Hi-

I'm re evaluating my 8 year old daughters meals. I've got a good handle on the LC way of life now and want to begin incorporating more of it into my kids lives too. I've been having problems with my oldest daughter behavior-wise too. I've been told previously by professionals that she's "gifted" but now that she's 8 and things are not settling down, I'm going to take her back in to see if we're also dealing with an ADD/ADHD. I've been doing a lot of research lately on the subject and have some to find that in MANY cases the underlying causes of ADD/ADHD are rooted in nutrition, allergies, mineral imbalances, etc. She does have a history of high lead levels and yeast overgrowth with are also factors.

I'm currently looking into some dietary supplements for her (Efalex, etc. so if anyone has any input about that too-- great!) but also, want to improve her diet by cutting out a lot of the sugars and processed foods to see if that may help her concentrate in school.

I personally don't feel it is practical to forbid her to eat all sweets, etc. She makes her own choices when she's away from home. She's pretty good about trying to stay balanced, she's not a huge sugar junkie anyway but come on, if a kid brings cupcakes to school or the teacher passes out a treat-- she's going to have one.

I am not going to cut out fruit or whole grains but I'm going to try to cut down the processed sugars as much as possible in her everyday meals so when she does have a treat or dinner out, it's not just being piled up on top of a whole bunch of other sugar she's been eating throughout the day.

My biggest challenge is lunch time. I'm also new to making lunches, she ate the lunchroom food at her old school. Below is a current typical lunch and my ideas of replacements. Would any of you mind looking of my current food selection and ideas and putting in your 2 cents? Thanks!!!


Sandwich:
Meat/cheese/mayo sandwich on white bread (I'll replace the white with wheat)
Every once and a great while PB&J (I can get a natural fruit spread & natural peanut butter instead)
She also likes tuna and chicken salad although I have not made it yet this year

Fruit:
Dole fruit cup
applesauce
yogurt
blueberries
apple or plumb or other in season fruit

Instead of chips (because I don't do chips):
Baby carrot sticks (may also do cream cheese on celery or cherry tomatoes for variety. She LOVES her veggies)
1/4 cup roasted peanuts for some extra protein
Beef Jerky (she actually picked this out herself! So proud!)
Uhhhh . . . I get stuck here . . . maybe cheese and whole wheat crackers?

Beverage:
Gatorade or 2 juice boxes (I can replace with Crystal Lite or Diet Hanson's-- what else??? Should I be concerned about the artificial sweeteners?)

Treat:
Fruit snacks-- the ones that resemble Gumi bears but are supposedly "natural"
Mini marshmallows
2 chocolate chip cookies-- only once per week
1/2 a Twix bar-- only once per week on Fridays
THIS IS MY BIGGEST CHALLENGE! All I can think of is SF jell-o and pudding cups. Any other ideas?? Again, too much fake sweetener?

Also, anyone have a suggestion for a brand of wheat bread your kids like? She tells me she is going to give her best effort to eat wheat instead of white but is not sure if she can do it. She LOVES white and is going to have a really hard time with this one (she's picky). Thanks bunches!

I agree that getting your kids to eat low carb is a challenge... one of many parenting challenges!

I started just by cutting out the starch at dinner - so no rice, potatoes, pasta, filler - just meat/chicken/fish and a couple of veggies. They never missed it.

Then I stopped buying breakfast cereals. They could have unsweetened yoghurt and fruit, the LC egg and cream cheese danish, eggs and ham or bacon. The most popular breakfast is plain yoghurt and blueberries (I buy all kinds of frozen berries and fruit and just defrost them in the microwave before serving).

For lunches I do make them sandwiches, on whole wheat bread (Dempsters 100% whole wheat is a good brand), because it is convenient for me and they don't eat bread at any other time. They both like ham, tuna, chicken, cheese, egg salad, and I try to add some "salad" to the sandwiches (tomato/lettuce). I even cave to the occasional pb&j (everything in moderation). Snacks include plain yoghurt and fruit, veggies and dip, fruit and dip (cream cheese mixed with a little cream to make it "dippier").

I buy Ceres brand juices which come in a very wide variety (mango, pear, kiwi, guava, different berry mixes, etc.). I dilute them a little (mostly to stretch them) and the kids know that they are only allowed to have a small glass or two a day. Otherwise they drink water or 2% milk.

I think the biggest thing to remember with kids is EVERYTHING IN MODERATION.

My kids are 5 and 8 and I find the hardest thing is saying no to all the snack foods and treats that they are offered by their friends and their well meaning parents (and grandparents!!). I don't think that fruit snacks, cookies, popsicles, freezies, Mr. Noodles, Ritz crackers, chocolate granola bars, lollypops, are appropriate after school snack ideas. Call me crazy. I'm not a food nazi, I do say yes once in a while ('cause, again, everything in moderation!). I just think that there are so many other things they can eat and enjoy!

I keep a tray of cut veggies and a couple of dips in the fridge all the time and the kids know that they can help themselves anytime they want. I have almost completely obliterated the "I'm hungry"s in my house. You know that whiny one, 30 minutes before dinner?! They can help themselves to the veggies in the fridge (so what if they fill up before dinner?!).

Good luck in your quest for better kid nutrition. It sounds like she is willing to try out a healthier WOE.

Thanks for the response. You gave me a great idea with the frozen berries. She LOVES berries but they are not always in season and they don't stay fresh long enough. Great idea, she'll love it!

My family already eats an LC dinner and they enjoy it. Every once and a great while (maybe every couple of weeks) they make a rice or something to go along with the dinner but I'd say 99% of the time it's completely LC.

Breakfast is another one we've got to work on. They would rarely eat cereals but recently DH went out and bought a few boxes to support the "box tops" promotion for the school. Before that the kids would have yogurt, apples and cheese or something to that effect. We need to get back to that.

Cookies are everywhere though. My 2 year old LOVES cookies. Luckily, the older one isn't too into them. She almost always refuses the offer of a cookie. The 2 year old we need to work on . . .

I was talking with my oldest last night about changing her diet. She actually suggested bottled water for a drink at lunch. She said she'd prefer that to the sugarless drink that I was going to get. That was a shocker! Thanks for the bread brand suggestion, she's still reluctantly going along with that one. She also said usually at lunch she throws away her bread and just eats the meat and cheese anyway (I had no clue!). She asked if I could just give her meat and cheese. So, meat roll-ups may be another option.

She's also fine with having a fruit or yogurt for a lunch time treat (whew!). I was surprised at how she is going along with this. She told me that she's tired of having so many problems in school with her behavior and it's so hard for her to concentrate. She also feels tired all the time and has a somewhat "sour" stomach often. She's tired of all this and if cutting out the sugar and taking supplements will make her feel better she's all for it. Her weakness is ice-cream but she's had the sugar free versions and really can't tell the difference. I also reminded her that she can have sugar here and there-- like you said, it's the moderation thing we're working on.

We'll see how it goes . . . . .

Is it possible for your daughter to get milk with her lunches? Many schools offer the option to purchase milk for the kids at lunchtime. Just a thought...maybe the bottled water AND some milk?
I get little cups with lids at my local party supply place and send ranch dressing along for them to dip their veggies in.
We do a LOT of Gogurt at my house as well as string cheese. Sometimes I will get the small Gladware containers and make sugar-free Jello with berries in it for a treat or sugar-free pudding made with half cream, half water. My oldest loves pistachios in her lunch and tonight I tried something new on them for an after school snack...cucumbers seeded and cut into eighths then rolled up in ham slices spread with a mixture of cream cheese, a little mustard and some garlic powder (I hear dill is very good with this, too, but I don't care for dill) then chilled and sliced into bite-sized pieces. Mixed results. The oldest love it, but the youngest turned up her nose (doesn't like mustard).
The brand of wheat bread I get is Aunt Millie's Light wheat (7 net grams of carb per slice). My girls are PBJ junkies, so I get the sugar-free peanut butter and low or no sugar jams for them.

Breakfast is sometimes cereal, more usually it's eggs, toast with cheese or peanut butter or oatmeal or yogurt with milk to drink. I try to encourage them to at least eat a little protein with breakfast so they don't get so hungry before lunch.
Lunch is usually a 1 slice sandwich (PBJ, bologna, ham, turkey, etc..), a fruit, a Gogurt, a string cheese, crackers with cheese and sometimes Cheez-its, chips (only a few times a week, though) or pretzels. Sometimes I'll make sugar-free jello with fruit or pudding. They either bring a water bottle or get milk (or both) to drink.
After school snacks are varied...veggies with dip, fruit, cheese sticks, cheese and crackers or peanut butter and crackers...stuff like that. If they have stuff left from their lunch, they eat that.
Dinner is whatever DH and I are having...usually lots of veggies (they both love their veggies) with butter or cheese sauce and a decent size serving of protein (at least a couple of ounces) and milk again (6 oz. cups). Between the yogurt, the milk and the cheese, they get plenty of calcium.
Tonight DH is rewarding my oldest for successfully getting up, dressed and ready for school ahead of schedule all week so far (this has been a huge battle for her..she's not a morning person!) by taking her out to a local ice cream shop for REAL ice cream. We don't say no to treats like that all the time, but we do keep them reserved for true treats and not an every day occurance.

Lisa N-

Thanks for the reply. I'd love it if she drank milk at lunch but she won't do it. She is a milk drinker (so we try to get in a glass at dinner) but she HATES the cartons the milk comes in. She can't open them properly and wrestles with them every time. She also just does not like drinking milk from cartons for some strange reason (I don't quite understand that one!).

Thanks for the tip about sufficient protein at breakfast. Syd eats breakfast at about 6:30 and has the first lunch period at 10:30. She says she's STARVING by then. I've been trying to incorporate more in her breakfasts the last few days. She LOVES hard boiled eggs and they have about 17 grams of protein each. I boiled up a whole bunch yesterday to stick in the fridge for her to last the week. All day yesterday all she said was "can I have another egg, can I have another egg, can I have another egg!?!?!?!?" Drove me nuts! I bet I'll have to make more before the week is up. She also likes pepperoni & cheese which is my staple breakfast so we always have that in the house.

Goose- I got some organic yogurt and frozen peaches and blueberries yesterday. Both kids LOVED it! I mixed in just a little bit of unsweetened cocoa to make the yogurt chocolate. My oldest wants to have that in her lunch as a treat (as well as for breakfast and an after dinner treat!). I'll be going out this weekend to find some small Tupperware containers for that. That yogurt has a pretty decent amount of protein per serving too.

Thanks to both of you for sharing your ideas with me. I can't believe in the last few days I've gotten her to love SF jam on whole wheat toast and a whole bunch of other good-for-you things. I got some natural peanut butter for PBJ days and to put on celery. Today for lunch we're going to have a meat roll-up sampler platter so she can tell me which combination she likes. She's super excited about her new foods and so am I.

I do have a question. Did you find that cutting out some sugar from your kids diet helped their behavior or attitude? I'm taking my oldest in to the doctor soon because I think there is some kind of ADD or ADHD issue going on. She can't concentrate at school (although she's really bright and knows her school material well). She's falling asleep in class and taking naps at recess although she gets enough sleep. It's only the 3rd week of school and her teachers are already at their wits end with her behavior and disruptions to class (I have a Monday morning meeting with her teacher and Asst. principal about a string of incidents that have already occurred). She constantly complains of feeling sick to her stomach, weak and tired. Basically, there are lots more "warning signs" that have been going on her entire life and things are not getting better despite the countless "behavior modification" techniques we've tried at home. We've got lots of clear-cut rules and consequences-- basically, she's not allowed just to run crazy like a lot of parents seem to allow these days. I have a feeling she is a candidate for ritalin. Before I go that route I'd like to try some other options first. I ordered some Efalex for her and as you know I am trying to change her diet a bit. I know diet alone will not solve all our problems but did you guys see a little bit of difference?

Maybe get her some keifer to drink instead of milk. It comes in easier to open containers and I love the taste. IF she likes yogurt she'll like it.

Will she have PB and cream cheese in celery? You can also get the LaTortilla wraps. They are extreamly high fiber. Then make all kinds of roll ups. Do traditional tacos/fajitas. Do lunch meat and cheese roll ups, or peanut butter and jelly roll ups. You can add in lettuce and tomato with some chicken for a kind of samwich wrap.

String cheese is always a favorite. I wish the gogurts (yogurt in the tube) would come in plain unsweetened. My son loves them, but they are mostly sugar so he hasn't gotten any in months.

With the fruit cups, make sure they are in juice, not syrups. For the chips you can experiment with making sweet potato chips, turnip crisps, or cheese crisps where you cook the cheese into a chip like treat.

Making a quish can also work. Make one on the weekend, then just wrap up a piece and stick rest in the freezer. I don't think it needs to be refridgerated even between then and lunch time.

Get whole milk, plain unsweetened yogurt and mix in your own frozen fruits. It also is great with protien shake mix mixed in.

Cutting down on her sugar intake will definetly help with attention span and also energy levels. She won't have to be dealing with gluclose spikes followed by sever downers. It's like the crash down after a caffine high.

You might also want to include something along the lines of jerky, or other small snack she can have mid afternoon. Something small that can be eaten discreatly in class so she won't get in trouble. I know by the end of the day I was too hungry to pay attention in class.

I think I've seen little bottles of milk at the store. You could buy those and put them in her lunch. Another option might be soy milk, because I have seen some in little juice containers (the ones with the straws, like HI-C and Capri Sun). The soy milk comes if different flavors, but I'm not sure if it's all sugar free. I don't know how much help any of this was, but those were just a couple things that came to mind. ~CindyLynn~

I think for the milk I'm not going to worry about it too much. She's really pro-water for lunch and I don't want to start causing friction with her. I'll make sure she has a glass at dinner and/or after school. I think with the yogurt, eggs, green veggies at dinner, etc. she'll be getting enough calcium elsewhere. Next time we are at the store I'll look for the single serve milks (that's cool, I never knew they had those) and see if she is interested. She does get freaked out if her milk gets the least bit warm so I'm thinking she won't go for it if it's sitting in her backpack all morning (even if I put an ice pack in to keep stuff cold -- it's all in her head).

Speaking of the yogurt, the kids still LOVE it. I found a SF strawberry syrup made by Sugar Twin today (I think it's supposed to be for ice cream-- 1 carb that is a sugar alcohol so I can put it on my stuff too). I put a little squirt in the yogurt today along with frozen cherries and strawberries and they liked it better than the chocolate I did yesterday.

I'm going to try the celery and cream cheese or peanut butter (probably PB, she's iffy on cream cheese). Problem is, the celery I bought this weekend was mutant. Every single stalk on the entire thing was rolled up so tightly that I couldn't get anything between it. Strange, that has never happened to me before! We did roll-up samplers today and found "THE ONE." 2 pcs of lunch meat and a slice of swiss rolled in. I stuck it together with a light layer of sour cream. A hit -- I'm packing 3 in her lunch tomorrow (I think I'm going to even start eating it for breakfast myself!).

Good idea about the afternoon snack. I have a meeting with her teacher this week and I'm going to see what their policy on classroom eating is. I've found these days a lot of schools let you bring something to class. If they can't eat in the class-- I don't know. She's rather clumsy and discombobulated -- she'll totally get busted. Also, there are a few kids the sit near her that already have it in for her, I know they will tattle. She loves pepperoni slices, jerky and string cheese. That's stuff we have on hand normally so it would be perfect.

She's been really receptive and excited about this WOE so far. I just need to make sure I keep her carbs at a good level. She can't stand to loose any weight. At 8 she's only 63 lbs. Very petite -- she got the "good" genes of the family!

Boy does this sound familiar! I went through something very similar with my oldest daughter during 1st and most of 2nd grade (she's third grade now). I tried the EFA, cutting sugar, you name it but nothing really made much difference, although the school was very patient and tried to work with me while I was trying the alternative treatments. She also had problems concentrating and because of that was very distracting to the other kids around her even though she knew the class materials and is very bright. I dug in my heels on the Ritalin even after she was "officially" diagnosed with ADD (actually, there are some new meds on the market now that are not Ritalin) the whole time, but finally agreed to give it a shot last January. She was on it less than 4 days and I found myself saying, "I wish we had done this months ago!". What a difference! She takes a timed release version of Ritalin called Concerta and the only major problem she has had with it so far is weight loss. She now takes 20 minutes to finish her homework instead of 2 hours with me constantly redirecting her and both of us getting more frustated by the minute. She's still a bit fidgety in class (busy hands) but she's much more able to pay attention and stay focused. I know a lot of people have a problem with giving kids Ritalin or similar medications, but for me and my daughter I can honestly say it has made a world of difference when nothing else really seemed to help.

Thanks for sharing Lisa. The warning signs have been there from infancy. I'd take her to the doctor and mention her behaviors and the doctor told me she was gifted and eccentric. I took her to a therapist a 5 and got the same story. Now at 8, COME ON-- THERE IS SOMETHING GOING ON. Things are much more pronounced now that in 3rd grade most kids have "settled down" and she has not.

We've got her a little more settled down at home but we've got to run things like drill sergeants-- not enjoyable for anyone. Any yes, HOURS on homework is the story! She's so smart and already does times tables, division, reads beautifully, etc. But, man is she S L O W. I also wonder if she's got anxiety problems. This morning we were having a heart to heart and she let some of her emotions go (which is rare for her). When I asked why she didn't like to talk about her feelings she got all choked up and said "because it's embarrassing and I don't want people to know about my feelings!" And then she puked on her shoes.

I have a doctors appt on Tues and unfortunately my school meeting got resked until Thursday. I only hope they are as understanding as your daughter educators seen to be. I'm not totally against meds. I think it's all in my head-- but I'd like to try more natural methods first. But then again, if school keeps going the way it has been I may just cave and go along with the dr's if that's what they suggest. I've been doing a lot of reading and it seems like she's got A LOT going on. I don't think natural methods will hurt but I have a gut feeling they won't totally help either.

Regardless, I do really like cutting down on sugar and upping the protein. That will stay no matter what we decide to do.

I do commend you for doing what you have done for your DD-- it's not easy! I'm kind of kicking myself for not doing something sooner. I believed the doctors even though my gut was telling me something different. I do believe she's gifted but I also believe there is a WHOLE bunch of other stuff there too. I'm going to try and be open minded about the meds. Sure it makes me nervous as heck but if we do end up going that route I think it may be better for her in the long run. Her esteem is going down the drain fast.

I found a great article online. Although you are through most of the tougher times (I hope!) I found this REALLY INTERESTING. I've only gotten through the first 2 "chapters" but boy! The first one described my DD to a T from infancy to present. Here is the link if you are interested:

http://www.klis.com/chandler/home.htm

Thanks again!

I just wanted to thank you guys for all your suggestions. DD is eating maintenance level carbs and loving it. She's had a real improvement in her attitude (were also supplementing with EFA's and other vitamins for that) and she actually LOOKS better--brighter skin, hair, more rested, etc. She really likes eating like this -- for an 8 yo that's an accomplishment! I've got the school lunch thing down to a science. She says some of the kids give her funny looks when she pulls out her hard boiled egg & beef jerky or meat rollups. But then she tells me she does not care because the food I give her is REALLY GOOD.

She still has occasional sugar if there is a treat at school or something. A couple of times she learned her lesson and ate too much. She made her self sick with just a fraction of the sugar she used to eat on a daily basis. She gladly now just takes a little bit (if any) and says "no thanks" to any more.

I tell her that I will not forbid her to eat anything. I will give her certain things and not buy certain things at home but when she is on her own, it's HER choice. I'm only there to educate her about her choices and help her decide when is too much -- she should feel like she HAS to pass something up that she wants (the whole moderation view on things). It's working better than expected!

She wants to go trick or treating but one day it dawned on her that it's a whole bunch of candy. She says to me "Oh no, what am I going to do with all that candy?!" I told her we could keep it and have a piece every once and a while. Then she says "but I don't want it." Wow! What a change! THANKS!!!!

Get rid of the wheat!!!! Children who are struggling with self control often have wheat allergies. They eat bread at lunch and by 1 pm they are lethargic and slow. Many times they will rev themselves up to get through the afternoon and they end up having problems with self-control.

Son No 2 is 7 and has a wheat allergy. We have taken him off all types of grains and the behaviour problems cleared up after 2 weeks. He was no longer trying to keep himself alert in the afternoon by wandering in the classroom and talking out loud etc.

Weaning children off wheat is extremely difficult but it sure paid off in our house.

Thanks for the wheat advise. I do wonder . . . . .

In the beginning I bought wheat bread but my DD told me she didn't really like bread, especially not WHEAT bread so we stopped buying it all together. I didn't really think about it until I read your post, but she has been consuming NO wheat products for the past few weeks.

Interesting, thanks!

In regards to the quiche suggestion- try them made in a muffin/cupcake pan. I poured the quiche mix into a pre oiled pan and it worked great-or you can use the cupcake liners. Mini quiche to go! You can also line the muffin pan with a ham or canadian bacon slice. When my son takes something that needs to stay cool, I freeze his water bottle over nite-it's thawed by lunch in the summer. In the winter, just chill it the night before in the fridge.