I feel incredibly sad. Some incredibly difficult emotions that I struggled with, albeit a very long time ago, have been triggered and brought to the surface again.

I watched the Oprah Winfrey show. This show was aired in the US sometime in March but in UK it was aired today. She was interviewing Rusty Yates, the husband of Andrea Yates who has been found to be mentally ill but responsible for the murder of her five children. She had support from Rusty and her mother, Dora. She had suffered post-partum depression after the birth of her fourth child, Luke. She was suffering from post-partum depression again after the birth of her fifth child, Mary. The doctors had put her on drugs for psychosis and anti-depressants. She was then taken off the drugs for psychosis and deemed fit enough to be discharged from hospital. She loved her children. Despite all the support her family gave her, she drowned her five children and has been found guilty of their murder.

Was she responsible? Did the doctors who treated her help her or make her condition worse? Is it fair to judge the family (Rusty or Dora)? Is the support system for people suffering depression “caring” enough? Are the mentally ill listened to? Is the public too ready to condemn people suffering depression. Are we realistic about the responsibilities we place upon the shoulders of someone suffering from depression?

These are all questions that I have struggled with since my teens. I did take anti-depressants in the 1970s. By mid-70s I had decided that the drugs were not doing me any good – if anything they were making me worse. It took me another couple of years to get myself off them. Since then, I have determinedly and stubbornly refused to take anti-depressants. Listening to Oprah and her guests today I feel soooo glad that I made that choice all those years ago. However the case has helped trigger off the rage, total isolation, despair, helplessness, inability to understand what was happening to me, guilt for letting my family down, self-recrimination etc that I went through at the time. These emotions still haunt me - at times more than at others. What do people here feel: about antidepressants, about the questions that the show once again brought to the fore?

I suffered from mood-swings after I came off the anti-depressants but it is only since I started Low-carbing I finally feel in control and believe my depression is a part of my past.

Take Loving Accepting Inclusive Care.

Depression can be very scary. I am currently on antidepressants and antianxiety medication (when needed). The cases of yates and lemak are isolated cases of deep deep depression. Let me tell you my story. In december, I was watching the news about lemack (she sedated her kids and then suffocated them) and I got very nervous. I was by myself with my kid and felt so angry at her for doing such a thing. Then I thought how could a mother's love falter so. I was so nervous around my child. I do a lot of role playing and I saw myself in her situation and I thought I was going to die. Just to imagine my child being harmed by someone or myself, drove me up the wall. I love my child so much that I would kill myself or someone else before they did harm to him....one person in this forum told me something that really helped me. She told me that this person thought that because she loved her kids that she should end their suffering. This helped me in the way that i am not like them. I was feeling so guilty of imaging this things. I would never ever hurt my child but just to role play in my mind how things would be, drove me to the hospital. I have also had situations that I am in work and suddenly "oh my God, what if a fire broke out in the babysitter's house and they can't get out". This gets me very upset and feel I have to drive out just to see if my child is ok.

I am with you on this. If you need to talk more freely on your feeling my email is: cristian0616~yahoo.com. Sometimes a little understanding and listening, can go a long way.s

I am not scared of depression - I learnt to cope with it. Its the attitudes that surround it that I find difficult. Anyway since I started LCing my mood-swings have all but disappeared.

I haven't, or hadn't until now, heard of Lemack. How awful. I think anyone suffering from depression is capable of doing the unthinkable. There were times when I would get really angry but my instinctive response was to retreat, do nothing until the anger passed. When one is taking drugs those inhibitions are bypassed and the unimaginable comes to pass.

Should not the doctors who are allegedly the experts take some responsibility for what their prescription is doing to their patients?

It is frightening. People do get nervous and shy away. As if by not acknowledging the problem it will go away.

How do we go about changing these attitudes? And providing real help where it is needed, WHEN it is needed.

Take care.

anti-depressants worry me for several reasons.

They are no doubt bolixing up the user's serotonin system even worse

They are addictive

They keep people out of deep sleep, which leads to (you guessed it!) depression

I tried super mild doses for a week (doc told me they'd help prevent the migraines) and became totally psychotic. I was about two more doses from hearing voices, I swear. Very disturbing, but more disturbing to me to realize that a quarter of American women are walking around on these things. Thank God my mind cleared up 48 hours after I quit them.

And lastly, there's a political aspect to this. Women suffer depression more often. Married women also do 90% of childrearing, 80% of housework, have been taught to unhealthily caretake emotionally for others, hold down a full time job, are taught to hate their own bodies...and on and on and on. Many live with alcoholic husbands or men who beat them. Most are underpaid.

Medicating away the very real feelings of tiredness, misery, and confusion that such social inequities cause is, to my mind, morally wrong.

I say, change the world first. Then see what changes about our own body image, our own sadness and exhaution.

I'm so glad LCing and better nutrition has helped you so much fiona. I think it has helped "moodiness" for most of us.

I empathise and agree with a lot of what you say Razzle. What struck me is that attempts have been made to medicate away the feelings. All it does is suppress them. Sooner or later one has to acknowledge and face those inner feelings.

It says something about my own inner change that I feel sad today and have spoken about it on the same day. It reminds me of the days that I would pretend to be extra cheerful to compensate and avoid the reality of my inner feelings.

One cannot medicate away feelings.

Take care.

The Andrea Yates story should be a wake up call for all women. Women today are dealing with isolation, lack of support and a disconnectedness, that drives us into depression. We need our family, friends and neighbors to help with the kids, and get involved in each other’s lives. Stay at home mom's have it the hardest in my opinion because of the isolation. However, there are wonderful groups out there intended just for this, M.O.P.S. is just one that I can think of off hand, and many churches have play groups for kids where the mom can also make friends. I say we need to change the way we think first, and then we can change the world. We have to take control and not be controlled by our situations. We have options, we just need to be creative. Some times medication is needed to get us thinking clearly, but you can't just take medication, you have to be willing and able to work on the problems, things don't fix themselves. Maybe therapy is needed to get a fresh perspective on things, or a priest or rabbi can help, or even most local governments have parenting programs, and I know in Syracuse there is a hotline for parents to call. There is help out there but you have to make the first move, things are not hopeless. You have to take personal responsibility for your mental health as well as physical health.

Hi Razzle
Only some anti-depressants are addictive such as Xanax.

Zoloft and others are not addictive. The problem is that they work on the receptors--so they take 3 weeks to block the receptor and work properly. If the person goes cold turkey, your body responds.

Just my 2 cents!

*cowering down and hoping that no one will throw rotten fruit at me for sharing this*

I have been on anti-depressants for about one month now, and I really do feel like they have helped me tremendously.

I feel like medication can be used as a tool to help in dealing with the events that cause depression/anxiety. Medication all by itself might not produce long-lasting changes, but I feel that it can be used as a starting place toward achieving wellness.

I don't think that all medication is bad, but I do feel that there are times when doctors prescribe medicine when it actually isn't necessary. Sometimes a change in eating/exercise/vocation is what is needed, and sometimes there are chemical problems that must be corrected through medicines.

I suppose each person is different and what works for one doesn't work for another. I feel blessed that my doctor evaluated my situation closely before prescribing any sort of anti-depressant...and I feel blessed that the medication prescribed is indeed helping me to deal with the issues that I need to deal with in my life.

When used properly as a tool toward providing assistance in dealing with the REAL issues or causes behind anxiety and depression, medicine can be very beneficial. (At least it has been for me personally.)

Only limited fruits allowed on LC WOE Positive experiences are always good to hear about and I am glad that anti-depressants are working for you.

I do agree with you that for SHORT periods of time a-ds, properly supervised, can be useful to tide one over a crisis situation in life.

My own experience was bad enough for me to never want to try them again. Rusty, having lost both his wife and all his children would, I imagine, be very wary of a-ds in future. I would not like to be in his shoes.

God give him strength. And Andrea too for that matter.
Take care,

Dear All

This is the first time I've been in this part of the forum and was particularly interested to read this thread.

If anyone has read my journal you'll notice I've been going through a pretty rough time of it of late. But around 6 weeks ago I realised I needed to talk to someone outside of my family and friends.

I paid privately to see a counsellor and it really helped me to see that I needed more help from my doctor. He was shocked that I had paid privately for counselling and arranged that I should see one through our national health service here in england. He also made me realise that I needed a little help medication wise. My problem was sleep - I was'nt getting any, so I was really tired all day and could'nt function properly throughout the day and little problems seemed huge.

To cut a long story short - he prescribed a very mild antidepressant that I only take before bed - this has really helped me. Its enough to relax me so that I go to sleep and wake up refreshed and ready to face the world the next morning. I suffer from no drowsiness what so ever during the day.

I too was extremley worried about the antidepressants, but with those and the help I have been getting from a counsellor - I am getting much stronger and back to being the old me.

What I want to say is this :- I really wanted to know if I needed help genuinely or was just down in the dumps. My doctor was encouraged that I had done this and then got me more help without my having to pay for it. There are all different types of people out there with different problems and on different medications. Dont please label all antidepressants same.

bye everyone

She knows what she did is wrong. I hope she rots in hell for harming those children.

Although your Dr. and the pharmecutical companies will tell you that Zoloft, paxil, prozac and others in the ssri category are not addictive, I can tell you from my experience, and the complaints of others at the St. John's Wort forum, these anti-depressants are addictive. The withdrawals are very bad, and you need to wean yourself off over a period of a month.

I am on an SSRI (Celexa) and I am glad. I feel as if I am the SAME person; I don't feel like a zombie. I still cry and feel depressed a lot. BUT what the medication has helped me to do is to get out of bed; and not to spend entire days crying in bed and toying with suicidal thoughts.

I KNOW that when the time comes to withdraw it will be difficult and that I am now "chemically" addicted. I had a friend who had a rough time withdrawing from Prozac, but in the end she believed that the experience of being on Prozac helped her out of a slump that she felt she could not get out of on her own.

I am working hard in therapy and trying my best to understand the basics of my depressive personality. I think of my Celexa as a measure that helps me until I can learn to help myself better without drugs.

On the other hand, I certainly agree that the drug companies "push" these drugs mercilessly and that a lot of doctors just want to blindly put everyone on them. I have read (cannot recall where) that many of the "elderly" are over-prescribed.

This is very much a case of Your Mileage May Vary, however. When a depression becomes disabling, sometimes the drugs can help a person. I did resist anti-depressants for a long time; I did not want to be "hooked" on drugs and I feared that they would change my personality. In my case, I am glad that I decided to give them a try.

But I support every individuals decision on how to go!

Natalie

Paxil CANNOT be addictive because it does not work. The only addiction is mental. Recent studies have showed that Paxil had the same effect as the placebo. So those people who *think* it's working it works because they want it to so bad it seems as it is. I do not think that these people have a chemical imbalance since they can make themselves better with brainpower. I do study psychology by the way so this is not just random bs.

Somersize,

Obviously, you have not taken Paxil. Just because you read something, somewhere doesn't make it true.

Paxil is addictive because it changes the amount of neurotransmitters available in the brain. There is an actual physical and chemical change that takes place.

Your attitude about anti-depressants is what perpetuates the "shame" that some feel about being depressed and having to take medication. Shame on you if you really do study psychology. Telling someone who is depressed it's all in their head, and can change it with brain power is just wrong, any/every Dr. will tell you that depression is caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain.

You mention one study, what about all the people who have had great success on Paxil, and have recovered while on medication. Paxil may not be the only solution, but it does help people to getting moving in the right direction to change their lives and overcome a debilitating illness.