OK, my twopennyworth.
My family ate like MONSTERS. We had a tough life and food was the way my mother felt she was meeting our needs (and I can tell you sometimes there was not enough money to put food on the table). Bowls of barley stews, dumplings, huge plates of potatos - that's what we lived on.
At 14 I'd had enough. I had massive fights with my mother - I wanted less potato, less bread (remember that was how we used to lose weight anyway - when did we forget that?). At 11 I weighed 140 pounds, at 14 I took up karate and loss a sh*tload of weight - I was Action Man!
All well and good: until I hit my mid-twenties. Deeply depressed, lost love affair, lonely; well you get the picture. Comfort eating! Never managed to lose properly again. Thought I ate OK (ignore the 'treats' of 1/4 pounds of chocolate Brazils and Lemon Bon-Bons).
Finally, I've learnt this - EATING CARBS MAKES ME HUNGRY! And food is not what fills the hollow in your belly that has sat there forever.

time for me to chime in (even though i swore i'd go to bed half an hour ago...)

i agree with a lot of people on this thread. you know, i don't remember this, but apparently i didn't really eat very much when i was a child. my mum had to try creative ways to get me to eat. but i remember from the age of 9 or 10 getting ferociously addicted to chocolate and crisps. i ate them all the time. once i started going to secondary school, and had no adult supervision, i ate them even more - and bought them on the way home and ate them in my bedroom and hid the wrappers from my parents. what was that? emotional eating? binge eating? or an extreme insulin response?

i definitely ate my way to being 190 pounds by the age of 16. but i dieted my way to being 250 pounds by the age of 23. my weight stabilised at around 190 for years, but trying to diet, and starving my body, and fighting those cravings - well i lost weight twice, once at 16/17, and once at 22/23, and each time, after an extended period on weightwatchers, i snapped and went into binge mode, and the weight piled back on - plus more.

i don't believe it's a cop out to say that we are addicted and that it's NOT OUR FAULT. i have now been low carbing for over 2 years, and i have lost weight painlessly. most of that weight went when i was doing CAD and still eating plenty of treats during that reward meal. i am totally and utterly convinced of the insulin connection. i can FEEL how different my body reacts to food now. i have NEVER been able to stay on a diet so successfully before and not be at the end of my tether, feeling myself about to snap and binge and put it all back on. i feel fine. i feel in control. in 2+ years i think i have eaten 'emotionally' on maybe a couple of occasions. that's it. my life is not so different from when i was younger. i no longer believe that i was weak, or greedy, or eating from pain, or all those reasons people give us. if that was true, then LC wouldn't have worked for me either. but it has.

as for taking control of ourselves, well...sure. but how many of us were ever told about LCing as a way to do that? no, no, that's unhealthy, dangerous, it's a fad. i was destroying my body on my 'healthy' weightwatchers diet, by feeding it 'healthy' complex carbs 3 times a day, with lots of healthy veg, small amounts of protein and tiny amounts of fat. that's what was *supposed* to work and be good for me. it was nightmarish.

i am more impressed now by the sheer willpower it took me to stick with weightwatchers for over a year when i was at university than i am disappointed with myself for all the times i swore 'this time i'll diet' only to give up after 2 days and reach for the chocolate. i am amazed i managed to fight the cravings for that long that one time (when i was 16 i didn't diet for that long - i lost weight really quickly...aah to be young).

yes, i binged like crazy at times. hid food from others. ate secretly, when i wasn't even really hungry. just something made me keep buying the chocolate and crisps, keep eating them. other times even when i wasn't binging i ate too much food. but it wasn't greed. it was my body telling me to do it. it was a biochemical mechanism gone wrong. i am not to blame for that. i spent years of my life feeling like i was to blame, like i had some horrible moral flaw at the centre of my being for eating this way, looking this way. i'm reclaiming myself from that. i don't accept that shame anymore.

conversely, i really don't often accept the 'praise' heaped on me for having lost weight this time. sure, it's not always easy, and i am tempted to eat food i like. that i'm not 'allowed' - but i've been given the answer, and when the carb monster isn't in control, then i can say to myself, quite normally, what do you prefer? that chocolate, or to be thinner and healthier? and i know the answer, it's easy. carb monster is banished, insulin is down, i'm in control. so yes, it's wonderful i've lost weight, but part of me feels like telling people who praise me (particularly my parents, but then food/parents/issues...ugh) that it's like praising a diabetic who remembers to take their insulin shot. i'm just taking the medicine. that's all i'm doing. sometimes it's difficult, but compared to how it was before it's a walk in the park. i'm working with my body instead of against it.

in 28 months of low carbing, i've had many plateaus. i tend to lose rapidly for a few weeks and then stay the same weight for months. that can get disheartening - but i've stuck with it. because i KNOW that this is the answer my body so desperately needed. i've gone off plan occasionally, for a couple days, usually when it was too hard to stay on because of social/travel reasons, but always with the knowledge that i can get back on. that in itself is practically a miracle; the idea that i know i can get back in control without a problem. i am used to that 'snap' of losing the willpower and having the weight pile back on. i know that will never happen to me again. i can't say how grateful i am for that. i wasn't at a weight that was phsyically dangerous for me, but it was ruining my life nonetheless.

Deborah

Thanks so much for writing that. That was truly inspiring. I am in my 40s and have a lifetime of dieting experience, very little of it low carb.

I identify as a sugar addict... I tried that CAD diet where you have the hour to binge and the hour would become a week. Sigh.

Last time I tried low carb I didn't lose much weight and I got discouraged and left. I am back and determined to get healthy - the weight loss, although I want it sooo much, has to be secondary to good blood sugar, tryglyceride, and C-reactive protein readings....

I think that you do deserve positive feedback for sticking to it when society puts so many temptations in our way. When someone is a recovering alcoholic, there are very few people who will drag them into a bar and put a drink in their hand, and yet the equivalent of that has been done to me many times.

When I was in my early 30s I was in OA and I lost 110 pounds by giving up sugar and flour. My in laws, who had been so nasty about the weight I gained having my kids, were tremendously unsupportive, especially after I had lost the weight. My friends weren't there for me either - a number of them had never seen me fat. But they got their chance! I gained it all back and have been fat ever since. My kids - now 15 and 17 - don't remember when I was thin.

So yeah, you treated the disease. But others of us just let it run rampant. Not a moral issue - but I wish I had stuck with it 3 years ago. I let the people at work who offer me pizza have their way instead of continuing to make better choices.

I'm beginning to feel like there is a chance for me. (You have to understand that my endocrinologist has told me that I will never be thin. And my [former] asthma guy told me to go have a gastric bypass.) But maybe they are wrong!

I know I belong here, I only hope I can stick with it. I have started a journal and am trying to particiapte in the boards as I learn about my new WOE.... you have given me hope.

Thanks again.

I agree with a lot of what has been said, but I go back and forth on the issue of what gets us fat. I have to agree with MrE and Krya'sDad who but the onus on ourselves. I think as a society today we spend way too much time trying to find someone to blame for the situation that we are in and not enough on trying to solve it.

Thankfully we have found something here that we can do!! Now if we are willing to take the majority of the blame for getting here in the first place, then we all deserve to take a bow and get a hearty pat on the back for realizing that we had a problem that needed to be addressed and doing something about it.

That's my .02

As for what got me here, I was the closet eater. Not that I actually at in the closet , but you know. It started when I was younger and my parents did there best to keep me from eating sugar, but I enjoyed the taste of it too much. So because I couldn't eat it in front of them I would hide it, or eat as much as I could at a friends house, or go to the store (you get the idea). This just continued into adult hood. Even though my DW never 'watched over' what I was eating, I found myself feeling like I had to 'sneak' my favorite treat. At work someone would bring in doughnuts and I would have one, then later would go into the room where they were, look around to make sure no one was looking and then put one in a napkin and quick go back to my desk. As I look back on it now, the sad thing was, that I didn't even get to enjoy the taste of any of it because I was always to concerned about eating quick so no one would see me.

I can proudly say that in the four and a half months that I have been doing this woe, I have neve felt like I was 'sneaking' food.

So congrats to everyone who has posted in this thread for doing something to fix the situation you found yourself in, wether you feel that it was an addiction, genetics, a physical problem, or just poor choices. Kudos to you!!

Actually, that's quite within the realm of the carb addict. Part of the syndrome is never feeling satisfied no matter how much you eat. Add to that the plain fact that junk food tastes good and you're off to the races. I used to think that I was fat because food tasted good and more was even better. Of course more was better b/c the initial amount just didn't satisfy me. I never felt that feeling of satiety no matter how much I had. An open bag/box was an empty bag/box b/c there just never came a point where I felt like I'd had enough unless I was completely stuffed and even then it wasn't that I felt satisfied, it was that I was just too full to cram any more in there.

I feel the same way. In fact, I've recently had a few people tell me I should be so proud of all the weight I've lost and I've actually told them I really don't feel 'proud' b/c I don't really feel like I'm doing anything. As you put it, I'm taking my 'medicine' and it's managing the illness that made/kept me fat. I felt VERY proud whenever I lost weight on WW (any of the numerous times I did it) b/c it took an extraordinary amount of willpower to eat those tiny portions and fight the carb monster (who I didn't even know about at the time) for years at a time. I don't care how fat I was, no one was gonna tell ME that I didn't have willpower. Anyone who could stick to low fat/cal for years at a time has got willpower. That's for sure. However, there always comes a time when willpower alone isn't enough.

Thank goodness I've found a lifestyle where willpower isn't even an issue (for me).

What a horribly unsupportive thing for anyone to say to someone who is trying to manage their obesity. Unless your endo can see into the future, there is no way s/he can know that. There are very few people in this world that don't have the potential to be thin. It's all a matter of finding the plan that works for you and then working that plan.

Good luck to you!!

This is a healthy discussion to have, and I should edit some of what I've said to include a healthy dose of "IMO."

I do believe that there are physical factors that contribute to obesity. That's more or less indisputable, and they are uncovering stuff it seems every year that helps us understand the contribution these factors make.

But that's what they are: contributions.

The prime cause is that pesky law of thermodynamics. If we take in more than we use to live, we get fat. And every one of us is absolutely in control of that. It's more difficult for some than others. It's not even an issue for many people. But for us, for those who are more than 100 pounds overweight, we cannot allow these contributing factors to prevail. It's our responsibility not to. It's our fault if they do.

Blame. Fault. I am of the opinion that I bear it. It's not a badge of dishonor since all of us our flawed people. Reaching out and embracing that responsibility is what's allowed me to progress. Maybe it's just worked for me, but I feel that taking that control is precisely what overweight people need; that we by nature are people who let things happen to and around us. I have had to reject that way of thinking in all things.

So when I speak of blame, perhaps it's best to frame it as responsibility. Forget what made us fat, and work on what will free us from fat...knowing that from the moment we decide to fix it to the moment we fail or succeed, that nobody's in charge of the boat other than us.

I think that's a lot healthier way to phrase it than blame. Personally, I feel that my overeating was caused by a physical addiction that I had no knowledge of and the eating style that was supposed to be a "cure" for my obesity was the exact WRONG way for me to be eating. I, and many others I've spoken to in the 100+ club, have felt 'blamed' for our condition all of our lives. It's like blaming a diabetic for not being able to control their blood sugar levels. Most of the people I know have tried and tried for years to combat their overeating but, when you constantly have this gnawing desire to eat, obessive thoughts of food and never feel satisfied, there is only so far willpower is going to get you.

Personally, finding out that there is a way to eat that combats these physical urges and it wasn't just a matter of 'fault' or weakness on my part has helped me to beat this addiction. If I was walking around beating myself up for getting so fat and feeling like I was just too weak to lose the weight, I'd probably still be 400#. No, make that 400+# because we all know we just won't stay at one weight forever eating the way we used to.

As you said, who cares how we got fat. Let's just work on how we can keep from staying that way.

Thinking about "blame" and "guilt", trying to decide if those words come into play in my thinking about my weight. I have thought of my overeating as a "flaw" and a "weakness" and even my "fault" but I have lots of those. "Guilt" is too strong a word for what I feel, and I'm not a blamer in general. It's not as if we're going around robbing banks or murdering people or abusing children or something (although I do have my doubts about some of you...) we just tend to eat too much, for whatever reason, and we're not stealing the food from other people, either! So I guess what I'm saying is that we shouldn't beat ourselves up about it as much as we do. It is aggravating that we have been overweight, a pain in the a**, extremely inconvenient, embarrassing even, but here we are doing something about it. I, for one, love the praise and the compliments I am getting on my "achievement" so far. It has been a lot of work for me but it is a labor of love.

Liz

I remember in the last year talking to someone on the bus around 11 a.m. going home and people would ask me what I was gonna do for the day and I would say...I had to figure out what to make for dinner. Everyone would turn around and look at me, but food was constantly on my mind.

I have to disagree with the lady that said that you don't get fat by eating normally...that's true, serving sizes for us were more than regular folks, this we all know. But, I never ate a dozen of donuts, and I never ate a whole pizza by myself. And when I dieted I would follow the low fat/bland diet which was loaded with potatoes and rice. But I didn't eat a carton of ice cream...I ate 2 pieces of chicken, about 2 servings of rice with gravy and very little vegetables. I realize now that I was eating more than I should've and that contributed to my weight gain but the feeling of never being full has been a problem since I can remember.

Even my mother recently told me that I could never wait to eat snacks. I would eat it and then beg my siblings to share theirs. I can see the thing in my dd who is constantly hungry,even after eating dinner she immediately wants a snack and then not too long after she wants another snack. She wants to eat about 7 or 8 times a day. As soon as she's through eating she is thinking about her next meal...

I think not getting that signal in the brain that tells you your not full is definately why SOME of us can sit and eat a normal portion-(for us that's about 2 portions) and eat only one candy bar, a few soda's like regular folks and gain weight instead of gorging ourselves on a dozen of donuts. Not all of us did that and I was 370 lbs...gee ya'll are making me which I had've-(Just joking!!!)

It's not normal to not feel full, it's not normal for you to feel the need to constantly plan out your meals...it's not normal to feel that you're losing apart of you by dieting. I mourned the fact that I could no longer bake which I had just discovered a love for before LCing. My sister told me that once I started losing weight I would replace that feeling of needing to bake with things like walking and going out to the movies etc. Regular folk see food as a part of their lives, not as their lives. I know that as a child constantly wanting food was not something I could control. I even asked my dd recently why she was eating and her answer at 7 was...I'm just hungry, I'm still hungry.

I blame myself for stopping from buying Atkins at that bookstore nearly 4 yrs ago and listening to the bookstore woman who told me Atkins was a crackpot diet and I listened to her and instead bought the Dietbetic Diet cookbook which I later abandoned...I blame myself for not investigating into this WOE back then and instead gaining even more weight till I was nearly 400 lbs, just as my mom was. But, I don't blame myself for never feeling full...that was beyond my control...

What a fantastic thread.

I identify with everyone here.

I was a complusive eater. Could still be if i had not taken control.

I would eat anything and everything - and like many here it would be in 2-3 hour binges

it was not pleasure - it was hell. Pure hell. I had no control and ate and ate and ate (when i was alone i add) and people would say - i have no idea why you are gaining weight - you eat nothing

and i didnt - in front of them.

I would bin all the wrappers before my partner came home and once he found a bag of wrappers and confronted me

I said it was over the past week. yeah more like over the past hour - but i had to say something.

I became better at hiding them after that and no more was said.

Until i had a particular binge and felt so ill i was in bed for days with cramps

I knew i could not continue and started numerous low fat diets. to no avail whatsoever.

Then i started LC and at the start the weight fell off.

It still is - but it has slowed down but to a more managable level (for myself)

Thanks.

Wow, what an interesting discussion.

Has anyone else noticed it the difference in the attitudes between the men and women? Interesting.

I think the bottom line is that regardless of how we got here and who or what is to blame, or contributed to or whatever, we all agree that whatever got us here, it is our responsibility to change it.

The person blind from birth or a man in a wheel chair from an accident he helped to create may both feel differently about how they got to where they are, but in the end, they both have to be responsible for making the changes necessary to live the best life they can.

That's how I feel about my weight. I might disagree with you about what happened to get me here, but I do agree that I'm the one that has to step up and fix it.

Valerie

Not sure I do detect a difference at base: we all seem to know that there were reasons why we got fat, have all felt guilty and/or pissed off and now want to do something.

But still, the experiences are something worth the sharing. Shall we talk about the problems around finding partners and forming relationships when you're fat? Nothing like feeling like an unlovable freak to help with the self-esteem.

Every day of my life I fight the unlovable freak in me. I have discovered though, that I would be a freak even if I'm thin. In one sense my fat is a shield. If someone rejects me now, it hurts like hell, but I can always blame it on my fat. If someone rejects me when I am thin, that is somehow much more personal.

I have also been borderline abused by an authority figure in my life, plus there were no men in my life when I grew up. These two factors have combined to make me terrified of males. Am beginning to get over it though. If I'm thin, I have to deal with those fears more often as well.

I guess my conclusion though is that I *know* I am smart, and at some level that I am worthy of love. Everyday I try to remind myself of these facts. This forum also helps me remind myself and it provides support and impetus for exercise and smarter diet choices.

My sincere thanks to all the beautiful honest people on this thread and this forum.
Birdie