Ditto, and that's the thing about Aseem, he speaks strongly, but tends to straddle the limits of what is publicly accepted when recommending a diet. There is no research (RCTs) showing direct correlation of red meat to metabolic health issues, but when the WHO comes out and gives a warning based on epidemiological guesses and claims, people start to get in line. I like many of the things he recommends, but I don't like it when certain foods are recommended to be limited based on no clear research or direct root cause. Maybe he'll sell a few more books this way, maybe not, and maybe he truly believes in his recommendations. Don't have any interest in his book. Think his stance has some value to many. Nothing is either black or white. We live in a world of grays or greys.