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  #1   ^
Old Sun, May-11-08, 22:25
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
Default health benefits

Wondering what your blood results have been while doing low carb veg as compared to regular low carbing. Specifically interested in cholesterol levels, sugar levels and also how has your blood pressure been? Does anyone here use unsweetened soy milk? How's it effect your loss? T
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  #2   ^
Old Thu, May-15-08, 02:59
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
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Is it just quiet in here or is cholesterol, bp, blood sugars not an issue for the veg version of low carb? T
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  #3   ^
Old Thu, May-15-08, 18:05
Elsah's Avatar
Elsah Elsah is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,666
 
Plan: Undecided atm
Stats: 162/000/115 Female 5' 4"
BF:
Progress: 345%
Location: North Carolina
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Think it just stays quiet in here for the most part. Only a few veg on the lc forums.
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  #4   ^
Old Tue, May-20-08, 05:43
Gaelen's Avatar
Gaelen Gaelen is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 244
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 216/166/150 Female 60 inches
BF:45%/33.5%/28%
Progress: 76%
Location: CNY
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I've been low carb and low carb mainly meatless. My blood values and lipid profiles have been good and basically the same whether or not I'm including meat in my meals.

If you're looking for a way to say that veggie low carb is healthier than low carb which incorporates meat, I'm afraid my results don't support that...low carb is healthy, however it's done.
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  #5   ^
Old Tue, May-20-08, 06:06
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
Default

My cholesterol and blood pressure improved doing low carb w/meat but is still not where it consistently needs to be. Somewhat due to weight and somewhat do to heredity. My main reasons for making the switch is that I've stalled it seems permanently so I'm wanting to see if this helps the weight loss. Also its been bothering me to eat what the factory farms are producing.....lots of press on their treatment of animals this past year in Ohio. I am needing to watch my blood sugar level so I'm being sure to include protein w/everything I eat.

BTW I'm wondering if you include dairy and eggs....

This is my tweaked version of low carb veg....suggestions are appreciated!

First, I'm not using the frozen prepared meat substitutes like burgers as they have wheat gluten (allergy here), too much salt (hypertension) and some of the ingredients I'm not wanting to eat. Also limiting the dairy and aiming for the lower glycemic/lower carb choices as I am borderline diabetic.

Breakfasts:
3 T ground flax seed w/hot water, a small handful of raw walnuts, cinammon, nutmeg, vanilla and stevia

or flax seed cereal w/a side of free range eggs

or an omelet filled w/steamed veggies and herbs w/a light sprinkle of hard cheese

or a protein drink made w/fresh strawberries

1/2 tart apple w/crunchy peanut butter and silk unsweetened soy milk

Lunches and Dinners:

any of the "breakfasts" or

Protein: tofu, unsweetened soy milk, free range eggs, ocean caught wild salmon, tuna or raw nuts, 1/3 - 1/2 c beans

Vegetables: salads, stir fry or steamed lower carb veggies

etc....

unsweetened soy milk for a snack w/a stir of cinammon, nutmeg, vanilla and stevia
lower gly fruit w/a handful of raw nuts
avocado half w/salsa and a dollop of plain silk soy yogurt
romaine lettuce leaf rollups w/tuna, egg or tofu salad or beans w/salsa and shredded cheese
artichokes, salad, feta, black olives
edadame (sp?) w/feta, basil, 1/2 tsp dried cranberries (high carb but a little is ok i think) and vinegarette
cabbage/bok choy/onion stir fry w/walnuts

Last edited by Flower51 : Tue, May-20-08 at 06:23.
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  #6   ^
Old Wed, May-21-08, 07:42
Gaelen's Avatar
Gaelen Gaelen is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 244
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 216/166/150 Female 60 inches
BF:45%/33.5%/28%
Progress: 76%
Location: CNY
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Flowers, just judging from your sample menus, you are not getting anywhere near the amount of protein and fat you need for someone who is currently 204 lbs. Per Protein Power (which is very vegetarian friendly, btw), you need at minimum 120g of protien per day, and you'd do better with 60-80g (at minimum 60% of your intake) as fats.

Yes, I do eat eggs and dairy, and fish.
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  #7   ^
Old Wed, May-21-08, 20:46
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
Default

Hi Gaelen. Just got news from doc that my tri and hdls improved and there is no hint of any blood sugar problems (in the past a doctor called me borderline diabetic). total chol increased as did LDL. Sending her a note to find out how much of the LDL was "fluffy" and what my crp level was. Total was 270 and HDL was 42 I think. not so good! Hoping eliminating dairy and doing lower carb veg will help.

Don't know how I could eat that much protein being a veg. Today I wasn't hungry...had a small amount of raw walnuts early in the day. At 7ish had 1/2 avocado w/salsa, a T of plain soy yogurt, two stalks raw broccolli, 3 strawberries and 3 baby carrots. Later I had a whey protein shake made w/peanut butter and silk unsw soymilk. Just not hungry!
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  #8   ^
Old Thu, May-22-08, 17:39
tammay tammay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 538
 
Plan: Vegetarian Low GI
Stats: 188/179.8/125 Female 5'1"
BF:
Progress: 13%
Location: Israel (temporarily)
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Hi Flower,
Congrats on being a veggie! The animals will thank you (even if you're not doing it for them ).

I can't say much for the medical issues, as I haven't had any of that checked (though I probably should...) You might want to check out the "Vegan Low Carb for Dummies" thread, as I just posted there a sample menu of mine, which might give you some ideas. I'm trying to do vegan and low carb, so I'm not eating dairy or eggs at the moment.

As for unsweetened soy milk, I do use it, but I don't drink it "straight". For some reason, I can't stand the thought of drinking any kind of milk without anything. So I usually throw it into a protein shake or some other recipe where the taste is disguised. One interesting thing I noticed since I became a vegetarian/vegan and started using more soy products - I had a really hard time with the taste of soy in the beginning, couldn't even stomach soy lattes. But now (three years since going vegetarian, a year since going vegan) the taste of soy proteins (like soy milk and tofu) really don't bother me at all. Weird!

Tam
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  #9   ^
Old Thu, May-22-08, 19:20
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
Default btu

Thanks Tammay. It wasn't much of a stretch for me to go veg. I love animals, have two wonderful pups, and it breaks my heart to see how factory farms abuse animals. I did paleo before. Felt good on it but my conscience bothers me too much to keep eating meat for now. I do buy free range eggs. I love soymilk...only the silk unsweetened so far. I add cinammon, nutmeg, vanilla and a bit of stevia. Yum. It's like eggnog to me.

I also eat fish so I'm technically a "peschotarian???" LOL not such good spelling I guess. Do you know if B 12 is in eggs and fish?

Also I make a whey protein shake (maybe I'll go soy someday) w/2T peanut butter, 1 c soymilk, a bit of stevia and 3 cubes of ice. Whir it in the blender......I am addicted to peanuts and peanut butter!

I don't eat any sieten, tempeh, or frozen fake meat products....They look tempting but the wheat gluten, salt and some other ingr don't agree w/me (btw I noticed one had partially hydrogenateds in it...what a surprise! I thought people ate those because they want to be healthy.)

I'll go hunt for the thread you mentioned...hope I can find it. If not I'll try and get back to you for a link.


This is kind of my last best stab at getting the cholesterol and bp in line and losing weight outside of going completely raw.
Terry
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  #10   ^
Old Fri, May-23-08, 01:52
NorthPeace's Avatar
NorthPeace NorthPeace is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 388
 
Plan: Nutritarian
Stats: 248/208/168 Male 5'9"
BF:Waist 46?/34/?
Progress: 50%
Location: British Columbia
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Hi flowr51! I have a bit of data here for you. I follow a low meat, low starch/grain eating plan that emphasizes whole plants - mainly vegetables, fruits, beans, nuts and seeds. It is not low carb (nor is it low fat or low protein). I get about 3% of calories from animal products and 3% from other sources (e.g. sugar, oil, alcohol, food-like substances).

At 0, 2, 8, and 14 months got the following results without drugs:

Weight: 248, 218, 196, 202 lbs
FG: 128, 101, 95, 85 mg/dL
A1C: -, 6.2, 5.9, -
TC: 186, 151, -, - mg/dL
HDL: 35, 36, -, - mg/dL
LDL: 122, 101, -, - mg/dL
Trig: 144, 69, -, - mg/dL
Systolic BP (dr.): 142, 138, 130, - mg/dL
Systolic BP (self): -, -, 115, 117 mm Hg
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  #11   ^
Old Fri, May-23-08, 07:14
Flower51's Avatar
Flower51 Flower51 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 348
 
Plan: ketogenic neandrathin
Stats: 254/212/155 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
Default

Interesting info Joe. A little info here as you didn't start off in as bad shape as I was according to your stats:

I've been hypertensive since my 20s....I'm now in my 50s. For some of that time, while low carbing w/meats and fish, my bp was GREAT....like 115/64 at the lowest....or cruising around 120s and 130/s over 70s or 80s. Cholesterol was always an issue and something that I saw beginning to come down but still pretty high and a bad ratio.

In February I had a stroke. Docs wanted me on chol and bp meds immediately as my bp had begun spiking (200+/110 or so)
I said I wanted to try and bring them down by exercise and tweaking what I was eating and supplements. BP still gets in the 160s/high 90s even 101 the other day. I ate strict lc (meat) for two months and exercised during which I was in the 120s/ 70s consistently, then hurt my foot, couldn't exercise for the next month and just began making bad choices on what I ate....succumbed to pizza, ice cream....aargh. So I saw both my bp and chol rise again. Now my foot is better and I'm back to exercising and decided to try the veg/fish low carb as my weight loss has been at a snail's pace for the last year.

Do you have a journal where you show what your typical woe is?
For bps sake it seems lc helps me so I'm inclined to aim for lower carb though eating a grapefruit or other fruit once a day or so does seem to help the bp. Maybe its the potassium.
Experimenting to see if drinking low sodium v8 or upping the lower gly veggies do the same.

Say what's a "food like substance" That one had me both guessing and laughing at the possibilities!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks! Terry
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  #12   ^
Old Fri, May-23-08, 19:24
NorthPeace's Avatar
NorthPeace NorthPeace is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 388
 
Plan: Nutritarian
Stats: 248/208/168 Male 5'9"
BF:Waist 46?/34/?
Progress: 50%
Location: British Columbia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flower51
Do you have a journal where you show what your typical woe is?

My journal is very old now, and it is more of a habit. Typically it goes like this:

Breakfast:
Large smoothie made with spinach, arugula, kale, berries, pomegranate juice, another fruit, ground flax seed, sunflower seeds soaked overnight, plus either water or a half cup of soy milk. You need a big food processor with some horsepower for this. The idea is to have just enough fruit in it to make the otherwise boring green mush taste good. Chopped fruit on a bed of romaine, with nuts sprinkled is also nice.

Lunch:
Large salad with flavoured (fruit infusion) vinegar
Vegetable 'n' Bean soup (has dulse for iodine and nut butter for nutrient absorption)
Two fruits

Dinner:
Large salad with a homemade dressing (e.g. with avocado base, vinegar or lemon for acidity, some herbs)
Steamed greens - typically bok choy, cabbage, and a little of whatever else is kicking around, like beet or radish tops. I may add some frozen peas to the steamer as well. I often make a dressing out of the soup du jour by adding a tablespoon of nut or seed butter, some spices and some chopped mushrooms, then heating the mixture slowly in a microwave. Btw all my dressings are homemade but they aren't much work once you get into the flow (using the soup as a base, or using the veggies you would chop for salad anyhow).
Dessert is a homemade ice cream made from processing together some frozen fruit, soy milk and a little dried fruit. My favourite is with mangoes and a dried apricot.

The above adds up to about 1200 kcal but somehow I get it up to around 1800 kcal or more. I drink too much coffee, always with cream and sugar. I might have a boiled free range egg every second day, and fish or chicken every week or two. Add to that one or two large apples, and more than enough nuts, and I am now stalled at a little over 200 lbs.

Weekly mega B12, daily fish oil, vitamin D, and a little supplementation with Se and Zn.

Flower, BP is a bit of a mystery for me. My change in diet quickly had noticeable effects on lipids and blood sugars and other improvements I won't mention, but systolic BP has only come down about 12 points so far. Perhaps with atherosclerosis, hardening of the arteries, it takes a while to bring about physical change in the arterial walls; but meanwhile serum lipids and sugars react more quickly, being in a more dynamic part of the body?
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  #13   ^
Old Sat, May-24-08, 12:25
tammay tammay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 538
 
Plan: Vegetarian Low GI
Stats: 188/179.8/125 Female 5'1"
BF:
Progress: 13%
Location: Israel (temporarily)
Default

[QUOTE=NorthPeace]Hi flowr51! I have a bit of data here for you. I follow a low meat, low starch/grain eating plan that emphasizes whole plants - mainly vegetables, fruits, beans, nuts and seeds. It is not low carb (nor is it low fat or low protein). I get about 3% of calories from animal products and 3% from other sources (e.g. sugar, oil, alcohol, food-like substances).

Hi Joe,
I noticed from your stats that you're doing Joel Fuhrman's Eat to Live. I tried that for a while and it was a pretty good plan, although he encourages lots of fruit, which, for me, was the downfall in the end .

But it's interesting that you say it's not low fat. It's been a while since I read the book, but I recall that he is of the "added fat is evil" camp (a la Ornish, etc.) Although he doesn't totally condemn all fat (he does point out that it's better to eat the olive instead of the olive oil, etc.) he only allows 1 oz of nuts per day and and a little avocado and no added fats like oils, etc. From what I recall, this is one reason why so many of his salad dressing recipes are fruit-based instead.

Since I don't believe the crap about "fat is evil" (although I also don't believe that unlimited fat, whether low carbing or not, is good either, from a health standpoint) I confess that I did add a little olive oil and Smart Balance Light to the menu, but my health didn't seem to suffer for it

Your menu looks great, though. I've also discovered the joys of frozen fruit and soy in a vegan low carb sorbet. Here's how I make mine:

Berry Sorbet
1/2 cup frozen berries
1 oz silken tofu, cubed
1 tbsp unsweetened soy milk (you might need more for consistency)
Sweetener to taste (I use 1/2 tsp xylitol and sometimes more if the berries are of the less sweet variety)
Blend all in a mini food processor (might work in a mini blender as well - haven't tried it) until a sorbet consistency, usually like a soft-serve ice cream consistency. I usually eat right away or you can stick it in the fridge for a few minutes (but not in the freezer - it'll get icy!)

Tam

Last edited by tammay : Sat, May-24-08 at 12:32.
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