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  #1   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 00:55
Demi's Avatar
Demi Demi is offline
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Plan: LCHF/IF
Stats: 217/000/160 Female 5'10"
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Location: UK
Default Obesity should be classed as a disease to remove the stigma it is 'self-inflicted'

Quote:
From The Telegraph
London, UK
17 July, 2019

Obesity should be classed as a disease to remove the stigma it is 'self-inflicted' medics say

Obesity should be classed as a disease to remove the stigma that it is "self-inflicted" and encourage those with weight problems to get help, medics have said.

Writing in the BMJ, they said that up to 70 per cent of weight variability was inherited, with 200 genes linked to it.

And they said the rise in obesity was due to “an altered environment” which meant cheap food was readily available.

Latest figures show that 29 per cent of adults in England are obese.

John Wilding, professor of medicine at the institute of ageing and chronic disease at the University of Liverpool, and Vicki Mooney, executive director of the European Coalition for People living with Obesity, said: “Body weight, fat distribution, and risk of complications are strongly influenced by biology - it is not an individual's fault if they develop obesity."

“The recent rapid increase in obesity is not due to genetics but to an altered environment (food availability and cost, physical environment, and social factors).

“Strong links exist with social deprivation; some environments are more obesogenic than others, but again we should not blame individuals. Despite these facts, the prevalent view is that obesity is self inflicted and that it is entirely the individual’s responsibility to do something about it.

The pair pointed out that the World Health Organisation has classed obesity as a disease since 1936.

Prof Wilding is president elect of the World Obesity Federation, while Ms Mooney runs Ireland’s only plus size modelling agency.

"The Oxford Dictionary defines disease as 'a disorder of structure or function ... especially one that produces specific symptoms ... and is not simply a direct result of physical injury” their comment piece says.

"Obesity, in which excess body fat has accumulated to such an extent that health may be adversely affected, meets that definition.

They argued that recognising obesity as a chronic disease rather than a lifestyle choice "should help reduce the stigma and discrimination experienced by many people with obesity" and encourage more people to seek NHS treatment.

In contrast, Dr Richard Pile, a GP from St Albans, said the Oxford Dictionary definition of disease "is so vague that we can classify almost anything as a disease".

Also writing in the BMJ, he said such attitudes would encourage “fatalism” and stop people being motivated to lose weight.

"It suggests health professionals will slap themselves on the forehead in a eureka moment, shouting: 'This changes everything.'

"Labelling obesity as a disease risks reducing autonomy, disempowering and robbing people of the intrinsic motivation that is such an important enabler of change.

"It encourages fatalism, promoting the fallacy that genetics are destiny,” he added.

Dr Pile said making obesity a disease may not benefit patients, "but it will benefit healthcare providers and the pharmaceutical industry".

The debate follows calls from the Royal College of Physicians (RCP) in January for the Government and the NHS to recognise obesity as a disease.

The RCP said it wanted to see obesity recognised as an ongoing chronic disease to allow the creation of formal healthcare policies to improve care both in doctors' surgeries and hospitals.



https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...self-inflicted/
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  #2   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 06:51
Dodger's Avatar
Dodger Dodger is offline
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Plan: Paleoish
Stats: 225/170/175 Male 71.5 inches
BF:18%
Progress: 110%
Location: Longmont, Colorado
Default

I tend to agree with Dr. Pile on this. The obesity problem is more of a social problem in that social pressure has pushed people into eating foods that lead to obesity. Labeling obesity as a disease will not fix the carb addiction problem.
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  #3   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 07:26
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
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Progress: 32%
Location: Massachusetts
Default

Genetics are not the driver we think it is. Environment plays a FAR bigger role. In cattle and horse breeding, the genes are credited with AT MOST a factor of .35 and that is HIGH. This means that .65 is attributed to ENVIRONMENT.

We turn on and off our genes by what we eat!!!

Again, this article is a failure to point the finger at the poor quality foods that abound and have become the staples of the diet.

WHen I read DANDR the first time. It was a revelation on many levels. For the first time I could stop blaming myself ( and failure just drove me to eat more, you all get it) and found peace with my " lack of control". It wasn't my lack of effort, it was I was told the wrong way to eat.

DANDR is a corrective diet for the human body that has been corrupted by the poor Western diet. Forntuately LC is also becoming the diet for a normal healthy life BEFORE metabolic disease ramp up.

Providers are still behind the curve and always will be.
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  #4   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 07:31
Sniggle Sniggle is offline
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Plan: General Low Carb
Stats: 208.6/189.8/190 Male 73.5
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Progress: 101%
Location: West Virginia
Default

I got fat because I, with no assistance from anyone or any outside forces, shoved way too much food in my mouth, and often 'carb' foods like chips, french fries, ice cream and beer.

You can not get fat unless you consume more calories than your body needs, over an extended period.

It is not a disease (just as I think that calling drug addiction a 'disease' is wrong...personal opinion). It is self-inflicted, although that is obviously a gross oversimplification of why folks become overweight/ obese.

( I am extremely cynical of the push to classify everything a disease, because it is usually pushed by folks who will benefit from that classification (and I am not talking about those folks suffering from a given condition))
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  #5   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 08:04
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
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Plan: Ketogenic (LCHFKD)
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
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Location: Herndon, VA
Default

I agree that obesity is not a disease. Until the truth is confronted, these distortions will continue. Given the rapid rise of obesity over the past 50 years, it would be logical to examine what has changed to isolate the root cause. Obesity is a result of changed behaviors and the currently available nutritional environment. The good news is that we are able to regain control over these conditions once the root cause is understood.
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  #6   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 08:40
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is online now
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Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
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Location: Ontario
Default

I tried taking up smoking. Didn't take--probably because asthma etc. made it too immediately unpleasant to become habit forming. Probably would have wound up addicted otherwise. I was old enough to know better--but young enough to lack the wisdom to avoid getting into trouble. Just got lucky.

I sort of think we have a lot of unnecessary baggage when it comes to "responsibility." "Who's responsible?" is often a question of accusation, synonymous with "who's to blame?" I'm certain that there are people on this board who ate/behaved more responsibly when they were younger than I did when it comes to food, but who had worse consequences. We don't live in a fair world, we all respond to the environment differently. Self control matters, some of us are given a harder task than others. And some of us take decades to figure out how to best control ourselves. If somebody's dog is misbehaving, do we put it down to a lack of discipline--or to poor discipline? Because part of discipline is figuring out what works. It's not insisting that the dog not jump up on the table and eat your dinner--it's figuring out how to teach the dog not to do that. Discipline isn't a moral virtue, it's a skill.

Is it a disease? I think we should have all the compassion that we'd afford somebody who did have a disease, if they're suffering.
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  #7   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 08:50
Bonnie OFS Bonnie OFS is offline
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Plan: Dr. Bernstein
Stats: 188/165/135 Female 5 ft 4 inches
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sniggle
I got fat because I, with no assistance from anyone or any outside forces, shoved way too much food in my mouth, and often 'carb' foods like chips, french fries, ice cream and beer.


Except for the beer, that's my story. I started overeating when I quit smoking - I'm still not sure which is worse!

I would call obesity a symptom, not a disease in itself. After years in OA I finally figured out that it's not particular foods I'm addicted to, but certain behaviors. One of those behaviors is denial, which is why even on low carb I couldn't lose weight or control my diabetes - I overate protein. Now that I'm finally limiting my protein as well as the carbs, I'm doing a lot better. But it is hard - I'm hungry. Not starving tho, so it's uncomfortable rather than painful. I'm hoping that at some point I'll get used to it & won't be hungry so much of the time. (And yes - I'm getting plenty of wonderful fats! )
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  #8   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 09:18
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
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Location: Massachusetts
Default

Quote:
The good news is that we are able to regain control over these conditions once the root cause is understood.


Well doesnt that apply to a "disease" .

Im not fat because I couldnt control my eating, Im fat because the sugars and carbs drove me to eat more. When I abstain from carbs/sugars the cravings STOP. WHile Im not allergic to carbs, they DO have far more addictive impact than cocaine per a study. Helped me feel it wasnt MY fault that I ate too much. Im a carbaholic. It was that my body's systems were malfuctioning. THAT is "disease".

I refuse to be shamed because my body is malfunctioning.

Obesity needs to be moved from an emotional, lack of self control condition to a biological malfunction. Otherwise we will NEVER get to a cure!!!

Is cancer a disease????? Lots of new research is pointing out that it is a metabolic disease, and food choices influence the growth or decline of some types of cancer. Yet how much money is poured into cancer research with some progress for some types but overall very little progress via chemo and radiation.

OBesity is a metabolic disease; cancer appears to be a metabolic disease.
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  #9   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 10:17
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DancinGurl DancinGurl is offline
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Plan: Atkins/KETO/IF
Stats: 370/163/155 Female 65
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Location: Central Texas
Default

“How much obesity has to be created in a single decade for people to realize that diet has to be responsible for it?”
Robert Atkins

Dr. Atkins did not believe in blaming people for being fat. He looked for solutions for his patients. He recognized that some of us cannot process carbs without gaining weight and having disordered metabolisms and blood sugar swings as a result. He recognized the role of insulin long before Dr. Fung.

I think compassion is called for, towards ourselves and others, whether obesity is categorized as a disease or not.
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  #10   ^
Old Thu, Jul-18-19, 18:24
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cotonpal cotonpal is online now
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Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/128/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 106%
Location: Vermont
Default

Since there are no hard and fast criteria as to what constitutes a disease and what doesn't classifying something as a disease is often tied to political and financial considerations rather than to questions related to cause. Whether or not to classify obesity as a disease is more politics than science.
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  #11   ^
Old Fri, Jul-19-19, 03:25
Grav Grav is offline
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Plan: Banting
Stats: 302/187/187 Male 175cm
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Progress: 100%
Location: New Zealand
Default

What Jean said. In my view, discussing how to "classify" obesity is like discussing how to re-arrange the deck chairs on the Titanic.

To make a real difference, we need people to be applying solutions, not semantics.
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  #12   ^
Old Fri, Jul-19-19, 05:44
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WereBear WereBear is offline
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Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/136/150 Female 67
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Progress: 120%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie OFS
I would call obesity a symptom, not a disease in itself.


I agree, and high carb is not the only path to this symptom: stress and hormone imbalances make things worse, too. It can come from water retention or injury or any number of reasons.

But it's not okay. Fat Acceptance is a good concept, but their attitude that "it doesn't affect my health" is wrong, and like vegans, anyone who loses weight gets thrown out of the movement.
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  #13   ^
Old Fri, Jul-19-19, 07:33
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Posts: 3,012
 
Plan: Ketogenic (LCHFKD)
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
Since there are no hard and fast criteria as to what constitutes a disease and what doesn't classifying something as a disease is often tied to political and financial considerations rather than to questions related to cause. Whether or not to classify obesity as a disease is more politics than science.

My thoughts as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonnie OFS
I would call obesity a symptom, not a disease in itself.

Yes, this is exactly how I describe it. I wouldn't compare obesity with cancer due to obesity being a symptom and an indicator of an unhealthy lifestyle. While cancer can be a metabolic disease, it is very complex where it can also be a disease of exposure to certain carcinogenic chemicals, sun, etc. with the presence of varying genetic sensitivities.

No fat shaming here. Obesity is also not simply a condition of too many calories; rather, it's more of an indicator of the types of calories one is eating and how one responds to those types.
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  #14   ^
Old Fri, Jul-19-19, 09:46
CityGirl8 CityGirl8 is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 757
 
Plan: Protein Power, IF
Stats: 238/204/145 Female 5'8"
BF:53.75%/46.6%/25%
Progress: 37%
Location: PNW
Default

Quote:
The good news is that we are able to regain control over these conditions once the root cause is understood.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
Well doesnt that apply to a "disease" .
I think it does. Consider all those cases of T2 diabetes that are entirely in remission from cutting back carbs. People have regained control once the root cause was understood.

I think obesity is definitely a medical condition. I don't like the idea of classifying obesity as a disease, because, from my understanding of what I have read, it is a symptom, not the disease itself. The issue is what it is a symptom of: It's been considered a symptom of gluttony and laziness, when it's really a symptom of excess carbohydrates, diabetes, metabolic disorder, and not eating the way evolution intended us to eat. There is also a genetic component to it. But carrying one or copies of the FTO gene or a variation in the Panx1 gene or other variations we don't know about yet will significantly increase your tendency towards obesity. But obesity is still a symptom of those genetic variations.

If you engage in a lot of high risk sports and you injure yourself a lot, those injuries are not a disease. Those injuries are medical conditions that need to be treated (broken bones, etc.). We have a very clear understanding of the cause and effect: If you go skateboarding and play rugby every day, you're going to get hurt. But far too many people (including the medical community) don't have a clear understanding of the cause and effect of the food we eat and the medical conditions that might result.
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