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  #31   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 13:01
Shortdraw Shortdraw is offline
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Posts: 36
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 214/130/135 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 106%
Location: Central Illinois
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While class-ism may have something to do with it. The majority of the attacks on McDonald's are because of it's popularity.

It's the largest food chain in the world, serving close to 60 million customers each day.

(personally, I much prefer Burger King)

I think I'm going to buy a couple copies of Fathead. I have friends who are otherwise quite smart but just can't get past the 'consensus' on saturated fat. I don't hold much hope that it will change their minds... but it can't hurt.
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  #32   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 13:14
capmikee's Avatar
capmikee capmikee is offline
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Posts: 5,160
 
Plan: Weston A. Price, GFCF
Stats: 165/133/132 Male 5' 5"
BF:?/12.7%/?
Progress: 97%
Location: Philadelphia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shortdraw
While class-ism may have something to do with it. The majority of the attacks on McDonald's are because of it's popularity.

That would be a reasonable angle to take, and I'm sure that's why The Media Foundation chose McDonald's as a target - McDonald's is a huge symbol of globalization not only because of their restaurants opening all over the world, but because of the way they take over land in every country to grow their very own kind of livestock and potatoes. And that's what Slow Food has responded to.

I got mad at Adbusters because they think it's OK to use the same kind of brainwashing techniques that corporate advertisers do. They're more interested in "winning" than in telling the truth. That's very dangerous.
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  #33   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 14:09
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Posts: 25,865
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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It definitely is classism. Pollan made that point in his book. The stuff starbucks has, other than their pure coffee and teas, is absolute garbage. But people roll up their in the BMW's and spend $10 for a snack and feel somehow superior.
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  #34   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 20:22
tnaughton tnaughton is offline
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Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 215/195/180 Male 71 inches
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Default NetFlix, classism, etc.

Netflix placed an order for Fat Head early this week. Should be available for rent any day now.

I agree that much of the vitriol directed at McDonald's is about class, as is much of the vitriol directed at the obese. As Eric Oliver points out, the adjectives used to denigrate fat people are often the same as those used to denigrate minorities and the poor. "Lazy" comes to mind, but as Gary Taubes made clear in GCBC, poor people are often fat despite working long hours at manual jobs. Laziness isn't the problem.

The L.A. city council recently voted to stop allowing fast-food franchises to locate new restaurants in poor neighborhoods ... because gee whiz, THOSE PEOPLE don't know what's good for them, right? That's classism. Didn't seem to occur to the city council that they were also reducing the number of jobs available to poor teens.

If you really wanted to get fat and screw up your health, you could drop by Ben & Jerry's every night for a big bowl of Cherry Garcia -- but a Morgan Spurlock would never do that for a film, because Ben & Jerry's is a hip operation that appeals to hip customers. Same goes for Starbucks, as someone pointed out.

I always find it interesting when people hate a corporation merely for being so large and successful. As someone who has read many books on economics (another subject I nearly as interesting as nutrition ... also one of Mike Eades' favorite topics), I try to explain to those people that a business like McDonald's can only become large and successful by offering something that millions of people want at a price they consider fair. (Oh, the horror of it all!) After all, doctors don't prescribe Big Macs and the people buying them can't turn the bill into their insurance companies. They choose to trade the cash for the burgers.

As soon as we all (I hope) convince the majority of the public to go low-carb, McDonald's will no doubt be offering a nice variety of low-carb meals. They can only sell what people are willing to buy.
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  #35   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 22:13
Utah Jake Utah Jake is offline
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Posts: 98
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 203/184/180 Male 5' 11"
BF:
Progress: 83%
Location: St George, Utah
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Tom:

I hope your film gain wide distribution. It will save many lives by teaching people a healthy way to eat.
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  #36   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 22:24
jschwab jschwab is offline
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Posts: 6,378
 
Plan: Atkins72/Paleo/NoGrain/IF
Stats: 285/220/200 Female 5 feet 5.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bike2work
I think it's about class-ism. The very worst menu by any nutritional standard is that at Starbucks. But Starbucks is white-collar while McDonalds is blue-collar. So McDonalds is villainized while no one ever comments on the nutritional atrocity of Starbucks food.

Think of any high-end restaurant out there. The menu will invariably have refined sugar, refined flour, transfats, saturated fats, high-fat items, high-carb items, and so on. Their configuration may be different, and the food will probably be better, but you can eat badly anywhere. Nonetheless, the nutrition experts continue to point fingers at only the blue-collar restaurants.

I've eaten at many of the best restaurants in this country and in Europe and from a macronutient standpoint, those meals were all just as bad as fast food. When I lost 86 pounds on low carb I was eating breakfast at McDonalds (two sausage egg muffins, sans muffins) every single day. I ate many lunches and dinners there too (I was an unemployed grad student). And I never felt better.


Before I low-carbed I once made the mistake of buying banana bread at Starbucks. Now I am a very polite woman and usually eat the cost of something no matter how disgusting and just toss it up as "lesson learned". But this "banana" bread didn't have a lick of banana in it - it was obviously made from fake banana flavoring. I actually demanded my money back, which is very uncharacterisic for me, but it was shockingly bad.
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  #37   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 23:03
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KarenJ KarenJ is offline
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Posts: 1,564
 
Plan: tasty animals with butter
Stats: 170/115/110 Female 60"
BF:maintaining
Progress: 92%
Location: Northeastern Illinois
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnaughton
As soon as we all (I hope) convince the majority of the public to go low-carb, McDonald's will no doubt be offering a nice variety of low-carb meals. They can only sell what people are willing to buy.


As a capitalist libertarian, I thoroughly agree. Vote with your wallet!

The only problem I see is that people need to have food that can be picked up and eaten by the fingers on-the-go. I've (more than enough times) eaten a burger with half a bun (or no bun), but eating a burger/salad with a hunk of meat requires a knife and fork. Perhaps if they actually cut through the hunk completely that would help? I'm thinking chop salad, where the meat is already cut up.
People need food on-the-go. Finger food. Good quality finger food.
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  #38   ^
Old Wed, Feb-11-09, 23:27
capmikee's Avatar
capmikee capmikee is offline
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Posts: 5,160
 
Plan: Weston A. Price, GFCF
Stats: 165/133/132 Male 5' 5"
BF:?/12.7%/?
Progress: 97%
Location: Philadelphia
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Yes, bread does make finger food handy. The first part of The Omnivore's Dilemma talks about how fast food is designed to be eaten in the car.

I'm sure they'll figure it out - pork-rind encrusted McNuggets anyone?

Edit - recently someone mentioned Wendy's or BK offering lettuce-wrapped burgers.
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  #39   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 11:31
tnaughton tnaughton is offline
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Posts: 24
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 215/195/180 Male 71 inches
BF:
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Default Burger wraps

In 'N' Out Bugers, a popular chain in California, has been offering a "protein style" option for years. They wrap the burger in big lettuce leaves.

It's caught on at McDonald's too, at least in our area. When I request a burger with no bun, they always ask if I want it wrapped in lettuce.

There's hope.
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  #40   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 11:41
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Posts: 25,865
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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I think most fast food places offer lettuce wrapped burgers now. In & Out is awesomesauce.

I'd like to see a paleo fast food joint someday. That'd be interesting.
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  #41   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 11:43
Shortdraw Shortdraw is offline
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Posts: 36
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 214/130/135 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 106%
Location: Central Illinois
Default

Hardee's offers a low carb, lettuced wrapped burger.

When I order a double whopper sans bun, they put it a bowl and give me a fork. No problems.
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  #42   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 12:11
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Wifezilla Wifezilla is offline
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Posts: 4,367
 
Plan: I'm a Barry Girl
Stats: 250/208/190 Female 72
BF:
Progress: 70%
Location: Colorado
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Quote:
I'd like to see a paleo fast food joint someday. That'd be interesting.

As soon as I figure out how to clone a mastadon, I am SO opening one
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  #43   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 14:40
folkshot's Avatar
folkshot folkshot is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 507
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 220/255/180 Female 5'5"
BF:
Progress: -88%
Location: UT
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tnaughton
In 'N' Out Bugers, a popular chain in California, has been offering a "protein style" option for years. They wrap the burger in big lettuce leaves.

It's caught on at McDonald's too, at least in our area. When I request a burger with no bun, they always ask if I want it wrapped in lettuce.

There's hope.

Yep, most Carl's Jr. restaurants do this as well.
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  #44   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 14:57
kyrasdad's Avatar
kyrasdad kyrasdad is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,060
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 338/253/210 Male 5'11"
BF:
Progress: 66%
Location: Broken Arrow, Oklahoma
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tnaughton
The L.A. city council recently voted to stop allowing fast-food franchises to locate new restaurants in poor neighborhoods ... because gee whiz, THOSE PEOPLE don't know what's good for them, right? That's classism. Didn't seem to occur to the city council that they were also reducing the number of jobs available to poor teens.


There was a debate about this on this site a few months ago, and the people who defended the law ducked the question: if you remove all the fast food joints from poor neighborhoods, what comes into their place? Do we magically get salad bars, baked chicken, and asparagus? Do we elite of those cities who propose to take choices away from the poor open nutritious kitchens in their neighborhoods?

I am not admirer of fast food. I think it can have a destructive effect. I think its marketing to children should be outlawed. But I cannot see what good Los Angeles thinks it will do. (At the time some of us were called "corporate apologists for asking that very simple question).

If the ban had been city-wide, I'd have respected it more. But still believed that it would serve no particular purpose other than letting people feel good about having done something, when in fact they did nothing.
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  #45   ^
Old Thu, Feb-12-09, 17:40
tnaughton tnaughton is offline
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Posts: 24
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 215/195/180 Male 71 inches
BF:
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Default Paleo restaurant idea

Okay, I'm combining two thoughts into one idea:

1. My daughters, now five and three, love watching "Man vs. Wild." (Warning to parents: if you let your children watch this show, you will soon catch them eating bugs. They'll even have opinions about which bugs taste best.)

2. For awhile, "cook your own steak" restaurants were the rage.

So ... I say we open a paleo restaurant where you get to stalk and kill your own dinner, then cook it over a roaring fire. The restaurant will supply a well-stocked mini-forest, clubs, spears, flint knives, and a cooking pit. Near-nakedness will be encouraged.

The PETA people will no doubt protest, but they're usually spindly little people, so we can just ask our children to push them out of the way.
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