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  #1   ^
Old Mon, Mar-17-03, 14:25
Leora99 Leora99 is offline
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Posts: 66
 
Plan: Atkins plan
Stats: 167/156/130
BF:
Progress: 30%
Question Almost Hypothyroid....?

Hi, guys, my last TSH test (couple years ago) was 2.95.

Hypothyroidism runs in my family.

At the time of the test, 2.95 was smack in the middle of the ".5 to 6.0 is normal" range according to my family doctor.

I just read that the American Association of Clinical Endocrinologists (AACE) revised their guidelines in - 2002 or 2003 not sure when - and the NEW normal levels are now (for TSH)

.3 to 3.04

When I look at the bell curve, my reading of 2.95 is on the far end...right near hypothyroidism.

I have been having most of the symptoms of hypothyroidism for years. Tried a million antidepressants, wasn't really helped much.

Always cold. Nurses when taking my temp would often find a temp below 98.0 - many times I have heard, "What - how can you have such a low temp? Are you DEAD?"

Weight problems. Extreme fatigue, to the point where I honestly do not feel I can hold down a job (in my youth, was an Airborne Army Officer - very gung ho - worked long hours - ran six miles a day - plenty of energy.)

Problems with frequent UTI's, other infections, dry eyes, sick all the time.

Mother-in-law asking "are you okay? You sleep so much...."

Now, by these guidlines, at 2.95 I am healthy.

But it seems to me that there is not really a huge jump between healthy (2.95) and hypothyroid (3.05). Oh, my free Thyroxine is also at the extreme low end of normal.

I plan on being tested again - TSH and free TH. - I find myself actually hoping that my levels will rise a bit to above 3.0 so I can get treated and maybe feel better.

I'm pretty darn sure that it is only a matter of time before my TSH does rise above the magic number. From what I have read, anything above 2.0 on TSH is strongly indicative of future hypothyroidism, and TSH levels do tend to rise with age.

But there is one worry I have - are doctors bound by the new AACE guidelines? Or are they still following the old, outdated guidelines?

Can they refuse to treat me, if I do go above 3.04, and have all these symptoms, because the OLD guidelines said I was normal? Or are they morally/legally bound to use the new standards?

Does anyone know?

What are you guys' experience with your docs? Do they use the old guidelines or new?

Thank you,
Love, Leora
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  #2   ^
Old Tue, Mar-18-03, 03:05
Paleoanth's Avatar
Paleoanth Paleoanth is offline
Slothy Superhero
Posts: 12,159
 
Plan: Vegetarian Atkins
Stats: 165/145/125 Female 60 inches
BF:29/25.2/24
Progress: 50%
Location: Tennessee/Iowa
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I went in to my doctor with an article that showed a population with no hypothyroidism had TSH's of no higher than 2. I asked to have my thyroid meds upped to lower my TSH and he agreed. My doc is also hypothyroid and I think that helped.

My suggestion is to go in to the doc with the articles in your hand. Explain your symptoms clearly and ask him/her to consider upping your meds a bit.
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  #3   ^
Old Tue, Mar-18-03, 05:25
Leora99 Leora99 is offline
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Posts: 66
 
Plan: Atkins plan
Stats: 167/156/130
BF:
Progress: 30%
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Hi, sweetie! Thank you so much for answering!

The problem is, I am not on meds.

Every time I have asked for a thyroid test - because I could swear I have had symptoms of this for about 8 years now - the doctor looks at me with disgust when the test results come back (right under 3 - usually in the 2.90's) and says it's all in my head, that I need to eat less, exercise more, need to take antidepressants, etc. Because, since the old standard was .5 to 5.5 or so, I was smack dab in the middle - obvious a picture of perfect thyroid health, to the doctor!

Oh, and I have a couple of other hypo symptoms, too - no eyebrow hair on the outer half of my eyebrows (none at all), VERY heavy periods with cramps bad enough that I throw up several times each period I get.....

So the problem I have, is trying to find a doctor who will consider letting me try meds to bring me down to under 2.

I don't expect any doc to let me try meds as long as I stay 2.95 or so....I figure I will have to creep up to above 3.0 and then I can say, "look at the AACE guidelines, treat me..." and then I MIGHT have a chance at getting treated maybe...

But in my mind, maybe there isn't so much of a huge difference between 2.95 and 3.04 - maybe if I am sick and need help at 3.04, I'm sick and need help at 2.95 too....

Today I am going out and buying kelp and maybe looking for naturopathic meds - if there is anything else anyone can suggest I try, I will...

I just want to be well again, to be like I was when I was younger and my thyroid was (apparently back then) normal.

I am sure my thyroid number will continue to rise - my Mom was hypothyroid, and it took her quite a few years of suffering before her number got high enough they would treat her - boy what a difference when they finally did - 60 lbs. just fell off her without her even trying, she wasn't tired and depressed all the time - she said she felt better than she had for decades.

I find myself praying I will flip over 3.0 to get to the "magic number" where I can finally be treated and not just hover on the edge of hypothyroid like I've been doing for a number of years now....

Doesn't it suck when doc's are slave to numbers instead of listening to how their patients feel and what their clinical symptoms are???

Love, Leora

P.S. I was wondering if you might have a link bookmarked in your computer to that post you showed your doctor? I found the article with the new AACE guidelines but I don't remember seeing the part about anything over 2 being bad?

Last edited by Leora99 : Tue, Mar-18-03 at 05:26.
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  #4   ^
Old Sat, Sep-18-04, 13:25
unreg unreg is offline
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Posts: 20
 
Plan: none
Stats: 145/145/115 Female 63 inces
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Take a look at this website and see if you can't make an appt at one of these centers. I was desperate enough to fly myself from San Francisco to L.A. to at least get this doctor's opinion since the 4 other ones I have been to seem to dismiss all of my symtoms.At least check it out and read about the thryoid!
http://www.hormoneandlongevitycenter.com
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  #5   ^
Old Sat, Sep-18-04, 20:06
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doloresrod doloresrod is offline
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Posts: 5,980
 
Plan: ONE DAY AT A TIME:)!
Stats: 142.5/138.6/120.0 Female 5 feet and 3 inches
BF:
Progress: 17%
Location: Texas
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Hi Leora,
When you go into have more blood work, you also should ask to have the Free T4 test and Free T3 test. My TSH level was at 2.93 and my Free T4 was at 1.0 all borderline, I don't remember what my Free T3 was at the time. You need to find a doctor who will at least put you on a trial of Armour Thyroid. It wasn't until my 3rd doctor that I had seen put me on the Armour and now I see an endo, who has worked with me tremendously. She added a compound T4 because I asked her to because that level was still kind of low, I go in Monday for blood work. I hope you find the right doctor. I wish you all the best.
Take Care,
Dolores
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  #6   ^
Old Sat, Sep-18-04, 22:20
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tigger64 tigger64 is offline
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Posts: 193
 
Plan: Schwarzbein
Stats: 104/114/99 Female 4'10"
BF:
Progress: -200%
Location: Arkansas
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Hi Leora!

I am kinda in the same position as you altho I am over that magic number. My TSH is 4.2 and the lab result range showed that to be normal. The nurse practitioner that I am working with--altho very good and the best listener that I have ever run across--indicated that this was in the normal range, going by what the lab said. She obviously did not know about the narrowed range. I was talking with a friend about my lab results and she immediately pointed out that she thought that this number was too high. She lent me a wonderful book that I highly recommend--Thyroid Power by Richard and Karilee Shames. The authors indicate that if there is a family history of hypothyroidism--even tho tests don't indicate it yet--the positive family history is enough for them to try a clinical trial of thyroid medication. The authors did indicate that other drs may not go along with this but that there are other tests and clinical signs that might convince them. The book is very functional and tells you exactly what you should ask for. As for myself, I am going to talk with my nurse practitioner and bring up the new range of normal. Armed with the info that I now have, I feel confident that she will listen and act on it. Good luck with everything!

Tig
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  #7   ^
Old Sun, Oct-10-04, 19:17
wcollier wcollier is offline
Mad Scientist
Posts: 4,402
 
Plan: Healthy eating/lifestyle
Stats: 156/115/115 Female 5'4 - small frame
BF:
Progress: 100%
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Hi Tig:

Good ta see ya! Did you ever get this sorted out?

Wanda
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  #8   ^
Old Sun, Oct-10-04, 20:21
tigger64's Avatar
tigger64 tigger64 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 193
 
Plan: Schwarzbein
Stats: 104/114/99 Female 4'10"
BF:
Progress: -200%
Location: Arkansas
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Well, hi Wanda!

Fancy meeting you here!! I have an endocrinologist visit on Oct 27th with a dr that my nurse practioner feels really good about. I've also done saliva testing for adrenal fatigue and my cortisol is really low in the morning--no wonder I can hardly drag myself out of bed. The rest of the day, I am at the extreme low end of average. I am hoping that by addressing the thyroid/adrenal issues, I might finally start feeling better and maybe lose some of this weight I have gained, too.

How are you doing? Are you having thyroid issues, too? It is really good to talk to you again!!

Tig
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  #9   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 09:35
wcollier wcollier is offline
Mad Scientist
Posts: 4,402
 
Plan: Healthy eating/lifestyle
Stats: 156/115/115 Female 5'4 - small frame
BF:
Progress: 100%
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Hi Tig:

Wow, that's a long time to wait for your appt. After waiting all that time, probably the endo'll tell you what the nurse practitioner said. Do you have an alternative setup in the meantime?

Yeah, I'm having thyroid issues too. In hindsight, I've probably had them for a really long time. Nat gave me some great info in the "Useless b****** doctors" thread. I'm seeing my doc on Thursday with my test results. Thankfully, he wants to see my thyroid at 1, so I won't have to fight for treatment.

It's great to see ya again. LOL, you never DID start that journal.

Wanda
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  #10   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 09:53
tigger64's Avatar
tigger64 tigger64 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 193
 
Plan: Schwarzbein
Stats: 104/114/99 Female 4'10"
BF:
Progress: -200%
Location: Arkansas
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Hi Wanda!

No, no alternative plans. I've just been praying that this will work out. I thought progesterone was going to be my answer, but it hasn't made me feel all that much better, except reducing headaches--which is something!! I am just so worn out tired feeling I feel like I have been hit by a Mack truck most days. How about you? What led you to start thinking that your thyroid was the problem? I'm hoping I'll be as lucky as you re: getting a cooperative dr.

Tig
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  #11   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 10:09
wcollier wcollier is offline
Mad Scientist
Posts: 4,402
 
Plan: Healthy eating/lifestyle
Stats: 156/115/115 Female 5'4 - small frame
BF:
Progress: 100%
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Hi Tig:

Tig, hopefully things will get sorted out for you. You've had a really hard time of it. Treatment is out there for you, you'll just have to get persistent. Post your info here after your endo's visit.
Quote:


How about you? What led you to start thinking that your thyroid was the problem?


The final straw was when I gained 30 lbs in a short period of time - some of it due to abnormal sugar cravings like I've never seen before, but not all of it. Then when the cravings settled down and I was able to focus on losing the weight, I couldn't lose anything for 5 months (other than 10lbs in the first month) despite exercise and diet.

I've been getting my mercury fillings removed to try to reduce my high estrogen levels so it's possible that the process has worsened my thyroid. The weight gain started within weeks of the first phase of my amalgam removals. Previous tests showed some questionable TSH levels even before the mercury removal.

Wanda
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  #12   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 12:47
unreg unreg is offline
New Member
Posts: 20
 
Plan: none
Stats: 145/145/115 Female 63 inces
BF:
Progress:
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I would encourage everyone to check out the other string of messages on this same website under low metabolism. http://forum.lowcarber.org/archive/...hp/t-75598.html
There are many people there who have been very supportive and informative to me!
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  #13   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 13:20
wcollier wcollier is offline
Mad Scientist
Posts: 4,402
 
Plan: Healthy eating/lifestyle
Stats: 156/115/115 Female 5'4 - small frame
BF:
Progress: 100%
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Good thread Shariq. I've been on that Dr.'s site. It's very informative. Gosh, you're a hormonal mess, huh? Glad you're getting things straightened out. My testosterone is low too.

Wanda
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  #14   ^
Old Mon, Oct-11-04, 15:24
faywin faywin is offline
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Posts: 42
 
Plan: custom
Stats: 150/115/100 Female 5'2
BF:
Progress: 70%
Location: US
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This is a snippet from a book I'm currently reading, I think it does a great job of explaining why thyroid test results can appear normal when you actually do have a thyroid problem. The book is "Screaming To Be Heard: Hormonal Connections Women Suspect...and Doctors Ignore" by Elizabeth Lee Vliet, MD. I highly recommend it for an excellent explanation of women's hormone issues, although I disagree with her recommendation of a low-fat, high-carb diet (I just skipped right over that chapter, lol!)

Quote:
A comment I hear frequently is "you couldn't have thyroid problems because your TSH (thyroid stimulating hormone) is normal." When the cluster of symptoms I described above are present in women, I think it is important to go one step further in evaluating the thyroid. I have a series of more than a hundred patients, all but two are women, who had a normal TSH and turned out to have significantly elevated thyroid antibodies that meant they needed thyroid medication in order to feel normal. This type of oversight is particularly common with a type of thyroid disease called Thyroiditis, which is about 25 times more common in females than males. There are several different types of thyroiditis, but in general this is an inflamation of the thyroid gland that can result in production of antibodies to the gland tissue (microsomal antibodies) or antibodies to the thyroid hormone itself (thyroglobulin antibodies).

These antibodies act like "blocking agents" to keep the hormones from working properly, and the patient begins to experience the clinical symptoms of declining thyroid gland function described above. For some period of time, that can vary greatly from person to person, there is a gradual or abrupt elevation in the thyroid antibodies before there is a compensating rise in TSH produced by the brain in response to the failing gland. This means a woman may experience the symptoms of disease months to years before TSH goes up.
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