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  #91   ^
Old Mon, Apr-04-11, 20:52
Cathy B. Cathy B. is offline
Posts: 4,034
 
Plan: Intuitive Ray Peat
Stats: 321/228.0/199 Female 63 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
Location: Virginia, USA
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I gained about 3 or 4 pounds in the first month of following the Peat recommendations. But I was also taking my measurements, and discovered that I was smaller in ALL areas except for my biceps! I could feel myself getting much stronger and more agile during that time, as well. Prior to that point, I could send my back into spasms, just trying to tie my shoes, and I was tearing tendons, ligaments, just doing the simplest of things, like going up the stairs. But since eating the Peat way, I am much more mobile and am no longer injuring myself when I exercise. I went snowshoeing a few times last month and had NO problems.

Interesting, and unfortunately, I kind of went off the deep end emotionally in January and ate grains all month - first gluten, then rice, and then corn. (NOT the Peat recommended way of eating!) During that month, I gained 8 pounds and that was NOT muscle. I couldn't even button my pants by the end of the month!

Then I started eating buckwheat, also not Peat recommended, and gained a little more weight. Since I quit all grains and pseudo grains and have been eating "pure Peat" for the past month, I have not gained any weight. I was in the mountains at a high altitude and had a lot of problems with edema and my thyroid so I wasn't able to lose any weight, but I just came back to "civilization" yesterday and I will be interested to see what happens now that I am at a lower altitude. I dropped about a half a pound of fluid yesterday and hopefully that will continue for a while longer.

After the excess fluid goes, then I will have to see what happens in terms of weight loss and my temperature and pulse. I don't know to what extent the diet will be able to correct the thyroid function without thyroid supplements. Time will tell!

I am pleased with the blood sugar, however. The fasting is a bit higher now than it used to be, but the post meal is lower, sometimes even lower than the pre meal reading, so there is very little fluctuation, only within about 20 points. I feel much better with the small fluctuations in the blood sugar rather than with the higher highs and the lower lows I had before Peat.
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  #92   ^
Old Mon, Apr-04-11, 21:12
Cathy B. Cathy B. is offline
Posts: 4,034
 
Plan: Intuitive Ray Peat
Stats: 321/228.0/199 Female 63 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
Location: Virginia, USA
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Debbie,
Unfortunately, Ray Peat has never written a "diet book" of what to eat. Debbie (Live Simply) created this thread for that reason, to help people be able to get as much info as possible in one place on Peat's recommendations. She and Scarlet and I did a lot of research on various websites and asked Ray Peat himself some questions and pooled our collective knowledge on this thread.
Admittedly, it is hard to create a "diet" from all the bits and pieces of information on the first page of this thread.

Lita Lee is a scientist who studied with Ray Peat and incorporates a lot of his recommendations in her dietary advice on her website. She has a fact sheet on thyroid resistance which sums up a lot of the Peat recommendations in a bit more clear cut manner, both in terms of what NOT to eat, and what to eat. However, there is one error. She recommends 25 grams of protein but omitted, "3 times a day". In other words, like Peat, she recommends consuming at least 75 grams of protein a day.

Here is the link:

http://www.litalee.com/documents/Th...0Resistance.pdf

A typical day for me would be the breakfast I described in a previous post. Then I might have a snack of some cheese and orange juice, or some orange "jello" (home made) with sweetened whipped cream. He also recommends eating a raw carrot, shredded, with coconut oil or olive oil and lemon juice or vinegar. Dinner is usually pot roast, served with the gelatinous broth, or shell fish, or sometimes steak or ground beef, served with mashed potatoes or fried potatoes. If I don't have gelatinous broth with the protein, I make sure to have "jello" right after the meal. (Again, this is homemade, with fruit juice, sugar, and gelatin.) Then I might have some Haagen Dazs before bed. Peat recommended ice cream before bed to help reduce the release of stress hormones in the night, which keep me awake. It has really been helping with my sleep.

He is a big fan of dairy, so he encourages drinking milk, which I don't really care for. He also recommends cheese, and says that in some ways this is preferable, because tryptophan is found in the whey, not the curds. (Tryptophan converts to serotonin, which is inflammatory.)

He says if you do want to consume a grain, masa harina would be the best choice. And he recommends pork rinds as a crunchy snack. You can read about the fruit and juice and all the other stuff at the link I gave you, and on this thread.

His article, "Vegetables: Who defines food" on his website has a lot of good info, also.

Cathy

Last edited by Cathy B. : Mon, Apr-04-11 at 21:25.
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  #93   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 07:28
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Posts: 6,273
 
Plan: IF/Fung IDM
Stats: 375/259/175 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B.
Debbie,
Unfortunately, Ray Peat has never written a "diet book" of what to eat. Debbie (Live Simply) created this thread for that reason, to help people be able to get as much info as possible in one place on Peat's recommendations. She and Scarlet and I did a lot of research on various websites and asked Ray Peat himself some questions and pooled our collective knowledge on this thread.

And I thank you for it! It's a great thread indeed, and I've enjoyed reading it all from beginning to end. I'm starting to read some of the Peat articles too, and seeing what else I can find out about his suggested eating plan online.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B
.Lita Lee is a scientist who studied with Ray Peat and incorporates a lot of his recommendations in her dietary advice on her website. She has a fact sheet on thyroid resistance which sums up a lot of the Peat recommendations in a bit more clear cut manner, both in terms of what NOT to eat, and what to eat. However, there is one error. She recommends 25 grams of protein but omitted, "3 times a day". In other words, like Peat, she recommends consuming at least 75 grams of protein a day.
Thanks, I'll take a look at that also.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B.
A typical day for me would be the breakfast I described in a previous post. Then I might have a snack of some cheese and orange juice, or some orange "jello" (home made) with sweetened whipped cream. He also recommends eating a raw carrot, shredded, with coconut oil or olive oil and lemon juice or vinegar. Dinner is usually pot roast, served with the gelatinous broth, or shell fish, or sometimes steak or ground beef, served with mashed potatoes or fried potatoes. If I don't have gelatinous broth with the protein, I make sure to have "jello" right after the meal. (Again, this is homemade, with fruit juice, sugar, and gelatin.)
Just last night while lying in bed I got thinking about making my own homemade "jello" to have with whipped cream, since I don't care for gelatinous broths or broths of any sort. Does he recommend any other juices besides OJ? It's never been a fave of mine, though maybe ok as a jello.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B.
Then I might have some Haagen Dazs before bed. Peat recommended ice cream before bed to help reduce the release of stress hormones in the night, which keep me awake. It has really been helping with my sleep.

He is a big fan of dairy, so he encourages drinking milk, which I don't really care for. He also recommends cheese, and says that in some ways this is preferable, because tryptophan is found in the whey, not the curds.

Ice cream! I love it so much I'd have a big problem trying to limit my portions I'm afraid. Eating an entire pint at one sitting would be nothing for me.

I'm not a fan of milk drinking either - but could see making milk custards perhaps, and I *adore* cream and cheese - among my fave foods. I get bootleg raw heavy cream every couple weeks and it's wonderful stuff.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B.
He says if you do want to consume a grain, masa harina would be the best choice.
I just bought some masa harina yesterday, though I'm still not totally sure what I might do with it.
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  #94   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 12:41
Cathy B. Cathy B. is offline
Posts: 4,034
 
Plan: Intuitive Ray Peat
Stats: 321/228.0/199 Female 63 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
Location: Virginia, USA
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Just last night while lying in bed I got thinking about making my own homemade "jello" to have with whipped cream, since I don't care for gelatinous broths or broths of any sort. Does he recommend any other juices besides OJ? It's never been a fave of mine, though maybe ok as a jello.

Hi Debbie,
If you follow that link above that I gave you to Lita Lee's article on Thyroid Resistance, and you scroll down to the Pro-Thyroid Diet section, you will find a whole paragraph about recommended fruit juices, fruit juices to avoid, etc. As I said, she is a colleague of Ray Peat, she has a Ph.D. in chemistry, and much of her nutrition advice is based on Peat's recommendations. I find her writing a lot easier to follow!

When I make orange "Jello", I boil the orange juice in order to concentrate the flavor, and also I skim off the yellow foam, which I believe is acid. And I add about a tablespoon of sugar per cup of OJ. Tastes quite nice. Also, I have bought cherry juice (100% pure cherry juice) at the health food store and made that into jello, sometimes adding some frozen tart cherries to it. I add sugar to taste as I boil the juice. You want to avoid things with additives, like citric acid and ascorbic acid, or juice that is sweetened with apple juice, so unless you are using orange juice, you will pretty much have to stick to juices found in the all natural or health food section of the store. Ceres is a brand of juice, comes in aseptic boxes, and they make some nice combinations of juice. Peat and Lita Lee say tropical fruits are best and Ceres makes some nice tropical fruit juice combinations that can be turned into "jello".

Ice cream! I love it so much I'd have a big problem trying to limit my portions I'm afraid. Eating an entire pint at one sitting would be nothing for me.

I'm not a fan of milk drinking either - but could see making milk custards perhaps, and I *adore* cream and cheese - among my fave foods. I get bootleg raw heavy cream every couple weeks and it's wonderful stuff.

As for ice cream, pretty much the only brand that does not have additives like carageenan or gums (both Peat no-no's) is Haagen Dazs. And many of the H.D. flavors have corn syrup or other non Peat recommended things in them, so basically you are limited to Haagen Dazs vanilla, coffee, chocolate, or strawberry. You can buy those flavors now in small, 3 oz. servings, so that helps a lot with portion control. I have been known to down a whole pint of Haagen Dazs in one sitting, on occasion, so I know what you mean about how tempting that can be! But MOST of the time, I find I am satisfied with just half of a pint. (WHICH, by the way, is no longer a pint, but only 14 oz.!)

Also, I always toss some Enjoy Life chocolate chips (no soy or other "bad stuff") in with the ice cream. Ray Peat said that dark chocolate can lower blood sugar so that is good, plus I find sometimes I feel a little "wired" from eating the ice cream without the dark chocolate chips mixed in.

I just bought some masa harina yesterday, though I'm still not totally sure what I might do with it.

LOL. Same here. I keep it "in reserve". The only thing I know to do with it is to combine it with warm water and some coconut oil or butter and salt, make it into a dough, roll it out very thin, and make corn tortillas on a cast iron skillet. Then you can make soft tacos or enchiladas, if so inclined, or if you are REALLY feeling industrious, you can take those tortillas and fry them in coconut oil for a Peat friendly snack.

I always have problems with portion control when it comes to eating ANY grains, even masa, and I find it stimulates my appetite and makes me want to eat again a short time later. The potatoes, fried or mashed with butter, however, really fill me up and hold me for 4 or 5 hours. I sometimes mash them with butter and heavy cream and cheese. Yummo! Now THAT will stick to your ribs! :-)

As a birdwatcher, you will be interested to know I saw a beautiful pileated woodpecker right outside my cabin door this morning. What a beautiful bird!

Cathy
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  #95   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 16:47
sollyb's Avatar
sollyb sollyb is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 880
 
Plan: modified Peat
Stats: 202/214/180 Female 62.5 inches
BF:
Progress: -55%
Location: Wyoming
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Recent posts are very interesting to me, and somewhat have relieved my mind that if I go to the Ray Peat way of eating my blood sugars will soar, increasing my neuropathy pain, and perhaps lead to dire complications.

I have suffered extreme variable vision for several years, along with other conditions too lengthy to go into detail about. In May of 2010 I developed severe peripheral neuropathy in hands and feet (along with severe upper back pain, as in between shoulder blades and upper spine). I was unable to type at the computer, even if I could have sat and looked at the screen for more than a couple of minutes at a time. I could not hold a toothbrush for two months or so, and even holding a paperback book was very painful, and feeling the edge of a page on my fingerpads when turning a page was really extreme pain, like the fingerpads were being sliced by razor blades. Long story short, I was taking high doses of painkillers, muscle relaxants (dropped after the first couple of months) and was eventually put on Topamax. As the months passed the PN improved, but the greatest improvement was sudden and happened within just 2-3 days of going gluten free. I was able to drastically reduce my dosage of painkillers.
It was confusing because dropping gluten meant dropping all grains overnight, which also lowered my carb intake because I have so many allergies that I can't eat 99% of the commercial gluten free grain based foods sold where I live.
I began testing my blood sugar levels more often and properly, as my eye doctor had suspected diabetes or pre-diabetes, and that was eye-opening. Reading Bernstein's book and Blood sugar 101 got me to go very strict on carbs and sugars. I did find that grains and grain products, even with minimal carb counts cause my blood sugar to spike much more than Haggen Dazs ice cream in an equivalent (or even higher total carb count, I can eat nearly twice the carb count in ice cream as I can in oatmeal, rice bread, or corn tortilla with a much smaller Blood sugar increase, even when using plenty of butter with the grains). Whole milk spikes my blood sugar badly, but I do love it, no real organic here though. No cream sold here at all that doesn't have carrageenan and/or other gums, but I can get half and half without those. (I've avoided carrageenan for about 20 years because I do react to it).
But after a few weeks of very low carb, I began to experience weird effects the worst of which is/was a return of nearly total insomnia. I don't understand that. Is it a result of the Bernstein way of eating? Does the Ray Peat way of eating help with insomnia at all? I am now also experiencing some increase in neuropathy as well, possibly because the insomnia sent me into a panic, and I began messing about with my diet and supplements again.
I am also upset about PUFAs. No argument as to their harm, but I don't really like coconut oil much, maybe I should try expeller pressed instead of centrifuged. I do eat a lot of mayonnaise, and have tried over a dozen home mayo recipes, including those with a coconut/olive oil mix, and the taste of them makes ne nauseous. Maybe light olive oil would work? But isn't light olive oil supposed to be as bad as corn and soybean oils? I also eat too much deli fried chicken and other oil fried stuff.
I can't eat white potatoes because I am sensitive to all nightshades. In addition, many of the better foods Peat recommends are just not available here, even OJ is a problem. Is frozen concentrate made up with non-fluoridated water ok?
Beef can be a problem for me if eaten too frequently, so I also wondered if the porcine gelatin from Great Lakes would work as well as beef gelatin?
Sorry for the length and rambling, I got started and couldn't seem to stop.
I *think* I would like to try this way to eat, but as above have some difficulties, and also am very scared my blood sugars will soar and the neuropathy will get much worse again.
sollyb
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  #96   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 17:33
Scarlet's Avatar
Scarlet Scarlet is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,437
 
Plan: Gluten free wholefoods
Stats: 173/145/147 Female 5"4.5 inches
BF:37/?/25
Progress: 108%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Megan200
Scarlet, that was helpful advice.

I'm curious if you or your previously l/c''ing friends experienced other symptoms of PUFA release and how long they lasted. I'm considering taking anti-oxidants or returning to regular salmon eating for omega 3s again, because I'm feeling and looking unwell, despite some weight loss. I read that Ray Peat said it could take years, and I worry I could do some major damage to my health in that time.


Don't add omega 3's as they are a PUFA too. Peat recommends good quality vitamin E. If you email him, he will recommend a brand. He is very helpful usually.
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  #97   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 17:36
Scarlet's Avatar
Scarlet Scarlet is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,437
 
Plan: Gluten free wholefoods
Stats: 173/145/147 Female 5"4.5 inches
BF:37/?/25
Progress: 108%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merpig
Well I have been trying to keep my PUFAs as low as possible for over two years now - not perfect but doing my best to limit them a lot. So keeping fingers crossed this will not be a major issue. Why would low carb diets be high in PUFAs?


You are a lot smarter than I was then. Do you eat any PUFAs though? Chicken skin or pork or nuts/seeds? Do you eat lots of eggs?

Sadly up until last week, I:

- Ate pork every day
- Ate at least three eggs per day and often more
- Had seeded GF bread daily

I also used to regularly eat chicken skin up until late 2010.

So my tissues are clogged with PUFAs. Sadly, they have a half life of FOUR years!!!
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  #98   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 17:42
Scarlet's Avatar
Scarlet Scarlet is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,437
 
Plan: Gluten free wholefoods
Stats: 173/145/147 Female 5"4.5 inches
BF:37/?/25
Progress: 108%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sollyb
I am also upset about PUFAs. No argument as to their harm, but I don't really like coconut oil much, maybe I should try expeller pressed instead of centrifuged. I do eat a lot of mayonnaise, and have tried over a dozen home mayo recipes, including those with a coconut/olive oil mix, and the taste of them makes ne nauseous. Maybe light olive oil would work? But isn't light olive oil supposed to be as bad as corn and soybean oils? I also eat too much deli fried chicken and other oil fried stuff.

I can't eat white potatoes because I am sensitive to all nightshades. In addition, many of the better foods Peat recommends are just not available here, even OJ is a problem. Is frozen concentrate made up with non-fluoridated water ok?

Beef can be a problem for me if eaten too frequently, so I also wondered if the porcine gelatin from Great Lakes would work as well as beef gelatin?



Where do you live?

I SOOO feel you on the mayo. I used to love it and have made it twice now with CO and olive oil. I really don't like it and it tastes NOTHING like Hellman's. My next step is to try it with light olive oil. I too wonder if it is just as bad as veg oil...

The fried chicken will be full of PUFAs. Sorry.

As long as OJ concentrate is fluoride free, it's okay.

Email Peat about the porcine gelatin/e. Beef is preferrable because it is low in PUFAs.
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  #99   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 19:03
Megan200 Megan200 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 60
 
Plan: Montignac
Stats: 135/125/125 Female 5 foot 3 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
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Thanks Scarlett. It seems like Ray Peat is gaining popularity on a number of blogs, and I get the impression the poor guy is getting bombarded with email.

I couldn't find a vitamin E supplement without soy oil in it when I looked yesterday, but I'm going to start a more serious search.
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  #100   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 19:07
Megan200 Megan200 is offline
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Posts: 60
 
Plan: Montignac
Stats: 135/125/125 Female 5 foot 3 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
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And do you mind if I ask how you're feeling? Do you have any of the same symptoms. My big mistake was cooking daily with grapeseed oil for the last couple of years. It was touted as this great alternative to olive oil, because of the high smoking point, but it has way more omega6 than olive oil.
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  #101   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 20:00
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Posts: 6,273
 
Plan: IF/Fung IDM
Stats: 375/259/175 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlet
You are a lot smarter than I was then. Do you eat any PUFAs though? Chicken skin or pork or nuts/seeds? Do you eat lots of eggs?
Well certainly I do eat SOME PUFAs. Pretty hard not to. I eat pork though only rarely. I almost never have chicken, though I have occasionally eaten chicken skin if I have had wings, but not had wings in a couple years probably. I do love nuts though I try to limit them. But yes, eggs are major. I buy pastured eggs from an Amish farmer and I do love them and eat them pretty often. But I do my best to keep high-PUFA items low for the most part - but I guess I will never be perfect.

Last edited by Merpig : Tue, Apr-05-11 at 20:09.
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  #102   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 20:04
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Posts: 6,273
 
Plan: IF/Fung IDM
Stats: 375/259/175 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cathy B.
As a birdwatcher, you will be interested to know I saw a beautiful pileated woodpecker right outside my cabin door this morning. What a beautiful bird!
Very cool. I have only seen a pileated woodpecker twice in my life!
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  #103   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 20:08
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Posts: 6,273
 
Plan: IF/Fung IDM
Stats: 375/259/175 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scarlet
I SOOO feel you on the mayo. I used to love it and have made it twice now with CO and olive oil. I really don't like it and it tastes NOTHING like Hellman's. My next step is to try it with light olive oil. I too wonder if it is just as bad as veg oil...
I hear you too. I *love love love* Hellman's but just cannot bring myself to eat it any longer because of the high-PUFA soybean all it's made from. Don't like the taste of mayo made with EVOO. I've tried light olive oil and it's better, but I have my doubts about the quality of the oil. It's not too bad made with macadamia nut oil, but that's expensive. And frankly none of them taste as good as Hellman's. I have just sort of given up on mayo for the time being.
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  #104   ^
Old Tue, Apr-05-11, 21:45
Cathy B. Cathy B. is offline
Posts: 4,034
 
Plan: Intuitive Ray Peat
Stats: 321/228.0/199 Female 63 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
Location: Virginia, USA
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Hey everybody, news flash! :-)

Josh and Jeanne Rubin of East West Healing have been interviewing Ray Peat once a month on blogtalkradio.com.. This month they will be interviewing Dr. Peat on April 27th from 5:00 P.M. to 7:00 P.M.. (I am not sure which time zone. I will try to find out.) The topic this month will be "Glycemia, Starch, and Sugar in Context". Here is the description:

Description: Listen in for this long awaited show. Ray will educate us on the different types of sugars, where they come from, how they work in the body, why we need them and clarify the many confusions around sucrose, fructose and glucose!

This should be interesting. I can't wait! I just hope I remember. But if anyone forgets or isn't available at that time, you can always listen to a recording of the program later.

Here is a link for for the upcoming show as well as links for some of their past interviews with Ray Peat, as well as other people.

http://m.blogtalkradio.com/profile....sthealing&pt=12

Cathy

Last edited by Cathy B. : Wed, Apr-06-11 at 08:32.
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  #105   ^
Old Wed, Apr-06-11, 11:51
Cathy B. Cathy B. is offline
Posts: 4,034
 
Plan: Intuitive Ray Peat
Stats: 321/228.0/199 Female 63 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
Location: Virginia, USA
Default

Found an interesting article online today in a 2010 newsletter by Lita Lee. I was doing a search online about corn syrup and high fructose corn syrup and Ray Peat because I couldn't seem to recall seeing any information about what he thought of those products. This short article is the only thing I could find. Note that the article continues on page 4.

Kind of makes sense, because I know eating candy made with corn syup sets off my "eat the whole bag" button. Dr. Peat suggests that there may actually be quite a bit of starch in the corn syrup, which would explain my reaction, because any starch made from grains results in my overeating and still wanting more! Plus I gained 10 pounds in one month a few years ago when I decided it was okay to eat Halloween candy during the month of October, even though I was eating it in place of REAL food, so calorically it wasn't that much higher than normal. Same thing happened this January when I was eating grains (not candy!) and gained 8 or 9 pounds. Any product made from grains makes me gain weight FAST.

http://www.litalee.com/documents/vF_i4.pdf


Cathy
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