View Single Post
  #6   ^
Old Tue, Jan-01-08, 18:20
Gaelen's Avatar
Gaelen Gaelen is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 244
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 216/166/150 Female 60 inches
BF:45%/33.5%/28%
Progress: 76%
Location: CNY
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthPeace
Sorry, Leasmom for hijacking the thread, but Gaelen does not understand at all where I am coming from and is misrepresenting my POV.


Au contraire, Northpeace...I understand exactly where you're coming from, and I read up on your POV before I replied the first time. I've read your 'diet' description--appropriately posted in the War Zone--and quite frankly, 'the thing is what it thinks it is.' As I said in my last post, what you do may work for you, but I'm going to quote your own words from the thread listed in your profile before I go any further:

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthPeace
Rather than hijack other threads when I talk about my strange eating habits, I am just going to post here in the War Zone. What better subject for a war zone thread than a diet that is not low carb, that in fact pays little attention to proportions of macronutrients?


Apparently, the War Zone wasn't receptive enough to your 'strange eating habits' so you sought more conversational waters?

Quote:
I don’t control my calories,


Perhaps not, but your original suggestion to Leasmom implied that calorie control might be what she was seeking ("If you don't want to consume excess calories, the way to do it is with the lowest calorie plants, the non-starchy vegetables.') That statement suggests that you have minimal grasp on the science behind why low carb ways of eating actually work. You might want to cruise through 'Good Calories, Bad Calories' by Gary Taubes. It's kind of a long cruise, but give it a shot.

Quote:
Bulk, fibre, volume does physically fill you. It is a law of physics not a party line. When we very overweight we only need about 12% of calories from protein, 10% from carbs and 15% from fat, so why not eat micronutrient rich foods, but be full, and let our bodies supply the remaining calories? ... I get 18% from protein, about 85g/d. I believe the RDA for males is around 55g/d protein.


That 'bulk fills you up' IS a party line, both of the American Dietetic Association and of the USDA, as well as of 90s vegetarians. 'We only need 12% of calories from protein, 10% from carbs and 15% from fat' is data based on old recommendations (1971 and 1985 WHO recommendations.) It's old information, old research, science which has been contested repeatedly within the last 15 years although it keeps rearing its ugly head for (mainly) political reasons and socioeconomic misconceptions. BTW, the 'RDA for males of 55g/day of protein' advice is woefully inadequate. The RDA for a woman of my size is about 35g/day. I eat that for breakfast, and eat about three times that amount total per day, on the recommendations of the nutritionists who work with the surgeons at Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center.

Yeah, I've got cancer. Family history--you can't always get past your genes. I was a vegetarian for 25 years, long before low-fat mania hit vegetarianism. Being vegetarian is supposed to reduce your cancer risk. Speaking as an 'n' of 1, I can categorically say 'not so much.'

Humans need a minimum of 0.5g protein per pound of lean body mass if sedentary, and up to 0.9g protein per pound of LBM if more active, very overweight, or under physical stress from illness (see M.R. and M.D. Eades, 'Protein Power', 1995; M.G. Kurilla at http://www.becomehealthynow.com/ebookprint.php?id=568 ; if you need more citations than that, I can get them.)

Quote:
I am not a proponent of 90s low fat vegetarianism and frankly don’t know much about it.


Well, while you may not 'know much about it,' your recommendations and many of Fuhrman's are McDougal and Ornish and 90s low fat vegetarian to a 'T.' And there are several 'protein risks' to a 'properly planned vegan diet'--chiefly that some of the people who are 'properly planning' those diets are still stuck on 1971 and 1985 recommendations for body weight, body fat percentage and protein intake that desperately need to be updated.

Quote:
Leasmom, I agree with Gaelen’s recommendations for nuts, seeds, nut butters, avocados, pulses and eggs. However, EVOO and butter seems to be too little benefit for the calories you take in, offering no important nutrition that you can’t get from foods that contain more micronutrients per calorie.


Really? I thought you weren't 'controlling calories.' Reality check.

Quote:
Gaelen, keep in mind that a vegetarian is not going to be consuming less than 100g net carbs/d, so heavy reliance on fat for fuel won’t give a vegetarian the appetite suppressing effect that ketosis brings.


Really? Guess you haven't met too many low carbing vegetarians.
I am no longer vegetarian, for medical reasons--I cannot digest enough protein from a completely vegetable source diet. Nowadays, about a third of my meals are pescetarian (seafood), which I have always considered meatless. The balance of my meals are ovo-lacto vegetarian, and some are vegan. I routinely consume <45g ECC/day, with approximately 65% of my average caloric intake as fats, 10% as carbs ad 25% as protein.

If you are interested in becoming better informed about low carbing in general and vegetarian low carbing in particular (since that IS the topic of this forum...), try visiting http://immuneweb.org/lowcarb/ or doing a google search on Cyndi Norwitz.
Reply With Quote