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  #1   ^
Old Tue, Aug-24-10, 12:27
ZFDA ZFDA is offline
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Posts: 11
 
Plan: Healthy For Life Plan
Stats: 213/175/125 Female 5 feet 5 inches
BF:
Progress: 43%
Default Trouble breathing, or something like it, and hands tingling

I've been low-carbing for about 6 or 7 weeks now. I also require thyroid support in the form of iodine. Most days, especially when I'm well into ketosis (going by urine test strips) I get a feeling like I'm having trouble breathing. I'm not sure it's truly breathing trouble; it may just be the side effect of having more acetone to get rid of via my breath. Whatever the case, it usually happens at about the same time as a tingling/numbness sensation in my hands (which can sometimes expand to my feet and/or face - the worst occurence of this sent me to the ER because I woke up with it in the middle of the night, but they said it was just anxiety).

Has anyone else encountered symptoms like this? I've seen doctors and been to the ER, and they can find nothing wrong with me, so I'm curious if it's only me that's affected this way by low-carbing, or if others have had similar experiences.
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  #2   ^
Old Tue, Aug-24-10, 16:18
maile1 maile1 is offline
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Posts: 376
 
Plan: hcg
Stats: 192/142/138 Female 67 inches
BF:
Progress: 93%
Location: Vancouver, BC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZFDA
I've been low-carbing for about 6 or 7 weeks now. I also require thyroid support in the form of iodine. Most days, especially when I'm well into ketosis (going by urine test strips) I get a feeling like I'm having trouble breathing. I'm not sure it's truly breathing trouble; it may just be the side effect of having more acetone to get rid of via my breath. Whatever the case, it usually happens at about the same time as a tingling/numbness sensation in my hands (which can sometimes expand to my feet and/or face - the worst occurence of this sent me to the ER because I woke up with it in the middle of the night, but they said it was just anxiety).

Has anyone else encountered symptoms like this? I've seen doctors and been to the ER, and they can find nothing wrong with me, so I'm curious if it's only me that's affected this way by low-carbing, or if others have had similar experiences.


have you had a thyroid panel done?
TSH
FT3
FT4
Tpo Antibodies?

Air hunger is a hypo symptom, if you have a low functioning thyroid or hashimotos iodine won't necessarily help.
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  #3   ^
Old Wed, Aug-25-10, 03:52
ZFDA ZFDA is offline
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Posts: 11
 
Plan: Healthy For Life Plan
Stats: 213/175/125 Female 5 feet 5 inches
BF:
Progress: 43%
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Yes, I had all the standard tests done, and regular MDs won't touch me, because my issues are sub-clinical.

I actually continued researching my problem after I posted here, and I'm beginning to believe it was due to hyperventilation. When I get this feeling, like I'm not breathing enough, I tend to breathe very deeply. Apparently when you aren't in the habit of breathing deeply, it causes you to lose too much carbon dioxide, and can cause all the symptoms I described and more. It can also actually contribute to the feeling of air hunger, creating a sort of self-feeding cycle.

Sure enough, when I fight off my urge to breathe deeply, and just breathe shallowly, my tingling goes away. I also had a look at my lab tests from the night of the ER visit caused by this, and sure enough, my blood CO2 level was below normal!

Here's where I found my info: http://drmyhill.co.uk/wiki/Hyperven...get_your_breath
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  #4   ^
Old Wed, Aug-25-10, 06:51
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nanefy nanefy is offline
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Posts: 108
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 411/347/170 Female 5.9
BF:
Progress: 27%
Location: Perth, Scotland
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OMG - I know exactly what you have!!!

This is nothing to do with Atkins - this is stress. I get the exact same symptoms randomly when I think I'm not stressed but then I find that sometimes the smallest things can set it off. For example, I have literally just recovered from this two weeks ago and had it for about 2 weeks and the only thing I could put it down to was money worries. The worst episode was last year when I had it for months. Sometimes I'd be over the side of the bed trying to get a breath, then my hands would start tingling etc. Basically it is literally one step away from a panic attack. I have suffered from it for years and it comes and goes when it pleases. The only way I can describe it, is that I am unable to take a deep satisfying breath and I end up so conscious of the fact that it makes me more stressed.

I got over the recent bout about 2 weeks ago but every time I take a deep breath successfully I really appreciate it because I know what it feels like to not be able to.

I can totally sympathise with you as I have very much suffered from this for years. I have never found a solution, it just decides to go away when it wants. I think the problem is that when I am stressed there must be a muscle or muscles inside my abdomen that tightens uncontrollably and because of this I am unable to fully expand my lungs like I would normally. Unless you can get some muscle relaxants I don't really have any solutions for you.

I nearly died when I read your post, because I've never met anyone or read anywhere about anyone with a similar condition.

Anyway, the best I can say is try and remove all stress and just try and relax - I know it's hard :-(
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  #5   ^
Old Wed, Aug-25-10, 08:34
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girlbug2 girlbug2 is offline
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Posts: 1,091
 
Plan: Ketogenic paleo
Stats: 186/167/125 Female 5'4"
BF:trying to quit
Progress: 31%
Location: So. California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nanefy
OMG - I know exactly what you have!!!

This is nothing to do with Atkins - this is stress. I get the exact same symptoms randomly when I think I'm not stressed but then I find that sometimes the smallest things can set it off. For example, I have literally just recovered from this two weeks ago and had it for about 2 weeks and the only thing I could put it down to was money worries. The worst episode was last year when I had it for months. Sometimes I'd be over the side of the bed trying to get a breath, then my hands would start tingling etc. Basically it is literally one step away from a panic attack. I have suffered from it for years and it comes and goes when it pleases. The only way I can describe it, is that I am unable to take a deep satisfying breath and I end up so conscious of the fact that it makes me more stressed.

I got over the recent bout about 2 weeks ago but every time I take a deep breath successfully I really appreciate it because I know what it feels like to not be able to.

I can totally sympathise with you as I have very much suffered from this for years. I have never found a solution, it just decides to go away when it wants. I think the problem is that when I am stressed there must be a muscle or muscles inside my abdomen that tightens uncontrollably and because of this I am unable to fully expand my lungs like I would normally. Unless you can get some muscle relaxants I don't really have any solutions for you.

I nearly died when I read your post, because I've never met anyone or read anywhere about anyone with a similar condition.

Anyway, the best I can say is try and remove all stress and just try and relax - I know it's hard :-(


I, also had the same thing happen to me as the OP, back in January, except more severe symptoms. Nothing like it had ever happened to me before so I had no idea what was going on--went in to the doctor and made them run all kinds of tests on me; breath capacity, EKG, lung x ray, even a blood test. Turns out, it's panic disorder. I'm 41 and this is the first time it has officially occurred in my life. My sister OTOH has had it since her early 20s. It took about a week for me to believe the diagnosis, because I never really considered myself a "nervous" kind of person.

My symptoms were as follows: wake up in the middle of the night with finger tingling, breath shallow and heart pounding. Same tight chest sensation as nanefy. The tingling would fade after I got up, but the pounding heart and shallow breath stayed 24/7. After that first night I could not get more than 2 hours sleep at a time, it was living hell. But after I finally accepted the diagnosis, the doctor prescribed me some meds which helped a little with the symptoms initially, then took a few weeks to kick in fully. The first moment my chest loosened up and I was able to finally take a full deep breath was like a miracle from heaven, it felt so good just to breathe normally.

OP, your symptoms may be panic disorder and if so, there are options on how it's treated. Not everybody has all the symptoms that I had, some have more, and it varies in intensity. I urge you to do a little online research and talk to a doctor about it.

One thing to take away--NO CAFFEINE. It is universally advised against caffeine or any kind of stimulant type drug if you have panic attacks.

My prayers go with you.
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  #6   ^
Old Thu, Aug-26-10, 05:22
ZFDA ZFDA is offline
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Posts: 11
 
Plan: Healthy For Life Plan
Stats: 213/175/125 Female 5 feet 5 inches
BF:
Progress: 43%
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Thanks, all, for your replies! I am not a stranger to panic attacks, but this feels quite different, and generally lasts much longer (hours; usually I can talk myself down from my panic attacks in an hour or so). I am still suspecting one of the many supplements I'm on, because yesterday, making my breathing shallower did not seem to remedy the problem. In fact, I tingled all the way through my therapy appointment, in spite of the fact that that's the one place I don't usually have anything resembling stress or anxiety. Also in spite of the fact that my therapist took me through some exercises to try to help alleviate it. It did, however, abate after I left the therapist's, and started running errands, but that was about the same time it normally clears up.

FYI, I cut caffeine out months ago, so at least that's one thing I can say for sure isn't causing it!

I am starting to wonder if maybe it isn't from an excess of energy from the iodine I'm supplementing. I haven't exercised in a couple of months (due to a scary, multi-day run-in with high blood pressure and racing pulse the last time I did exercise), so I'll be starting veeery easily, with just a walk up the street and back, and see how that goes. I'll make sure not to do this until the symptoms start, though, and then see if it makes any difference.

If that doesn't work, perhaps I'll skip my noon dose of iodine supplement, and see if it clears up before the usual 3-4pm time frame.

If that doesn't work perhaps I'll try skipping my noon dose of the only other supplement I take morning/noon (Standard Process HiPep, in case you're curious. And no, unlike the name, it's not designed for energy, it's actually a calming blend that the doc gave me after my last ER visit).

If all else fails, I do have valium, but I really hate the thought of going back on those! I'm trying so very hard to deal with everything naturally, and am making incredible process. I hate to load my liver down with toxins again, y'know?
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  #7   ^
Old Mon, Sep-06-10, 22:13
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Atrsy Atrsy is offline
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Posts: 2,044
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 050/029/000 Female 5ft, 8 1/2 inches
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Pennsylvania
Default

I also take thyroid meds and the doctor has been increasing the dosage for the past few months. When I get the feeling I can't breathe and my hands and feet are feeling numb, I realize it is all related to water retention. I am now so used to it, I can actually feel my feet and ankles swelling. I was wondering if the thyroid meds could make me retain more fluids.

Also one day I was working on crafts and didn't prop my feet up all day and my BP skyrocketed! I knew it because of the sensation of my ears closing. When I checked the bp, it was 140/70. I did some breathing exercises and took it again and got 120/60. It is usually much much lower. So now I will keep tabs on that, too.
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  #8   ^
Old Tue, Sep-07-10, 04:29
Ron_Mocci Ron_Mocci is offline
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Posts: 373
 
Plan: AK
Stats: 155/147/145 Male 5'7 3/4"
BF:
Progress: 80%
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Anxiety is one bad mother she can do anything to your mind she wants to do ! The list of things it dose to your or our bodies is to long ! Anxiety has taken a lot away from me ! this place has help me :http://anxietynomore.co.uk/blog/2010/08/ I wish you the best (-:
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  #9   ^
Old Sat, Nov-13-10, 10:28
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FroheFrau FroheFrau is offline
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Posts: 38
 
Plan: my own/ IF
Stats: 155/155/125 Female 63.75 inches
BF:I/don't/care
Progress: 0%
Location: cactus country
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ZFDA
I have battled those symptoms for a while. It can indicate adrenal gland weakness---which usually accompanies thyroid problems.
More specifically, the numbness and tingling and air hunger can indicate low aldsoterone and low cortisol.

It might be in your best interest to have a 24-hours saliva test to check on your cortisol and aldosterone levels. these are hormones that are produced by the adrenal glands. There are sources online where you can order the saliva test kit mailed to you---you do the test at home and mail your results in to a lab. Google "Canary Club" or cortisol saliva test. Having low adrenal hormones is nothing to mess around with !! Also google adrenal burnout or adrenal fatigue. There's plenty of good info online.
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  #10   ^
Old Sun, Nov-14-10, 06:00
ZFDA ZFDA is offline
New Member
Posts: 11
 
Plan: Healthy For Life Plan
Stats: 213/175/125 Female 5 feet 5 inches
BF:
Progress: 43%
Default

I actually had considered adrenal fatigue, but when I do the at-home test of lying down, taking my blood pressure, then standing up and taking my bp immediately again, I don't show any signs of it. I've been meaning to update this post, though, as I think the original cause I identified was incorrect. Here's how it goes:

I thought it was the calcium in my calcium supplements that was alleviating my breathing symptoms. I forgot that my calcium supplement also contains a small amount of magnesium, which is known to help with airway constriction in asthma patients! Since I had never been diagnosed with asthma, I never even considered this, but when I went to get a third opinion this past week (actually more like a 10th, if you count all my ER visits ), the doctor suggested asthma right off the bat. Sure enough, what I had previously described as a tickle in the center of my chest, is a wheeze...I'm having mild asthma symptoms!

I'm loath to start using an inhaler, though, so I've started supplementing with Natural Calm, a magnesium supplement that you can easily adjust the dose of. I do this so that I don't have to take more calcium, which seems to be triggering symptoms of its own (like muscle twitches and cramping, which might also actually aggravate the bronchospasm of asthma). I also chose this method because I have known unpleasant reactions (i.e. diarrhea) to magnesium in doses that are too high. Staying well hydrated seems to be another key (symptoms woke me up at night a couple nights ago, and it was a little more severe than usual, now that the air has dried out & I'm running the furnace for heat). I strongly suspect that my estrogen levels are decreasing, which can also contribute to airway dryness. I had blood drawn last week to test for estrogen, progestin & testosterone levels, so we'll see if that suspicion has any merit.

I'm still in the experimentation phase, though, so I'll try to remember to check in once my hormone tests come back & I've sorted through this and other symptoms!

Last edited by ZFDA : Sun, Nov-14-10 at 06:24.
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  #11   ^
Old Wed, Nov-17-10, 11:24
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nawchem nawchem is offline
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Posts: 8,701
 
Plan: No gluten, CAD
Stats: 196.0/158.5/149.0 Female 62
BF:36/29.0/27.3
Progress: 80%
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I used to have these symptoms, went on thyroid medication went away. Stopped taking thyroid medication, came back.

I've found that massage is helpful in calming my nervous system, not eating any processed foods sugar, caffeine and only doing light exercise that doesn't get the stress hormones pumping. I was reading anxiety is a symptom of hypothyroidism.

Have you been to a really good thyroid dr that treats by symptoms also? Could you post your thyroid numbers? Some drs wait until hypothyroidism is quite advanced before they treat.
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