Jessea or M1whowaits?????

[kenzy]

Hey,
I did a search for probiotics and there are so many kind and brands, what do you guys recommend? Also can I order antifungals and L-glutamine off the net? I need to know what order to start my healing.

1. low carb/sugar diet

2. probiotics

3. antifungals

4. then what L-glutamine? I have read several books I just don't know what kind of probiotic or antifunal to buy?

Any help please!!!!


Kenzy

[kjturner]

I'm not either one, but my recommendation is to do diet first. Starve 'em out! Get as close to NO-carb as possible for at least two weeks, but watch out for die-off symptoms. If they get too bad, you can add a bit of carb back, but be aware, you're just feeding the little beggars and the sooner and more completely they die, the better. Next get the L-glutamine and probiotics. Frankly, anthing will do for now. I prefer a probiotic with more than one kind, but plain old acidophilus will do to start. Gives 'em competition. You can probably get both of them at Wal-Mart. Wait and see how that does before trying the anti-fungals. Get most of them to die off then add the antifungal to kill the stragglers. If you do all of that at once you'll be *truly* miserable from die-off symptoms. Be prepared for the *tremendous* cravings for sugar/starch/fermented products (including beer, if you imbibe). There may also be a lot of intestinal gas, belching, itching in embarrassing places, and a wooly mouth.
Have fun!!! ;)

[jessea]

I agree with KJ. Starve 'em out! I actually wanted to take the agressive approach, and take the anti-fungals right away. Well, let me tell you, I was miserable. If I could re-do it, I would have started out slower.

I take a product called Candistroy. It is by a company called Nature's Secret. It comes in a box, has a bottle of anti-fungal, and a bottle of probiotic. Very convenient. You can take one tablet a day, then increase as you feel necessary. Not me, I took three at once, and four hours later, I wanted to die.

As for the L-glutamine, I would consider it your most important supplement. If money is an issue, just get the L-Glutamine and follow the diet. If you can, get the powdered form of L-Glutamine, it mixes with water. The capsules are fine, tho, you just have to take more of them. I would take a 500mg capsule at least three times a day, 1/2 hour before meals. Make sure the amino acid is a "free form" amino. Twin Lab makes a good product. You would find it in the amino acid section. If you order from iherb.com, you will save money, and get your order in two business days. You can find the Candistroy, and everything else you need on iherb.com.

If you have any more questions, just let us know!!!

-Jess

[m1whowaits]

I agree also. I eased into the diet to avoid cravings for 2 weeks. Then took all the flour and sugar in my house and thew it out. (DH and DS loved that! ;) Then I went to my health food store and said HELP! They recommended GSE (grapefruit seed extract) it's all natural, inexpensive and goes a log way. It's the yeastie killer. And I got PB8. It's a probiotic with several strains of acidophilus. I take the acidoph. w/ breakfast and dinner and the GSE on an empty stomach before bed. I just got a product from AZO to throw something different at them and was taking it with meals, but after hearing not to take the PB and antifungal at the same time should I stop, do y'all think? Isn't the yeast (candida) not a bacteria like the acidoph.? And when it overgrows isn't it considered a fungus? Or am I confused?

And with the diet, you want to avoid any mold prone foods (nuts and dried things, and one book I have said bacon while you're in detox), mushrooms, vinegar, and yeast. And if nothing else just stopping grains and sugars (not just white sugar, honey, molassis, anything that has an ...ose at the end of it's name. Even fruit during detox.)

Just learned about the l-glut. but if it's expensive it'll have to wait a week. I have been very good on my diet. Keep hardboiled eggs in the fridge, it's a quick protein fix when you have the munchies. Good luck! :roll:

[kenzy]

I have seen probiotics at wal mart but I didn't know if they would be good or not. I think I'll order the probiotic and antifungal from Iherb.com. The candistroy sounds very convenient. The l-glutamine can also be purchased there to, I'm amazed. the web is so great. I thought I was gonna gave to run my fanny off to find all this stuff. But I know diet is the key, so i'll start with that for a couple weeks. I assume the cravings eventually go away for sweets. I hope so. I'm gonna bookmark all these things for when I'm ready. thanks so much for helping.

Kenzy

[m1whowaits]

Just don't go cold turkey. Just make good food choices. Eliminate things slowly. Substitute something good for something bad. Eventually you won't miss the bad stuff anymore. And if you do slip...tomorrow is another day!!! Don't beat yourself up. It happens. My face found itself in my son's icecream tonight :( . But after I wake up feeling sick tomorrow, bet I won't do that again for awhile!!! Hang in there!!! Just the diet at first made me feel much better.

[tmo]

Jessea,

I remember you taking Yeast Cleanse by Solaray a while back. From what I read from your post, I thought that worked for you. But maybe it didn't since you are using another product now? It would be great if you could tell us your experience with Yeast Cleanse.

Also, can you tell us what kind of bad experience did you have with Candistroy when you took 4 caps instead of gradually increasing the dosage? You said you felt like dying. It would be great if you could elaborate on this.

Thank you very much,

tmo

[m1whowaits]

TMO.

I can tell you about a big yeast die off. It's like the worst flu you can imagine. I wasn't "running to the bathroom", but I had a fever, was freezing, was shaking at times so bad I just had to lie down. Not pretty. You can get very nauseous, sweat, abdominal cramps, bad flatulence. That's why you should ease into an antifungal to kill a little at a time and change products from time to time to confuse the little buggers. I'm taking liquid grapefruit seed extract. I put it in 10 oz of water (I'm on week 3 so it's strong)and mix in some lemon juice (cause it tastes very bitter and lemon water is good to clean your kidneys). And drink it all down before bed. That way I feel bad in my sleep!!

Hope this helps.

Be Well!! Liz

[jessea]

Hi! I just didn't notice a huge difference while taking the yeast cleanse, I think it is a milder "yeast killer", but that could be a good thing. I am sure it is better to do it gradually. I chose not too, because I wanted to get it over with. Looking back, I might have spared myself the pain!

The reason why I switched from the Yeast Cleanse to the Candistroy, was because I read that you shouldn't take the same anti-fungals for too long, because the yeast gets immune. So I originally got the Candistroy to have an alternate. I felt like I was having better luck with the Candistroy, stronger die-off, so I stuck with it. I plan on finishing the Candistroy, and am planning to start altering it with the Yeast Cleanse again. I am on antibiotics right now, so I do not want those little jerks to get a foothold again.

I also picked up a bottle of olive leaf extract. It is supposed to be a strong anti-fungal, as well. And it was relatively inexpensive compared to the others.

In comparing the two brands, Yeast Cleanse contains mostly Caprylic Acid, Pau D' Arco, and Grapefruit Seed Extract. It has a few other ingredients, can't remember them all. The Candistroy contains Goldenseal, Oregon Grape root, and Barberry extract, which from what I have read are all considered berberines, and are strong anti-fungals. I had read that Caprylic Acid is a good one to take, but it is not as strong as the berberines.

Hope this was helpful instead of confusing. There are alot of products out there, but from what I have read, the above mentioned ingredients are consistently mentioned as supplements that will kill candida. I noticed that the die off was getting weaker, so I am assuming I am making some headway. My sugar cravings are gone, and the itching is gone. But like I said, I am on antibiotics, so I am assuming the war is still on.

-Jess

[tmo]

Jess,

Thank you for detailed explanations on your candida/supplement experience. No, you were not confusing at all. Sorry you are on antibiotics again. I was on antibiotics last August (I should have supplemented with probiotics, etc while on it, but since it had been so long since I had problems with candida, I never even thought about it) and I haven't been the same person since although the symptoms are much milder now (I was running a mild fever for the 1st couple of months that I just couldn't shake, along with dizzy feeling especially if I ate something starchy. I used Primal Defense and then Threelac.) I can tell that mine is cyclical in nature (tend to have more problems when progesterone is high in the luteal phase, which makes sense since progesterone will definitely suppress immune system and increases insulin resistance) so I don't take candida specific supplements every day, but I am keeping the critters at bay with Threelac when needed, and of course, diet.

I did buy Yeast Cleanse a while back after I read your post. I haven't used it much but have it for later use (once Threelac runs out).

Thanks for your post,

tmo

[kenzy]

Hey Guys,
I'm starting this anti yeast diet, i'm starting with my diet first then going to the probiotics and antifungals, very slowly cause I can't stand to be sick. How long does it take to kill the little buggers? I mean is it a lifelong thing or do you eventually get rid of them and get your digestive track working again? I need to work on the leaky gut thing to.

[m1whowaits]

Congradulations on you path to good health :Party: !!! It's considered a fungal infection and unfortunately they are the hardest to get rid of. And once it's gone, you're more likely to get another one if you fall back to old ways. I've only started myself, but some people here have beat it. It can take as long as a year, or more. Depends on how invasive it has become. I've just decided to change my WOL and not give it a chance. I'll never go back to the way I ate before. I guess I'll keep up with the Pro b's and antifungals for a couple of months before I even think of stopping. Remember to switch out the antifungals from time to time. Keep 'em confused!!!

Good Luck!!

Liz

[jessea]

I agree with Liz, Kenzy, congrats, you are on the right track! Yes, it can be beaten, and we are all gonna do it!! I, like Liz, plan on staying on the eating plan forever. I want to be healthy!!! It has been a long time since I have felt well. I just can't wait!!!

As for the leaky gut - I had a list of supps to take for it, but I can't find it. I will look it up, and then post. I know the most important one is L-GLUTAMINE!!!! I am noticing a change in digestive happenings. I think I am getting better!!!

I will post the leaky gut info in a separate thread. Good luck and God speed to us all. Let's stick together, we can beat this thing!

-Jess

ps

picked up Dr. Crook's book yesterday. Took the test and was blown away by how high my score was. No wonder it is taking so long to get rid of!!!

[m1whowaits]

How high was your score Jessea? Mine was 295. If any of ya'll here want to take the quiz, there's a link to it at the bottom of my post. Good Luck!!!

Liz

[EarthLight]

Hi Kenzy, Jess, TMO, KJ, Liz, ... - can one more jump in?

Liz & Jess - thanks for all your comments and suggestions, on this thread & others. I wish I could feel the same determination as you 2 so eloquently express!

Liz - I nearly fell over at my score on the tests. In desperation this morning, I was googling for help and die-off sympton info & took the test. I hit 437! :eek:

Course - a lot of those "test" symptoms could be from other health challenges as well, PLUS I have battled candida, at various times off & on, for over 17 years now. :( I'm hoping that will make a difference if I can just get into low-carb food plan & stay there! Liz - I think you are right - And once it's gone, you're more likely to get another one if you fall back to old ways. Between that & being predisposed you really do re-create it.

Do any of you identify or feel a correlating emotional or mental component that makes us more likely to have candida issues?

For me, my easiest/most successful clearing was with MD-prescribed homeopathic remedy. My current professional, thinks allergy treatment, along with diet free of alcohol or sugar is key. She also recommended I check out & follow up on how to shift my body from acidic to alkaline (no clue yet on this, I don't really know what it entails.)

Good Low-Carb Luck to All!

[m1whowaits]

From everything I've read, you have it starve it and rebuild your beneficial bacteria. And unfortunately the other medical conditions you mentioned could be being caused by the candida!

To beat it, got to take away it's food and create an environment it can't live in. It feeds on sugars so any thing that metabolizes into a sugar has to be eliminated or extremely reduced. Then you need to take some kind of antifungal (homeopathic or prescribed) to start killing it off (I'll mention die-off in a minute)and a probiotic to build up the beneficial bacteria that are gone or that it has damaged. Also recommended are ammino acid supplements (L-Glutamine is the once I see the most) to rebuild the damage done to the intestinal walls. shift my body from acidic to alkaline I found a list of foods seperated into these catagories. An alkaline environment is oxygen rich. Fungus can't live in it. There are Ph strips out there so you can test your body's Ph level. If it's too low, it's acidic and good for the candida.food list (http://www.thewolfeclinic.com/acidalkfoods) There is a lot of information at this site about intestimal health. After all no one stops to think that the small intestine is our engine!! All of our nutrient adsorption takes place there. Damage it and you don't get your fuel and it can get weak and leak toxins that the blood stream picks up and carries EVERYWHERE!!!

When they start to die off, toxins are released (they are dying after all) and what ever symptoms you had because of it (everyone's different) intensify. Kill off too many at once and you can become extremely ill. So don't do too much at first.

Read a lot, make a plan and stick with it!! I think maybe the emotional connection may be that when one becomes depressed one reaches for comfort food which tends to be high in carbs because of the chemical hi sugar causes in our brains. It feeds the candida and it want's more, so we crave more to feed it. Sounds like drugs, doesn't it. I know the only time now I crave sweats is after I've taken my antifungal and I feel a little bad (then I know it's working). It's the dying little buggers screaming for food!! Be damned if I'm gonna feed 'em anymore!!!

Good luck on your new journey and keep us posted!!!

Liz

[jessea]

Hi, all! Liz, as usual you are chock full of good information!! Yes, I am reading a few books this weekend, and both books state that it is the toxins given off by the yeast that causes most of the symptoms. There are too many to list here.

I have never really been an emotional eater. I could never figure out why I wanted sugar so much, until I discovered the whole candida issue. Now I know why I ate what I ate. Leigh, this is so important to remember. You are not weak because you want sugar, the yeast is crying out for it, and if you are as loaded with it as it sounds like you are, your cravings will be very strong indeed. Couple that with depression, and staying away from sugar becomes a pretty tough battle. It will get easier as you kill off more and more yeast.

I think the candida causes the emotional issues. Feeling sick with no explanation causes alot of stress. Stress just feeds the candida, the problem is a vicious cycle. Beat the candida first. The rest will fall into place. I used to get extremely irritable, weepy, etc, but am finding that I am feeling better emotionally every day. Part of this, I am sure, is the empowerment I am feeling over my own body. I used to feel my body was out of control, now I know I am in control of my body. I can fix these issues, and I am on my way. I hope I can inspire others out there to do the same.

Take care, everyone, and let's get better!!!

-Jess

[m1whowaits]

The sugar and carbos caused me to have HORRIBLE!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad: Anxeity and depression. I still have little bouts with it, but not the constant state I was in before. It is hard at first, but, form a plan!!! It's much easier to follow some guidelines than to just wing it.

Liz

[EarthLight]

Bless You Liz & Jess! You are both angels! :angel:

I've copied & pasted some of your info, & some from Doreen's sticky link (the health web article), into a printout to take to my doctor appointment today. I hope she'll have time to consider (if not, I'll leave a copy with her to review later.)

The appointment is to clear any allergy or sensitivity to candida (if I completed Wednesday's mixed yeast/yogurt/whey treatment.) I'm hoping & praying this will give me the jump-start and help I need. Then I can do "follow-up"....

Because of budget, I need to figure out which supp's are going to be right/most important for me. So I've listed those possibilities at the top of my printout (using info gleaned from all these threads!)

Thanks for the encouragement and good wishes.

P.S. The itching is still intense, but the good news is my mood has been better, last night & this morning.

I AM READY TO CHANGE & HEAL!!!

[jessea]

Hi, Leigh! Glad to hear you are finding help on this forum, I know I sure did!!! I am ready to heal, too! Isn't it great to be on the right track, finally? I felt horrible for so many years, I feel like I wasted so much time being sick. But not any more, I am going to be healthy, even if it kills me!! :D

So good to know there are others here with the same issues, we are all in this together, and I know we are going to succeed. Ya know, getting started on low carb is hard enough, but combine it with the issues we face makes it even harder. So I think we should all be proud of ourselves for sticking with it, finding answers, and taking charge of our own healthcare! We are awesome!!!

A big hug to all of you!!!

-Jess

[kjturner]

Going 'alkaline' does help. FYI for when you test: Ideal readings for saliva should be 7.4 and for urine 6.6.

Sodium chlorite (yes 'ite'...not 'ide') added to drinks helps to bring pH back into line. (Always put it into a drink. 1 drop per 2 oz.--never take it 'straight') I put it in everything I drink. Also if you can't find sodium chlorite, then chlorine dioxide will also work as it becomes sodium chlorite when in the presence of H2O. For those who are interested, both chemicals are used by some municipal water systems as a bactericide. They both produce a mild chlorine-like taste/smell.
I've also read that potassium bicarbonate is a safe way to bring down the pH, but I've not tried it.

[m1whowaits]

I've been trying to eat as alkaline as possible, and I've noticed a difference. I've had a die off going for 4 days now. Feel a little better each day, but throat's still sore and my eyes burn so I know it's still going on. The muscle pain is diminishing, but my shoulders and neck are still really tight. Even my chiro noticed it! Weird to be glad I don't feel good. 4 days ago was horrible! Haven't been an uber b**ch like that since I gave up sugar!!! :mad: Didn't care for that feeling at all.

Keep up the good work everyone!!

Liz

[jessea]

Hi all! Can you post a list of alkaline foods. I just don't have time to research it on my own.

Thanks everyone!!

-Denise

[m1whowaits]

I posted a list further up the thread but here it is again for you :)

food list (http://www.thewolfeclinic.com/acidalkfoods)

Happy eating!!

Liz

[jessea]

THanks,Liz for the link to the very informative website. I found this very interesting. It is funny how the site talks alot about Spirulina. I have a shake mix in the house that contains spirulina, and everytime I drink one, I always feel good. Now I guess I know why.

I am going to add these alkaline foods right away. Thanks again, you are the new official research queen!

-Jess