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  #1   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 01:51
Demi's Avatar
Demi Demi is offline
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Default Pasta during pregnancy is linked to diabetes

Quote:
From The Times
London, UK
20 September, 2018

Pasta during pregnancy is linked to diabetes

Children born to mothers who eat a lot of bread and pasta containing gluten when pregnant have a higher risk of developing type 1 diabetes, according to new research.

Gluten-free diets have become increasingly popular in recent years, although experts say there is no need for most people to avoid it. Gluten, a type of protein, is found in foods including cereals, cakes and biscuits.

Researchers from Denmark found that children of women with the highest gluten intake, of 20g or more a day, were twice as likely to develop type 1 diabetes by their mid-teens as those with the lowest gluten intake, of under 7g per day. The risk appeared to increase gradually in line with increased consumption. On average women consumed 13g of gluten per day.

Unlike type 2 diabetes, which is linked to diet and obesity, the causes of type 1 diabetes are unclear. However, the disease has become increasingly common in the western world, leading academics to start searching for potential lifestyle factors.

The study, published in The BMJ, used data from 63,529 pregnant women enrolled into the Danish National Birth Cohort between January 1996 and October 2002. The researchers took into account other factors that might have had an impact, including the mothers’ ages, weights, total calorie consumption and whether they smoked. It follows animal studies that have shown a gluten-free diet during pregnancy can almost completely prevent type 1 diabetes in offspring.

The study was observational, so cannot prove cause and effect, but the researchers said possible explanations included changes to bacteria in the foetus’s digestive system or the leakiness of their guts prompted by maternal diets.

Researchers at the National Institute for Health and Welfare in Finland said further studies were needed “to identify whether the proposed association really is driven by gluten or by something else in the grains or the diet”.

They said, however, that doctors, researchers and the public “should be aware of the possibility that consuming large amounts of gluten might be associated with an increased risk for the child to develop type 1 diabetes”.

Jenny Myers, senior lecturer in maternal and foetal health at Manchester University, said: “Women should not make radical changes to their diet based on this evidence — it is important during pregnancy to eat a balanced diet and there is no evidence currently that gluten should be excluded from the diet during pregnancy.”

Dr Myers said further studies that looked more directly at how maternal diet in pregnancy influenced childhood health were needed.




https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/...betes-3fqz03qzt

Last edited by Demi : Thu, Sep-20-18 at 03:35.
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  #2   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 05:13
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teaser teaser is offline
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Quote:
Jenny Myers, senior lecturer in maternal and foetal health at Manchester University, said: “Women should not make radical changes to their diet based on this evidence — it is important during pregnancy to eat a balanced diet and there is no evidence currently that gluten should be excluded from the diet during pregnancy.”


Funny way to end an article about evidence that gluten might be harmful during pregnancy.

Correlation is not causation is true. That doesn't mean it's not evidence, it means that it's not proof.

There's also the question of whether not eating gluten is a radical change to the diet. A lot of people have traditionally eaten a radical, wheat-free diet...
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  #3   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 13:51
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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I followed DANDR list of induction foods thru my pregnancies. Reading DANDR BEFORE planned pregnancies helped me understand I was already enroute to Type 2, and used DANDR to control my blood sugars when the inevitable gestational diabetes arrived. This was my second evidence of proof that I was headed for type 2.

Fortunately, the Induction foods list is pretty limited.. and no pasta and gluten. Not saying I didnt occassionally imbibe, and had cravings for a BIG bag of DOritos, but bread was gone and pasta too. Hopefully this will safe guard my kids.

Interesting note: a best friend AND her sister are both type 1. I thought a strange co-incidence. Maybe not so strange after all.

( COws milk also causes type 1 when fed to children, especially toddlers. Im no longer convinced milk is a food for children; breastmilk yes, thereafter, water. )
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  #4   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 13:52
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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Does that mean the people who traditionally eat rice are less likely to have type1 rates???
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  #5   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 20:47
M Levac M Levac is offline
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So, in this context, a balanced diet means a diet that contains stuff associated with disease? Also, avoiding gluten by avoiding wheat would certainly mean a radical change, cuz there's wheat in everything, ya? But then, why is there wheat in everything?!? That is not a balanced diet.

I really have to wonder if that lecturer went through this process of reasoning the words that come out of her mouth. Oh wait, she's a lecturer, not a thinkerer.

Nah, on this forum, we are well aware of the wide array of unquestionably beneficial effects of cutting out wheat. It's literally unreasonable to argue that somehow these beneficial effects will turn 180 and become detrimental just cuz of pregnancy.

Here's a story to illustrate. I got hooked on golf and at some point decided to play as best I possibly could. Anyways, this meant significant changes to my diet, which meant cutting out wheat. It worked brilliantly. I did improve my game to such a high degree that I scored par for the course within a couple years. Obviously, cutting out wheat was just one of the many things that made this possible, but the point is it was one of the things that made this possible.

Now imagine I got hooked on anything else, or it's not me it's somebody else. Cutting out wheat will produce the same unquestionbly beneficial effects, which will be one of the things that make it possible, whatever it is. It could be riding a bike, running a marathon, learning a trade, getting a degree, a plain old job, or just enjoying life as you see fit.

Enter the dire warning about making radical changes to one's diet. Oh wait, nothing dire is gonna happen to anybody who cuts out wheat. Everybody is gonna improve their health, and in turn will derive benefits in whatever endeavor.

Apparently, it's only dire when we're making babies. Apparently, the unquestionably beneficial effects, which are unquestionably beneficial when we're doing stuff all kinds, become dangerous when we're making babies. So, what, women should avoid those unquestionably beneficial effects while pregnant? What about when the kid is born, keep doing that? At what point should these women, and their kids, be allowed to benefit from cutting out wheat, huh?

Dude, if a change provides unquestionably beneficial effects, it means nothing that it is also radical. Maybe it's because it's radical that it is unquestionably beneficial. I mean, merely reducing wheat intake won't be as unquestionably beneficial. It's gonna be somewhat beneficial. I mean, we should reduce our lead intake, ya? Dude, we shouldn't eat any lead - that's radical too.
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  #6   ^
Old Thu, Sep-20-18, 21:38
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deirdra deirdra is offline
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How do they know it was the gluten instead of something else like gliadin or just the overload of starch that rapidly converts to sugar causing the problems?
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  #7   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 06:54
Zei Zei is offline
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They probably don't know. Gluten is currently getting the spotlight for its questionable health effects, other potential factors less so; going some resulting bias there. As for that constantly used phrase "balanced diet," I tend to see it nowadays as meaning a diet balanced between eating good and bad stuff. I prefer an un-balanced diet of only good stuff. Radical, I know. And from my personal experience, pregnancy is a vulnerable time; you'll do anything to defend and protect that little guy or gal growing inside you, so all sorts of advice I now would let just wash over me (because I'm the only one it would affect) was a big concern then. I quit my healthy low carb diet because (back then) it wasn't known if it was safe for the baby or not.
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  #8   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 07:51
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teaser teaser is offline
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https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4586524/

Quote:
The Role of Gluten in Celiac Disease and Type 1 Diabetes

Go to:
Abstract
Celiac disease (CD) and type 1 diabetes (T1D) are autoimmune conditions in which dietary gluten has been proven or suggested to play a pathogenic role. In CD; gluten is established as the instigator of autoimmunity; the autoimmune process is halted by removing gluten from the diet; which allows for resolution of celiac autoimmune enteropathy and subsequent normalization of serological markers of the disease. However; an analogous causative agent has not yet been identified for T1D. Nevertheless; the role of dietary gluten in development of T1D and the potentially beneficial effect of removing gluten from the diet of patients with T1D are still debated. In this review; we discuss the comorbid occurrence of CD and T1D and explore current evidences for the specific role of gluten in both conditions; specifically focusing on current evidence on the effect of gluten on the immune system and the gut microbiota.


Things get a little weird with the mice and gluten/type 1;

Quote:
Gluten-free but also gluten-enriched (gluten+) diet prevent diabetes in NOD mice; the gluten enigma in type 1 diabetes.
Funda DP1, Kaas A, Tlaskalová-Hogenová H, Buschard K.
Author information
Abstract
BACKGROUND:
Environmental factors such as nutrition or exposure to infections play a substantial role in the pathogenesis of type 1 diabetes (T1D). We have previously shown that gluten-free, non-purified diet largely prevented diabetes in non-obese diabetic (NOD) mice. In this study we tested hypothesis that early introduction of gluten-enriched (gluten+) diet may increase diabetes incidence in NOD mice.

METHODS:
Standard, gluten-free, gluten+ modified Altromin diets and hydrolysed-casein-based Pregestimil diet were fed to NOD females and diabetes incidence was followed for 310 days. Insulitis score and numbers of gut mucosal lymphocytes were determined in non-diabetic animals.

RESULTS:
A significantly lower diabetes incidence (p < 0.0001) was observed in NOD mice fed gluten-free diet (5.9%, n = 34) and Pregestimil diet (10%, n = 30) compared to mice on the standard Altromin diet (60.6%, n = 33). Surprisingly, gluten+ diet also prevented diabetes incidence, even at the level found with the gluten-free diet (p < 0.0001, 5.9%, n = 34). The minority of mice, which developed diabetes on all the three diabetes-protective (gluten+, gluten-free, Pregestimil) diets, did that slightly later compared to those on the standard diet. Lower insulitis score compared to control mice was found in non-diabetic NOD mice on the gluten-free, and to a lesser extent also gluten+ and Pregestimil diets. No substantial differences in the number of CD3(+), TCR-gammadelta(+), and IgA(+) cells in the small intestine were documented.

CONCLUSIONS:
Gluten+ diet prevents diabetes in NOD mice at the level found with the non-purified gluten-free diet. Possible mechanisms of the enigmatic, dual effect of dietary gluten on the development of T1D are discussed.


There's research looking at a casein based diet being protective in these mice. Hydrolyzed casein is protective, intact casein is not. The "pregestimil" diet above is basically baby formula with hydrolyzed "predigested" casein as the protein source.

Gluten plus diet is weird here. Only the abstract, I'm tempted to assume that by "plus diet" they mean plus the control diet. I guess that would give the confounder of a slightly higher protein intake. Maybe it's easier for the immune system to "recognize" the gluten as a foreign protein in this form and that helps with the gluten in the wheat? Or something.
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  #9   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 08:42
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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To add to this, from recall, is that the casein protein is very much like a protein in the Islets of Langerhan, which makes insulin. The immunoresponse to casein also means very similar proteins are attacked resulting in no insulin. This is type 1.

Given the number of people that are developing type 1, far more than in the past, this is a SERIOUS problem. ANother posted listed a study where type 1 women live 18 years less than the average. And managing this is very complicated. ( have a good friend who shares her adventures.)

Proteins trigger immune responses.
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  #10   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 09:22
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teaser teaser is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle


Proteins trigger immune responses.


This is the big question, even if we knew for sure a protein like gluten is probably in the chain of causation--is it the leaky gut, which could lead to other proteins finding their way into the blood stream, is it a reaction to the protein itself? Some effect on the immune system that doesn't have much to do with similarities of dietary proteins to body proteins?

If it's leaky gut, omega 6 fatty acids and sugar might come into the picture.

I read one study where using palm oil for baby formula instead of soy oil caused rickets. The enzymes that break down triglycerides are better suited for the dairy fats, poorer digestion of palm oil results in an increased formation of calcium/fat soaps so that the calcium is lost to the body. Most studies looking at this seem to think that it's a good thing, since the fat is also lost in the stool.
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  #11   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 10:13
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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I have never heard of anything other than a protein to cause immunity responses.

Leaky gut lets thru large molecules that should not be allowed thru. This seems to be a very complicated situation that the body reacts to, as this is an unacceptable invasion. The body has many ways to deal with this, to save itself. To control the exposure, like white blood cells and macrophages, at the very least. Perhaps the reaction to the proteins in the wrong place is as simple as how vaccines work, introduce a foreign protein, and the T cells and Ig's get constructed to stand ready, and the body is armed, for the next invasion.

Im not a pro here-- just putting out ideas from my limited knowledge.
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  #12   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 11:03
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teaser teaser is offline
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Sure. What I was trying to get at--maybe going off topic will help. Germ-free mice, despite what seem to be some good consequences, have compromised immune systems. One function of the immune system is to differentiate between host and foreign proteins. It's true that confusing a host protein for a foreign protein is a problem. But does there have to actually be a foreign protein that the host protein is being confused for? All that's necessary is to not recognized the host protein as host. It doesn't really have to be confused for something.
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  #13   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 11:47
locarb4avr locarb4avr is offline
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Refresh our memory.

Fructan, Rather Than Gluten, Induces Symptoms in Patients With Self-reported Non-celi

http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=478676
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  #14   ^
Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 11:54
M Levac M Levac is offline
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If I'm not mistaken, normally protein is too big to be absorbed. We break it down, then absorb the amino acids.

Two scenarios.

Leaky gut, protein can probably leak in.

Healthy gut, something else is going on with gluten and other problematic protein.

The more I think about it, the more complicated it gets. Doesn't matter, it makes no sense looking for a solution that allows us to continue to eat wheat, hum, safely. Instead, I prefer the simple solution of avoiding wheat entirely.
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Old Fri, Sep-21-18, 12:30
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser
Sure. What I was trying to get at--maybe going off topic will help. Germ-free mice, despite what seem to be some good consequences, have compromised immune systems. One function of the immune system is to differentiate between host and foreign proteins. It's true that confusing a host protein for a foreign protein is a problem. But does there have to actually be a foreign protein that the host protein is being confused for? All that's necessary is to not recognized the host protein as host. It doesn't really have to be confused for something.


( Sorry for the long response...)
I can see your point. The theory would suppose that there was a malfunction of the "normal" process. Which should be a rare rare rare thing.

IMHO the seemingly explosive numbers of people affected by autoimmune issues in appalling. IMO it mostly goes back to foods.

I raise horses , sheep, and have had too many cats and dogs over the years. When I look at their health over 30 years, these creatures are healthier into old age than their counterparts at other farms/homes. I KNOW it is because of how I feed them. Meaning I would expect to see an animal withering away if there was autoimmune issues that crop up spontaneously. Instead if an animal can avoid a catastrophic accident, old age far beyond average is the norm here. And I cant help but credit it to feeding them correctly and living out doors. The most notable loss was an obese cat that lived on cat chow-- he developed type 2 diabetes. That was a wake up call. As there is not reasonably priced all meat cat food on the market, I no longer have cats.

While I would never discount the possibility of a spontaneous type of auto immune, I DO think it triggered by responding to another substance. Either directly from a protein, or other foreign chemical. Perhaps what we are or are NOT eating, is setting the body up for recognition problems.

Another twist is when, the timing, "items" are exposed to a body. For example, in an effort to reduce peanut allergies, the age of introduction was moved from 2 years old to 4 years old. The percentage of children allergic has only increased. So the time frame for introduction was moved to an earlier age.Clearly the mechanism is not clear here. In foals, vaccines were moved out to nearly a year, as earlier vaccines were negating the immunity imparted by the mothers milk; leaving the foals defenseless. The mares IgM that is passed to the foal is held in storage, and when the vaccine is introduced, the passive immune system attacks the invaders. There is a hiccup here that leaves the foal susceptible to the diseases the vaccines were supposed to protect them from.( Makes me question how fast pediatricians start vaccinating human babies-- starts at birth, despite a mom's wish to breastfeed.)

Overall, IMO the humans in the US are not eating a healthy diet that staves off disease. Some how we are triggering diseases that used to be more rare.

Im sure it will take many more years of research to sort this all out.
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