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  #1   ^
Old Fri, Jan-25-19, 12:18
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Posts: 45,360
 
Plan: Paleo 99.5%
Stats: 210/170/160 Female 67.5"
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Progress: 80%
Location: San Diego, CA
Default Alzheimer's caused by gum disease?

https://www.newscientist.com/articl...-how-to-stop-it

Really good read!
Actually, easier way to stop it is to stop the carbs that feed it.
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  #2   ^
Old Fri, Jan-25-19, 16:05
Zei Zei is offline
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Posts: 1,392
 
Plan: Carb reduction in general
Stats: 230/213/180 Female 5 ft 9 in
BF:
Progress: 34%
Location: Texas
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Not eating the carbs has got to be better, but there must be more to gum disease than that because I've eaten very few carbs for years and it still remains a problem. Hoping it's not a major cause of Alzheimers.
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  #3   ^
Old Fri, Jan-25-19, 16:44
bevangel's Avatar
bevangel bevangel is online now
Posts: 1,936
 
Plan: modified adkins (sort of)
Stats: 265/176/167 Female 68.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 91%
Location: Austin, TX
Default

Definitely interesting! Thanks for sharing.
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  #4   ^
Old Sat, Jan-26-19, 12:59
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Posts: 11,335
 
Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/154/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 94%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zei
Not eating the carbs has got to be better, but there must be more to gum disease than that because I've eaten very few carbs for years and it still remains a problem. Hoping it's not a major cause of Alzheimers.


Gum disease can be a sign of inflammation. Store bought mayo and salad dressing are full of Omega 6 oils, even though they are low in carbs.

Or you might be sensitive to a food item and donít know it.

Just throwing out ideas.

Last edited by WereBear : Sat, Jan-26-19 at 14:45.
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  #5   ^
Old Sat, Jan-26-19, 15:03
mike_d's Avatar
mike_d mike_d is offline
Grease is the word!
Posts: 8,440
 
Plan: PSMF/IF
Stats: 236/181/180 Male 72 inches
BF:disappearing!
Progress: 98%
Location: Alamo city, Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zei
Not eating the carbs has got to be better, but there must be more to gum disease than that because I've eaten very few carbs for years and it still remains a problem. Hoping it's not a major cause of Alzheimers.
Same issue for me, but I finally found a way to beat it
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  #6   ^
Old Sat, Jan-26-19, 17:44
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 45,360
 
Plan: Paleo 99.5%
Stats: 210/170/160 Female 67.5"
BF:
Progress: 80%
Location: San Diego, CA
Default

Gum disease is inflammatory, but it is due to a specific bacteria, according to the article: "Porphyromonas gingivalis, the key bacteria in chronic gum disease." So reducing inflammation, in general, isn't necessarily going to reduce that particular bacteria, or the toxins from that bacteria (which they think is the cause). They're working on a vaccine though.

Last edited by Nancy LC : Sat, Jan-26-19 at 17:49.
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  #7   ^
Old Sun, Jan-27-19, 09:56
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Posts: 11,335
 
Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/154/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 94%
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Default

It has long been known that gum disease creates heart infections. This could be the same cause.
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  #8   ^
Old Sun, Jan-27-19, 10:49
deirdra's Avatar
deirdra deirdra is offline
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Plan: HF/vLC/GF,CF,SF
Stats: 197/136/150 Female 66 inches
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBear
It has long been known that gum disease creates heart infections. This could be the same cause.
Unhealthy gums are an easy conduit into the bloodstream. There is also a correlation between gum disease and miscarriages.
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  #9   ^
Old Sun, Jan-27-19, 13:39
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/154/150 Female 67
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Progress: 94%
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nancy LC
Actually, easier way to stop it is to stop the carbs that feed it.


I couldnít agree more. I worry that everyone will stop THERE with the vaccine or targeted antibiotics, and continue to ignore the way excess carbs wreak havoc through the whole body.
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  #10   ^
Old Sun, Jan-27-19, 13:48
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
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Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
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Default

Looking up gingipain in wikipedia;

Quote:
Gingipain is a protease secreted by Porphyromonas gingivalis. Among other functions, it works to degrade cytokines, thereby downregulating the host response in the form of reduced inflammation.[1]


If blocking gingipain turns out to be effective in reducing alzheimers--maybe it does so at the expense of expanding our understanding of diseases of inflammation. Yes, I think that counts as a joke. Please don't judge me.

Point being--what we call inflammation, immune response, etc. is a lot more involved than these labels imply. Inflammation broadly speaking is a change in the local interior environment. Besides fighting infection--our cell's genetic and epigenetic expression, differentiation etc. are all dependent on environment. These "inflammatory" cytokines have important roles to play throughout the development and maintenance of the brain and other organs. Mal-expressed cells could obviously cause all sorts of problems in a multi-celled organism.

Also besides attacking foreign invaders, the immune system has the job of degrading various host proteins etc. when appropriate, maybe that's relevant when we're looking at accumulation of tau and amyloid.
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  #11   ^
Old Tue, Jan-29-19, 09:22
NewRuth's Avatar
NewRuth NewRuth is offline
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Plan: LC gut healing
Stats: 302/285/165 Female 5'3"
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Location: Heartland of the USA
Default

We do like to go for the medication/vaccine over preventative medicine. But telling people to use pickle juice mouthwash doesn't make much money.

The paper below says that more than one species of bacteria is needed for periodontal disease to develop (emphasis mine).

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4746253/
Quote:
Nonetheless, complex interactions between bacterial flora and the host defense mechanisms significantly influence the balance between bacterial aggression and host protection and thus determines whether periodontal breakdown occurs (Hajishengallis et al., 2012). In light of these criteria, a number of experimental evidences have demonstrated that the primary etiological agents of periodontal diseases are generally Gram-negative rods which include Actinobacillus actinomycetemcomitans, Tannerella forsythia (previously designated Bacteroides forsythus), Prevotella, Fusobacterium, and P. gingivalis. Not one of these microbial species is capable of causing the destructive events involved in the periodontal disease progression but the etiology requires a concerted interaction of these members to establish their niches in the oral cavity


But, you also need a susceptible host
Quote:
The expression of virulence factors is often regulated in response to changes in the external environment of the periodontopathogen. If active in a susceptible host, these virulence factors can result in a rapid and significant destruction of periodontal tissues, bone resorption, induction of host responses by cytokine production, as well as inhibition of host protective mechanisms.


Alzheimer's moniker of Type 3 Diabetes is consistent with the above. The condition of the host determines the virulence.

There's pretty strong evidence that Lactobacilli that are found in commonly consumed fermented foods, like yogurt and pickles, counteract p. gingivalis.

What would a discussion be without a mouse study? (emphasis mine) The LG2055 is Lactobacillus gasseri SBT2055
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-00623-9

Quote:
In conclusion, our results demonstrate that gastric administration of LG2055 could control oral inflammation and bone resorption by P. gingivalis infection. Furthermore, the suppression of inflammatory cytokine production in gingival tissue by gastric administration of LG2055 may correlate with β-defensin production in oral sites. Since the administration of tablets containing Lactobacillus reuteri significantly decreased the number of periodontal pathogens in the subgingival microbiota and was effective as an adjunct to scaling and root planing in chronic periodontitis in a randomized clinical trial35, 36, it is probable that the results observed in our animal experiment will also be seen in the human oral cavity in clinical trials.


In humans

https://www.sciencedirect.com/scien...896112618300683

Quote:
Porphyromonas gingivalis inhibits the proliferation and induces the apoptosis of human gingival epithelial cells. Lactobacillus acidophilus could attenuate this effect in a dose-dependent manner, and it thus reduces the destruction from pathogens. Lactobacillus acidophilus could be an effective candidate for probiotic therapy in periodontal diseases.



For now, I won't worry about p. gingivalis. I'll brush my teeth, keep eating low carb and live fermented things.
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  #12   ^
Old Tue, Jan-29-19, 09:38
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
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Posts: 13,362
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
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Default

One reason we go with vaccines is that they're pretty effective. If I were high risk, and this line or research panned out, I would consider the medication.

I know one little girl who's had umpteen operations and is currently on a round of chemotherapy. If her mother had been given a particular vaccination when she was young, this probably wouldn't be happening.
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  #13   ^
Old Wed, Jan-30-19, 23:49
mike_d's Avatar
mike_d mike_d is offline
Grease is the word!
Posts: 8,440
 
Plan: PSMF/IF
Stats: 236/181/180 Male 72 inches
BF:disappearing!
Progress: 98%
Location: Alamo city, Texas
Default

I used "HealThy Mouth Blend" essential oil and homemade kefir for a mouthwash. Fixed my gums and banished my chronic tooth staining and bad breath in about three months.

The clove and other oils disrupt bacterial plaque formation, and kefir is an natural antibiotic. That's why it does not spoil. It also colonizes the GI tract over time; crowding out 'bad bugs' down there just as it does in the mouth. That's my theory as to why it works so well when low-carb alone did not.

Last edited by mike_d : Wed, Jan-30-19 at 23:54.
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  #14   ^
Old Fri, Feb-01-19, 15:40
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Posts: 45,360
 
Plan: Paleo 99.5%
Stats: 210/170/160 Female 67.5"
BF:
Progress: 80%
Location: San Diego, CA
Default

I just discovered "Hard" kombucha at TJ's. Get my probiotics and a little buzz at the same time. Seriously, it takes almost nothing to get me tipsy.
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