Life occassionally gets in the way as those around me do not understand I have a food limitation--not like I have a food alergy or something--- JUST pre-diabetic but who cares about that too----so I have to choose between going to Thanksgiving eating all the sugar laden foods passed around and staying home; going to famiy BBQ as BIL describes his lucious BBQ wings soaked in hot pepper sugar sauce or not; Christmas or not...... there are times I stay home and have been able to get my weight down significantly and didnt regret missing the function. However there are times when I just cant avoid the crap food and fall off the wagon. I can back on asap these days--not sure why as I could never manage more than 10-14 days at a time so it took YEARS to drop 20 pounds, but now, wow, 50% of the reboots result in getting on plan, used to be almost zilch. Just kept trying until I could string 3 days together.....like I said for some reason it is much much easier to get back on plan now.

Hope you stick around and find a new p lay group.

So here's where I'm talking about with the gray area.Following the links that thud123 posted as an example, people seemed to think of cheating in terms of cheat meals and cheat days. And some folks actually embrace the concept of taking a full-on break. I'm not talking about (nor do I advocate) anything like that, nor am I talking about partaking in sugar-laden foods or falling off the wagon.

My basis was in terms of an entire day of eating correctly, having one burrito with LC friendly ingredients EXCEPT the regular tortilla shell for lunch. Maybe it pushed the day's quota an extra 20-30 grams (I'm not strict induction or anything like that), so in the larger scheme of things, it wasn't like a backslide or a binge, and it wasn't intended to be a long term practice. Likewise having a couple of beers on a different day.

I just hate the word "cheating" because of the negative connotation. Certainly when one is working with higher daily carb quotas and correctly managing all other aspects of this way of eating, a slight, planned, temporary deviation can occasionally work into a successful scheme. It's not always a perfect black and white picture. I know everybody is different, but I can say without a doubt (and the numbers prove me out) that I managed this situation effectively.

I don’t use the word cheating when it’s about anyone’s WOE, because I don’t really like that term. I would just describe it as eating OFF PLAN. JMHO.

Isnt it all really about judgement.

It’s not cheating. You don’t win and often, you don’t lose.

But really, cheating implies you are getting away with something. And there have been times when I have eaten off plan, holiday, etc. But I did it less and less once I realized a “treat” would make me feel rotten afterwards, now that I had a basis for comparison.

That reminds me of someone I used to know who, when my husband found out her "secret," she screamed at him to tell no one, not even God. Which we both thought was hilarious. I think of her whenever I think I can eat off plan & my meter won't record the spike in blood sugar. My body know, my meter know, & God certainly knows. I can't get away with anything.

Okay...so I just got booted off another one. LOL There's a lot of angry, bitter, zero tolerance people out there.

The discussion started with somebody crying that they were going peach picking and that they weren't going to be able to have any. I made the mistake of suggesting that if it meant preventing a crash and burn by giving in to all temptation, maybe having a small amount of peach (especially with some cream to mitigate the glycemic load) could be done in the context of a full day's plan. I never promoted peaches as a regular part of the plan. I also followed with the proviso that we are all 100% in charge of our lives and that we have to live with the consequences of our decisions.

I was mischaracterized, demonized, and ostracized all within minutes.

Funny...I recently watched a documentary about Frank Zappa, where the reporter asked about his use of "foul" language. his response: “There is no such thing as a dirty word. Nor is there a word so powerful, that it's going to send the listener to the lake of fire upon hearing it.”

I kind of feel the same way about forums. Reading about somebody eating a couple of slices of peaches isn't going to send you off on a ho-ho and candy binge. I give people credit for being intelligent enough to read, comprehend, and understand context (that seems to work well here, and I thank you all for your thoughtful contribution to the discussion).

Wow you're racking up a lot of places you're getting booted from! Excellent statement!

The funniest thing is that peaches are discussed as being somewhat acceptable for low carb eating. It definitely is NOT an off-plan food...especially if you are following a moderate plan. But people see what they want to see, and it was like holding a lighting rod in a storm.

Susky2, I think your advice is good for some, bad for others. For me even raspberries and cream quickly turns into a habit, servings get bigger--if not the berries themselves, than I'll tend to increase the heavy cream and sweetener. Also I actually disagree with adding heavy cream to mitigate the glycemic load--I find a handful of raspberries more satisfying than a handful of raspberries plus heavy cream, with the second I just want more.

I still don't blame the heavy cream, because heavy cream by itself I find pretty satisfying it's my go to if my regularly scheduled meal doesn't satisfy, I just get in trouble when I start sweetening it.

Thanks, teaser. Dr. Atkins actually wrote about adding fats to mitigate glycemic impact, so while it might not work for you, there is a precedent for it.

The important thing for me is that we can actually discuss the merits like reasonable, intelligent people. I guess I shouldn't be surprised that FB is a wasteland in terms of thoughtful discussion.

I wasn't saying there isn't an argument for it. I just don't believe it. Ice cream is lower glycemic index when it's fatty. So are fatty potato chips vs. fat free. Does that make them better than the fat-free? I'm not saying the fat free is better, but it's all crud. Marginally better only helps if the diet is marginally bad. Not so much if you're deep in the red. I wouldn't go that far with peaches or berries, but I'm not unique in finding the cream and fruit mix sort of risky.

I've found some fairly reasonable facebook pages. But maybe because of the format, there seems to be more of a party line about some things there. The war zone also increases the scope of subjects we can discuss without causing some sort of schism.

There was time I too would head down the rabbit hole after consumming berries and fat, but these days I can hardly finish a serving. Perhaps it is that full fat yogurt is mixed with a few berries and usually no sweetener instead of HWC. Perhaps the protein acts as a buffer. And I eat it as dessert after a meal instead of a meal in itself.

Fats help absorb the fat-soluable vitamins. TO me this means I can eat fewer berries to get the nutritional impact.

Cheating, not in my vocabulary. I sometimes can "eat off plan" or eat "off the grid," but if I want to eat anything, it's a decision I'll make. Again, that free will thing. How you stay consistent with what's healthiest for you is all that really matters. And no, we would never ban "cheating" or "cheaters" on this forum.

Cool. Group hug!