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  #1   ^
Old Mon, Jul-26-21, 11:21
CarlieW CarlieW is offline
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Posts: 93
 
Plan: Low Carb
Stats: 200/186/135 Female 61in
BF:
Progress: 22%
Default Intuitive Eating

I don't understand IE.
I have been watching a YouTuber who promotes this lifestyle and she seems out of touch with reality.

She praises obese people for choosing junk food over healthy foods.
She reprimands people for calling certain foods junk or trash or bad.
She reprimands people for not wanting to keep junk food in the house since they know they will over eat it.

Why would a person who is trying to lose weight and struggles with junk food cravings want to keep those foods in the home? She made a statement that she has ice cream and treats in her home but doesn't even think about them. What kind of $*&! is that? Who says that to a person who is struggling with overeating?

Am I missing something?
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  #2   ^
Old Mon, Jul-26-21, 11:51
wbahn's Avatar
wbahn wbahn is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 8,651
 
Plan: Atkins-ish, post-WLS
Stats: 408.0/288.0/168.0 Male 72 inches
BF:
Progress: 50%
Location: Southern Colorado, USA
Default

I haven't heard of Intuitive Eating before and so I just went out and did some reading on it and it sounds like a bunch of tripe to me. According to this philosophy, it is disrespectful to our bodies to not cater to every whim we have and we show respect for our bodies by learning to be happy with whatever results.

So let's be consistent with this philosphy. An alcoholic is disrespecting their body by trying to control their drinking. If their body wants a drink, they should have the drink and respect their body by learning to accept whatever results.

But why stop there. If a student doesn't want to study, they shouldn't study since, to do so, would be to disrespect their body. An abusive parent shouldn't control their urges to beat their childen, they should respect their body and learn to accept whatever results. We should never discipline our children for doing anything wrong because they are just respecting their bodies and doing whatever feels good to them at the moment.

What utter, shear, tripe.
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  #3   ^
Old Mon, Jul-26-21, 12:27
wbahn's Avatar
wbahn wbahn is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 8,651
 
Plan: Atkins-ish, post-WLS
Stats: 408.0/288.0/168.0 Male 72 inches
BF:
Progress: 50%
Location: Southern Colorado, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlieW
What kind of $*&! is that? Who says that to a person who is struggling with overeating?

Am I missing something?


I think what you're missing is that the whole notion of IE seems to be that the person simply shouldn't struggle with overeating. The problem isn't the overeating needs to stop, it's the struggling with it that needs to stop. If their body wants to overeat, then the "right" thing to do in order to "respect their body" is to overeat. Instead of trying to control your overeating, you need to embrace it and accept that your body is becoming the body it is meant to be and so you should be happy with whatever results.

It sounds like something that started off as a somewhat reasonable, though also somewhat kneejerk, reaction to one thing and then went whole-hog off the rails.

The idea seems to stem from opposition to all of the various diet/health plans that tell you want to do and when to do it according to the plan and without any regard to what your body is trying to tell you. Instead, we should get more in tune with what our body IS trying to tell us. Fine, I can get behind that notion 100%. But then it went full-on whacky and ended up in a place that basically says that we should do whatever we think our body is trying to tell us at the moment, no questions asked, because to do anything else is to disrespect our body.

Sounds like the parenting philosophy that was a rage some time back where you let your children do whatever they wanted because that was how they "explored their world". What you ended up with, of course, was a bunch of spoiled, self-centered, entitled and insufferable brats.
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  #4   ^
Old Tue, Jul-27-21, 01:23
Kristine's Avatar
Kristine Kristine is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 25,585
 
Plan: Primal/P:E
Stats: 171/146/150 Female 5'7"
BF:
Progress: 119%
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlieW
I don't understand IE.
I have been watching a YouTuber who promotes this lifestyle and she seems out of touch with reality.

You and WB hit the nail on the head, pretty much.

I do think there's merit to the idea of eating intuitively within your rules. Just like anything else: how you spend your money or your time. You have restraints - you only have so much disposable income and only so much time, but you can make decisions on the fly based on your moods or what not.

I also think there's merit to the idea, though difficult to prove, that we'll crave certain foods for their nutrients.

Whether trying to lose weight, maintain, or treat a condition unrelated to weight, some people do best on LC eating when their diet is pared down to the core, simple and repetitive. Others need to have choices and variety. I go through both ends of the spectrum, but it's usually the latter. Those choices fall within my rules. Maybe I planned on eating x, but then I'm not in the mood for it and want y instead. That, to me, is true intuitive eating - not "eat whatever garbage you want and then try to white-knuckle your way out of binge eating."
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  #5   ^
Old Tue, Jul-27-21, 04:53
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 5,284
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
Default

I say ignore the ignorant and ill informed. Seek out credible sources of information and stick with what you know works best for you. During my now 20 year experience with low carb eating I only once fell off the wagon badly and gained 20 pounds as a result. One thing that helped me get back on track and stay there was to tell myself "I am not my cravings". This is the exact opposite of intuitive eating. Satisfying a craving might bring some short term relief but in the long term it is damaging, as we all know. I could also have never stopped smoking if I hadn't told myself the same thing. I was not my craving. I did not need to listen to it. Giving up those things that harm us in the long term is the only smart way to proceed.
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  #6   ^
Old Tue, Jul-27-21, 07:37
wbahn's Avatar
wbahn wbahn is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 8,651
 
Plan: Atkins-ish, post-WLS
Stats: 408.0/288.0/168.0 Male 72 inches
BF:
Progress: 50%
Location: Southern Colorado, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristine
That, to me, is true intuitive eating - not "eat whatever garbage you want and then try to white-knuckle your way out of binge eating."


I think the IE crowd would say that there's no need to white-knuckle your way out of binge eating, because if you are truly respecting your body then binge eating is perfect natural and acceptable. Just enjoy the binge and whatever results from it. Enjoy the extra two hundred pounds. Rejoice in the diabetes. Celebrate the coronary heart disease. Savor each stroke and the heart attack.
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  #7   ^
Old Thu, Jul-29-21, 22:53
CMCM's Avatar
CMCM CMCM is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,264
 
Plan: Keto / Atkins VLC
Stats: 173/148.6/135 Female 5'6"
BF:23.9
Progress: 64%
Location: N. Calif. Sierra Nevadas
Default

Personally, I have seen that when I have been eating sugar in particular but other junk as well, my "intuitive" eating is completely haywire and I am driven to crave and eat all the wrong things and also to eat too much of that stuff. ''

Pulling myself back to a way of eating that I know works for me....a very low carb zero sugar zero grain diet....THEN my intuitive eating is rational. I don't crave the junk any more. I eat what is a correct amount of food rather than overeating. My digestive system is calm again, my head is clear. It's amazing what the right foods in the right amounts can do for you.

Using a so-called intuitive eating plan (especially when any and all foods are on the table) that doesn't limit you to the right kind of foods is a recipe for disaster and I, for one, would never be able to lose weight that way or stick with a diet long enough to lose much weight.

I love having finally reached a state where I don't crave or think about any of the bad junky food any more. I've lost interest in all of it entirely. Now when I experience true hunger (which I never had previously, I only had blood sugar crash type hunger), I recognize hunger and can easily find the right foods to satisfy that hunger. This is an entirely different and very calm state that I could never get to previously. I will NEVER go back to my old kind of eating. Ever. This is how I eat to lose weight and this is how I will continue to eat when I reach my goal. You can't go back.

Last edited by CMCM : Thu, Jul-29-21 at 22:58.
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  #8   ^
Old Fri, Jul-30-21, 05:59
lowjax's Avatar
lowjax lowjax is offline
Think, then Eat.
Posts: 10,299
 
Plan: LC / L-FODMAP / L-IgG
Stats: 276.4/231.7/199 Male 5' 5"
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: The Land of Cheese
Default

As I work to get myself back on track, I've been "Intuitively eating" for the last couple week. Eating whatever I want, but tracking it. And I'm averaging about 3,200 calories. Yes, averaging. And I've piled on the pounds these last two weeks as well. Permanently eating this way would kill me.

Fully agree with Kristine & CMCM's approach, but that is far different than the person that the OP was referencing.
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  #9   ^
Old Wed, Aug-04-21, 07:28
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 15,075
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
Default

Food scientists are baiting the hook, and the fish are discussing the merits of intuitive eating.
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  #10   ^
Old Wed, Aug-04-21, 12:01
LiterateGr's Avatar
LiterateGr LiterateGr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 163
 
Plan: Atkins/General LC
Stats: 240.0/167.2/155 Female 5 '9"
BF:36/29.5/25
Progress: 86%
Default

OK... I'd never seen it capitolized before, but it's something I've been using/promoting for a few decades now, with exactly that name.

I don't mean what they mean, though!!!

I mean:
You're hungry? You need to eat something. Listen to your body.

What are you craving? That craving probably represents a deficiency you need to fill.
Craving candy (Jolly Ranchers, Twizzlers type candy -- straight sugar with a mild fruit flavor)? You need vitamin C. (If you're really interested, I can go into the long story that is behind this... basically, lived this with 30 other people... when we had no C in our diets, we first craved foods with it, then craved candy.)

Craving chocolate? OK.... Well, it might be you just need some good, old-fashioned dark chocolate, but if there isn't a bar of 90% chocolate on your top shelf, try a dollop of peanut butter.

You want chips? Oh, clearly you need salt! Have some boullion and seaweed snacks! (The latter you can eat *like chips*, they are usually flavored with sesame oil, AND they're a nutritional powerhouse.)

You're craving beef? Cook it with some broccoli in cast iron, and give yourself some bonus iron.




The idea here is that:
* Your body knows what it needs
* Your body will send you messages about what you need, based on where it's "found" those things in the past
* Your body (as opposed to your brain) lacks language. If it can't get the thing it REALLY needs, it'll try for something close.

I'll use this when someone is "hungry for" something, but doesn't know what, and everything you have on hand "doesn't sound good".

"If you could eat anything in the world right now, what would it be?"
The answer -- if you use your intelligence & break it down -- will usually have the "answer" to breaking the craving.

This other nonsense? Eating whatever you want whenever you want? That's not "intuitive eating", that's indulgent, unrestrained eating, and does not lead to health -- physical or mental.
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  #11   ^
Old Thu, Aug-05-21, 04:47
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,609
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
Default

Excellent suggestions, LiterateGr! That's a fascinating angle with the vitamin C, but it makes sense to me: fruit, maybe?

From what I've seen, Intuitive Eating actually started as you describe above, as a path out of Eating Disorders. Instead of imposing some weird bunch of rules on oneself, as done with anorexia, it's important to loosen up and acknowledg the needs of the body.

As with so many good ideas, con artists battling like crabs in a bucket for a career as an Social Media Influencer have run in all sorts of foolish directions with it.

The idea of partnering with one's body, instead of fighting it like an enemy, is still a good idea.
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  #12   ^
Old Thu, Aug-05-21, 05:27
LiterateGr's Avatar
LiterateGr LiterateGr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 163
 
Plan: Atkins/General LC
Stats: 240.0/167.2/155 Female 5 '9"
BF:36/29.5/25
Progress: 86%
Default

So the candy/vitamin C thing:

We were working at an isolated mountain resort where room & board were included.

Unfortunately, our "board" included no fruit and very little with any C in it. We all started craving fruit BADLY. Someome called a relative, and had them bring us a HUGE thing of pre-cut citrus... which, obviously, had to be refrigerated.

The owners confiscated this and fed it to the guests. We were screwed. On our days off, we'd drive 2 hours into "town" and order 3-topping pizzas where all toppings were pineapple... it wasn't enough.

Next thing we knew, we were ALL craving jolly ranchers and twizzlers (both of which were sold at the resort's "general store" for pennies. When we went back home, after the summer job was over? We all resumed our normal diets and no longer craved Jolly Ranchers/Twizzlers.

Our bodies needed C. They couldn't get C, so they begged for fruit. When they couldn't get THAT, they started begging for things that tasted fruit-ish. Makes sense to me. Also explains why vinegar (pickles) will kill a sugar craving. (It's the same connection, really, since Vitamin C is often found in a sweet, acidic environment in nature.



I was dealing with this stuff the other day. I was hungry... not a lot, just a teeny bit, but persistant. None of the "snackables" I was trying were filling it. "If you could eat anything in the world, what would it be?" And I discovered I was craving meat, so I cooked a burger. (About 1/4 the size I'd usually make, because I wasn't *very* hungry, it just wouldn't be satisfied by anything else.) Topped with cheese and a little guac, and my body was happy.

See? Intuitive. Listening to your body. Giving it what it needs... not what it's screaming to get your attention.
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  #13   ^
Old Thu, Aug-05-21, 05:33
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 5,284
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
Default

Just because someone gives something a name, like "intuitive eating", and then describes and explains it doesn't make it true. The question should be does it work to reach the goal you desire. If it doesn't do that then name or no name it simply doesn't work and should be discarded. Certainly we can all simply eat whatever we crave but that doesn't mean that this is a healthy way to behave unless you prioritize short term desire over long term health which is not really prioritizing health but prioritizing a kind of hedonism. If that's what you are after then go for it. If not find something that does help you attain whatever your goal may be. Personally I prioritize health and find that low carb eating is the best way for me to get there. I try to ignore all the pseudo experts peddling their form of snake oil.
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  #14   ^
Old Fri, Aug-06-21, 03:54
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Posts: 14,609
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
Default

I think the more we make good choices, the better this craving system works.
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