I'm really pleased to have found a diet (Atkins induction) that controls my appetite easily and also has a positive effect on my epilepsy.

However, I came across this article, in which a Dr McDougall claims that blood lipids only improve when ketogenic diets are low calorie, but that when children eating full-maintenance calories on a ketogenic diet are tested, their blood lipids are at dangerous levels: \http://www.nealhendrickson.com/mcdo...oofpositive.htm.

Any helpful comments on this? I do find it a worry.

My personal opinion of Dr. McDougall is that he is an idiot.

The ketogenic diets used for epileptic children are low carbs and low protein. The low-carb diets are only low in carbs. While they may show 'poor' blood chemistry, the children show only improved health.

My blood lipids have gone from poor to great since I have been eating low-carb. According to my doctor, my heart attack risk has gone from high to zero, based on all the lab tests that he did.

Based on reading the McDougall letter, it seems that he prefers children to have uncontrolled epileptic fits, rather than eat low carbs. McDougall criticizes the ketogenic diet because it has a 15% dropout rate, I would be will to bet that the McDougall diet has closer to a 90% dropout rate. I tried a McDougall type diet and found that it was intolerable.

Well, most Atkins folks who have posted their lipid results have had amazing changes. I don't think any of them are doing anything particularly low calorie. My calorie consumption wasn't low on Atkins and my lipids were great. About 30 points lower total and my triglycerides, which McDougall's diet would raise, were far lower.

What is the McDougall diet (in a nutshell)? Why did you find it intolerable?

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The McDougall diet is a low-fat veganish eating program. The food choices are limited and low-fat eating leaves me hungry all the time.

McDougal is a good example of mental disease caused by his diet.

I did McDougall for months on end. My eczema got real bad, I looked like crap all the time, my skin dried out, and although I had a lot of energy it seemed, my strength on the tennis court went downhill. I also gained a lot of fat round my hips and lost muscle. I weigh about the same on whatever diet I'm doing (still trying to lose the last few pounds effort...).

I became neurotic and had to rely on st johns wort to sort out depression. My acne was bad as well.

However I did like the food (I like any kind of food fullstop, especially on diets which say you don't have to restrict).

Oh, yeah, and my asthma was at an all-time high. And I was constantly bloated. AND I was covering myself taking lots of supplements.

One day I started taking taurine and fish oil and felt so much better. That tipped the boat for me and I tried jumping right back into paleo. Was too fast and I rebounded several times. It's been a hard struggle since then, but I enjoy eating meat and fat soooo much more than brown rice and beans.

Oh, and I looked pale as dried out dog stuff all the time. Don't buy it - have you seen the piccies of the *star* McDougallers on vegsource website? They look terrible. That's actually what also convinced me to go back to low-carb. All the people here look really healthy imo in their pictures.

And the fact that I believe humans do muuuch better eating both animal and plant matter - not just one or the other (although I'm betting surviving off animal matter alone is better than just plant stuff). We are carnivores!

I second that opinion. Brains love ketones. Epileptic brains love them so much, they have separation anxiety.

It's true. My total cholesterol went way up after I'd been on Atkins awhile-- from an average around 170 to an average around 235.

However, considering that my HDL (the good stuff) is an awesome 120, and my HDL/LDL ratio an equally awesome .92, my doctor isn't worried. These numbers are a result of several factors: heredity, daily exercise (cardio and weights), and a healthy low-carb diet.

As a percentage of my diet, my fat intake seems high, typically 55%. But in gms, I'm sure it's far less than the "average" American diet in both quantity and quality. Same with protein. If only most people could be this "unhealthy," our national health care costs would plummet!

A very good example of how total cholesterol numbers by themselves are usually totally meaningless. If you want to know the real story, take a look at the individual fractions and ratios.
What's scary is that there are a lot of doctors out there who would look at that total of 235 and recommend Statin therapy despite the awesome fractions and ratios.

I'm pretty sure this is the same Dr McDougall who's a member of the PCRM, which is just a front group for PETA. Anyone from this group, I tend to take their info with a grain of salt. I find it deplorable to disguise vegan propaganda as "ligitimate health information." It's not the animal rights activism that I disagree with per se, but if you want to promote an agenda, be honest and open about it, and stick to the facts instead of distorting information and using scare tactics.

Well, I wasn't listening to McDougall himself, but the study he refers to seems worrying. Do you think the study has been misrepresented, or wasn't a well-conducted study in the first place?

Lilith,

The abstract of the study shows that the children were around 5 to 6 years old. I looked around the internet and could not find out how normal cholesterol levels change as children grow. The study had no control group to compare the changes to. The important part of the study, that was ignored by McDougall, was (highlights mine)The diet controlled the siezures.