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potatofree
Sun, Jul-27-03, 21:34
I admit, I have had my share of struggles staying on track with Atkins, but I'm getting kind of tired of hearing "I can't!, It's too hard!", both on the board, and in my "real-life" relationships.

I will be first in line to support a friend in need. We ALL need some support and encouragement from time to time. It just seems to me that a few are all but sabotaging themselves, as if to try to prove that they are too weak and the plan too flawed for them to ever "win".

I have two friends living within blocks of me. The first has HIGH bp, sleep apnea, borderline diabetes, with about 60 extra lbs she "can't" shed. I nagged her in to asking her doctor about Atkins, and he told her to try for two weeks, then check back in with him... she somehow took this to mean he "really didn't want her to do it, and her niece is a phamacist and says it's bad, and it looks hard...etc" Is dying of a stroke or heart attack easy? I just keep my mouth shut when she complains about her weight, WHILE eating a breaded, deep-fried meal.

The other, with asthma, wheat intolerance, and about 25 lbs she wants to lose, claims she "just can't do it", and after losing 10 lbs on induction, gave up, even resuming eating wheat because it was "too hard to give up".."It was handy..." "I couldn't resist it" "I EARNED it because I had a bad day"... You get the picture.

I'm getting so I just run the cursor over posts pertaining to anything remotely similar to these stories, since I know others will be able to be more supportive. I try to only say positive, encouraging things when I do "go there" to return the kindness of others shown to me.

That's why I chose to post here, since I just want to know if my frustration is shared, because I'm about to BLOW and tell them to wake up and snap out of it! It took that to get ME to get serious..(note i did NOT say "perfect"!)

jude
Sun, Jul-27-03, 21:49
Seems to me, when people are personally ready for this woe, it will work for them. No amount of nagging or even encouragement by someone else will do any good until they are ready.

I knew about Atkins 30 years ago. I remember my reason for deciding against it wasn't because I thought it was unhealthy, but simply because I couldn't imagine eggs and bacon without the bread! lol

judy

lburnikell
Mon, Jul-28-03, 05:24
You cant make people listen if they dont wanna, just you do your own thing and let them get on with their own lifes.
When they are ready they will do something about their weight!!
My husband was on weight watchers and kept going up and down,after seeing my loss and others he has now decided to do Atkins one week on he has lost just over 7lbs.
But I hear what you are saying people complaing about their weight, but not willing to help themselves can be annoying (but remember its not that easy for everyone,if it was nobody would be overweight!!) If you think it would help tell them if they dont want to do something about their weight you dont wanna hear about it!!

pepsi max
Mon, Jul-28-03, 06:15
i hear ya potatofree but i do think its hard being on a diet and the temptation to cheat is everywhere.i,ve always found it easy to stick to a diet, my previous problem was maintainance. always put the weight straight back on.although i,m no saint, i find atkins maintainance fine to stick to.never had bread, pots, rice etc for over 2 years.
i know from experience that these foods are triggers and i would never be able to just have one small slice.maybe some has to find their "triggers" and once eliminated, they could stick to this woe.
others, i,m afraid, will never stick to this diet, after all it doesn,t suit everyone.
at least here, everyone can get support when its asked for, even if it works for 50% then its been worth it.

potatofree
Mon, Jul-28-03, 11:54
I'm far from perfect, and was the Queen of Denial for years, and I realize that, much like an addict, a person may have to "hit bottom" before doing something about it.

The people I'm frustrated with are the ones who don't want to deprive themseves of whatever they wish to put in their bodies. The ones who are looking for some "magic" way to indulge their every whim, and have the pounds still melt away. I've tried to teach my kids that they can't always have everything they want. I've finally managed to teach MYSELF that!

I've tried a great many "magic pills" over the years myself, making excuse after excuse about why I weigh what I did, while secretly binging on whatever I could fit in my mouth. This infantile, self-gratifying behavior put me near 300 pounds. I blamed the diet plan for failing me, blamed my mother for overfeeding me, blamed my son's disability for stressing me into overeating. What I consider "hitting bottom" for me was the realization that if I didn't get it under control, my weight would kill me, leaving my son with NO ONE to care for him. (is father was killed 8 years ago).

I guess I don't want to see my friends go through the pain of illness, or their families go through the pain of losing them. I'm just frustrated because I know it's not MY place to convince them. I also realize you can't MAKE someone outgrow the self-defeating "magic-pill" mentality.

I guess my quote can be interpreted many ways. If someone has no desire to change, I shouldn't waste my time. I know I wish someone had given me a slap long ago, but I suppose I wouldn't have listened anyway. I probably would have gotten angry, hurt, and used their "meanness" as an excuse to medicate myself with food!

Thanks for listening to me "vent"...

lené
Mon, Jul-28-03, 12:17
I do understand your frustration, especially when the people in question are friends or family members. My mom, for example, was told a year ago that she has diabetes. Since then, she has neither seen a dr. nor changed her way of eating in any repsect. It worries me terribly, and I've "nagged" at her to please at least see a dr., but she simply refuses. (I suspect she does so because she knows that a dr. will advise her to make some dietary changes, and she doesn't want to "give up anything.") Meanwhile, she thinks I'm nuts for voluntarily making changes to my diet/life based on my own desire to do what is best for my health. (I was diagnosed as having insulin resistance, "borderline" diabetes, PCOS, and was in the hospital due to pulmonary embolism earlier this spring. Yikes! Talk about a kick to the fanny! I knew I needed to do *something* positive for my body, and lowfat certainly had never helped a bit. <g>)

At any rate, it is darned tough to let go of the frustration of watching someone you love pursue a course that you know/believe will harm them, but eventually you do just make peace with it. We all have to make our own choices, and take responsibility for 'em. Tough to stand back and allow others to have that freedom when we think we know what would be best for them... <G> At least you can come here and let off steam a bit. We undertand how you feel!

Lene'

potatofree
Thu, Jul-31-03, 22:47
Just a side note...lol. GUESS who started asking me LOTS of questions about Atkins?? The high-bp-sleep-apnea-"can't do it" friend!! I'm going to loan her my book tomorrow!!!!!

Karen
Fri, Aug-01-03, 00:56
The people you're referring to probably find any change difficult. They're probably always saying, "Oh, I should do this or that or I wish I had this or that then life would be so much easier." The shoulds and wishes are one of the "Magic Pills" you're referring to.

You've probably discovered that your attitude and behavior have changed just by changing the way you eat. If you remove the substance you're addicted to, what have you got left? Just yourself.
If someone has no desire to change, I shouldn't waste my time.
You don't have to say anything unless someone truly wants to know but you can be a wonderful inspiration by example. Attraction, not promotion baby! :)

Karen

gotbeer
Fri, Aug-01-03, 15:34
There are, of course, ways to "convert" the reluctant. They are immoral, of course, but they do work.

The "ultimatum" technique - do this, or else! - though long beloved of therapists, advice columnists, and daytime talk shows, it has mixed results, invites cheating, but is sometimes effective, especially when multiple loved ones / and or family are involved. Recruiting a forsaken lover or current lust-object to the team can dramatically enhance short-term results. Works best when the victim (um, convert) has an IQ between 75 and 110.

The "love bombing" technique involves isolating the victim (um, convert) and showering her with a barrage of sappy emotional appeals - the more people, and the more rehearsed/eloquent the appeals, the better. It helps to cloak oneself in religious piety (waving bibles around, etc.) Loud, rhythmic music, sleep deprivation, and repeated physical contact increase the impact of the appeals. Problem: this will ruin a weekend faster than a nuke can wreck the shopping mall.

The "contra" technique involves adopting a behavior contrary that which is desired, letting that contrary behavior "destroy" you (your dreams, hopes, family, whatever), and place your friend in the position of "saving" you: she would have to adopt the desired behavior in order to save you. This is risky, and needs planning, skill and timing to execute, but in the long term can be the most effective of all, since she will think she came up with the rescue idea, and hence, will buy into it quickly. Works best when the victim (um, convert) has a caring nature and an IQ between 110 and 135 - too smart, and she'll bust you; too dumb, and she won't get it.

***

The most moral option, of course, is the "exemplary" one: adopt the desired behavior yourself, and let is shine forth: quietly, and persistently, in a low-key way. This is twisted, difficult, frustrating, and unsexy - but it works, is morally sound, and will let you sleep at night unashamed of the day. You may have noticed this already.

hysteria
Mon, Aug-04-03, 11:46
Here is a primo example, not food related...
My mother smoked for almost 40 years. We all kept trying to get her to quit - when I was a child, I would flush her smokes down the toilet ;)
When we would nag, she would get defensive...as I got older, I came to understand her addiction (I got hooked for 10 years myself). Then, back in January, she almost died at work. She was diagnosed with pulminary edema & further tests were needed. Well, already long story a little shorter, she ended up having triple bypass surgery in April. It was horrible - Thank God, she pulled through. Even though there are times when she wishes she could still smoke, it took open heart surgery to make her quit. She knows if she ever returns to smoking, she will die. Right now, she is not ready :)
Quitting would have been MUCH easier than what she is going through - she admits this now. Hind sight is 20/20 tho...

scthgharpy
Mon, Aug-04-03, 12:20
I know how you feel...You just wanna take them buy the throat and yell at them! Do you WANT to die!!!??!?!

But, I also know how fanatical Ive can get when I dive headfirst into another health project-running, tris, -or healthy eating. I used to be like 10g fat a day and the loudest evangelist you can imagine. BOY, is my face red, 100 lbs later...

But hey, like gotbeer recommended (at least the last one, and probably the one that will save your freindship! :yay: ) lead by example. Yur freinds will see you happy and healthy and more energetic, and say hey, maybe this CAN be done.

And see, shes coming around! Allright! Now be gentle! :p

J

gary
Mon, Aug-04-03, 12:21
I have a friend who completely converted along with his wife to Atkins. They emptied their cabinets of the old food then bought everything you could find of LC products including all the candy bars, cereals, low carb pasta, pizza crust. He never did induction and tells me his doctor does not think it is good because of supposed kidney damage from prior drug use. He is obviously overweight with a big overhanging stomach. After at least 8 months he has not lost a single lb but still loves Atkins. Problem is he eats tooooo much period. They eat all that Atkins junk which adds up carbs and calories. So he has been having problems with diabetes. But when you see him eat the truth comes out and he cheats too with real sugar temptations. The latest is he was down the shore on vacation and said he was walking on the boardwalk when he felt sick. He called his doctor and the doctor said go to the hospital right away. His glucose was over 400 so they put him on insulin for the first time. Well he tells me this story, says the diet was not working (which pissed me off)- I just know the way he eats and cheats especially on vacation - my big suspicion is that he cheated and that is why his glucose was over 400. But he denied it and said his pancreas was failing. Still - where did the glucose come at that sickness episode on the boardwalk if he did not cheat.

Can anyone tell me perhaps Karen- is there a way for your glucose to be up without cheating? He denies that he ate sugar - but then how else did his blood sugar go up. Put two and two together - he is known to cheat and vacation down the shore (Fudge, salt water taffy, icecream).

Maybe I am wrong - I only know from the past diabetics who kept eating sugar had high glucose levels and had continued problems. He is bummed now about taking shots - his doctor said he can come off it depending how he controls his diet! (This seems to back what I am saying - he is not being honest about what he is eating - if his doctor said diet can influence it)

I have hammered on him that he should lose weight to help with the diabetes. Strangest thing to have caused an Atkins convert but he can't lose weight because they can not control their eating (total calories) and his diabetes is worsening. I wish they would throw all those candy bars out! I have told him you don't do that stuff until after you have control of weight loss. I had success because I ignored all that stuff - now use some in maintenenace.

Very frustrating - he has to work it out - I am done. I will only be a boreass to him. I don't think he is being honest with me but that means nothing compared to his not being honest with himself and having to do insulin shots. :bash:

gotbeer
Mon, Aug-04-03, 12:28
Starches - potatoes and such - can boost glucose levels even more rapidly than sugar. That is the point of the "glycemic index" link (http://diabetes.about.com/library/mendosagi/ngilists.htm).

gary
Mon, Aug-04-03, 12:47
To Got Beer - yeah he knows it maybe it was french fries on the boardwalk. Who knows. I still maintain there must have been a sugar or carb input to boost the glucose in his blood unless there is some other mechanism at work that a diabetic can tell me about.

How can your blood glucose level go up if you are eating all low glycemic food? :confused:

Angeline
Mon, Aug-04-03, 12:52
Obviously he is cheating, but he might possibly be unaware of exactly how.

Tell him to keep a strict diary of everything he eats for a few weeks. Just that action might make HIM aware of what he is doing. If not, he might be simply making some mistakes .... eating something that he doesn't realize is high-carb. The diary should reveal that as well.

pepsi max
Mon, Aug-04-03, 13:19
could it be that he,s eating too much food, even though it may be low gi food you can still get a bg rise if you eat too much.
also, if the protein intake is higher than the body,s requirements,the liver will turn the excess into glucose. a percentage of protein is converted into glucose anyway at a slow rate, maybe after 3 hours and then if hes eating again(carbs) bgs are going to stay high, or go even higher.the only way to know for sure is to tell him to keep a strict food diary.


christine

Lisa N
Mon, Aug-04-03, 14:25
even though it may be low gi food you can still get a bg rise if you eat too much.

Yes, but not to a blood sugar of 400 unless he's eating massive amounts of protein and even then I don't think a person would be able to give themselves a blood sugar of 400, diabetic or not. Gluconeogenesis just isn't that quick and efficient at raising blood sugars. Only too many carbs or sugar will give a blood sugar reading that high unless you are a type 1 diabetic.
Honestly...I think the best explanation is denial, pehaps even to the point that he's got himself convinced that he's doing everything right and not cheating.
I would suggest a food journal as well...what he eats, how much and when and he needs to be completely honest about it (no leaving out cheats because he doesn't want it to look bad).
This is a good example of doing low carb the wrong way and then blaming the diet for your results.

Marebear
Mon, Aug-04-03, 17:30
Stress can cause glucose levels to rise too. Maybe he was overheated and perhaps had too much exercise with the walking. Blood glucose levels sometime seem to have a mind of their own. You can do everything right and still have high numbers sometimes.

Mary

potatofree
Mon, Aug-04-03, 17:39
I've seen a couple of people when I was an EMT, that could test at 400 FASTING blod sugar, but they were also unconscious...

The friend I mentioned AGAIN decided it looks "too hard"... and she hadn't read the book. She's going to do it "The old fashioned way" and watch what she eats and get more exercise....which SOUNDS good, but I've seen it twenty times before. (My bet is about three days this time at MOST before she's "earned " a pizza...the WHOLE pizza...)

I'm taking some good advice here. All I said was "Well, if you ever do want to borrow the book, just holler." and left it at that, eating my low-carb snack while she ate cheetos. (If you KNEW me, you'd know what a monumental thing my careful choice of words WAS!!!)

She and the ther friend "envy my willpower" but claim they don't have any... They refuse to see that the plan MAKES it easier to stick to than what they're doing. They just have their minds made up they can't do it..and you know the saying "Whether you think you can or can't, you're usually right!"

GaryW
Wed, Aug-06-03, 03:51
Low-carb doctor and author Fred Pescatore (whose dues including having worked at the Atkins Center in Manhattan) wrote a book called Thin for Good: The One Low-Carb Diet That Will Finally Work for You. My reading of it gave me the impression that he's entirely pro-Atkins, but felt that the Atkins book itself somewhat lacked fully dealing with the range of psychological issues that can plague some dieters to varying degrees. He attempted to address that with a series of psychological exercises, insights, etc. along with an Atkins-style low-carb program. I think his book (and books like it) might be helpful for some who have a higher degree of psychological barriers/issues and just reading the Atkins book might need more than just its science why's of low-carbing and 1-2-3 how's of what-to-eat instructions. My point is that some of these people have psychological barriers to an extent that they sabotage themselves before even making it through Atkins induction enough to realize for themselves the health/weight improvements to get self-propelled in their motivation.

I also think Rachael Heller's writing in the beginning of her CAD book was pretty good in one aspect of this too, about how before she discovered (in fact, stumbled) upon low-carbing, the psychological abuse people take when failing on low-calorie/low-fat diets (even though they may be following local/lofat to the letter, yet doctors blaming them for not following it "correctly")... these people can understandably get quite a chip on their shoulder from those failures, then showing up to low-carb with a lot of psych baggage - potentially sabotaging their giving low carb a true try. Being an outsider, it's very easy for them (especially before reading "the book") to get a lot of misconceptions, such as thinking one of their successful low-carb buddies simply has much better willpower - rather than understanding the appetite-reducing, blood sugar stabilizing benefits of low carbing many benefit from.
So, I'm learning not to be too critical of them after what a lot of them have gone through from those other diets that haven't worked for them combined with conflicting/changing advice from the government/media. Ms. Heller herself only caught on due to an unusual situation of needing to forego certain foods to prep for a doctor visit, and discovered it caused weight loss the next day, upon which she repeated the same low carb for another day, and got the clue by direct observation... sort of sneaking up on her and her barriers under the wire. And so on.

gary
Wed, Aug-06-03, 08:19
Thank you for your ideas and suggestions. I saw my friend last night and he would not admit it directly and skirted around the issue of whether he cheated - did say he has to watch his carbs more closely. Also his Doctor is a Nutritionist who likes Atkins. He told my friend to get rid of the Atkins candy bars and stuff. My friend finally realizes that even that LC food adds up to affect your blood glucose levels. If you eat one candy bar that might be 3gm carb - then eat sugar free cookies at 10g - then eat three slices of Atkins pizza(Carbsense Dough) with sauce - maybe 10 gm per - you get 43 g of carb in one sitting!

Looks like he is on better track - is taking 35 units of something called Lanced so has to use syringes

So thank you again! :wiggle:

potatofree
Wed, Aug-06-03, 20:43
GaryW- I do think the CAD diet book covers the psychological issues much better than Atkins does. I think it's the first-hand knowledge she has of BEING overweight/dieting/"failing"... I struggle to overcome my emtional eating, and low carb DOES make it easier.

"Other" Gary..lol.. Your friend reminds me of my sister, who ate a WHOLE BOX of cookies because they were LOW FAT, thus GOOD for her diet!!
Admittedly, I've overindulged myself, because a food was low carb.. another reason I had to cut out the sugarfree chocolate for now. It was to easy to rationalize overdoing it!

gary
Thu, Aug-07-03, 07:46
I have nother friend who is obese. I used to tell him about healthy fat like olive oil. His idea is to eat huge quantities of regular typical saturated fat food and then have some olive oil on top thinking that makes it all healthy. :lol: :( He had 1/2 his stomach cut out with an obesity operation.

Now he is gaining weight. His doctor laughed at him and said he never did such an operation on somebody and they immediately gained so much weight.

Kind of sad this person just cannot control the total quantity of food they eat.

potatofree
Thu, Aug-07-03, 17:40
It's really sad that even surgery can't help him. Scary too... It sounds like he needs a better doctor as well as some nutritional counselling so he can learn exactly what he needs to eat.

IthinkIcan
Thu, Sep-11-03, 09:35
I've had feelings of frustration on this support forum as well. Such as the one day cheats ..weekend cheats...low carb products galore.
I want to support and help, I want them to see how fantastic they can feel and all the advantages of sticking to Atkins as its written. Everytime I see someone who is not even 20% to goal asking about low carb breads, muffins, cakes, candies, I want to just scream out, give yourself a chance! I know not everyone feels these things can be harmful, but to me its just replacing an addiction with something else. It doesn't allow a person enough time to re-learn how to eat. To appreciate the unprocessed foods and to let the body learn new reactions to what is put in it.
Yea, attraction rather than promotion Karen. That's what I try to do. I also always try to reply with my experience only. Its sometimes very hard to stay so positive.

It makes me think of that post someone put up about a lady in the office found out she was on Atkins and told her how it'd not worked for her and the other lady, stating something about maybe it was the doughnut or whatever it was, she was having with lunch.
There is misinformation galore. So these people attempt a half-Asskins for less than a month, eat carbs again, gain...and they are the ones out there saying how rotten it is for you.
Anyway, yea I'm done venting too.

Dstar96920
Thu, Sep-11-03, 10:28
Wow, this post keeps going and going and going...
I posted almost the same thing a few weeks ago after seeing one to many "whiney" posts. I have to remember that it was a little strange and difficult at first for me also. So, I ask myself what kind of mood I am in before responding or even reading them. As for others that prefer to eat themselves to death, or are diabetic and eat sugar all day, so be it. I have tried to help people, and only those that at least make an effort, will have me there to encourage them when they have a bad day. My dad is diabetic and finally got a hold of his candy addiction, by switching to sf candy. He is now no longer diabetic and I am thrilled. We can debate whether he learned anything about his addiction til the end of time. I am just happy he doesn't need insulin shots or could become blind.

potatofree
Thu, Sep-11-03, 18:30
Dstar-- good point. Does it matter if he learned anything about his addiction? Not really. The immediate threat is being mitigated by the substitution, which gives him the opportunity to learn better habits. He may or may not choose to, but he's alive!

IthinkIcan- I share your frustration about peple who blame the plan, or go off-plan and complain about it "not working"...

I'm not so frustrated with the ones who ask about lc products. Yes, I suppose it's "better" to do it with whole natural foods, but I look at those products as ways to make the program more bearable, and alternative to falling off-plan.

We all have to be careful about our mood, tone, etc when we post. My own personal achilles heel is when people who aren't 20% to goal telling others the "right" way to do the program.

adkpam
Mon, Sep-29-03, 15:14
To get back to potatofree's original rant, I want to say I totally understand her frustration, but at the same time you really cannot change others, you can only change yourself.
Being a good example isn't necessarily as glamorous as getting someone to "see the light," but it works better in the long run.
I totally agree, by the way. It drives me crazy when someone says, "Oh, I couldn't give up bread/potatoes/sugar." Heck, if I gave them all up, and now don't even miss them, there is hope for everyone.
I say, "Okay, on the one hand we have a slimmer body, more energy, clear skin and better health. On the other hand, we have...bread."
It doesn't seem like a hard choice to me.

FromVA
Mon, Sep-29-03, 18:09
Thought long and hard before I posted to this thread. I really get upset when I see threads where people are constantly discussing a carb blow-out day, or days, or meals. When I first started Atkins and signed up on this site, I read all of that and thought it might be okay because there were so many people who didn't feel it did any harm and lots who felt it helped. I tried it ONCE for ONE meal and then wondered what in the "h***" I was doing. I resent people who constantly cheat and talk about how hard it is for them and say it doesn't work, because it gives the impression that it is easy for the people who have struggled, had horrible days and sometimes suffered through without the cheating. What...we are somehow immune from the frustration? I haven't cheated once, and it wasn't easy when I was under terrific stress or exhausted. I know when I am vulnerable to cheats and try to head them off at the pass. I'm not patting myself on the back, but I'm certainly not going to start a thread and whine if I make the choice to pig out and choose not to exert some self-control. Again and again and again. When I first started Atkins I found it incredibly difficult, but it has gotten much easier as time has passed. And I certainly didn't see amazing results in the first two weeks! Or month. The threads for support are great...as long as the idea that it is "okay" to cheat, forgive yourself and move on...over and over and over again aren't reinforced to the point where "falling off the wagon" is almost a good thing! Just look at all the folks who will rally 'round to tell you it is okay again and again and again! Everyone is vulnerable to temptation and there is nothing wrong with falling victim to it as long as it doesn't become a way of doing Asskins. (Loved that expression!) I know I sound nasty, but I am somewhat fed up with the attitude that "if I don't lose a lot, and right now and can't eat what I want, this doesn't work".

Thank you so much for letting me vent. I feel so much better!

potatofree
Mon, Sep-29-03, 18:17
You know I was WONDERING where this thread went...it looks like it was added on to one I started earlier....hmmmm.....

madmike
Mon, Sep-29-03, 18:27
Potato:

I agree with you... great post. I have a 17 year old niece that is about 5'2" and weighs 260 lbs. She babysits a lot for us and is sweet as can be. She saw the success I was having on the WOL and wanted to try it. I spent a lot of time talking to her about it and trying to help her, and my wife went to the grocery store with her to help her get her first weeks food.
DAY 3, she didn't go to school and called me crying saying she was sick and her system just couldn't handle all the FAT in the diet. EXCUSE ME? I see her put back triple cheeseburgers from Wendys with an Xtra Biggy Fry and she can't handle the fat? She was too lazy to do it, wanted her carbs, and found an excuse!
Now, the other side of the coin is that I was heavy as a teenager, was thin through college and gained my weight back over the past ten years and there was nothing that anyone could do or say to get me to lose it until I decided to do it on my own... so, its a little hypocritical for me to critisize at this point. BUT, its likes... this is so easy if you give it half a chance, aren't you sick of being in that condition? Arggghhhh... mad

Colleen1
Fri, Oct-17-03, 20:14
I discovered Dr. Atkins and the whole idea of low-carb eating a year ago. Now I can't help but think that whoever devised that food pyramid should be forced to resign and apologize to the country.

I have a sister-in-law who is morbidly obese (over 100 pounds overweight). She thinks fat is evil and swears by the low-fat approach to dieting. I want to put her in front of a mirror and scream, "it's not working!!!"

watersidhe
Fri, Oct-17-03, 20:22
Potato:


DAY 3, she didn't go to school and called me crying saying she was sick and her system just couldn't handle all the FAT in the diet. EXCUSE ME? I see her put back triple cheeseburgers from Wendys with an Xtra Biggy Fry and she can't handle the fat? She was too lazy to do it, wanted her carbs, and found an excuse!



That is certainly possible, but are you absolutely sure she was not feeling sick? Lots of us experience dizziness, headaches, etc. for the first week or so of Atkins. Make sure she knows this bit of information before you pass judgement... I apologize if you already told her and I am being an assumptive jerk, though.

Lisa N
Sat, Oct-18-03, 05:37
MadMike...

It seems that day 3 is often the worst for the carb withdrawal symptoms which can include feelings of nausea (it's not the fat, though...it's your body jonesing for sugar!) so your niece may have felt bad. A lot of people who start low carb quit in the first 3 to 5 days just for that reason because nobody explained to them what carb withdrawal can feel like and claim that low carbing "made them sick". Unfortunately, if she had just stuck it out for one or two more days she probably would have found herself feeling far better than she has in a long time.
If your niece is willing to give it another shot, she could try another plan of attack which is to more gradually reduce carb intake, dropping to 60 grams of carb, then 40 and then finally induction levels. Some people have a hard time dropping right to 20 grams of carb..it's too big of a shock to their bodies, but they can manage it if they do it gradually..kind of like getting in a cold pool slowly instead of diving in head first. :)

watersidhe
Sat, Oct-18-03, 11:09
Madmike- MEEPERZ! I got lazy and must have missed the date on your post----didn't realize this had happened over 2 weeks ago. :blush:

It sounds like your niece looks up to you & really admires you for accomplishing all that you have. If you haven't done so yet, please do have a talk with her and encourage her to try again! Suggest that she start on a Friday.... maybe her high-school will even have a Teacher Inservice Day? That would give her a nice, long week-end to detox from the carbohydrates, and she would probably feel GREAT by Monday or Tuesday.


Orrrrrrr she could start again on Halloween.... that is also a Friday this year, and I guarantee that she will not have a lot of difficult schoolwork that day.

potatofree
Sat, Oct-18-03, 11:31
You can lead a horse to water....

There's NO way to force someone to try this WOE if they aren't ready and motiviated. IN fact, especially a teenager, most will outwardly rebel if they feel forced or pushed.

The friend in question will still bemoan her fate and say "I have to do SOMETHING.." but when I mention Atkins or CAD, her eyes glaze over and she'll rder a piece of pie.....

My only hope for her is her love of Dr Phil! I convinced her to order the new book, since when I offered to lend her mine, her excuse was "I'm the type who likes my own copy to refer back to.."

Hopefully she'll get something out of it..IF she in fact ordered it..<sigh> She is taping Dr Phil while she's at work and feels "Sorry for THOSE people"...maybe she'll make the connection that she IS "those people"...

LilaCotton
Sat, Oct-18-03, 12:33
My own personal achilles heel is when people who aren't 20% to goal telling others the "right" way to do the program.

Oh, I so hope I'm not falling into this category! :( I've been trying to help some newbies with questions and such but have been trying to go by what I've read in the books and the hundreds of helpful posts from more experienced folks here. I KNOW I'm not experienced enough to give advice based on what I've done.

I do know, though, from experience the frustration that others who've posted here feel. I've read some of the 'carb-day' posts myself and I can't say I'm real thrilled about that approach. I may never be absolutely 'cheat-free' on this WOE, but I know I have to do it to the best of my ability. If I end up having a carb-day I'm very afraid I would fall into that same old trap again and that's something I want to avoid. Yes, I am missing pizza and Pizza Hut's lovely deep-dish crust. But if I should indulge would it be worth it? I don't think so. When the holidays roll around I know the dinner rolls are going to be difficult to face. (Home-made bread is one of my absolute favorite foods in the whole world!) But since this is a WOL and not a diet, I'll have to take those steps as they come along.

I have a sister who is diabetic, and she has read the studies on Atkins, and she knows it's a sound plan. But, she's also a very stubborn and intelligent person who thinks she knows everything there is to know about diabetes and what she has to do. She has, however, at least agreed to help her 11-year-old daughter learn to eat more healthily in order to stave off possible later diabetes, and for that I'm very thankful. This kid would polish off 2 packages of Ramen noodles in one sitting, for crying out loud!

I know the turning point for me came just a short while back. I had heard of low-carbing for a couple of years when my sis-in-law started on The Zone. I looked at the plan, though, and it just seemed entirely too complicated. I had tried to increase protein and decrease carbs, and for a while it was helping a lot. I had even lost a few pounds. Then over the past summer I wasn't feeling well at all and started eating more of the wrong things again and gained that weight back. The thing was, that even though I knew I shouldn't be eating that many carbs, I thought, 'Oh, I'm just having an order of onion rings with my burger!' Then pretty soon that was two or three times a week, and it just escalated. Not only that, but our entire family is hypoglycemic and one of my daughters just kept putting on a few pounds here and there. A short while back she was wearing a size 38 jeans, then had outgrown those. The older daughter was gaining at the rate of a couple of pounds here and there, and hubby had extra pounds he wasn't shedding, either. I knew it was time to take action, not only for myself but for the sake of the entire family.

I am very happy, though, that in our family, the Atkins WOL is growing exponentially. Two more members took up this WOE during the past week, and I think it will really help them if they're determined enough (one of my sisters will be more than determined enough and the other [sis-in-law] has me a little worried, but I think with proper support she'll be just fine).

bcadieux
Sat, Oct-18-03, 12:44
to "fromva"
thanks so much for your post.
I was thinking that maybe it was alright to cheat.
I've been doing this WOL for 101/2 months and never cheated, although tempted. I'm a sugar-holic and when I found sugar free candy it was a life saver for me. It never tempted me to eat the "real" thing.

watersidhe
Sat, Oct-18-03, 13:07
I absoultely agree with you, potatofree. People can only change their lives when they are ready, and the shrinks always tell us that you can never rescue or even reason with any kind of 'addict'. :nono:
However, I really do think that the tears and the desperate call to madmike meant that this girl was trying and really very disappointed. There is an absolutely huge difference between force and supportive encouragement, and it sounds like the little one might only need some of the latter. So, this is probably a little different from the denial-type situation your friend is facing.

I hope things go well for the two of you, tho. I am a great admirer of Dr. Phil's mind, if not that crazy-sounding new diet-plan of his... :thup:

potatofree
Sat, Oct-18-03, 16:01
Why is his plan crazy-sounding to you?

watersidhe
Sun, Oct-19-03, 09:38
IMHO Dr. Phil's new book seems to focus mainly on the psychological aspects of losing weight and getting healthy, which is set of tools a large majority of people need to understand. However, the information is rather generalized and honestly doesn't deal much with the fact that the average John or Jane Doe, at least in the United States of America, really doesn't know very much about nutrition or exercise. A lot of people will likely read the book and then start or continue with whatever they currently feel is a 'healthy' WOL for them. Exempting the ones who really DO have a knowledgable support-system, long-term change is going to be a lot more difficult for them.
That said, I feel really happy all of his WL-challengers for sticking with the program and losing the weight. It is a highly-controlled environment, though, and I just wonder how they will do in the long-run (i.e. once they are no longer being monitered by Dr. Phil's team of doctors, nutritionists, and cameramen) It brings back the first thing I heard anyone tell me at Weight-Watchers.


"If you stop coming to our meetings, YOU WILL RE-GAIN ALL OF YOUR LOST POUNDS!!!" And how true that premonition was.... *shudders*

potatofree
Sun, Oct-19-03, 12:05
Have you read the book?


The plan in the book is pretty sound, and he spends a great deal of time teaching about choosing nutritious foods that provide maximum nutrition and minimum negative impact on your health and weight loss. This plan, or any other, coupled with the lessons on how to deal with the WHY as well as the WHAT we eat, makes a well-rounded program, IMHO.

The show did start off a little too "Big Brother" for my taste, but is now dealing with teaching the participants HOW to cope with everyday challenges...so they DON'T fall back into the old traps when the cameras are off...

EmyAmber
Sun, Oct-19-03, 20:16
For information on Eating Disorders, http://www.something-fishy.org/whatarethey/coe.php

This site explains some of the underlying issues behind both Complusive Overeating and Anorexia.

From Emily

komireds
Tue, Oct-28-03, 15:16
I've seen a couple of people when I was an EMT, that could test at 400 FASTING blod sugar, but they were also unconscious...

The friend I mentioned AGAIN decided it looks "too hard"... and she hadn't read the book. She's going to do it "The old fashioned way" and watch what she eats and get more exercise....which SOUNDS good, but I've seen it twenty times before. (My bet is about three days this time at MOST before she's "earned " a pizza...the WHOLE pizza...)

I'm taking some good advice here. All I said was "Well, if you ever do want to borrow the book, just holler." and left it at that, eating my low-carb snack while she ate cheetos. (If you KNEW me, you'd know what a monumental thing my careful choice of words WAS!!!)

She and the ther friend "envy my willpower" but claim they don't have any... They refuse to see that the plan MAKES it easier to stick to than what they're doing. They just have their minds made up they can't do it..and you know the saying "Whether you think you can or can't, you're usually right!"

what you have there are a couple of friends who have not made a decision yet (and maybe never will). you can't push and it's important to stop yourself from getting on a soapbox about it (even in your mind). I had a similar experience when I stopped drinking. I grew so frustrated with people who were like "I can't stop!" "It's too hard...waaaahhh." I just had to remind myself that everyone is different and that I should compliment myself for my strength instead of criticizing their lack of it.....

EmyAmber
Wed, Oct-29-03, 11:45
I do find some comments here very insensitive and also showing a lack of understanding of eating disorders. No one should be shamed or blamed or told to 'just stop eating', or 'just stop drinking' (not that I believe the above post was saying that.

It is simply very hurtful and only adds to the impetus of an eating disorder to be blamed and shamed for it. And I personally felt less comfortable sharing my struggles and what is REALLY going on with me on the boards, because it sounds as tho' anyone who is going through stuggles may well be judged as stupid, lazy, or an irritation.

This generally happens because people don't want to be aware of their own vulnerabilities, and I know, at times when things were going really 'well' with the weight, and I feel shame at this, I would feel 'superior' to other overweight people, and think,
"They should start Low Carbing". And those thoughts are just another way to feel better than someone else, when inside, I don't feel very good about myself to start with.

That need to put someone else down, or control them, must come from some lack of self esteem inside, or...codependency...whatever...that's none of MY business either, except to point out the harmful effects of it on me, and to say that I personally believe that this discussion really should not have been allowed-because it involved gossiping about/judging people on this board, which is not a matter of 'argument', but a way to say what wouldn't be allowed in the main board about others there.

The comments about the subject in general, that's a legitimate thing, but....what if i came over here and wrote, 'You know SOME people really get on my nerves, coming around saying how GREAT they are doing and telling everyone else what to do on the boards' (I'm not saying that, but as an example, is that REALLY appropriate????

From Emily

Kristine
Wed, Oct-29-03, 12:07
When did the conversation switch to disordered eating? I thought we were talking about people with a weight problem because they eat like most average North Americans - there may or may not be emotional issues behind it. Unfortunately, it's "normal" - anyone eating the way most Westerners eat and exercising as little as we do, obesity is the norm. Is it practical to imply that everyone with excess weight and less-than-stellar eating habits has an eating disorder? I mean, one of the biggest obstacles to adopting this WOE is the fact that everybody around you *isn't*.

FromVA
Wed, Oct-29-03, 13:02
I don't think EmyAmber realized she was in the Low-Carb War Zone, where there is more latitude in expressing opinions. My personal take on this thread was it was more about expressing the frustration you feel when people knock or whine about LCing. I think someone got defensive and brought up eating disorders as a reason people can't stick to LCing, which really had nothing to do with the initial post. Frankly, I don't know what eating disorders had to do with the discussion.

EmyAmber
Wed, Oct-29-03, 13:48
Hmmmm, that's interesting....I assumed that everyone knew that anyone who is morbidly obese no doubt has underlying emotional issues, but perhaps....sigh....

Perhaps....some people don't have eating disorders who are overweight, but I feel that many do....and am...well.....had no idea that other's didn't share this view.

I myself have had one since around 8 years old, and remember quite well how the critisimns and shaming of people saying 'GO onto Sego' contributed to my yo yoing....when I see others speaking of feeling so disheartened about their weight, well....can't help but feel there are many others like me, tho' not all people.

My main point though, was truly this:

Is it okay to come here and talk about other members of the board????

I thought that would be considered 'flaming', and that....you know, this place was for argument, but not to deride other members...

For me, there is no discussion of weight issues without eating disorder issues, I suppose everyone doesn't think of it that way, but...I think it's an epidemic. Not everyone, true for some it is a physical thing.

Anyway, excuse the intrusion, I'll stick to the 'safe board'...

From Emily

atiaran
Wed, Oct-29-03, 14:21
As far as I can see, no one specific on the board was named or flamed, and a frustration was expressed that was in no way offensive. Simply an opinion answered to with other opinions. This is part of what this section of the board is set up for: to be able to have discussions.
If anyone were flaming someone else, their account would be suspended. Read "The Sticky Note" on the War Zone forum for more details.

FromVA
Wed, Oct-29-03, 14:23
When did the conversation switch to disordered eating? I thought we were talking about people with a weight problem because they eat like most average North Americans - there may or may not be emotional issues behind it. Unfortunately, it's "normal" - anyone eating the way most Westerners eat and exercising as little as we do, obesity is the norm. Is it practical to imply that everyone with excess weight and less-than-stellar eating habits has an eating disorder? I mean, one of the biggest obstacles to adopting this WOE is the fact that everybody around you *isn't*.
EmyAmber: THAT was the focus of this post...nothing was said about people with eating disorders...they were NOT the subject of the post. People who profess to "know" all about LCing (without having read the book and published studies) and are critical of us who DO live this WOE, were. There is nothing wrong with venting frustration over this issue. Loads of people have to deal with it every day. You are welcome to come here and do it any time you want. OBTW, I DID vent about people who whine about this WOE not working...because they don't stick to the program and THEN complain it doesn't work.

You said "Is it okay to come here and talk about other members of the board???? I thought that would be considered 'flaming', and that....you know, this place was for argument, but not to deride other members...

Yes, I guess you could say I was being of critical of people who don't follow the plan and then spread the word that LCing doesn't work! Don't knock the program if you won't follow it. It was a generalized statement and I don't consider it to be "flaming".

komireds
Wed, Oct-29-03, 15:07
No one should be shamed or blamed or told to 'just stop eating', or 'just stop drinking' (not that I believe the above post was saying that.




From Emily

While it is utterly ridiculous to suggest that someone "just stop eating" I personally don't see any reason why someone couldn't and shouldn't "just stop drinking." I have done it and I know people who have done it. Don't get me started on lame AA philosphy that says otherwise...

Anyway, I was simply comparing a lack of will power in one area to a lack of will power in another area. I was in no way talking about individuals with eating disorders. I am overweight and I feel that I need to lose some pounds for my health. That means I automatically have an eating disorder? This diet has required much will power to stick to it (even in the first two weeks) and it required a serious decision on my part to start it and stick to it. That was all I was saying.

Anything is possible if you think you can do it, serious medical and mental conditions aside.

potatofree
Wed, Oct-29-03, 16:28
I guess I can speak with authority, since I'm the one who started the discussion, that it is most definately not about eating disorders, nor is it about another board member, but people around us in our lives that "knock" low-carb without understanding what it is.

"Flaming" would be calling someone a moron for not reading a thread and understanding it before judging and jumping down people's throats.

Lisa N
Wed, Oct-29-03, 18:41
Perhaps....some people don't have eating disorders who are overweight, but I feel that many do

I think it's true that many people who are morbidly obese do have a form of eating disorder called compulsive overeating, but I also think it's a vast overgeneralization to broaden that to include all those who are morbidly obese or even mildly overweight.
There are many causes of obesity. If it were as simple as identifying and treating an eating disorder, there would be a far lower incidence of obesity than we currently have. PCOS, Hypothyroidism, Insulin resistance, Steroid therapy (as well as a host of other medications) are all examples of things that can and do lead to being overweight or obese without having to first develop an eating disorder. Heck...sometimes it can be traced to simply eating a poor diet and not excercising enough; bad habit, yes, but not an eating disorder.
Back to the topic at hand. Yes, it drives me nuts to hear people talk about how they tried low carb but they just couldn't handle living without their favorite high carb food (or whatever other excuse you can think of), or how "they followed it to the letter" (NOT) and it just didn't work for them. So far, in every instance that I've encountered, those that have claimed to follow the program exactly....didn't. Most never read the book for the plan that they were following and those few that actually had didn't follow it (cheated often, no supplements, you name it). So for them to blame low carb intead of just plain old operator error...yup...it makes me want to roll my eyes and say, "Oh, puhleeeez" every time I hear it. :rolleyes:

EmyAmber
Wed, Oct-29-03, 21:23
I did a bit of research, and I was wrong in thinking that anyone who is significantly overweight must have an eating disorder, I do appologize.

I suppose I just...thought everyone was like me!

And had never occured to me that it might be considered an insult either, to say others had an 'eating disorder', until I read a website on fat acceptance, where they spoke of how angered they felt at being seen as 'diseased' or 'unhealthy' because of their size.

As to the rest, the truth is I felt as tho' the criticism of the first post was directed to people like myself, tho' I've never blamed the Low Carb way of eating for my struggles, it just hurt my feelings to think people would be irritated with me, and probably they WOULD be if I wrote about binges or times of feeling .....hopeless etc. on days when it is like that.

But, you know, this isn't an 'eating disorders' SITE, so my expectations are not in tune with reality.

It would be fine for talking about other aspects of Low Carbing here, recipies, sharing or getting information, sharing when things go well or weight is lost.... but you know...if I need help for the other stuff, that's what places like O.A. or other web sites are for. Kinda liked the Size acceptance site, actually (grin)

Appologies for the misunderstanding,

From Emily

Mary P
Wed, Oct-29-03, 21:40
I can sympathize. I've run into exactly the same thing. I will not let them pull me down to their level. I have to bite my tongue many times when I have to listen to their "excuses". I think our addiction to food is similar to others addiction to tobacco or alcohol and we too have to hit rock bottom before we can pull ourselves up or at least we have to realize we need to do something good for ourselves to improve our health.

FromVA
Wed, Oct-29-03, 22:27
It would be fine for talking about other aspects of Low Carbing here, recipies, sharing or getting information, sharing when things go well or weight is lost.... but you know...if I need help for the other stuff, that's what places like O.A. or other web sites are for. Kinda liked the Size acceptance site, actually
EmyAmber: Again: You are in the wrong forum. You are in the LC War-Zone which is NOT where you need to be. Please go to Active Low-Carber Forums (http://forum.lowcarber.org/index.php?) > Main Low-Carb Diets Forums & Support (http://forum.lowcarber.org/forumdisplay.php?f=25) and pick the support forum you would like to use. Or try them all. They are the SUPPORT forums. This is not.

Hellistile
Fri, Oct-31-03, 11:01
PotatoFree:
Being an elderly, asthmatic, arthritic, former stroke victim, and trying every fad diet in existance before trying low-carb, and kicking my butt from here to eternity for taking so long to discover low-carbing, I now want to shout to the entire universe about how great I feel, how I can almost run up stairs instead of crawling up them slowly, how I can still breathe once I'm at the top of the stairs, how I no longer need a nap at work after lunch, how I now have to fight the urge to do a lively jig during meetings, to name just a few of the benefits reaped from my way of eating, it is very difficult for me to zip my lip.

Several of my co-workers are my age. One of them takes anti-depressants, sleeping pills, colesteral lower drugs, tylenol daily, diuretics and these are only the drugs I know about. Her husband died at 58 years of age from a combination of diabetes and heart disease.

Every day as I walk the 3 blocks to work in the morning I keep repeating to myself over and over again, Zip your Lip Helllistile, Convert through example. But it never works. I just can't help myself.

However, on the bright side, I did convert 3 co-workers. One's on CAD, lost 20 lbs and got his blood pressure down to normal, the other two are on Atkins and doing extremely well. As it was mentioned before, only those who want to help themselves will and there is nothing anyone can do.

Thanks for listening.

BTW I myself cheated during the first six months on the plan, but now a parade of pizzas, donuts, cakes, ice cream, cookies could pass directly under my nose and I wouldn't be tempted (and trust me, in this office this happens daily).

potatofree
Fri, Oct-31-03, 14:04
Hellistile-- I'm so happy you're doing well! You really DO understand my frustration too!

It's hard not to nag my friend. I worry about her health, but I just try to encourage whatever steps she takes in the right direction, and ignore the mis-steps. She's bragged to other people about how great I'm doing, but just doesn't see that she can do it too. I keep hoping she'll give it a go... I've convinces another of our circle of friends to try. Maybe when she sees Vicki try, she'll get "brave"...<sigh>

FromVA
Fri, Oct-31-03, 20:26
Good Lord!! Is that SNOW???!!! Please keep it up your way this year! LOL...it started snowing in these parts Thanksgiving Day last year and didn't stop 'till mid Spring. I never would have believed you could be housebound from snow in Virginia! Oh, please, NOT again this year!

potatofree
Fri, Oct-31-03, 20:52
Snow...snow..and MORE snow already...and unseasonably cold temps. It's edging below zero as we speak! It feels like December....

adkpam
Mon, Nov-03-03, 18:29
Gee, now I feel behind the times. Where I live is regularly featured on the Weather Channel as one of the coldest places in the US.
It will come, for sure.
I'm fortunate that I haven't gotten too much flak. I remember when I was talking to my friend at work about my new way of eating, and someone else overheard, and immediately started saying all the "Atkins myths," about nothing but meat, and "no bread, that's unhealthy." Of course he's a rail, never had to think about it in his life.
And my Dad was negative, until I emailed him a copy of the "What if it's all been a big fat lie?" article, and now he just wants to make sure I'm eating my vegetables. He did a 180, but I don't rub it in (grin.)
Now that I have two people at work doing it, and two more planning to do so, the balance of power is shifting my way!

Mizree
Mon, Nov-03-03, 20:13
My BF has diabetes and would constantly keep saying," I need to do this...I need to do that..." Meanwhile stuffing his face with plate fulls of rice, potatos, tortillas, etc...
I did nag repeatedly for awhile. Then he decided to "join" me in my way of eating. That lasted as long as 1 month. And only at dinner time. Lunch for him was whever the guys from work went. He never saw results and just gave up.
I got tired of his always saying and never doing. I just ate my way and continued on my road (however bumpy) to success. He keeps saying he wants to do it, but he doesn't make any attempt to learn how. He wants me to decide every bite that goes in his mouth. Then gets mad if I said anything like,"Hey thats got way too many carbs. or Are you sure you NEED that?" I never said things that I thought to be mean or sarcastic and demeaning. I want to be supportive, but I can't do it for him!
His blood clocked in at a whopping 419 Saturday night. I just about decked him I was so mad! He said he would start eating my way, and has so far done OK according to him. He told me what he ate for breakfast, lunch etc...
I can handle this from him, but I hope he's serious this time. This has to be a real decision at changing your life. I get upset that he thinks a few days eating like this and it's ok to have "just a little". I am not perfect. I make mistakes. I blow it. But I pick myself up and wipe myself off and get on with getting on....
Ok , I have rambled enough.
Just wanted to say I agree with your frustration seeing the ones you care about not doing anything.....

Lisa N
Mon, Nov-03-03, 20:38
His blood clocked in at a whopping 419 Saturday night.

Mizree...you probably already know this, but a blood sugar of 419 is not only high, it's dangerously high. If my blood sugar was that high and my doctor knew about it, he'd put me on insulin immediately. Mine hit 250 and my doctor was flipping out. :p
If your BF isn't going to get serious about controlling his blood sugar through diet, at least encourage him to get his butt in to see his doctor. One way or another he's got to get those blood sugars down or he's going to be in for a world of hurt a lot sooner than he seems to realize.
You're right that this has to be his decision and he has to be the one to commit to it, but if it were me and my blood sugars were that high, I'd be scared to death and heading for the ER.

adkpam
Tue, Nov-04-03, 11:55
I hope your BF doesn't have to have a big wake up call.
I keep thinking of a friend of mine, years ago, who had a little stroke, a high blood pressure warning. He came back ok, and I was talking to him about changing his diet the way his doctor wanted him to, and he kept saying how it's hard, can't do it, he feels fine, etc.
A few years later, and he's had a few more strokes, and now he has great difficulty thinking, talking and walking, and has to go twice a week for dialysis. He managed to say to me, "I wish I had listened to you."
Rat him out to his doctor. It's better than trying to do this alone.

Mizree
Thu, Nov-13-03, 05:54
Just to touch back,since my bf started eating "my" way and making sure he is taking his medication, his blood sugar was 240 last time I saw it. Its still high, but not as scary as Saturday. This is hard for him, but I think he is realizing that he does have a problem, and he is the one who needs to fix it. He refuses to take insulin, so I told him that the only way would be through diet. I have started making him walk with me too. I think he needs the exercise as well. Its a struggle some days because I can see he wants to eat something and hasn't quite caught the spark that this WOE gives you, but hes serious now, .....XxXfingers crossedXxX...I hope.

Thanks for writing :)