Active Low-Carber Forums
Atkins diet and low carb discussion provided free for information only, not as medical advice.
Home Plans Tips Recipes Tools Stories Studies Products
Active Low-Carber Forums
A sugar-free zone


Welcome to the Active Low-Carber Forums.
Support for Atkins diet, Protein Power, Neanderthin (Paleo Diet), CAD/CALP, Dr. Bernstein Diabetes Solution and any other healthy low-carb diet or plan, all are welcome in our lowcarb community. Forget starvation and fad diets -- join the healthy eating crowd! You may register by clicking here, it's free!

Go Back   Active Low-Carber Forums > Main Low-Carb Diets Forums & Support > Daily Low-Carb Support > General Low-Carb
User Name
Password
FAQ Members Calendar Mark Forums Read Search Gallery My P.L.A.N. Survey


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 10:58
LiterateGr's Avatar
LiterateGr LiterateGr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 163
 
Plan: Atkins/General LC
Stats: 240.0/167.2/155 Female 5 '9"
BF:36/29.5/25
Progress: 86%
Default National Weight Control Registry

My paperwork arrived yesterday.

I've filled it out, included my PCP's contact info, printed photos, and included something like 20 printed pages of weight-logs.

Today, I'm not overweight. My weight is fluctuating, up and down, in a 5-lb range around the goal I decided to settle on. (Some of this fluctuation is because I now have a very physically demanding warehouse job, where I'm on my feet up to 12 hours/day. Swollen feet/tired muscles/fat being replaced with muscle = weight gain, on the scale.)

But I'm stable enough that I finally ordered those custom-fit jeans I'd promised myself, back when.

So excited! I'm "official"! (One more person skewing the data to what actually works!)
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 11:05
thud123's Avatar
thud123 thud123 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 7,038
 
Plan: DDF (2021 Q4)
Stats: 168/92/82 Male 182cm
BF:
Progress: 88%
Default

Congrats! Never heard of " National Weight Control Registry" link or brief description?
Reply With Quote
  #3   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 11:39
Grav Grav is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,390
 
Plan: Banting
Stats: 302/187/187 Male 175cm
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: New Zealand
Default

The NWCR is a registry of people who have successfully lost a minimum of 30lb and kept it off for at least one year. The data has been used in a number of published studies, but of course it's all observational so the findings need to be put in perspective. And it's opt-in, so it's subject to the same sort of bias as any sort of phone-in poll.

I looked at signing up for it a while back, but decided against it for reasons I can no longer remember. Might look at it again sometime.
Reply With Quote
  #4   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 13:42
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Posts: 4,974
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
Default

I participated in the registry for a few years over a decade ago. Eventually I got disgusted by it. The questionnaire was clearly not designed for people eating low carb and because of the design of the study the low carb data just gets lost in all the low fat follow the guidelines folks. Consequently the results just mirror the conventional “wisdom”. I believe Janet (Jey100) has participated and tried to point out the problems with the study to the people conducting it with no positive changes ever made as far as I know.
Reply With Quote
  #5   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 13:48
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,002
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

I've been registered with them since 2012, Jean, Barbara and others much longer. Ken joined about five years ago. Think we have all become fed-up trying to change the questionnaire.

You will find it is impossible to give accurate answers for a low carb WOE, the multiple choices are biased against it. So I valiantly write a separate long email, explaining why my "answers" will seem wrong, how they could change it to account for the many LC successes, to no avail. I attach recent LC studies, photos, etc. This was a typical Dr. Thomas response to me in 2017:

Quote:
Hello Janet,

Thanks for your message. I appreciate the time you took, both to complete the survey and to send an email with clarifying information. In the past, the surveys were sent by mail, and I you can believe it, they were even longer. At that time, we included a lengthy assessment of dietary intake. As alternatives to a low-fat diet became more popular in the general public, we published a paper showing some of the same changes in the NWCR (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16741274). When the NWCR transitioned to an online format, we could no longer continue to administer the lengthy dietary assessment (which required special paper forms). We continue to include the online questions that you mentioned (which originated back in the low-fat days) as a way of continuing to track change over time. However, we’re unlikely to publish data collected from this somewhat crude and outdated measure. Rather, if/when we get around to publishing another update on diet, we will likely invite participants to complete an additional optional online questionnaire to report in greater detail on their dietary habits. That would certainly capture the approach that you described using to great success.

Sincerely,

J. Graham Thomas, PhD
Associate Professor (Research)



The wheels of academic research grind slowly...but wishing you the best of luck to have them finally change the form!!
Reply With Quote
  #6   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 16:10
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Posts: 4,974
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
Default

I quit before they went digital and the long food surveys designed for the low fat is healthy crowd were nearly impossible for me to fill out and then when I would get updates on the results it was all the same old same old low fat low calorie exercise mantra. I was statistically non-existent, I found it all a pointless waste of time.
Reply With Quote
  #7   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 18:49
thud123's Avatar
thud123 thud123 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 7,038
 
Plan: DDF (2021 Q4)
Stats: 168/92/82 Male 182cm
BF:
Progress: 88%
Default

Thanks for all the feedback on the National Weight Control Registry
Reply With Quote
  #8   ^
Old Wed, Oct-07-20, 19:09
DaisyDawn's Avatar
DaisyDawn DaisyDawn is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 332
 
Plan: Atkins 40
Stats: 147.6/146.2/128 Female 66
BF:
Progress: 7%
Default

Great milestone I'm registered but changed my email address a while back and never contacted them with the update. I should probably get on that
Reply With Quote
  #9   ^
Old Thu, Oct-22-20, 07:37
LiterateGr's Avatar
LiterateGr LiterateGr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 163
 
Plan: Atkins/General LC
Stats: 240.0/167.2/155 Female 5 '9"
BF:36/29.5/25
Progress: 86%
Default

Just filled out the online survey. Yeah, they definitely wanted me to talk about how I cut fat....

There was an "always" option for things like trimming fat from meat, but no "never" option -- just "rarely".

I filled things out as truthfully as I could. (Things like "how many times a day, including snacks, do you eat" was hard. Um, 0-30? Depends on how hungry I am?) (Physically demanding job means some days, I feel like I can't stop eating. I stay on-plan, and don't sweat it. Other days, I'm not hungry at all, so have my morning coffee, and just drink a lot all day. Granted, most days fall somwhere between those extrems.)

There was also an optional "free-answer" section at the end, where you could just type.

So told my story: Nov 1 2018 diabetes diagnosis. Asked doc to let me try diet first. Cut out all sugar, grain, starch. 3 months later, normal A1C. (5.2... currently 5.1). 6 months later normal liver & lipid panels. Make sure I get plenty of fat, weigh daily, drink lots of water, and the weight continues to stay off.

Also described the fact that when folks are offering treats, if I tell them, "No thanks, I can't", they will -- 100% of the time -- try to talk me into having some anyway, but if I say, "No thanks, I can't -- I'm diabetic" they accept it and don't push. (I'm NOT diabetic anymore, but that's a whole 'nuther conversation.)

Honestly, if they don't accept my data because it doesn't fit what they're expecting to find... well, I can live with it. Some minds are hard to change.

But on a personal level, it means I did it... I got to mainenace and stayed here.
Reply With Quote
  #10   ^
Old Thu, Oct-22-20, 07:55
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,002
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

Congratulations for getting to maintenance ..and you will continue to stay there! I was not trying discourage anyone from joining...the more we write to them about low carb the better, just a warning about those question.
About two years ago? they sent a supplement survey for how you handle the holidays...it was newer so had some responses that acknowledged not everyone cut the fat.
Reply With Quote
  #11   ^
Old Thu, Oct-22-20, 09:21
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,908
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
Default

What actually works--I wouldn't say that what low fat dieters report as working for them doesn't actually work. But I do think the data's skewed. Tell everybody in the world to do things a certain way--and then send out a call for people with weight loss success to say what they did. You've got an extremely large sample from which those your advice actually worked for can self-select themselves.

So I'm for low carbers registering, from a propaganda standpoint.
Reply With Quote
  #12   ^
Old Sun, Oct-25-20, 06:32
LiterateGr's Avatar
LiterateGr LiterateGr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 163
 
Plan: Atkins/General LC
Stats: 240.0/167.2/155 Female 5 '9"
BF:36/29.5/25
Progress: 86%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser
What actually works


I am assuming this is a quote from me.

I can't find it in my posts on this thread, but I'm still 100% convinced you're quoting me. (This shows how much that phrase is part of my mindset, when it comes to reaching goals in terms of fat-loss and improved health.)

When I do get into a conversation with someone about how I eat and why, the phrase, "I eat like a QUEEN." is always used.

I mean, one week recently, I brought cheesecake to work as my lunch. (Not saying every day that week, but at least once I JUST had cheesecake for lunch.)

My favorite "grab a quick meal" is wings. (Which usually gets the folks trying to starve themselves salivating.) (I like wings -- lots of places you can get them, and they're almost always "safe" in terms of added carbs... and always satisfying.)

I never feel "deprived" in my food, which is one reason it's not hard to stay on-plan. Heck, I even recently found a readily available LC ice cream. (Used to make my own, but a.) my machine broke, and b.) I couldn't make caramel swirl.) (Ingredient list is short, not franken-food... I can feel good about indulging once in a while.) (Brand is "Rebel", before anyone asks. Found it in Publix.)

I eat when I'm hungry. I don't eat when I'm not. If I have a craving, I find a way to fill it. (Sometimes, this means dissecting the craving... like if I'm forced to smell doughnuts for an hour, and start to want them, what is it I need? Certainly not the doughnut... but maybe a square of 90% dark chocolate will make that noise shut up. It'll taste better, than actual doughnuts, anyway.)

What I tend to see on low-fat is people walking around hungry all the time... sometimes feeling stuffed (from the volume in their stomach, but never quite satisfied. When you're always hungry, eventually, you'll eat. (They always seem to.)

When I run into folks discussing weight, I'm supportive. I give encouragement, and don't bring up how I eat unless asked. If they ask, though... I'll tell.
Reply With Quote
  #13   ^
Old Sun, Oct-25-20, 09:07
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,908
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
Default

LiterateGr--I don't think I disagree with you in any material way. At the same time--because of self-selection I do think anything we do along the lines of the weight loss registry is along the lines of representing the cause rather than something somebody should see as proof of efficacy. People will, and have, for low fat, so I do think it's good to get in there just to counter that. We don't need to meet a standard of evidence any better than that of the evidence we're refuting, after all. We do of course, in other places.

I don't discount anecdote--I think any honest anecdote is useful, "if it worked for me, it may work for you" is true even if "if it worked for me, it will work for you" may or may not be in all cases.

Low fat actually did work for me, for the weeks or months I was willing/able to follow it. Low carb is something that I've been able to stick with pretty constantly for well over a decade. So due to probability of compliance, for me personally low carb/ketogenic doesn't really need to be better for me than low fat, it just has to be better than the SAD diet I always defaulted to when low fat was what I did when I was trying to be good.
Reply With Quote
  #14   ^
Old Mon, Jul-19-21, 13:00
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,002
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

A 2021 update. Today I filled out their survey shortly after having received it. Nothing has changed with the survey, same 'ole questions geared to a low fat diet and lots of exercise. Checking my emails, found I had sent the lead researcher, Dr. Thomas, an update only last December. That email summarized my weight regain in 2020 and losing back down to a healthy BMI of 169.

Now at 156, I send another update ... still low carb, but increased protein, added more vegetables and fermented dairy. He answered right away, and wanted to know more about my physical activity and the P:E diet. He must have been disappointed to learn of my very limited exercise until this summer...this past year was only walking around the neighborhood. But filling in the "free form" section at the end...you can write anything you believe important for him to know about your weight loss journey... is worth it. You are invited to email him directly as well..I do both. He obviously reads them. The survey is unlikely to change as he explained in 2017, but maybe more special surveys or a new researcher will look back on all our comments make some adjustments.
Reply With Quote
  #15   ^
Old Tue, Jul-20-21, 04:14
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Posts: 4,974
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
Default

I applaud your perseverance Janet. I just gave up when I realized that not only was the research design severely flawed but that nothing was going to be done to change it and that my low carb success story, which did not support their flawed conclusion derived from their flawed design and no doubt flawed initial assumptions, would simply get swallowed up and therefore discounted. Perhaps your continued persistence will make some small dent in point of view of the researcher.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:41.


Copyright © 2000-2021 Active Low-Carber Forums @ forum.lowcarber.org
Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.