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  #1   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 10:06
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default HCG P2 Challenge/Progress Part III

This is a continuation of the hCG Phase 2 threads here:
Part I http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=420922
Part II http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=427175
Link to the stabilization and maintenance thread (P3, P4):http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=422160

I thought a good way to begin the new thread would be with a summary of what hCG is, how it works, and the Dr. Simeon's protocol.


1. hCG is Human Chorionic Gonadotropin. It’s a hormone produced in great abundance by pregnant women. It is the hormone tested for by home pregnancy kits.

2. The purpose of hCG is to increase metabolism and fat-burning, in order to provide a growing human embryo a steady supply of rich nutrition in the early stages of the pregnancy, when heart, brain, nervous system, etc is forming (mother may not even know she's pregnant, let alone be eating nutritiously). HCG accomplishes this by accessing the abnormal fat stores in the body, and releasing this fat.

3. The FDA approved use of hCG is as a fertility treatment in females, and select hormonal treatment in males. It is not approved as a weight loss drug, but US doctors can prescribe it "off-label".

3. The use of hCG as a diet aid was first discussed in a report (Pounds & Inches) that Dr. A.T.W. Simeons published in 1954, who discovered that his patients could drastically reduce their caloric intake without experiencing hunger or weakness while taking it. Over 16 years of research, he developed the hCG diet protocol.

4. Taking hCG in and by itself will not cause weight loss. A drastic decrease in calories must accompany the hCG. Users are prescribed a 500 calorie a day diet. Without hCG, this would be a starvation diet, and mess up metabolism. As much muscle tissue as fat would be lost. Hunger would make the diet non-sustainable. Any weight lost would quickly return as soon as normal levels of calories were consumed.
WITH hCG, up to 2000 calories a day worth of FAT is released from abnormal fat stores. The body is well-fed off this fat; muscle tissue loss does not occur. Slowing of metabolism does not occur. Appetite is naturally suppressed and hunger is not felt. Weight does not return when the diet is ended.

5. Average rate of weight loss is about 1 pound a day for men, .5 - .75 pound a day for women.

6. Since hCG accesses abnormal fat deposits, a loss in girth and reshaping of body contour is quickly noticeable.

7. Dr. Simeons wrote that he believed hCG works on the hypothalamus to cause a change in set point and metabolism, thus resulting in a "cure" for obesity. The details of this mechanism are found in "Pounds and Inches", readily available to download from the internet.

8. Naysayers say sure, anyone can expect to lose a pound a day while eating 500 calories, the hCG isn't doing anything. A number of double-blind placebo studies comparing hCG + a 500 calorie diet to placebo + a 500 calorie diet have been performed, and there was no difference in weight loss. The naysayers are missing the point. See #4 and 7 above.

9. Dr Simeons said that a minimum of 23 injections is needed, even if the patient reaches his/her normal weight before that (weight loss is self-limiting, as only abnormal fat stores are lost, normal and structural fat stores are spared) because it seems that in cases of obesity, where the hypothalamus has been exhausted by long periods of overuse, about three weeks rest is needed for it to regain normal function. This "reset" is the key to maintaining the weight loss.

10. The reason for limiting a course to 40 injections is that by then some patients may begin to show signs of HCG immunity. Some may show signs before that, so skipping one day out of 7 may be used to help avoid immunity and prolong the weight loss period.

11. After 40 daily injections it takes about six weeks before the immunity is lost and HCG again becomes fully effective.

12. After the last injection, hCG will still be in circulation in the body for about 3 days. The 500 calorie diet must continue during these 3 days, as increasing calories while the hCG is still in the system could lead to rapid weight regain.

13. The first 2 days of injections are called "load days" and the patient is instructed to eat to capacity of all the high-caloric fattening food they can choke down. "One cannot keep a patient comfortably on 500 Calories unless his normal fat reserves are reasonably well stocked. It is a fundamental mistake to put a patient on 500 Calories as soon as the injections are started, as it seems to take about three injections before abnormally deposited fat begins to circulate and thus become available."

14. So, the normal course of treatment is as follows:
HCG 125 - 175iu daily injection for 23 to 40 injections. Skipping one day in 7 is optional but advised.
Phase 1: First 2 injection days, forced feeding.
Phase 2: After 3rd injection, 500 calorie diet of specific allowed foods to be continued until 72 hours after the last injection. 1 to 2 gallons of water a day must also be drank.
Phase 3: For the following 3 weeks, all foods allowed except carbohydrate, starch and sugar in any form. Slowly and gradually increase calories, introducing 1 new food a day, until you are eating at your calorie limit (Your weight, or desired weight, x 10 (women) or x 11 (men)).
Phase 4: After 3 weeks, very gradually add carbs in small quantities, always controlled by morning weighing. If ever a 2 pound gain is seen, immediately do a correction day: See “Pounds & Inches”.
FOOD PLAN
BREAKFAST (is basically skipped): Tea or coffee in any quantity without cream or sugar.
LUNCH:
100 grams (3.5 ounces) of veal, beef, chicken breast, fresh white fish, lobster, crab, or shrimp. All visible fat must be carefully removed before cooking, and the meat must be weighed raw. It must be boiled or grilled without additional fat. Salmon, eel, tuna, herring, dried or pickled fish are not allowed. The chicken breast must be removed from the bird.

One type of vegetable only to be chosen from the following: spinach, beet greens, fennel, chard, lettuce, tomatoes, celery, onions, radishes, cucumbers, asparagus, cabbage.

One grissino breadstick or one Melba toast.

A small apple, orange, 6 strawberries or one-half grapefruit.

DINNER : The same four choices as lunch.

The juice of one lemon daily is allowed for all purposes. Salt, pepper, vinegar, mustard powder, garlic, sweet basil, parsley, thyme, marjoram, etc., may be used for seasoning, but no oil, butter or dressing.

Tea, coffee, plain water, or mineral water are the only drinks allowed, but they may be taken in any quantity and at all times. Only one tablespoonful of milk allowed in 24 hours. Saccharin or Stevia may be used. It is important to drink about 2 liters of these fluids per day.

The fruit or the breadstick may be eaten between meals instead of with lunch or dinner, but not more than four items listed for lunch and dinner may be eaten at one meal. Allowed substitution for meat (no more than once per day) 1 egg + 3 egg whites, or ˝ c of skim (fat free) cottage cheese. No other cheeses allowed.

Link to Dr Simeon's original manuscript, "Pounds & Inches":
http://endthefat.net/simeonspi.pdf

Taking it a step beyond "pounds & Inches", an excellent blog and book, Weight-Loss Apocalypse, with some more up-to-date theories on how and why hcg works: http://weightlossapocalypse.blogspot.com/

Last edited by MizKitty : Thu, Jul-05-12 at 13:03.
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  #2   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 10:12
jande2211 jande2211 is offline
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Posts: 2,631
 
Plan: Atkins/M&E
Stats: 165/127.1/115 Female 63"
BF:
Progress: 76%
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I was briefly in the other thread and had used hhcg drops. I was wondering if anyone uses hcg without prescription and where they got the drops/injection materials. Would appreciate the help as I want to do this again but had a lot of difficulty with the second go at hhcg drops I last used. Thanks in advance!
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  #3   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 10:24
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default

That was going to be the topic of my next post, Jande, so thanks!

HCG is a prescription-only drug (even though it's a natural hormone) in the USA. The only way to obtain real hCG in the US is to get a doctor to prescribe it for you (and there are quite a few weight loss clinics that offer it) or to buy it from an out-of-the-country source.

Forum rules here prohibit posters from naming specific buying sources, but there are a number of dedicated hCG forums around the web where "where to buy" is discussed freely.

Please be warned. In prior years, it was possible to buy homeopathic hCG (hhcg) in the USA. Just a few months ago, December 2011, the FDA cracked down on that. THERE ARE NOW NO PRODUCTS SOLD OVER THE COUNTER IN THE USA OR ONLINE FROM USA-BASED WEBSITES, THAT ARE SELLING A PRODUCT WITH HCG IN IT. That means the bottles of drops called HCG you see at GNC, Walmart, Walgreens, CVS, or online at sites like HCG1234, or any others, are scams. They contain amino acids and other "proprietary blends" of appetite suppresants, but no hCG. You will lose weight, but you will be on a starvation diet, with all the dangers that entails. You will be losing normal fat and muscle mass, slowing your metabolism, and you will not be resetting your hypothalamus. Without hCG, you're basically doing Kimkins. Immediate regain of any weight lost is a given.

I know there are many Canadian users of this board, I hope one will pop in here and speak to the buying situation in Canada.

How to know if your homeopathic drops have any hCG in it:
The ingredients will list "Human Chorionic Gonadotropin", followed by the dilution and strength, something like 6X, 12X, 30X, 60X. If you don't see that, you are not on hCG, homeopathic or otherwise.

Before you buy oral HCG from ANYONE, look at their website carefully. If they will not tell you how much HCG and what else is in the bottle itself, If it brags "Hormone Free!" (like that's a good thing), or it's called "HCG Support" or a hundred other scams, DO NOT BUY IT! Those websites do all they can to distract from what and how much of the ingredients are actually in the bottle they are selling.

It doesn't matter if they claim FDA approval (the FDA NEVER issue approvals for HCG), how professional their websites look, if they offer money back guarantees or promise you will lose 2 pounds a day. Selling "HCG" that literally has NO HCG in the bottle is the worst marketing diet scam on the Internet! DON'T FALL FOR IT.

If you want to DIY, you can purchase freeze-dried hCG from some reliable overseas pharmacies. You can then mix it for either injections or sublingual drops. Instructions for how to do it, youtube videos showing how, mixing kits with everything you need, are readily available. You will just need to do your research on some of the dedicated hCG forum sites around the web. One I recommend is hcgdietinfo.

Last edited by MizKitty : Thu, Jun-21-12 at 20:02.
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  #4   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 11:19
4beatgaits's Avatar
4beatgaits 4beatgaits is offline
New Member
Posts: 15
 
Plan: hcg diet
Stats: 177/177/130 Female 5'5"
BF:globs
Progress: 0%
Location: Mountain Center, CA
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Oh gosh this is so alarming. My bottle lists HCG 3x 6x 12x 30x 60x but now I'm worried it's not the real thing because it's made in California. Or maybe it's a leftover lot they had before the change in rules. I guess I had better get a pregnancy test and see if it's legit. Will let you know this afternoon. Shoot!
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  #5   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 11:26
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default HCG P2 Challenge/Progress Thread Part III

I don't think you need to worry if it says that. The changed formulas no longer list the 3x 6x stuff.
For example, hCG1234 used to sell real hhcg, but here's the ingredients list of the revised post-fda crackdown formula:

HCG 1234, Active Ingredients: Proprietary hcg1234 complex formula 160mg, L-Omithine, L-Carnitine, L-Arginine, L-Glutamine, Maca, Niacin, Pygeum Africanum, Beta-Alanine, Rhodiola, Astragalus.
Inactive Ingredients: Water, 20% USP Grade Alcohol.

Notice how misleading that is, calling their proprietary blend of amino acids "Proprietary hcg1234 complex". I can see how people would think it has hCG in it.

But it looks like yours does.

Last edited by MizKitty : Wed, Mar-21-12 at 11:31.
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  #6   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 12:31
colipdx's Avatar
colipdx colipdx is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 148
 
Plan: Atkins, hCG Diet
Stats: 168/120/120 Female 64 inches
BF:30%/25%/23%
Progress: 100%
Location: Oregon
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Hi Jande2211 - I just researched like a crazy person till I found an online source that felt right to me. It is all a crap shoot at some level I suppose so it is a matter of faith when you decide to actually place your order. The day I went to order all the online pharmacies stopped selling it so I had to find an alternative. Mine came from Hong Kong and I mixed it myself. I am doing injections of hCG.

It is totally confusing at first so don't be alarmed if you feel like you are all mixed up etc. Just keep researching till it becomes clear in your head. Then you know you are ready to purchase. At least I did.

Also, it took 14 business days on the nose to arrive at my door.

How was everyone's weigh in today? Just a refresher from the last thread - I am down to 137 (-1.4) pounds today; totaling -2.4 lbs from my preloading weight. On P2VLCD3 today. Getting my rhythm. For me it is essential to eat three snacks(10 AM/3 PM/8 PM) and have my lunch within 6 hours of waking and then dinner within 6 hours of lunch.

Last edited by colipdx : Wed, Mar-21-12 at 12:38.
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  #7   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 12:37
jande2211 jande2211 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,631
 
Plan: Atkins/M&E
Stats: 165/127.1/115 Female 63"
BF:
Progress: 76%
Default

Colipdx, do you have the hhcg or the hcg? When you said you mixed it, I figured it to be the hcg. Grrrr, so much information.

4beatgaits, I too had one hhcg that said 3x,6, etc., and it worked fine. The second one I got, can't remember, but I was terribly hungry and moody with it, barely got thru 23 days. That's why I'm thinking of going with the hcg.
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  #8   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 12:44
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default

Quote:
How was everyone's weigh in today? Just a refresher from the last thread - I am down to 137 (-1.4) pounds today; totaling -2.4 lbs from my preloading weight. On P2VLCD3 today. Getting my rhythm. For me it is essential to eat three snacks(10 AM/3 PM/8 PM) and have my lunch within 6 hours of waking and then dinner within 6 hours of lunch.


Doing good here, too. No issues with hunger or lack of energy, in fact, my husband and I were both comparing how we've never felt better. I'm doing a longer round, I'm down 24 pounds on VLC day 31. It's been slow the last few days, I think I'm due a whoosh!

For me, I prefer eating all my calories in one meal, especially on work days, so I'm kind of doing an IF version of P2. On my days off, I will do 2 meals. For me, snacking between meals always sets up the desire to keep on snacking, with hunger not having anything to do with it.

Hubs is finishing his first week of P3. I got on him the morning I found him making himself a bowl of frosted flakes with milk for breakfast, but then decided he's an adult and I'm not the food police, and let him do what he wants to do and see the consequences. He was up 1.2 pounds the next day. Since then, I don't think he's had anything carbier than a piece of fruit, and he's lost 3 more pounds. It doesn't surprise me he'd lose on LC, as he was pretty much on an ALL-carb diet before! lol
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  #9   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 13:17
gadge's Avatar
gadge gadge is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 504
 
Plan: HCG
Stats: 28/22/16 Female 72 inches
BF:yes
Progress: 50%
Location: LA Metro
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I'm doing great today; no weakness or tired feeling. I'm drinking all my water and got a good night's sleep, which was a tremendous help.

Day 15 of VLC, and around as many pounds--again, my scale is stupid. But the clothes are looser and looser.

Ginger Ahi and fennel with balsamic vinegar and a hint of onion for lunch. Yay!
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  #10   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 13:21
colipdx's Avatar
colipdx colipdx is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 148
 
Plan: Atkins, hCG Diet
Stats: 168/120/120 Female 64 inches
BF:30%/25%/23%
Progress: 100%
Location: Oregon
Default

MizKitty - are you skipping a day every 7 since you are on a long phase? Just curious.

Jande2211 - see my prior post, I made an edit to include an answer to your questions above. The "mixing" refers to adding bac. water into the freeze dried hcg pellets to liquify them etc. YouTube is a great source of info on all this.
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  #11   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 13:36
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default

Quote:
MizKitty - are you skipping a day every 7 since you are on a long phase? Just curious.


Hi colip, yes I do, I skip injecting on Sundays. Can't tell a difference.
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  #12   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 14:11
doreen T's Avatar
doreen T doreen T is offline
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Posts: 37,203
 
Plan: LC paleo/ancestral
Stats: 241/188/140 Female 165 cm
BF:
Progress: 52%
Location: Eastern ON, Canada
Exclamation

REMINDER!

Dear members,

Our forum rules state:
Quote:
By clicking the Agree button, you warrant that you will abide by these rules and not post any messages that are knowingly [ ... ] violative of any laws.

1. Injectable/sublingual hcg is a drug which requires a prescription from a qualified medical practioner. Procuring this drug from any source, including overseas, without a prescription is unlawful. Do not post links, advice or information on how and where to obtain this - or any other - drug without a legally-obtained prescription. Please consult a qualified health care professional who can provide the appropriate information to you.

2. Homeopathics are regulated as drugs - not "health food" supplements - by the FDA. As of December 2011, the FDA banned all over-the-counter products containing homeopathic hcg in the USA (more information here). Health Canada has not "officially" banned the OTC sale of these products, but more and more individuals and businesses are having their shipments seized at the border. Please do not post links or information about where to buy these homeopathic drugs. As with the prescription form of this drug, you should consult with a qualified health practitioner who can provide information that's appropriate for you.

3. Most countries/states/provinces have strict regulations as to who can dispense medical advice such as information about preparing, dosing and administering drugs. Please do not post instructions for preparing, dosing or administering hcg. Readers are advised to consult a qualified health practitioner for this information.


Thanks for your attention and co-operation in this matter


Doreen
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  #13   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 15:04
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
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Thanks for the reminder!
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  #14   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 15:15
MizKitty's Avatar
MizKitty MizKitty is offline
95% Sugar Free!
Posts: 7,010
 
Plan: Very high fat LC/HCG
Stats: 310/155.4/159 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 102%
Location: Missouri
Default

Experienced Phase 2'ers, how, if any, have you "tweaked" the food plan? This is a Low Carb forum... are you doing a lower carb version? Are there foods other than the limited protocol list you have successfully eaten on P2? Have you used artificial sweeteners other than stevia or saccharine? How important do you think it is to do the food plan exactly as written by Dr. Simeons? Please share your experiences with others.
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  #15   ^
Old Wed, Mar-21-12, 16:08
doxiemama's Avatar
doxiemama doxiemama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 915
 
Plan: HCG R2 10/17/11
Stats: 176/159.6/155 Female 5.5
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: So. California Desert
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MizKitty
Experienced Phase 2'ers, how, if any, have you "tweaked" the food plan? This is a Low Carb forum... are you doing a lower carb version? Are there foods other than the limited protocol list you have successfully eaten on P2? Have you used artificial sweeteners other than stevia or saccharine? How important do you think it is to do the food plan exactly as written by Dr. Simeons? Please share your experiences with others.


Justy marking the new thread. Will post more about what you asked later
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