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  #16   ^
Old Sat, Apr-20-19, 15:36
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
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Plan: Ketogenic (LCHFKD)
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
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Location: Herndon, VA
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Just came back from shopping at our local Wegmans. The cheese department hadn't heard of A2 cheese, that doesn't mean they don't carry it, as they have a lot of imported cheese. Will have to look harder when I have more time.
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  #17   ^
Old Sat, Apr-20-19, 22:38
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
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Location: Massachusetts
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As for pricing, dairy products from the super producer dairy breed Holsteins will be cheaper than the more modest producers like Geurnseys an Jerseys.
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  #18   ^
Old Mon, Apr-22-19, 08:08
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Plan: Keto (Atkins Induction)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
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Progress: 100%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRB5111
Just came back from shopping at our local Wegmans. The cheese department hadn't heard of A2 cheese, that doesn't mean they don't carry it, as they have a lot of imported cheese. Will have to look harder when I have more time.

If it's imported from Europe or England, it's almost surely A2 cheese.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
As for pricing, dairy products from the super producer dairy breed Holsteins will be cheaper than the more modest producers like Geurnseys an Jerseys.


True, but is the inflammation in your body for those who have an intolerance to the mutated amino acid in A1 milk worth a couple of extra bucks? Inflammation is at the root of many diseases, and our health is priceless.

It's a matter of prioritizing for all but the destitute. Is poor health worth that premium Cable TV channel? That magazine subscription? That perfume? That expensive car? Think about it. A few dollars per week.

I know people who eat/drink dairy and then take lactaid products. Most of them would not need the digestive enzyme if they consumed A2 dairy.

To me, good quality food is important. If I have to save somewhere else to put something non-inflammatory in my body, that's what I will do. Without your health, nothing else matters.

Bob
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  #19   ^
Old Mon, Apr-22-19, 13:25
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
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Ummmm, I think I was trying to point out that A2 milk products are justifiably more expensive......the producers are NOT trying to rip off the consumers.

YES, OUR HEALTH IS PRICELESS, agree 110%.

I prefer a pretty Jersey over a Holstein anyday.
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  #20   ^
Old Mon, Apr-22-19, 13:35
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Meme#1 Meme#1 is offline
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Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/188/160 Female 5'4"
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Just use cream and eat cheese and you won't have that problem.
In France, no adults drink milk except for babies.
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  #21   ^
Old Mon, Apr-22-19, 18:55
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Plan: Keto (Atkins Induction)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
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I don't drink milk, but I do eat cheese, butter and put cream in my coffee and tea.

But since A1 dairy gives my wife black eyes, we use imported cheese and butter.

Bob
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  #22   ^
Old Sat, Apr-27-19, 14:31
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amergin amergin is offline
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Plan: Low carb, suff. protein
Stats: 115/103/95 Male 191cm
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Bob, You could try Goat's milk and sheep cheese. In Ireland Goat milk is available in many large chains though about twice the price of cow milk.
Sheep cheese is available in many West and South Asian food stores.

Most cheeses are high in proteins so will have A1 if it's in the source milk used.

Also I'd not be complacent about UK, Aussie or Irish milk being A2. It's likely to be predominantly A1 unless stated otherwise.
Also, being of a suspicious nature, I'd suspect there's a strong possibility of some A2 labelled milk being contaminated with A1 given the large price premium.
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  #23   ^
Old Sun, Apr-28-19, 09:11
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Plan: Keto (Atkins Induction)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
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Location: Florida
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Sheep cheese I like and I don't drink milk. Not because it upsets me, it's just that I mostly drink water.

UK, Aussie, Irish, and European cheese don't give my wife black eyes. US cheese, even if organic does. That's enough proof for me.

https://www.drlaurendeville.com/articles/dairy-europe/

First, let’s talk about proteins in general: a protein is a structure comprised of a unique sequence of individual amino acids (of which there are twenty). Beta casein is a chain of 229 amino acids. The difference between the cows in the United States and the cows in Europe hinges on amino acid number 67.

In European cows (and in the cows of antiquity), as well as in all other mammals producing milk (including goats and sheep), amino acid number 67 is a proline.

But due to a genetic mutation in American cows, amino acid number 67 is a histidine.

Why this is important: amino acid 67 anchors a peptide (protein fragment) called beta-casomorphin 7 (BCM-7). BCM-7 is associated with dairy intolerance. It also stimulates opiate receptors, and has been associated with autoimmunity.

Upon digestion, BCM-7 is either released into the bloodstream… or not. It depends upon the amino acid that anchors it. The proline found in European cows (Jerseys, Asian and African cows—also called A2 cows) holds BCM-7 tightly, while the histidine found in American cows (Holstein cows—also called A1 cows) does not. This study found that BCM-7 released in hydrolyzed (pre-digested) milk from A1 cows is four times higher than that from A2 cows.

When doing research many months ago, I found something at PubMed that had similar findings, but PubMed is so huge, I should have bookmarked it because it would take too long to find it again.

Bob
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  #24   ^
Old Sun, Apr-28-19, 12:12
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WereBear WereBear is offline
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Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/140/150 Female 67
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This fits right in with my quality-not-quantity plans for cheese. Good thing to try.
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  #25   ^
Old Sun, Apr-28-19, 14:00
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverEm
Bob, yes. I look for Guernsey milk and cheese. 100% grass-fed and organic.

Em, what brand names would I be looking for?
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  #26   ^
Old Sun, Apr-28-19, 14:15
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meme#1
Just use cream and eat cheese and you won't have that problem.
In France, no adults drink milk except for babies.


When I read Anne _Wigmore,s autobiography, her grandmother, in 1920's Lithuania ,as a "healer" did not recommend milk for the adults. That her grandmother was in great health with all her teeth was a tell, and when Anne immigrated to the US, her teeth started to rot asap. This book made me question the SAD, inmore ways than DANDR. I kept looking for information, and it comes by bits.

We eat cheese etc, but balance the calcium with magnesium, potassium and vit K2. And, we are increasing the whey portions while decreasing the Greek style yogurts.

Still need to visit the local dairy farm to see if licence for raw milk has been issued. If not, will look for a dairy goat.
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  #27   ^
Old Mon, Apr-29-19, 12:19
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Plan: Keto (Atkins Induction)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
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I don't drink milk, but do eat cheese. Several times per week.

I've read that the best source of Branched Chain Amino Acids are milk products. Red meat is second on the list.

BCAAs are essential Amino Acids, and cannot be produced by the human body.

I also read that although some plants have BCAAs but only trace amounts are absorbed by the human body. Most go through the digestive tract to be excreted. Note: I didn't find this in PubMed, which is my 'gold standard' so it might have been a biased article.

PubMed reposts papers published in respected, peer-reviewed scientific journals. If I read it there, I have much more confidence it wasn't written by someone with an agenda. However, the search function usually brings up way too many irrelevant hits for me so if it doesn't come up soon, I give up due to a lack of time. (Perhaps I don't know the best way to use their search terms).

Anyway, European cheese seems to agree with both myself and my wife.

Bob
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  #28   ^
Old Thu, May-02-19, 14:02
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Plan: Keto (Atkins Induction)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
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Location: Florida
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Got a PM from a friend I suggested the A2 dairy to.

She had severe lactose intolerance, you know, the kind that keeps you close to the toilet.

She found out she only has lactose intolerance to A1 dairy, and she can eat all the A2 she wants.

I wonder how the North American Holstein cows ended up with this? Do they give more milk, and therefore were sold as breeders and sooner or later dominated? That's the most logical guess I can come up with. But it's just a guess.

Bob
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  #29   ^
Old Fri, May-03-19, 06:41
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
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Progress: 32%
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Bob, my understanding is that A1/A2 is a protein and not a milk sugar. OFten folks that think they are intolerant to lactose are really intollerant to A1.

THe A1 vs A2 is a breed thing. Holsteins carry it, and are the greatest portion of the dairy industry in the US. Other breeds do not have it, like Jersey, Gerunsey, and goats and sheep.

Quote:
The most common variants among Western cattle are A1, A2, and B. In general, milks from Guernsey, Jersey, Asian herds, human milk, and others (sheep, goat, donkeys, yaks, camel, buffalo, sheep, etc.) contain mostly A2 beta casein. Milks from Holstein Friesian contain mostly A1 beta casein.

Feb 9, 2017
A2 Milk Facts - California Dairy Research Foundation
cdrf.org/2017/02/09/a2-milk-facts/


I expect the A2 milk in stores to have removed any A1-- but Im just guessing here.

Could also be what our cattle are fed here versus what is fed across the pond, regardless of the A1/A2 proteins. To get the high production from the farmlands here the amount of fungicide, herbicides and drying agents is staggering.

Watched a video yesterday on potato production. At harvest time every plant was laying down flat, browned and ready for the havester. The announcer mentioned dessicants but did NOT show it. But it prompted me to look at the field more closely. Chemicals were used to knock down the plants to make harvesting the potatoes easier. It reminding me of a heated "discussion" at an agricultural event in Maine where one of my professors who was doing research on dessicants was sayig the reserach showed 2x the amount of dessicant was required to do the job and the sales agent in disagreement.

While the above is potatoes, the disagreement was over spraying hay!!

A friend in the midwest lost their entire crop due to hail. The plan was to spray the field to kill off the crop and replant the next year.

The ads on TV re round up shows a map of its use and the staggering amount that is used annually on the fields in the US.

Makes me wonder what else and how much is used on the food producing fields in the US.

Im betting the EU doesnt follow the same practices as the US.
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  #30   ^
Old Fri, May-03-19, 09:00
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Posts: 2,849
 
Plan: Ketogenic (LCHFKD)
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Here's a fairly thorough background and explanation of the A1 and A2 differences:

Quote:
According to the literature, more than 10,000 years ago, and before they were domesticated, cows produced only the A2 beta casein protein and not the A1 beta casein protein. However, some 8,000 years ago a natural single-gene mutation occurred in Holsteins, resulting in production of the A1 beta casein protein in this breed. This mutation in the beta casein gene led to 12 genetic variants, of which A1 and A2 are most common. The mutation was passed on to many other breeds, principally because Holsteins are used to genetically improve the production of other breeds. Slowly, the A1 beta casein variant became dominant in milk. While dairy herds in much of Asia, Africa, and part of Southern Europe remain naturally high in cows producing A2 milk, the A1 version of the protein is common among cattle in the Western world.

A point of reference is that A2 milk products are made from dairy cows that produce only the A2 beta casein protein, whereas today’s cow’s milk contains both A2 and A1 beta casein proteins. The most common variants among Western cattle are A1, A2, and B.

In general, milks from Guernsey, Jersey, Asian herds, human milk, and others (sheep, goat, donkeys, yaks, camel, buffalo, sheep, etc.) contain mostly A2 beta casein. Milks from Holstein Friesian contain mostly A1 beta casein. The Holstein breed (the most common dairy cow breed in Australia, Northern Europe, and the United States) carries A1 and A2 forms of beta caseins in approximately equal amounts. More than 50 percent of the Jersey breed carries the A2 beta casein variant, but with considerable variation among the herd, and more than 90 percent of the Guernsey breed carries the A2 beta casein variant.

Two major protein groups are present in cow’s milk – approximately 82 percent of protein is casein and approximately 18 percent is whey protein. Both groups have excellent nutritional benefits.
Caseins are a group of proteins. Among the caseins, beta casein is the second most abundant protein (about one-third of the caseins) and has an excellent nutritional balance of amino acids.
The beta casein group has two common variants: A1 and A2 beta casein. Most milk contains a mixture of these proteins. Approximately 60 percent of the beta casein is A2, and 40 percent is A1.
The proportion of A2 and A1 beta casein in milk can vary with different breeds of dairy cattle – A2 milk contains only A2 beta casein.


The link to the full article:
http://cdrf.org/2017/02/09/a2-milk-facts/

Again, in my case, I'd want to confirm in a n=1 that A2 dairy products don't cause issues with me. Since the A2 information is still being studied, and I don't place much value in rat or mouse studies, I want first-hand experience to be my guide. I've tried A2 products without any issues, and as mentioned in an earlier post, more A2 herds are starting to produce dairy products in the U.S. Note that any cow dairy product from Europe does not mean that it's pure A2.
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