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  #61   ^
Old Thu, Oct-26-23, 22:41
deirdra's Avatar
deirdra deirdra is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,328
 
Plan: vLC/GF,CF,SF
Stats: 197/136/150 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress: 130%
Location: Alberta
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
"Nonfat half-and-half is actually misleadingly named, as it doesnít contain any cream. Instead, itís nonfat milk thatís been treated with corn syrup and thickeners to approximate the taste and texture of regular half-and-half.
Luckily I never bought it because I assumed it was half non-fat milk & half water, but I could always add water at home if I wanted watery milk. Corn syrup is worse than cream in my book!
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  #62   ^
Old Fri, Oct-27-23, 05:23
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deirdra
Corn syrup is worse than cream in my book!


In every book, truth be told. I have cream and coconut oil in my coffee every morning. And it's a BIG mug
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  #63   ^
Old Sat, Oct-28-23, 14:25
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,038
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
I used to make greek yogurt but I used half and half which came from a local dairy in glass bottles with no additives. I guess Iím a purist but I canít imagine eating low fat greek yogurt. The greek yogurt I used to make was really quite wonderful. Although I have cut down some on how much fat I eat I just cannot get on the low fat band wagon. I eat 30%-40% protein and the rest is some combination of carbs and fat. Seems to work ok.

Agree, Iím similar in that unsweetened whole milk Greek yogurt, whether I make it or buy it, has all the positives for me and none of the perceived negatives due to the fat. While it may have to do with my current weight as Janet alludes to in a previous post, which Iíve maintained for quite a few years, I also believe the dynamics of fat consumption vary per person. How I eat is informed by how I feel and react metabolically and physically. Being intimately in tune with these things helps me eat correctly and make adaptations as I get older. For many of us, itís a lifelong pursuit, and when one is paying attention, can make all the difference. While Iím eager to apply new programs if they make sense, I find some donít work well for me, and that should be expected.
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  #64   ^
Old Sun, Oct-29-23, 04:38
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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I love unsweetened whole milk Greek yogurt, which is a staple here, as much as grass fed hamburger

In fact, my "hamburger sense" has become so refined that I can't eat bunless burgers just anywhere, any more. But that's a good thing.

I accidentally bought Fat Free Half and Half (identical carton, small print for the italics) and DH poured it on his morning steel cut oatmeal. He had to throw the whole thing away. Because it was skim milk and corn syrup. That's how far he's come from junk food, I'm happy to note.

Do people put up with the difference for "health"? Or can they no longer tell the difference?
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  #65   ^
Old Sun, Oct-29-23, 07:59
Calianna's Avatar
Calianna Calianna is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,889
 
Plan: Atkins-ish (hypoglycemia)
Stats: 000/000/000 Female 63
BF:
Progress: 50%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBear
I love unsweetened whole milk Greek yogurt, which is a staple here, as much as grass fed hamburger

In fact, my "hamburger sense" has become so refined that I can't eat bunless burgers just anywhere, any more. But that's a good thing.

I accidentally bought Fat Free Half and Half (identical carton, small print for the italics) and DH poured it on his morning steel cut oatmeal. He had to throw the whole thing away. Because it was skim milk and corn syrup. That's how far he's come from junk food, I'm happy to note.

Do people put up with the difference for "health"? Or can they no longer tell the difference?


I don't think it's a matter of not being able to tell the difference, but that the real thing tastes weird to them after eating fake stuff (or for that matter fat free everything) for such a long time, although they do generally switch to the fake stuff because it's supposed to be a healthier way to eat.


A friend's adult son got to the point where he would only drink fat free milk, because "the thick stuff" (whole milk, or even 2% milk) didn't taste right to him any more. He could tell the difference between the milk that still had any fat in it at all and the fat free milk - he was so used to the "thin white water" version of milk though that he couldn't choke down milk with any fat in it any more.

I suspect the same thing happens with things like fat free half'n'half - the fat free stuff has 3 g of carbs (from the added corn syrup), as opposed to only 1 g carbs in the regular half'n'half. The corn syrup also helps thicken it to the same texture as regular half'n'half, but gives it a different mouth feel from the fat in half'n'half - that mouth feel can be disconcerting if you've been using the fat free stuff for years.



For that matter, I grew up on farms, and we had fresh milk from the cattle. Mom pasteurized it because dad's cows were strep carriers, which meant that until she got the pasteurizer, us kids were sick ALL. THE. TIME. However, even though she skimmed off as much cream as she could to make butter, the milk still had some cream in it.

I didn't care for the milk that was included in school lunches - it was whole milk back in the 50's and 60's, but it took me until I was decades into adulthood and just happened to have access to some non-homogenized milk again to figure out what it was that I didn't like about the school milk - it tasted different because it was homogenized.

If I'm going to actually drink milk, I still prefer it to not be homogenized.



Similar thing happened after decades of buying regular grocery store ground beef. My brother had a steer butchered and somehow ended up with way more ground beef than he'd ordered - he gave me some of it just to get some of the excess out of his freezer, and it was like going back to the ground beef of my childhood - it tasted like what I ate back then.
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  #66   ^
Old Wed, Nov-01-23, 02:40
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,421
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Processed Meats:
By Using the simple P:E calculator, consider the low carbers" beloved bacon, pepperoni "chips", sausage, beef sticks, etc. The Hava scoring will also add the impact of hedonic factors like sugar and salt, but losing these low protein, high fat foods makes sense for weight loss. You can eat any foods, in any amount, but the P:E ratio informs how each may impact your goal. E.g. Pepperoni was .25 P:E, solidly in the Fat Gain range, only 1 point difference from its Satiety Score.

Dr Eenfeldtís Twitter post this morning is quoted below about processed meat:

Quote:
🥓 Are processed meats good for weight loss?

They are usually pretty low-carb, but they still don't have a great reputation. One reason is the word "processed," which does not sound great.

Another reason is that, statistically speaking, people eating a lot of processed meat tend to be less healthy.

Correlation is not necessarily causation... but it can be.

It's interesting that from a satiety per calorie perspective, processed meats🌭 tend to score much lower than unprocessed meats.🥩

The reason is that processed meats are usually lower in protein, higher in fat, and sometimes higher in added carbs, as well as higher in sodium (fat plus salt together makes food more hedonic i.e. seductive).

Let's check out some scores. Higher scores mean a predicted higher satiety per calorie, meaning that the food tends to result in eating less while still feeling satisfied and happy and getting the nutrition you need.

In short, higher scores mean better weight loss foods that still keep you strong. Generally, above 50 should be pretty good from that perspective, the higher the more effective. Much lower than that is not helpful.

Pepperoni 24
Chicken nugget 27
Hot dog 26-38 (varies from brand to brand)
Sausage 28 (varies)
Salami 41
Bacon 44
Jerky 48
Serrano ham 67
Ham 71
Canadian bacon 73

Most unprocessed meats score in the 60s or 70s, so they're pretty much all solid options.

However, as you can see from the list above, processed meats are a mixed bag. Ham scores high, but hot dogs, sausages, and chicken nuggets... not so much.

The reason is that these are way lower in protein, much less nutritious, and higher in fat and carbs.

Know the effect your foods have, and it can help you reach your goals.
*X, formerly known as Twitter.

Last edited by JEY100 : Wed, Nov-01-23 at 03:35.
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  #67   ^
Old Mon, Mar-04-24, 12:23
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,421
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Another good HAVA interview on the Protein Leverage Hypothesis
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...i=1000647954550
Quote:
We are thrilled to have had the opportunity to sit down with these two great minds and talk about protein, processed foods, the current food environment, modern-day dietary challenges, and health implications. The work by professors Stephen Simpson and David Raubenheimer has been a major inspiration for us. Their work on the Protein Leverage Hypothesis has been instrumental in developing the satiety score, especially the role of protein in it. Enjoy!
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