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  #1   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-15, 11:54
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
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Default Need advice, please

Hello,

this is my first posting here and I hope I can find some help and encouragement here.

To cut a long story short: my hashimoto's was diagnosed only last August while I have a goiter since my youth and massive typical thyroid problems since my early adulthood (I'm 44 now). I have found a doctor who is a thyroid specialist (after all those "specialists" here, including a radiologist and a cardiologist who both see no connection between thyroid, mood, the heart etc.) but he is so far away I can only talk by phone. My doctor at home only wants to put me on beta blockers and thyreostatics.

Got another blood work taken today, results will arrive tomorrow (I know what my doc will tell me again, take those beta blockers etc.). I went to my doc because my thyroid is very active for some weeks now, it feels sore, I ma tired as hell, I hear my heart beat constantly and today my pulse rate was about 100. I feel a bit better now but as an anxiety person (don't ask, nobody ever checked my hormones or thyroid but put me on antidepressants for 10 years where had enough time to teach my body and brain to react with fear to almost anything, big or small - I'm a msater of anxiety even though I did make progress with meditation and mindfulness, but I still need a lot of practice) I was so hyper the last few days, fearing a heart attack, having to leave my kids, dying....the whole drama.

I'm on a paleo diet for a few weeks now (I do drink a little milk and sometimes rice or potatoes, so not strictly paleo, or not paleo at all), too early to say anything but I am willing to go on. I just don't know how to handle those hyper periods, My new doc says that after my ferritin is high enough again things will be better anyway and that I shouldn't take any hormones by now. I'm not sure what to do and even though I don't have those periods all the time I'm really disturbed about my "loud" heartbeat. Sometimes I have palpitations as well, only for one beat, more if I get my menstruation. Maybe it is also my glands, I just don't know. Always had too much cortisol.

Any ideas how to proceed?

Thank you,
mare
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  #2   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-15, 17:49
MickiSue MickiSue is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 8,006
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 189/148.6/145 Female 5' 5"
BF:36%/28%/25%
Progress: 92%
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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First of all, listen to your new doc. Cardiologists have no business treating people with thyroid disease; that's for endocrinologists.

Hashimoto's is a special case, because (as you know) you will cycle between hypo and hyper thyroid activity.

If you can talk yourself into understanding, deep down, that when you feel "anxious" it's really your Hashimoto's talking, that may help some; hyperthyroid activity leads to those kinds of symptoms. The fact that it also leads to impulsivity doesn't help. You're anxious, because your T4 is sky-high, and you're impulsive because of the same reason, so you jump to conclusions about the terrible things that you are CERTAIN are going on with your body.

But really, it's the T4 talking, and, while it's not healthy to have a pounding heart rate that's elevated, or to get winded walking across the room from said pounding heart, you are NOT having a heart attack.

If your heart rate is very high, though, I might ask the new doc if beta blockers might, indeed, be a good short term helper.

I had viral thyroiditis, 11 years ago. And when my resting heart rate went to 100, I asked for beta blockers, because an endocrine website from the Mayo Clinic suggested that they offered symptomatic relief. And I needed some, at that point.

I only took them for a little while, and at a very low dose. They lowered my resting heart rate to 86; not healthy, but also, not terrible. The horrid flush, with sweats lessened, as well.

If you can avoid the rice and potatoes, along with using the honey that a lot of paleo folks are fond of, it will help you a lot.

Let us know what happens, OK?
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  #3   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 01:08
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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Thank you MickySue for your reply!

When I last did my blood work my T4 was too low, my t3 in a really normal range, antibodies about 98, so elevated but not extremely high.
I'm curious what they will say today.

It is morning now, I woke up, as usual, with a punch in my stomach, so to say, and then the spiralling started. I did some meditation and breathing which did me some good but in the end fear was too dominant. I am so scared my heart will give up. I know all the connections between my thyroid and especially when my locked thoracic spine is worse again, that is when my heart gets problems, and I normally am not afraid of it, but at the moment I'm just scared. Weeks ago I experienced some kind of stinging in my left arm but it rather feels like a nerve that is squeezed (coming from my spine) rather than what I imagine a heart attack pain would be like. It doesn't last very long and I had it several times now during the last few weeks. I guess a heart attack wouldn't announce itself that long? Maybe I will have the courage to go to a cardiologist when I'm fine again in a few days (or weeks) I always get fine again, last time I felt great for 2 months!

Oh please, give me some encouragement and tell me that I am not doomed (I know you are not doctors, but maybe some of you have experienced the same or something similar?)

Thank you so much,
mareblu
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  #4   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 02:06
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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oh, I forgot to add: the cardiologist found that my left heart chamber is slightly thickened but after having tested me for about a week with all kind of tests he said that there is no reason to prescribe any meds and that I should run a marathon if I wanted to. I know exactly why that heart chamber is thickened: 15 years of anxiety caused it. I'm absolutely certain. I didn't go for a re-check because what this week of tests did to my anxiety is huge.

Just checked several websites and found that none of my symptoms feels like those of a heart attack. At least I don't think so. Of course there is a chance I could get one, but nobody is safe from it anyway. I try to calm down now.
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  #5   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 10:09
MickiSue MickiSue is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 8,006
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 189/148.6/145 Female 5' 5"
BF:36%/28%/25%
Progress: 92%
Location: Twin Cities, MN
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I'm not a doctor, but I will say this: start, and stick to, your low carb diet. Make it very low carb: Atkins might be a better blueprint for you than sorta kinda paleo.

There is plenty of hard evidence that very low carb can help people with all sorts of mental issues: schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, seizures. I've not heard about any data for anxiety, but all brain disorders start with inflammation, and eating plenty of healthy animal fat is GOOD for your brain.
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  #6   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 14:13
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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Thanks again!

Got my results today, my antibodies have reduced to 88 but the rest is not so good: my blood lipids are all elevated, slightly above the normal range which isn't good nevertheless. My thrombocytes and erythrocytes are elevated as well but they have been for years now.

I'm very decisive about finally doing the right thing for my health. I've got two kids who need their mom for some more time, I guess.

Started doing some sports again today (I daily go for a walk with our dog but that is not enough), I reduced carbohydrates again, I will drink more water (normally I drink 34 parts water with one part 100% fruit juice with no sugar added, but I will reduce this as well.), besides this I will try to do some intermittend fasting, only from 6 p.m. to 8 a.m. because I mustn't experience drops in blood sugar, not so good for my thyroid, but I guess this amount of time will be fine.

Thanks for the advice, I will read into Atkins.

My main problem is my thyrooid and my heart, not so much my anxiety. I've tools for that (my meditation, mindfulness and being strict on what I allow my mind to think - works like a charm when I am disciplined enough). But the inflammation IS the main issue, you are right.

Have a nice evening,
mare
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  #7   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 14:26
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Merpig Merpig is offline
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Posts: 7,582
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
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You have not mentioned being on any thyroid meds. Are you? If so, what? And what dose? Have you seen the stopthethyroidmadness.com website?
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  #8   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-15, 18:37
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WereBear WereBear is online now
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Posts: 14,605
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
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I had a serious high cortisol problem. Would wake up in the morning with an awful feeling that I was dissolving. That spiraling you spoke of? I had that, too.

Got a lot of help with a giant morning breakfast, at least 55 grams of protein & fat first thing in the morning. And some serious sleep hygiene moves. How is your sleep?
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  #9   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 01:45
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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No, I'm not on hormones but I take all kind of supplements for my thyroid, gut etc. My ferritin was really low, about 20, and I got two injections so far so now it is at 66 which is still too low. I'll get another two injections for that.

This new doc said that at the moment I should elevate my ferritin etc. before we decide about taking hormones. My Ft3 is perfect, only my ft4 is low which would speak for an adrenal issue.

Yes, I know stopthethyroidmadness. I don't want to take synthetic homrones if I have to take any, but rather the NDT. I hope I find a doc to prescribe it. Otherwise I could take supplements with like glandular extract or something like that.

I used to sleep like a baby. Not anymore. Yesterday I tried to go to bed earlier (normally I watch TV until midnight or 1 a.m. and fall asleep in front of it whcih is not ideal, I know), at 10 o'clock. No way. My panic was so strong (panic, I could have a heart attack, having to leave my kids behind) so I stood up again and watched more TV which worked a bit. But my sleep on the whole is rarely good as I am so sensitive to noises.

I have meditated again this morning which does me good, always come to that moment where I find that place inside of me where I feel whole, happy, and healthy. This time it didn't last very long but it is there and that is good to know. My body seems to look forward to it whenever I sit down for meditation.

How does that bis breakfast help when you are fully awake and in fear at 5 o'clock in the morning? When I stand up I calm down but I need to get more sleep without interruptions and being awake that early with a body fully on adrenalin and cortisol.

Thanks,
mare
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  #10   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 09:07
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Kristine Kristine is offline
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Posts: 25,581
 
Plan: Primal/P:E
Stats: 171/146/150 Female 5'7"
BF:
Progress: 119%
Location: Southern Ontario, Canada
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Hi Mare.

I can relate somewhat to your situation. My ferritin was down to about 20, also, and I can't seem to get it up with iron pills. It went up to the 60s then fell back to the 40s. (I'm also in the unfortunate situation of the doctor only looking at my TSH. I'm perpetually freezing, I have almost no eyebrows left and my hair is falling out massively. I think I'm screwed unless I can sweet talk the doc into running a proper thyroid panel... but that's beside the point.) I have also been plagued with a racing/pounding heart for years now. Y'know what? I'm just so used to it now, I hardly think about it. I wore a Holter monitor for a day or two about ten years ago, and there was absolutely nothing wrong with my ticker.

I'm still here. That's after an eating disorder, ephedra abuse, alcohol abuse, and just generally living life running on all four cylinders and burning the candle at both ends.

Quote:
My main problem is my thyroid and my heart, not so much my anxiety.

Are you sure about this? It really sounds like the fear-of-death thing is taking a toll on your quality of life.

Where I can't relate (with no disrespect) are those feelings. There's no emotion tied to these symptoms for me. I have a screwed up adrenaline system. That's it. It is not a heart attack. A heart attack is a blockage. I'm already eating pretty well and I'm active - but guess what? Even the "healthiest" people can drop dead from a heart attack, and Uncle Phil who drinks like a fish and smokes like a chimney will live to be 90.

I think you'd be doing yourself a huge favour by working on the doom feelings.

"What you THINK about, you BRING about."

I've struggled with depression and anxiety my whole life, and I no longer consider it a "struggle". When my mind starts "going there," one of my favorite tools for these intrusive thoughts is to literally imagine a stop sign and say the word, "STOP" to myself. Then, I switch my thoughts to something specific about the day - what do I need to do today? What's up at work? Any occasions coming up like birthdays? I focus on current reality. You might want to find some mind tricks like this.

Side comment: are you entirely off gluten? If not, try it. One of my first clues about gluten affecting my brain was going back and looking through my online journal, and I had massive melt-downs shortly after gluten cheats. There are many, many anecdotes about this, especially at celiac forums. (Not much science yet, since no one profits off a gluten-free diet)

Maybe another good thing for you to do is face death head-on, and shine a light on it. We're all going to die. I don't know how old your kids are, but have an age-appropriate conversation with them and make sure your will is done up. None of us like to talk or think about it, but it's prudent. And then, trust that your kids are going to be fine either way. Trust them!

Wishing you luck and good health.
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  #11   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 10:50
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 14,605
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mareblu
How does that bis breakfast help when you are fully awake and in fear at 5 o'clock in the morning? When I stand up I calm down but I need to get more sleep without interruptions and being awake that early with a body fully on adrenalin and cortisol.


This program is designed to reset my circadian rhythm. It is a discovery of Dr. Jack Kruse, but if you cannot figure it out from the link I don't blame you. I think Dr. Kruse is a genius, but communicating via the written word is not exactly in his skill set.

Leptin Reset Easy Start Guide

Short version: You are having trouble sleeping because your body is confused and sending out the wrong hormones at the wrong time. I don't know how much is due to your Hashimoto's. But I was a total mess and the protocol always helped.

Local sunset: all lights go to the red spectrum. This includes TV and electronic devices like phones and laptops. I use a salt lamp, a light with an orange shade, and put on amber-lensed sunglasses. My laptop uses the f.lux program to switch the screen from blue light to red light. All of this prepares the body for a 10pm bedtime. Which is strict.

Then, sleep mask, all night. There's a ton of different kinds and I am currently on my eighth pick, but it is awesome. There is one out there you will like. Check DreamEssentials.com

Breakfast: At least 50 grams of protein and fat. No carbs. Within an hour of getting up. And get sunlight on your face & eyes first thing as soon as possible upon waking. Open a window if need be and stick your head out.

I found that I needed to address inflammation to get the most of my sleep. Have you had a CRP test done? In any case, the Ep-Paleo diet helps with a lot of inflammation sources: sugar, grains, seed oils are all forbidden. Lots of fish oil, especially natural sources like actual fish. (I eat it with Paleo mayo - made with avocado oil. Yum!) But since I had such a bad case of high cortisol that wasn't getting into my cells = high inflammation, I had to take herbs, and then niacin, to knock it down.

Currently supplementing with progesterone because I had a nearly lifelong case of estrogen dominance, barely treated, but that might not be affecting you. The point is to figure out what is causing the inflammation and knock it out. I was able to shut down the inflammation with supplements, but the progesterone hormone is what I need to stop my body reacting with inflammation. Cutting out the source of the problem is always best.

I went from 2-4 hours to 8-10 hours, every night. And it's the best sleep of my entire life.
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  #12   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 12:47
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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Hi Kristine,

thanks for your most encouraging answer - and you are pretty right, my anxiety adds a lot to the problem.

I guess I want total control about it all which is nonsense of course. My heart is an issue for me as I don't know if the thickening has worsened, but I guess that it hasn't worsened within this 1.5 years after the tests with much more mindfulness (and all of those exercises you mentioned, the stop sign for example) when those 20+ years before I did nothing but put extreme stress on it didn't kill me. But one thing is clear: I have to get those crazy emotions under control because they do the harm. Several years ago I was completely out of control and my emotions were in control, not things get much better. I'm quite good now at persuading my anxious mind to cooperate and to remember how powerful it can be and that it should use this positive power insted of spreading fear. Or at just telling it to shut up. This morning was bad but then after breakfast, doing my sports and beginning my day everything was normal again (emotionally). Not too long ago all this would have caused days or even weeks of hopeless despair.

Facing death....normally I am not too much afraid of it after having read tons of eastern philosophy which really speaks to me, but when my mind is in red zone and anxiety is in charge - and when my kids are involved - there is no means of calming myself. It takes some time but I have to work and let go, let go, let go....then I can think normally again.

Thanks again for your posting, it is great encouragement for me!
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  #13   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 12:57
mareblu mareblu is offline
New Member
Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
Default

Thank you WereBear so much for explaining what exactly you mean. Lots of very good ideas, and I will check out the Leptin reset guide. I am willing to make those major changes and stick to them. I want to have my health back and I am willing to get it.

Yes, I am very careful about being gluten-free but of course in my house there is gluten, from my kids' and husband's food so there is always the chance of consuming particles. But this I cannot change. I know gluten is gluten and even a tiny bit does me harm, but I cannot live in a separate cave

I am a sun/light addict, so it is not too difficult for me to stick me head out of the window (and I'm glad that we have so many mild and sunny days this winter - even though it is clear that this is due to climate change).Maybe one day I can afford buying a light therapy lamp.

I also use bioidentical progesterone and it makes all of a difference if I take it or not, or not enough. I also put it directly on my thyroid, as it affects FT4 positively.

Oh, I forgot: Kristine, my alternative health practitioner says there is no way of elevating ferritin with pills etc. in a satisfying way. With those injections you get your ferritin level from almost zero to about 150. I don't lose hair that much and my eyebrows seem to grow better now, maybe I have been diagnosed early enough (guess I always have been hyper, being extremely thin, and nervous before at about 25 it turned around and that is when depression and anxiety started, and getting fat....)

Thanks again for your great help, I really appreciate it a lot!
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  #14   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-15, 14:40
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 14,605
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
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You are very welcome, mareblu, I have documented the whole journey in my journal, I think my illness story starts on page 7 if you want to read it in order

We have different challenges but the issues with anxiety and panic disorders are something we do have in common
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  #15   ^
Old Thu, Dec-31-15, 02:00
mareblu mareblu is offline
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Posts: 9
 
Plan: modified paleo
Stats: 170/170/150 Female 167 cm
BF:
Progress:
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Does any of you have issues with blood lipids etc. like me?
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