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  #1   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 07:21
Angeline's Avatar
Angeline Angeline is offline
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Plan: Atkins (loosely)
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Default Saturated fat study sucks

The one we have been waiting for...enjoy!

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/...ated_fat_s.html


The latest saturated fat study to come down the pike has been picked up by all the newspapers it seems, reinforcing one of my favorite Mark Twain quotes:

If you don't read the newspaper, you are uninformed. If you do read the newspaper, you are misinformed.

This latest piece of whatever has followed the typical trajectory of such things. Study done, pre-publication press release, dissemination by gullible press that doesn't have sense enough to ask the right questions, publication in scientific journal. In this case it goes to show that the gullible press is really gullible where saturated fat is concerned. No study is too moronic as long as it implicates saturated fat as a bad nutritional actor.

Let's look at a sampling of what a number of "health and science' outlets have to say. Medical News Today warns that meals high In saturated fat Impair "good" cholesterol's ability to protect against clogged arteries and cautions us that

Before you bite into that burger or devour that doughnut, first chew on this: New research shows that just one meal high in saturated fat can affect the body's ability to protect itself against some of the underlying causes of heart disease and stroke.

HealthDay asks us if we 'need more proof that a diet high in saturated fats is bad for [our] heart[s]?' Then informs us that 'just a little high-saturated fat can be hard on the arteries.'

Good ol' reliable WebMD (reliable, that is, if what you want to know is the low-fat take on things) comes through with the caveat that 'even one fatty meal affects arteries' and tells us that

a new study that shows eating a meal high in saturated fats, like a cheeseburger and fries, can reduce the ability of the body's "good" HDL cholesterol to protect against clogged arteries.

And enlists the aid of an expert to help make the case

"It's further evidence to support the need to aggressively reduce the amount of saturated fat consumed in the diet," says researcher Stephen J. Nicholls, MBBS, PhD, PRACP, FACC, a cardiologist at The Cleveland Clinic in Ohio.

And you thought that all those letters behind someone's name make him smart?

Reuters chimes in with 'saturated fat impedes "good" cholesterol activity.'

What I've laid out is just the short list. I found this study mentioned in practically every newspaper I read from throughout the world. They were all the same. Not an ounce of questioning, but a ton of implication instead. Notice how in the above examples the reporters are so certain. There is no equivocation. In their minds saturated fat is, by God, bad for you, and that's how they're going to report it.

Let's take a look at the actual study to see if it lives up to all it's hype, let's see if it's worthy of all the knee jerk substantiation by the finest minds in the medical reporting world.

The study, published in the current issue of the Journal of the American College of Cardiology, looks at what happens to the arteries of subjects who consume a high-saturated-fat meal as compared to those who eat a high-polyunsaturated-fat meal.

Fourteen thin (BMI 23.6), healthy subjects (average age 29.5), after an overnight fast consumed a single meal containing primarily saturated fat or primarily polyunsaturated fat. A month later the process was repeated with the opposite diet.

The first meal contained safflower oil (fatty acid composition: 75% polyunsaturated, 13.6% monounsaturated, and 8.8% saturated fat). The second meal contained coconut oil (fatty acid composition: 89.6% saturated fat, 5.8% monounsaturated, and 1.9% polyunsaturated fat). The order of meals ingested was determined by random allocation and was blinded to the investigators.

How did they provide the saturated and polyunsaturated meals? I mean it's hard to down a bunch of safflower oil and coconut oil all by themselves, so how did they get the subjects to eat all this fat?

Well, according to the paper

Subjects consumed 1 of 2 isocaloric meals comprising a slice of carrot cake and a milkshake containing 1 g of fat/kg of body weight.

Say what? Carrot cake and a milkshake?

Is there anything else in carrot cake and milkshakes besides fat? How about sugar and flour? Let's see what the article says about the nutritional breakdown of the carrot cake and milkshake meal. Would you believe that it doesn't say anything at all? Nada. Zip. Zero. Other than the fact that there is about 70 gms of fat per meal and that one meal contains 89.6% saturated fat and the other 75% polyunsaturated fat, we are provided with no nutritional information.

Never one to let researcher lack of openness stand in my way, I looked up a milkshake and carrot cake in my handy nutritional analysis program and worked backwards to calculate what else we would find in these foods along with the 70 grams of fat. Turns out that a piece of carrot cake contains about 55 grams of fat and 24 ounces of milkshake contains the other 15 grams. What else is in there along with the fat? How about 173 grams of carbohydrate, 143 grams of which is sugar. Remember, 100 grams of sugar is about a half cup, so 143 grams is almost 3/4 cup. Of sugar.

So, what we have are two meals: one high in refined carbohydrates and saturated fat, the other high in refined carbohydrates and polyunsaturated fats. In fact, both diets are higher in carbohydrates (in terms of calories) than they are in fat. Each diet contains 692 kcal of carb and 630 kcal of fat. If you add it all up, including the protein, you get a single meal containing 1426 kcal, most of which is carb.

We all know that the standard American diet, which is the high everything diet, causes problems. So, what these researchers have done is studied the standard American diet with two different types of fat. Assuming they found a difference, all they can really say is that saturated fat in combination with a ton of carbohydrates (mainly sugar) causes more problems than the same diet using polyunsaturated fat. What of value can we take away from any of these findings, assuming there are some? The researchers have used two foods that allow this kind of fat substitution and maintain their taste and mouthfeel. Any more--thanks to the food police--most foods containing saturated fat do so only because saturated fat has some cooking property that is necessary in the preparation of that particular food. Anything else is made with unsaturated fat. So, we have a study that may tell us that there is a difference between the actions of saturated fat and unsaturated fat in a giant, calorically dense meal that contains more carbohydrate than anything else. Who cares? The great unwashed masses who flock to the fast food places and chow down on 'indulgent' items certainly don't care. And the study isn't applicable to those following either low-fat or low-carb diets.

Let me get off my soap box and let's move on. The researchers did a number of evaluations on the subjects while they were fasting, gave them the 1426 kcal cake and milkshake diet, then repeated the evaluations at 3 hours and 6 hours after the meal.

What did they look at?

The researchers looked at four different parameters. They wanted to see if the difference in fat type made a difference in blood lipid and insulin levels, if it made a difference in the way the subjects arteries reacted in a couple of different ways, and they wanted to see if the different fats made the HDL particles less anti-inflammatory.

First, looking at the difference between serum total cholesterol, LDL, HDL, triglycerides, Insulin, and non-esterified fatty acid levels after the two diets, we find that only two--total cholesterol levels and LDL levels--are different to a statistically significant degree. Both were lower after the saturated fat meal. Now most low-fat advocates believe that LDL is the single most important lipid parameter in existence, but for some reason these guys chose to not even mention the fact that in this study LDL was lower on the saturated fat diet than on the polyunsaturated fat diet. I wonder why?

Next, the researchers performed two different tests for evaluating arterial function on the subjects. One of these tests was a measurement of forearm blood flow; the other was a measurement of brachial artery (a large artery in the arm) diameter change. Both of these methods of evaluation are difficult to explain using non-technical language, but basically both work in similar ways. When blood vessels are compressed with a tourniquet for a period of time, the arteries downstream from the area of restriction receive little to no blood. When the tourniquet is released, blow flows into the artery and the artery dilates. You can press your thumb hard into the inside of your forearm and hold it for 10 seconds. When you remove your thumb, the area underneath will be white. As you watch, the area under your thumb print will become pinkish red as blood flows back into it. The more quickly blood flows back in, the better your arterial and capillary function. The two tests used in this study look at this same thing only using much more sophisticated techniques.

In one of the two tests there was a slight difference in the negative direction at the 3 hour mark with the saturated fat diet, but overall there was no statistically significant difference between the two diets in either test.

Finally, the researchers performed a complicated evaluation of HDL samples incubated with human umbilical vein endothelial cells. I'll let them explain it.

Human umbilical vein endothelial cells were isolated and incubated with HDL samples at a concentration of 2, 4, or 8 μmol/l apoA-I in media containing 10% heat-inactivated serum for 16 h at 37°C in 5% CO2. Cells were incubated for a further 5 h in the basal or stimulated state following the addition of tumor necrosis factor-alpha (0.2 ng/ml). The cell surface expression of adhesion molecules was assessed with an enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay technique. Cellular viability was determined to be greater than 95% by trypan blue exclusion.

After incubation with the HDL collected after both the meals, there was a higher level of expression of ICAM-1 and VCAM-1 in the 'activated' cells incubated with the HDL from the saturated fat diet than from that from the polyunsaturated fat diet. This difference would seem to indicate that there may be a decrease in inhibition of these inflammatory molecules by the HDL from the saturated fat diet. And, although the data was difficult to determine from the paper, this difference apparently reached statistical significance. What we can't tell from the paper is if the difference really makes any difference in the real world of arterial function. In other words, I may get a statistically greater amount of ethanol in gasoline I purchase from Mobil than I do in gas I purchase from Chevron, but does it make a difference in how my car runs? Given all this, I will readily stipulate that HDL from the subjects who ate the high-carb, high-saturated fat diet has a reduced anti-inflammatory potential as measured in incubated human umbilical vein endothelial cells compared to the other HDL. But no one can tell me what it means--if anything--in real life.

I suspect that it doesn't mean a lot since the authors of the paper went to great lengths to play up the non-significant differences in the more direct tests. As mentioned before, there was not a single word about the differences in total cholesterol and LDL levels, which were significant.

The authors reported

A nonsignificant trend toward impairment of endothelium-dependent vascular reactivity in conduit arteries was also demonstrated after the saturated fat meal.

Hey, guys, there ain't no such animal. Just like a woman can't be trending toward pregnancy, there is no nonsignificant trend toward anything. It's either significant or it isn't. Period. Unless, of course, you're trying to pull the wool over someone's eyes.

There was a trend toward a greater post-prandial impairment seen after the consumption of the saturated compared with the polyunsaturated fat.

There they go again.

Although the meals had different effects on hyperemia in conduit and resistance vessels, the direction of the meal-related changes was similar in large and small vessel studies, with a trend toward a greater increase in flow after consumption of polyunsaturated fats.

And again.

Let's see what the conclusions of this study are. First, let's look at the conclusion in the abstract, which is the only part of this study that the vast majority of people will ever see.

Consumption of a saturated fat reduces the anti-inflammatory potential of HDL and impairs arterial endothelial function. In contrast, the anti-inflammatory activity of HDL improves after consumption of polyunsaturated fat. These findings highlight novel mechanisms by which different dietary fatty acids may influence key atherogenic processes.

Pretty darn unequivocal, I would say. These guys aren't shy. No pussyfooting around here.

Now let's look at the conclusions at the end of the paper, the ones someone would see who actually took the trouble to read the paper and see all the references to nonsignificant trending.

In summary, the present study raises the possibility that the differential effects of dietary fats on the anti-inflammatory potential of HDL and endothelial function may contribute to the apparent benefits of polyunsaturated over saturated diets observed in the epidemiologic literature.

Quite a difference I would say.

Now, go back and read the press reports now that you know the real story behind this study.

Once again, I've got to say, the anti-saturated fat bias is so pronounced that this mealy mouthed study was picked up by news services and newspapers all over the world and reported as gospel. All because the press report spun it the way they did. Well, I have to say it. The spin stops here.
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  #2   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 09:35
JHudson's Avatar
JHudson JHudson is offline
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 280/220/219 Male 6 2
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Quote:
First, looking at the difference between serum total cholesterol, LDL, HDL, triglycerides, Insulin, and non-esterified fatty acid levels after the two diets, we find that only two--total cholesterol levels and LDL levels--are different to a statistically significant degree. Both were lower after the saturated fat meal. Now most low-fat advocates believe that LDL is the single most important lipid parameter in existence, but for some reason these guys chose to not even mention the fact that in this study LDL was lower on the saturated fat diet than on the polyunsaturated fat diet. I wonder why?


Are you kidding me? This was a finding in the "saturated fat will kill you" studies quoted for the past few days?
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  #3   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 09:41
kaypeeoh kaypeeoh is offline
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We're all differently the same. Not everyone does well on lowcarb. On a strict Atkins diet my cholesterol went to 280.
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  #4   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 09:44
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Kay, did you ever consider it might be because you're sensitive to Arachondoic acid?
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  #5   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 10:46
TBoneMitch TBoneMitch is offline
OOOOOOOOOH YEAH!
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The cholesterol may rise, but what is doubtful is whether this increases your chance of suffering from CHD.
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  #6   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 11:25
jbrennsk's Avatar
jbrennsk jbrennsk is offline
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Plan: Atkins - Bernstein
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I read this in my local paper too. So many people BELIEVE without question whatever is printed in the newspaper. Most newspapers carry wire service stories VERBATIM. No questioning, no (egads!) reporting. Just fill up the space. And most people believe everything they read in the paper as gospel.

I started questioning newspapers many years ago after watching a late night Presidential address. It really doesn't mater who the President was because I learned something that hasn't changed. The press totally misrepresented what the gist of the address was and MADE UP their own story as to what the President said...including things he DID NOT SAY. I watched the address...I know what was said. Anyway, from that day forward...I do not believe anything I read in the paper as fact.

Joe
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  #7   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 11:53
Angeline's Avatar
Angeline Angeline is offline
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And that will never change because the media is not held accountable for what it says. They can print outright lies and there are no consequences.

There should be a disclaimer on every story that appears in the newspaper..something like "this information has not been validated by this paper, therefore we cannot assert that it is factual.

It might make people realize that what you read in the news is as real as your grandfather's wooden teeth.

There really is very little difference between the National Inquirer and the New York Times. The only difference is that the National Inquirer doesn't seriously expect people to believe their stories, but the NYT does.
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  #8   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 11:59
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mike_d mike_d is offline
Grease is the word!
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Plan: PSMF/IF
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Thumbs up In case you missed it.

That report is still getting press, but one showing the value of LC to lipid profiles I can only find one link:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13036768/
Quote:
These healthy changes were seen whether or not the men were eating less saturated fat, and whether or not they lost weight. The 54 percent carbohydrate diet resembles the normal diet many of us consume by following standard dietary recommendations, Krauss said. People can cut their carbohydrate intake to a level similar to that used in the study by "avoiding the kinds of food we don't need in our diet anyway — sugary foods, white rice, pasta, white bread," he added.
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  #9   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 12:16
Frogbreath Frogbreath is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angeline
The one we have been waiting for...enjoy!

http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/...ated_fat_s.html


"It's further evidence to support the need to aggressively reduce the amount of saturated fat consumed in the diet," says researcher Stephen J. Nicholls, MBBS, PhD, PRACP, FACC, a cardiologist at The Cleveland Clinic in Ohio.

And you thought that all those letters behind someone's name make him smart?



Here's mine: PhD, BFD
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  #10   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 12:55
catfishghj's Avatar
catfishghj catfishghj is offline
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Anthony Colpo has addressed this on his "striped down" website.
http://www.theomnivore.com/One_High...at_Meal%20.html
Very well done, like he always does.
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  #11   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 14:07
refmls refmls is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Angeline
And that will never change because the media is not held accountable for what it says. They can print outright lies and there are no consequences.

There should be a disclaimer on every story that appears in the newspaper..something like "this information has not been validated by this paper, therefore we cannot assert that it is factual.

It might make people realize that what you read in the news is as real as your grandfather's wooden teeth.

There really is very little difference between the National Inquirer and the New York Times. The only difference is that the National Inquirer doesn't seriously expect people to believe their stories, but the NYT does.



If you have ever seen the actual NYT newsprint, their masthead says right there "All the news that's fit to print". As I read it that really means "All the news WE think you should be reading", whether it really is or not. Big brother is not just the government, it's the media, too.
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  #12   ^
Old Tue, Aug-15-06, 22:55
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ItsTheWooo ItsTheWooo is offline
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I'm a little disappointed w. his rebuttal to be honest. He pretty much dodged the issue of sat fat and inflammation. I was really hoping to hear an explanation as to why this difference occured. Instead what we got was "it doesn't matter don't worry about it". Yea, it's true the effect was observed in a petrie dish but still, it was a significant finding IMO and it smacks of bias and lack of objectivity to denounce it unimportant (the very same he's accusing the researchers of). Don't ge tme wrong I *agree* with him that this doesn't invalidate low carbohydrate eating or finger saturated fat as a bad nutritional actor... but I don't like how Dr Eades tends to cherry pick data to support his views and denounce all that doesn't fit. For example, what he wrote about the NWCR the other day and how he magically concluded like 60% of the participants were specifically on LC diets... the evidence didn't support that conclusion though.

I enjoy reading him, I just wish he were more... fair. I trust him to explain things to me I as a layperson have a hard time understanding. I trust him to be interested primarily in the truth, understanding, and health of people. If even *I* catch him saying things which are untrue and illogical (so as to support his position), how can I trust him on the other stuff? I can't.

Then again, maybe the lesson is to take everything you hear from everyone with a grain of salt and do your own research...
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  #13   ^
Old Wed, Aug-16-06, 09:23
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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I have to admit I'd like to know more but I also realize that there probably isn't any research being done into why sat fat does this or if it is actually significant in the human test tube.
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  #14   ^
Old Wed, Aug-16-06, 10:20
ReginaW's Avatar
ReginaW ReginaW is offline
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Posts: 2,759
 
Plan: Atkins/Controlled Carb
Stats: 275/190/190 Female 72
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Progress: 100%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
it was a significant finding IMO and it smacks of bias and lack of objectivity to denounce it unimportant


The full-text clearly indicated there were few statistically significant differences between the two groups - in fact, both had what could be called "damage" done by the meal. As Dr. Eades pointed out (as did I in my blog) the statistically significant rise in LDL in those consuming the unsaturated fat was left alone and quietly ignored.

there were NO STATISTICALLY SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCES in HDL, triglycerides, insulin, non-esterfied fatty acids (NEFA), forearm bloodflow, peak flow, total hyperenemia, flow-mediated dialation, or blood vessel size.

What the researchers claimed to have was a trend...and quite frankly a "trend" is nothing but what you want it to be...because until statistical significance is reached, you ain't got squat to squawk about. All you can do is go theoretical and hypothesize that "if this or that" continued....you might, might, might see a statistically significant difference - or you might not. That's one important reason why p values are enforced to particular standards in research - to avoid this type of creative thinking that something might happen if only more time, more subjects or more whatever was in the trial.

Add to this the small sample size (way to small to provide any power) and the failure to even consider or measure the obvious confounding variables here - take the big picture, and Mike is right, the study sucks.
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  #15   ^
Old Wed, Aug-16-06, 11:57
Abd Abd is offline
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Plan: Atkins
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaypeeoh
We're all differently the same. Not everyone does well on lowcarb. On a strict Atkins diet my cholesterol went to 280.


Yeah, mine went over 300. But the HDL/LDL ratio improved, triglycerides were very low, and C-reactive protein was likewise very low, i.e., bboth were excellent, indicating low CVD risk. Overall, an improvement. Total cholesterol means very little, it seems.

And I didn't get the LDL fractionated, which would tell a more complete story. Not all LDL is created equal.
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