.com/dietsmain/dietsmain.html
http://www.theomnivore.com/index.html
http://www.naturalhub.com/opinion_r...uman_animal.htm
http://www.naturalhub.com/opinion_r..._human_diet.htm

Articles
Ray Audette article
http://www.sofdesign.com/neanderthin/observer.html
http://www.mercola.com/2003/oct/22/paleo_diet.htm
Balzer Article
http://www.earth360.com/diet_paleodiet_balzer.html
www.westonaprice.org/know_your_fats/oiling.html
http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/10/7-248323.html

A way of eating is not unhealthy simply because some fail to follow it properly.


I'm in the Ongoing Weight Loss phase of Atkins. I eat a broad range of foods including grains (flax seed), fruit (tomatoes, strawberries, blueberries), vegetables (pretty much anything that isn't starchy), unprocessed meats, and dairy (cheeses and yoghurt).


That's exactly what Atkins is. By the time you've reached your healthy weight, you are eating a very balanced diet.

The fact is this...
low carb vs low fat..a debate that shouldn't be
neither are the same
one is more extreme
it is sense to know that any restrictive diet is bound to cause failure, and health issues! It also nurtures an obsessive eating pattern and behavior which in end results in depression and poor self image

i wandered through this thread and noticed alot debate on whether ketosis is natural or if we are tricking our bodies into thinking we are starving and so on. i discussed the diet at length with my significant other, a biochemist-and made him read the Atkins book. This is how he explained it to me (paraphrased of course - i don't recall the technical/big words):

The brain needs sugar to operate. Carbs are broken down into sugar that are happily used by the brain to function (i think this is called the "Kreb Cycle" - but am not certain - i dropped chemistry in the 10th grade). However, sometimes humans don't have access to carbs to break down into sugar (particularily pre-agricultural hunter-gathering humans). So, to prevent untimely brain death and the end of our species, our body has a back up system. If there is no carbohydrate to create sugar, it 'switches' to ketosis and uses fat/protein to create ketones, which the brain can use just like sugar. since all of our calories come from either carbs/protein/fat, such a back up system allows us to stay alive regardless of where the calories are coming from. when carbs become available, it uses them.

when you are eating low carb, your body isn't in starvation mode (which is caused by not enough food) it is in ketosis (caused by not enough carbohydrate).

This issue is also addressed in another thread in this forum: 'burning fat through exercise or ketosis. 'Defence mechanism' is such an emotionally loaded term. If everyone ate low carb, glucose metabolism would probably be seen as a 'defense mechanism'. I for one do see it as a defense mechanism now, because I have realized that because of glycation, burning carbs for energy, although very efficient, is not really very healthy. It might help you to win sprinting races (or get away from marauding sabre tooth tigers) but it ages your body quicker than fat metabolism will - whether or not you use ketones or FFA's for energy. And although some people obviously adjust to using FFA's rather than ketones (in tissue that can use either - just about anything except the brain) FFA's in the mitochondria merely don't waste as much energy. Why do people persist in suggesting that ketones are unhealthy. I'd rather be producing ketones (and using , or excreting them) than glycating glucose and protein molecules. That's just the metabolic effect. The immune suppressing and blood sugar complications of carbohydrate metabolism are insignifigant aren't they? duh!. And if you want to lose weight ketosis is just about the best metabolic trick nature has to offer. Glucagon (dietary fat/catabolic) or insulin(glucose from dietary carbohydrate/anabolic). Take your pick. It's a no brainer.
'Defense mechanism' You can't be serious. We might as well call road safety a defense mechanism - rather than just plain old common sense.