The Westin A Price website is a great source for the LCer. This is a reference of Dr. Byrnes.

Among other things, this shows how a study took a vegetarian animal and fed it animal products. And this vegetarian animal got plaques in the arteries from eating animal products. Then they applied this to humans who are carnivore/omnivores and said we would get plaques in our arteries too by eating animal products. (And they call this science!?)

I will give here some exerpts from this article which is very long.

In 1954 a young researcher from Russia named David Kritchevsky published a paper describing the effects of feeding cholesterol to rabbits.1 Cholesterol added to vegetarian rabbit chow caused the formation of atheromas—plaques that block arteries and contribute to heart disease. Cholesterol is a heavy weight molecule—an alcohol or a sterol—found only in animal foods such as meat, fish, cheese, eggs and butter. In the same year, according to the American Oil Chemists Society, Kritchevsky published a paper describing the beneficial effects of polyunsaturated fatty acids for lowering cholesterol levels.2

In the years that followed, a number of population studies demonstrated that the animal model—especially one derived from vegetarian animals—was not a valid approach for the problem of heart disease in human omnivores.

In 1956, an American Heart Association (AHA) fund-raiser aired on all three major networks. The MC interviewed, among others, Irving Page and Jeremiah Stamler of the AHA, and researcher Ancel Keys. Panelists presented the lipid hypothesis as the cause of the heart disease epidemic and launched the Prudent Diet, one in which corn oil, margarine, chicken and cold cereal replaced butter, lard, beef and eggs. But the television campaign was not an unqualified success because one of the panelists, Dr. Dudley White, disputed his colleagues at the AHA. Dr. White noted that heart disease in the form of myocardial infarction was nonexistent in 1900 when egg consumption was three times what it was in 1956 and when corn oil was unavailable. When pressed to support the Prudent Diet, Dr. White replied: “See here, I began my practice as a cardiologist in 1921 and I never saw an MI patent until 1928. Back in the MI free days before 1920, the fats were butter and lard and I think that we would all benefit from the kind of diet that we had at a time when no one had ever heard the word corn oil.”

It was in the same year, 1966, that the results of Dr. Jolliffe’s Anti-Coronary Club experiment were published in the Journal of the American Medical Association.12 Those on the Prudent Diet of corn oil, margarine, fish, chicken and cold cereal had an average serum cholesterol of 220, compared to 250 in the meat-and-potatoes control group. However, the study authors were obliged to note that there were eight deaths from heart disease among Dr. Jolliffe’s Prudent Diet group, and none among those who ate meat three times a day. Dr. Jolliffe was dead by this time.

Read the entire article at:

http://www.westonaprice.org/know_your_fats/oiling.html

Thanks for sharing this link - This is scary stuff.

I've banned margarine from my house and only use olive oil for anything else.

I guess I need to change to all home made salad dressing as they can't be trusted to use the good stuff.

Vonnovich

My roommate and I were just talking about this last night.
I had just watched a movie with my children on Disney and my kids noticed what the kids in the movie were eating and wanted to know why we ate so differently that other kids. Which is true even though movies normally don't show what the real world does or looks like.

This got me thinking which I shared with my roommate and we both started to get angry.. First we were angry at Food. I mean, why oh why does our bodies react the way they do to bad carbs and sweets?! I know for me I am a victim of the Low Fat diet where meat was dropped and veggies and bread was increased.
I gained 110 lbs on this diet. Oh sure I cheated and ate ice cream and pastrys but that was ok as long as it was low fat.
lies, lies, lies!!
Then we realized its not food we were mad at but how dooped we all were to think that meat, butter, and oils were bad, when all along it was carbs. Someone taught us and our parents that fat was the bad guy. We are brain washed! Even now, being on Atkins for almost a year, I can't get that low fat nonscense out of my head. It makes looking at low fat ice cream even harder. It makes potatoes and rice seem so innocent. For me, this makes me angry.

I do hope that with the new information out there that marketing people get on the band wagon and make products that are higher fat, lower carbs, and have great appeal. Hopefully they won't charge an arm and a leg

Hi Voyajer

I have been reading and rereading the article on the Oiling of America. www.westonaprice.org/know_your_fats

I am flabbagasted by some of the information.

Do you know if they still add oxidised cholesterol to low fat milk....how can this be legal. The Article should be titled the Poisioning of America.

I've started looking at food labels more seriously now. Everything has corn oil or soyoil.

Back to basic food in my house.

Vonnovich

Hi Vonnovich,

It is interesting that you pointed out the very thing that has been plagueing me about this article. You see, Dr. Enig says that protein powders have oxidized cholesterol and I drink protein powder everyday as do many LCers. [Whew! Just read the label on my protein powder and it is 0 g fat and 5 mg cholesterol so even if the 5 mg is oxidized, it won't impact.]

I don't believe that Dr. Enig was saying that oxidized cholesterol was added to powdered milk or to protein powder. Rather I believe what she was saying is that anytime you make dairy products into powder the inherent cholesterol in the dairy product becomes oxidized through drying it into powder. Both whey protein and milk come from dairy products that naturally contain cholesterol. When these are dried, the cholesterol becomes oxidized according to Dr. Enig. She is also saying that some low fat milks are made from mixed dried milk with whole milk. Therefore, these would also contain oxidized cholesterol. Although I don't know if it is true of liquid milk products that they contain powdered milk because I've never heard of this before. However I do know that "milk solids" are a common ingredient in many foods and whey protein is a dryed dairy product that is in protein powder. But strangely enough I've never read anywhere before that drying milk or whey protein makes the cholesterol oxidize. Dr. Enig's point is that oxidized cholesterol would clog your arteries so if dried milk protein was added to water and used as a liquid cholesterol diet in the studies she mentioned, then of course the people or animals in the study would get clogged arteries from cholesterol (or at least this type of unnatural oxidized cholesterol.)

Here is Dr. Enig's quote:
"But the biggest flaw was that the subjects receiving cholesterol did so in the form of reconstituted powder—a totally artificial diet. Mattson’s discussion did not even address the possibility that the liquid formula diet he used might affect blood cholesterol differently than would a whole foods diet when, in fact, many other studies indicated that this is the case. The culprit, in fact, in liquid protein diets appears to be oxidized cholesterol, formed during the high-temperature drying process, which seems to initiate the buildup of plaque in the arteries.33 Powdered milk containing oxidized cholesterol is added to reduced fat milk—to give it body—which the American public has accepted as a healthier choice than whole milk. It was purified, oxidized cholesterol that Kritchevsky and others used in their experiments on vegetarian rabbits."

Okay, so there are literally hundreds of websites that talk about oxidized cholesterol. I now realize that it is the same thing as "lipid peroxides" that Dr. Eades wrote so much about in Protein Power LifePlan. He says rancid oils have oxidized cholesterol.

From everything I've read, I can only say that there has not been a definitive list of foods that definitely have oxidized cholesterol. Any fat can oxidize and a lot of fats do actually oxidize right inside our bodies everyday due to free radicals. This is dangerous because the latest information is that the only kind of cholesterol (LDL type) to cause artery damage is oxidized (LDL) cholesterol which is why we need to ensure we eat and supplement with antioxidants (Vitamin C, E and beta carotene etc. walnuts, strawberries, blueberries, etc. flavonoids in fruit and red wine).

The studies say that processing foods that naturally contain fat will oxidize the cholesterol (fats) in the food. Dried egg noodles have dangerous oxidized cholesterol (Italian research). It has also been said that aged cheese has oxidized cholesterol and powdered eggs and aged meat. Smoking cigarettes, having stress and pollution can oxidize fats in your own body. Heat and cooking also oxidize fats (lipids). But we heat and cook everything anyway.

I will quote what I think is a balanced discussion with references here:

Other toxic effects of cooking
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Heated Milk Protein

It is possible that heated milk protein may be a factor in atherosclerosis [Annand 1971, 1972, 1986].

Heated Fats

Oxidized fats, oils, and cholesterol. Research reveals that in animal models, oxidized fats, oils, and cholesterol induce higher levels of arterial plaque (i.e., atherogenesis) than do the corresponding non-oxidized fats, oils, and cholesterol [Taylor et al. 1979, Kummerow 1993, Kubow 1993, O'Keefe et al. 1995]. The biochemical processes that make oxidized fats atherogenic are the subject of scientific controversy; however, one suggestion is that the heating of fats, oils, and cholesterol increases the levels of lipid peroxide products. The idea is that the peroxides (in combination with lipids) promote an atherogenic response [Kubow 1993].

In tests feeding high-cholesterol diets to rabbits, the consumption of scrambled or baked eggs produced increases in serum cholesterol of 6-7 times the pre-existing levels, while fried or hard-boiled eggs raised levels by 10-14 times [Pollack 1958]. Cordain [in a posting to the Paleodiet list of 10/9/1997] also reports that his research group routinely induces atherogenesis in test animals (miniature swine) by feeding oxidized fats/cholesterol.

Role of oxidized LDL cholesterol in atherogenesis. O'Keefe et al. [1995, pp. 70, 72] explain the role of oxidized cholesterol in atherogenesis as follows:


LDL cholesterol must be oxidized or glycosylated (or both) before it becomes atherogenic.(8,9) Oxidative modification of cholesterol occurs by means of oxygen free radical processes. Only after the LDL has been modified (through oxidation or glycosylation) does it activate differentiation and migration of macrophages. The scavenger receptors on the macrophages recognize oxidized LDL (but not unmodified LDL) and allow for subsequent phagocytosis. When the macrophage becomes filled with oxidized LDL cholesterol, it becomes the foam cell that is typically observed in early atherosclerotic lesions...
The oxidative modification of LDL cholesterol seems to be the final common pathway in the process of atherosclerosis.


Steinberg et al. [1989] also report that oxidized LDL cholesterol, at high levels, is atherogenic. For a good summary of the atherogenic properties of oxidized LDL cholesterol, see Table 2 in O'Keefe et al. [1995, p. 72], and Table 1 in Steinberg et al. [1989, p. 917].
Here it should be noted that some aspects of the effects of oxidized cholesterol are controversial in the sense that a scientific consensus has not yet been reached. Readers are encouraged to consult O'Keefe et al. [1995] and Steinberg et al. [1989] for a detailed overview of current knowledge in this field.

The paradox of relatively high cholesterol intake and cooked meats vs. rarity of heart disease in hunter-gatherer groups . It is also worth remarking that many other factors than lipid peroxides influence the development and/or prevention of atherogenesis, such as the amount of saturated fat, amount of mono- or polyunsaturated fat, amount of carbohydrates and insulin response, etc. Of particular note here is the example of hunter-gatherer societies, where the incidence of heart disease is extremely low (perhaps the lowest that has been seen among human groups), despite the fact that relatively large amounts of cooked meat are consumed. (See Part 3's discussion of hunter-gatherers for a look at some of their food preparation practices; as well as another site link, Hunter-Gatherers: Examples of Healthy Omnivores, for a look at disease incidence.) This is in marked contrast to the high levels of atherosclerosis in Western diets containing cooked meat.

This divergence may be due to the differences between the type of meat (wild game) in hunter-gatherer diets--which in general is quite lean--compared to modern domesticated meats (five times less fat, and one-fifth to one-sixth as saturated [Eaton 1996]), and/or the difference may be due to a range of other factors. Of specific interest regarding the subject of oxidized cholesterol is that while hunter-gatherers eat roughly the same amount of cholesterol (480 mg) as in the modern Western diet [Eaton 1992] (from meat, presumably cooked), their serum cholesterol levels, as measured in five modern hunter-gatherer groups, averaged a very low 123.2 mg/dL [Eaton 1992].

Viewing single factors out of context can be misleading. Thus if cholesterol and/or oxidized cholesterol are in fact atherosclerotic in effect, then the implication is that there must be something else in the diets/lifestyles of hunter-gatherer groups mitigating or negating this effect. (A good overview of the large divergences between hunter-gatherer diets and the modern Western diet can be found in Eaton [1996]. Major differences are to be found in consumption levels of saturated and polyunsaturated fats, preformed long-chain fatty acids, protein, carbohydrate, phytochemicals, etc., as well as in exercise levels.)

The general point here is to keep in mind that, before attempting to form conclusions that might be premature, it is important to view the role of any one factor in the equation of health in the context of the overall diet rather than in isolation. Depending on the situation, the benefits of a food or class of foods may mean more for the health of the body than whatever associated negatives there may be--or vice versa. That nutritional benefits from foods, whether raw or cooked, unavoidably come at the expense of costs and tradeoffs is a central issue that we will return to more than once, in different forms, as this paper proceeds.

http://www.beyondveg.com/tu-j-l/raw...cooked-1g.shtml

______________________

Mayo Clin Proc 1995 Jan;70(1):69-79

Insights into the pathogenesis and prevention of coronary artery disease.

O'Keefe JH Jr, Lavie CJ Jr, McCallister BD.

Mid America Heart Institute, Kansas City, Missouri.

OBJECTIVE: To present information about risk factor clustering and the oxidation hypothesis of atherosclerosis and attempt to synthesize these facts into a clinically relevant approach to patients with or at risk for coronary artery disease (CAD). MATERIAL AND METHODS: The total cholesterol level is a relatively weak marker for the risk of CAD. The levels of both high-density lipoprotein (HDL) cholesterol and remnants of triglyceride-rich lipoproteins and the inherent susceptibility of the low-density lipoprotein (LDL) particles to oxidative modification may be as important as the total or LDL cholesterol levels. LDL cholesterol must undergo oxidative modification by means of oxygen free radical processes before it becomes atherogenic. Patients with high levels of oxidative stress include those with risk factor clustering or insulin resistance (or both). Such patients are characterized by hypertension, truncal obesity, hypertriglyceridemia, depressed HDL cholesterol levels, and increased insulin levels. They also have increased levels of triglyceride-rich remnant lipoproteins and LDL particles that are characterized by their small dense nature and pronounced predisposition to oxidative modification. RESULTS: Biologic antioxidants seem to be promising therapy for the prevention of atherogenesis. Although long-term prospective data are not yet available, vitamin E has been shown to be effective in both animal and human models in preventing LDL oxidation , and it may have a role in the prevention of CAD. A healthy diet of fresh fruits, vegetables, and whole grains is beneficial because it improves the lipid levels and provides high levels of natural antioxidants. The atherogenic potential of hydrogenated polyunsaturated fats is approximately equivalent to that of saturated fats. Monounsaturated fat [like Olive Oil] is inherently resistant to oxidation and may be protective against CAD. Niacin may be effective in patients with clustered risk factors. It has been found to convert the easily oxidized small dense LDL pattern to the large buoyant oxidation-resistant particles. Hydroxymethylglutaryl-coenzyme A reductase inhibitors are well tolerated and highly effective in decreasing LDL cholesterol, but they are expensive. Estrogen has multiple potentially beneficial effects relative to cardiovascular disease. CONCLUSION: Persons with or at high risk for CAD should be identified early and aggressively treated with a program that involves lifestyle changes, alterations in dietary intake, and pharmacologic therapy.

Hi Voyajer

That's tons of information for me to digest.

I'll try swallowing it all later, I'm sure i'll have more more questions.

What's your background? Sounds like biochemistry - (one of my worse subjects)

Thanks Vonnovich

Actually, what I posted raises another question. I think the writer Jean-Louis Tu (on the anti-vegetarian website) made an invalid point when he said:

"In tests feeding high-cholesterol diets to rabbits, the consumption of scrambled or baked eggs produced increases in serum cholesterol of 6-7 times the pre-existing levels, while fried or hard-boiled eggs raised levels by 10-14 times [Pollack 1958]."

After all the topic wasn't elevating cholesterol levels. Because if oxidation is the cause of athersclerosis then high cholesterol doesn't matter. You could have low cholesterol and have oxidated cholesterol or you could have high cholesterol and no oxidated cholesterol. So which style of cooking eggs raises cholesterol is not the point. The point is which style of eggs damages cholesterol by oxidizing it. Plus why they are feeding vegetarian rabbits eggs is beyond me. Rabbits' arteries were not meant to handle animal products so of course that will raise their cholesterol. This is like saying since rabbits eat their own feces, then humans should too. In other words, what applies to a vegetarian animal doesn't apply to us. In fact, Dr. Enig pointed out in her Oiling of America article that since these rabbit studies that were done in the 50s, the medical profession has invalidated them for humans because of this very point.

This is a quote from Doreen T explaining from the book Protein Power LifePlan by Dr. Eades that breaking the yoke which contains the fat exposes it to oxygen:

"The caution against scrambled eggs is that the cholesterol in egg yolks oxidizes rapidly in heat and air. So, the Eades recommend you eat scrambled eggs, omelets or other beaten egg-containing foods only occasionally. Their preferred cooking methods are poached, boiled in shell or fried in such a way that the yolk remains intact. I've read other sources too which suggest the yolk is best left soft or "runny"."

Apparently Dr. Enig is right. Some whole milks are mixed with non-fat dry milk to make low-fat milk. At least it is listed that way in the USDA Nutrient database:

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/cgi-bin/nut_search.pl?milk

http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/cgi-bi...0vitamin%20Axyz