I've been around low-carb for about 2 1/2 years now.

Way back when, ANY period of no loss was called a "Plateau" or a "Stall" - there was no difference. Then a differentiation came about where a stall was "bad" and a plateau was "acceptable".

Then, some time later, time frames were given to the plateaus and the stalls. Plateuas were short time frames and stalls were long time frames.

Numbers of weeks were then attributed to each. Stalls were 4 weeks or longer, plateaus were 4 weeks or shorter. Now. most recently, stalls are 6 weeks or longer and (I guess) plateaus would then be 6 weeks or shorter.

Hmmm. The first thing that comes to mind is: Grow up.

Weight loss is all about getting back to the weight we were/are most suited to. HOW we get there, - the steadiness (or not) of the weight lost, is completely and totally irrelevant.

My advise is to stick with the program, steadily and totally -- without micro managing and psychoanalysing ever step.... and do this until you get to goal. If you dissect whatever program you are on - too greatly, you will go crazy. If you pick apart every minute, every second, you may very well reach goal, but still be miserable. Lighten up. Your goal will come. Combat anal tendancies while you still have weight to lose - get them out of the way NOW -- , then once you are "thin" you will be absolutely perfect.

I totally agree and am shaking my head wishing I didn't get hung up about my loss and how fast or slow it's going. I think throwing away the scale would be great advice to follow yours

Thanks for the advice it really helps this weekend!

heather

Good for you, Heather.

Once a person reaches maintenance (which let's face it, can be defined as a "stall for the rest of one's natural life"), it's going to be that much easier to move into that stage, if "stalls" along the way are treated more matter of factly and not as such terrible and horrific experiences.

It's great advice LC Sponge.

What I see are 2 completely different groups of people here. Those that start out wanting a weight loss, and turn it into a life experience, a way of life. Then there are those that just want to diet, lose weight (mostly very quickly). It's great that everyone wants to lose weight but...if the focus is soley on losing weight, and losing it quickly, then there is a high risk of failure. The folks that continually tend to micro-analyse, get hung up on slow downs, and expect to lose tons of weight steadily because they are on some kind of organized plan a)don't understand how their bodies work, b) likely still haven't viewed this as a way of life, c) likely never will fully convert over to way of life thinking from diet thinking. Those are the people that really have the problems with stalls, plateaus and one pound gains, fall off the wagons guilt.

I had to stop visiting the newbie forum for a while because I was getting so frustrated that some people just weren't getting it. But then I realized that not everybody is in a mind-space where they can "get it". Some people will never "get it". Some people will have an epiphany one day and see the light. Some people get it on day one.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts LC. Maybe it will help some people find a better road for their journey.

Absolutely dead on, Angela. It poses the question "Once a person as you have described, reaches goal, how will they 'measure' continued success if LOSING was their only measuring stick?" The answer is - gain it back so they can lose it again. Thus is the heart of the problem with yo-yo dieters. Scary, isn't it?

I totally agree. But there is a problem in getting the message across.

Many people come on to this site with cries for help because they have done two weeks induction and have "stalled" or I have been putting on and taking off the same pound for a few weeks.

It is less easy to say to some one whos has not got many months of experiencing what will be a life time of LC that they should not micro manage the day to day. It is easier to put out into the distance by a few weeks the concern. The longer the better because the likelihood of some miniscule change occurring is high and the panic will go away and a more accurate feel of what is normal will be learnt.

Great post Sponge! I completely agree.

I know my weight loss has slowed down to 1 pound every couple of months, but you know...that is completely okay with me. Of course I am thrilled when the scale does move, however it is quite humorous to me about what and how I eat and see the scale stay steady every single day.

Some days when I think "omg I totally pigged today I must have gained 4 pounds!" only to find the scale the next morning exactly where it was the day before. Ah a system that is completely happy with it's fuel source is a wonderful thing.

On a different note but the same obsessive behavior as our stallers is the ketostix. Pink, purple, deepest purple....it's the same thing. Ketosis is ketosis is ketosis. It doesn't matter what color those darned strips are If you are in ketosis you are going to burn fat. If you aren't you ain't!

We are a product of our society I guess...
Everything has to happen fast...the minute we wish something we need to see it happen NOW or else it means its not working...
We got to the shape we are slowly but surely year by year...how can we expect to reverse the damage in a few days...we need to review this obsessive behavior we all acquired in this time and age of technology and fast food, fast relief, fast makeovers, fast results, fast acheivements and all...

Lets be zen about it and enjoy the process...I'm changing not only my way of eating that brought on some blubs and pumps and blimped me up...it is more than weight and inches...a learning process too...how does the body work, what does it need...how to stay epicurian and enjoy new ways of preparing our food...

Learning to appreciate, to master the art of living well...

The measures and weighing and testing the urine are only gauges of where we are heading...

We need to focus on other things than food as we follow this new way of Life...

Thank you all for this reflection on obsession...food for thought!
and lets help each other get out of it step by step...

I completely agree with you sponge, Angela, rust, ag and Claudia.

I think the terms of measurement were probably invented by lifers trying to get newbies into the way-of-life mindset but it backfired and caused more panic. So instead of worrying about overeating 1 gram of carbohydrate for one day, there was something even bigger to worry about.

You can bring a person who wants to lose weigh to the refreshing stream of low-carb knowledge, but you can't make them drink it...especially if they don't like water.

Karen

I think you guys are being a bit harsh...it is fine to criticize the micromanagement now the we are all comfortable with the WOL but I remember how fanatical I needed to be when I started! I needed to be fanatical becuase this was an enormous life change for me and there was an enormous resistance from society/ family in pursuing this life change. There were no accolades for me until I actually LOST the weight...really an enormous test of trust for new members-like falling backwards into the arms of a stranger and hoping that they'll catch you. The medical evidence out there is not as clear as I would like and people starting this are probably confronted with a great deal of conflicting evidence that is hard to dismiss at first.

Let's face it...most people begin this WOL to loose weight, and only discover the health benefits after the weight obsession wanes and a new 'mandate begins'.

Also, I think anxiety over control over your own body which has probably gone haywire--takes some time to dissipate. I agree that focusing only on weight and measuring success only by weight loss becomes an annoyance for people who have educated themself about the WOL but for me, part of that education HAD to be PERSONAL experience and intense personal experiment. I had failed too many times on other diets to simply make an intellectual decision.

Just my 2 cents,

Jenn

Jenn, I don't think it is too harsh. Maybe by us pointing out the fact that people stressing out over the "speed" at which they lose or the "color" of those ketostix is well, a bit silly. Maybe just maybe someone will relate and realize "oh wow that's me! Okay I need to relax a bit".

A lot of us don't realize we are micro managing until someone actually points it out to us. I know for the longest time I fretted over every single thing. Then I figured out that this is a way of life and regardless of how fast I lost weight or what color those strips are, it didn't matter because once I hit goal nothing was changing. I would still be eating exactly the way I am now.

Hopefully someone reading this thread will see themselves and the lightbulb goes off and one more person joins the ranks of those of us that realize this isn't for the short term.

Be happy. Be Heathy. Be stress free.

I think both Jenn and Agonycat have it right. Of course us newbies are fretting for all the reasons Jenn says. And yes, It probably does bring us up short and make us realise its a bit daft, once we're ready to learn that - it has to be a bit of personal experience too and maybe we have to go through the micromanaging bit first before we realise we're driving ourselves nuts!
For me, part of the issue was becoming conscious of my food and weight after quite a while of almost deliberately ignoring both. So once it was in my mind, I started to think about it all the time.

Bit like the housework - I walk past dust and chaos everyday when I'm doing other things and i really don't notice. Then I have a clearing up day and start to see the mess - if I don't get finished clearing up then, the mess that I used to walk past bugs me rotten because I've become conscious of it!

Most of us will graduate to sensible, WOL people and the discussions and advice in this forum will help.

Of course, it's necessary to do things "by the book" when you first start out, but if you're still stressing about being 1 or 2 grams of carb over your limit for the day and the color of the ketone strips 6 months into it, it's time to relax! It also helps not to compare your rate of loss to someone else's...it'll drive you buggy if you do! If this is for a lifetime, does it really matter if you lose the weight in 10 months or 30? You're still getting the same health benefits of this WOL even if the weight isn't flying off of you. When you're not losing as fast as you'd like or think you should, it's easy to get into the mindset of "I must be doing something wrong...person X is losing 3 lbs a week, but I'm only losing 1." and begin microanalyzing everything you do. You could be doing something wrong, but then again, maybe your body just doesn't want to let go of the fat as fast as person X's body does. Once you get the basics of low carbing, relax, settle in and enjoy the ride! Ask questions as you go and read, read, read...but above all...RELAX!! (stress makes you stall )

I posted the following almost a year ago to a member who was musing on plateaus ....
This comes from a thread where a member was contemplating abandoning the lowcarb WOE due to apparent lack of success. You might want to read the whole thread; it's posted in our "Best Of" forum. Look for Why quit L.C.-WOE?.

I tend to think of a plateau as a phase that the body chooses to be in when you're doing everything right. Whereas a stall has a cause .. whether it's a health condition, cheating or not following the chosen program as written or food allergy or undereating, overeating, lack of exercise, etc etc etc.

Doreen

some smart cookies on this thread! (can I call you smart cookies? Smart "pork rinds" sounds a little insulting, somehow ) Angela, your post really had me nodding my head. Not that the others' didn't--I just know the mod/mentors well enough by now that they seldom surprise me tho they always impress.

If it is harsh to wish people a life of joyous self-love, calm acceptance of their body and its processes (even if that means their natural dress size is an 18), an end to obsessive counting, and steady learning about what food is best for them, then I'll pray for more "harshness" in the world. But I agree with you, Jenn--it is the weight loss goal that (ironically!) leads some people to that self-acceptance. Unfortunately, it seems to lead even more people to self-hatred and self-destructive behaviors.

I wonder what makes that lightbulb finally go on for those of us it does go on for. If we knew, perhaps we could help other people more readily find the switch.