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  #16   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 07:27
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins
Stats: 255/230/200 Female 5'8"
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Location: Massachusetts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Benay
There is a great deal of evidence for the health of meat eaters over grain eaters in both cultural anthropology and archaeology that is readily available

Taubes has an entire chapter on the issue - noting the change in health of the Papago from meat eating to government food



Yes, the list of peoples that benefited from meat based diet over grain based and orocessed is endless.

On a low carb forum , most of us are aware of this history. New nembers and casual readers may not be.

Eating grain is in line with consuming sugar. Mdern garains may be worse than plain sugar.
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  #17   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 08:47
Calianna's Avatar
Calianna Calianna is offline
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Plan: Atkins-ish (hypoglycemia)
Stats: 000/000/000 Female 63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
Yes, the list of peoples that benefited from meat based diet over grain based and orocessed is endless.

On a low carb forum , most of us are aware of this history. New nembers and casual readers may not be.

Eating grain is in line with consuming sugar. Mdern garains may be worse than plain sugar.



I'd say grain is ultimately far worse than sugar.


  • It's recommended that you consume at least 6-8 servings of grain daily. It's recommended that you eat no more than 6-9 servings of added sugar daily.
  • The serving size of grains are far larger than the serving size for sugar, resulting in a far higher intake of carbohydrate per serving: 1 tsp sugar (4 g carbs) is a serving of sugar. One slice of bread is a serving (depending on the size of the bread slice, 12-15 or more g carbs), 1 half-cup serving of cooked rice has 22 g carbs, a one cup serving of plain shredded wheat has 41 g carbs, a 2 oz serving of spaghetti (weighed dry) has 43 g carbs.
  • With the RDA numbers, if you consume the maximum allowed sugar (9 servings for a total of 36 g carbs), and consume only the minimum 6 servings of grains, all in the form of smaller slices of bread (72 g carbs) you'll still be taking in twice as many carbs from grains than from sugar. Reduce the added sugar to 6 servings, and take at least half your grains in the form of rice and cold, no-sugar added cereal, and the g of carbs from grains could easily shoot way up to 170 or higher.
  • Starchy carbs convert to glucose more rapidly than sugar in the body, raising blood sugar levels faster than starch, since starch only needs to go through one chemical change to convert to glucose, whereas sugar needs to go through 2 chemical changes to convert to glucose.
  • The rapid effect on blood glucose from all those grains causes a massive spike in insulin, sending all that excess blood sugar to fat storage.
Neither grains or sugar is particularly good for the body, but even if everybody in the nation reduced added sugar consumption to 6% of total calories, grains will still be doing far more metabolic damage than sugar - especially in those whose metabolism has already been damaged by years/decades of excessive starch and sugar consumption.



Trying to fix the nation's obesity/metabolic ills merely by reducing added sugar intake a few percent is like trying to empty a 5 gallon bucket of water using an eye dropper, while a faucet continues to drip water into the bucket.
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  #18   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 12:33
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Posts: 14,967
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 255/230/200 Female 5'8"
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Location: Massachusetts
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ROFL , you are too right !

Quote:
Trying to fix the nation's obesity/metabolic ills merely by reducing added sugar intake a few percent is like trying to empty a 5 gallon bucket of water using an eye dropper, while a faucet continues to drip water into the bucket.
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  #19   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 16:10
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Merpig Merpig is offline
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Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
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Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
Dr edes ??? Studied two groups in the same state only a few mikes apart, centuries apart. One was hunter -gather, and the more recent group were farmers. The meat eaters had great teeth and bones. The grain eaters had serious health problems.

Both primative tribal groups.
Oh yes, I definitely remember that from Protein Power. That was the book that got me started on my initial LC journey.
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  #20   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 16:40
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Posts: 14,967
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 255/230/200 Female 5'8"
BF:
Progress: 45%
Location: Massachusetts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merpig
Oh yes, I definitely remember that from Protein Power. That was the book that got me started on my initial LC journey.



After reading DANDR and learning of other lc books, I tracked down every one. This was a great read, and his website well worth visiting.

Dr Edes still lectures about these two groups as a bases for a more carnivore diet..... A reason to avoid grains and save our teeth and bones/joints.
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  #21   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 17:31
Sniggle Sniggle is offline
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Posts: 283
 
Plan: General Low Carb
Stats: 205.2/186.4/185 Male 73.5
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Location: West Virginia
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My view is that it always comes down to moderation and self control. I don't buy into that sugar is the devil, or wheat is the devil (Water Boy reference), etc., but that the true devil is most folks inability to moderate their intake of sugar or grains or pasta or whatever (certainly is my 'devil').

If I were to redesign the food pyramid, I would make it a food circle, with a large inner circle of protein (and fat), and outer thin segments of all the other food groups.

I want to be able to enjoy some sugary things, and I won't feel bad about eating them, but I still have not been able to work out how to effectively balance my desire to stay fit thin and eat a variety of foods (hence for the last few years I yoyo 20+ lbs as I diverge from low carb).
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  #22   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 17:37
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Posts: 14,967
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 255/230/200 Female 5'8"
BF:
Progress: 45%
Location: Massachusetts
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Interesting design for a food plate !


I cannot moderate sugar or refined carbs. Moderation does not work for me. Maybe it works for others but NOT me.

I am a carb addict. Period.

Refined carbs like sugar flour and the like are like cocaine. It's been proven via studies. Real sugar and bread becomes a loooooong binge. Weeks and months of eating crap full day of sugar and ground grains and potatoes.

I do better without. Or with LC versions.

Last edited by Ms Arielle : Mon, Oct-05-20 at 17:43.
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  #23   ^
Old Mon, Oct-05-20, 20:04
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Posts: 7,565
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
Refined carbs like sugar flour and the like are like cocaine. It's been proven via studies. Real sugar and bread becomes a loooooong binge. Weeks and months of eating crap full day of sugar and ground grains and potatoes.

I do better without. Or with LC versions.
Ditto ditto! Eating carb, sugary foods is NOT something I can do in moderation! If I eat a little dish of ice cream it then falls into two whole pints in one sitting, and then it just goes on from there.

I know plenty of folks say the LC versions using sugar substitutes are just as bad. But when I have those I don't go into crazy binges. But I certainly do if I have any "real" sugars, etc.
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