Active Low-Carber Forums
Atkins diet and low carb discussion provided free for information only, not as medical advice.
Home Plans Tips Recipes Tools Stories Studies Products
Active Low-Carber Forums
A sugar-free zone


Welcome to the Active Low-Carber Forums.
Support for Atkins diet, Protein Power, Neanderthin (Paleo Diet), CAD/CALP, Dr. Bernstein Diabetes Solution and any other healthy low-carb diet or plan, all are welcome in our lowcarb community. Forget starvation and fad diets -- join the healthy eating crowd! You may register by clicking here, it's free!

Go Back   Active Low-Carber Forums > Main Low-Carb Diets Forums & Support > Daily Low-Carb Support > CAD/CALP
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members Calendar Mark Forums Read Search Gallery My P.L.A.N. Survey


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 09:59
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default CAD/CALP Overview & General Rules

Many CAD/CALP forum members have asked me questions in various threads to which I gave some or all of the answers/explanations below. I thought it would be helpful to have them together in a new thread. Please read "Carb allergy vs Carb addiction", too.

Also, if you think the plan fits you, please by the book(s). You will refer to them many times.

CAD/CALP is a diet and life plan for carbohydrate addicts. The plan calls for 1-3 meals/snacks a day of low carb (induction level) meals, called complementary meals by the Hellers. In addition to the complementary meals allowed you are allowed one meal a day that contains carbs called a reward meal.

In the first book, CAD, the Hellers said at your reward meal you can have whatever you want, however much you want. They did make a passing mention to having a balanced meal. Of course carb addicts did not hear that and some used the reward meal as a carb binge. Carbs taken to the extreme and not in the presence of other foods can still affect insulin levels. Additionally fake sugars cause carb addicts to react as if they are true sugars.

Therefore, in the next two books, CALP and ? the Hellers clarified rules and fingered triggers, fake sugars, diet drinks, MSG, that can cause an insulin reaction and thus hunger, weight gains or stalls.

There are degrees of carb addiction and and uncontrollable appetites for carbs. However, Rachel Heller also tried Atkins and couldn't lose and even gained.

For a "true" carb addict, there is an escalating insulin surge that occurs with every incidence of eating or of the eating of carbs. Since insulin is the hunger hormone, hunger grows and grows even if you have just eaten. This chemically induced appetite can become uncontrollable.

So you see, it is the amount of carbs you eat each time but it is also the frequency with which you eat at all. Think of a superball that bounces higher each time it hits the floor. Now think of the well-meaning suggestion that you eat six times a day or that you take in more carbs.

This is why the Heller's have the various eating plans of two to four meals a day. Each carb addict needs to find his/her own eating program but no more than four times a day.

This is probably why, unknowingly, some Atkinsers refuse to leave induction even though their weight loss has stalled and their metabolism has lowered. They know instinctively and through experience that if they leave the strict carb levels of induction their hunger comes screaming back and they wind up binging.

Make sure your reward meal is balanced. That means approximately 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 of carbs (including dessert and alcohol), protein and vegetables. Also try to start your reward meal with a small salad. That way you won't get out of control. Also check your other meals for hidden carbs. Protein shakes and bars are not allowed on this diet because of possible reaction to sugar alcohols. Also diet soft drinks, sugarless gum and, in fact, all sugar substitutes are also limited due to insulin reactions. A carbohydrate addict is very insulin sensitive to sugars and sugar replacements. If you get them at your other meals, your insulin will surge and your appetite can get out of control at your reward meal. Remember insulin is the hunger hormone.

It is important to follow the one hour Reward Meal limit, that is what controls your insulin levels. You get used to it after a while. Do not stop and start your meal again later for dessert. Have your meal and then dessert. Also if you're eating in a restaurant, don't touch your beverage until your dinner comes, have them bring appetizers and entree together. When you are half done with your meal, order dessert, if you want it.

The reward meal can be moved to any time of the day for special occasions. The reward meal can also regularly be at any time of day you choose to fit with your lifestyle (business luncheons?); don't move it around except for special occasions/events. Some of my best weight loss on CAD was to have my reward meal every day for lunch. That strategy gave me a chance to work the extra carbs off through the rest of the day.

Alcohol is only allowed at the reward meal and subject to the constraints of the 60 minute limit. Beers, low carb or otherwise are only allowed at the reward meal. I think low carb beers have over 3 grams of carb/serving and are therefore restricted.

If you have cravings on CAD or have trouble stopping at your reward meal, you need to examine the non carb meals for hidden carbs. Also read "carb allergy vs carb addiction". Carbs (other than allowed foods) at non carb meals/snacks can cause insulin surges and rebound appetite/cravings. Shakes and bars are notorious for this effect in carbohydrate addicts.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 11:02
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,427
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Default

Quote:
This is probably why, unknowingly, some Atkinsers refuse to leave induction even though their weight loss has stalled and their metabolism has lowered. They know instinctively and through experience that if they leave the strict carb levels of induction their hunger comes screaming back and they wind up binging.

Zuleikaa, I have to take issue with this statement.

Firstly, you are implying that Atkins Induction may stall weight loss and lower metabolism.
I have never seen any evidence of this. Many folk choose to stay on Induction for long periods and have wonderful weight losses. Here, we tend to encourage folk to move on from Induction so that they can begin more easily to prepare for maintenance.

And many, many studies have proven that metabolism is increased by eating more often. Not more food, the same amount of food, split into smaller meals eaten more frequently.
Remember, what works for you will not necessarily work for others and vice versa.

And my dear, I think that your statement about hunger coming screaming back is just plain wrong. The many thousands of folk who have succeeded by following either Atkins, Protein Power, of the myriad other plans would also disagree with you.
I doubt very strongly that the Hellers mentioned that in any of their books.

Zuleika, I am not dissing the CAD/CALP plan. I know it works very well for many folk. But that does not mean other plans don't work. They do.

Rosebud
Reply With Quote
  #3   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 11:28
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Rosebud

If you closely read what I said, the entire post, I was referring specifically to carbohydrate addicts, and especially severe ones. Atkins, past induction, while it works for many, many people does not work for severe carbohydrate addicts.

This is my opinion and I'll stick to it! I have a right to my opinion and I am very careful to state that this is my opinion.

Further, this is the forum for CAD/CALP and its users/supporters and the purpose on this and any specific low carb plan forum is to offer support and encouragement for that plan.

I did not bash Atkins. I use the plan myself. I think it is a very good plan and very well suited to many people. Just not the people on this forum, once past induction. If you read some of the posts here, you will see them saying exactly that.

Rosebud, I think you're out of line on this post. It is not a one size or a one low carb plan fits all kind of world. The human species is wonderfully diverse and so is it's body chemistry.

I respectfully request that we agree to disagree.
Reply With Quote
  #4   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 11:46
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,427
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
Default

Quote:
This is my opinion and I'll stick to it! I have a right to my opinion and I am very careful to state that this is my opinion.

Zuleikaa, Of course you are entitled to your opinion, but I cannot see where you state in the above post that the information is in fact, just your opinion. It comes across as an overview of the Heller's plan, not just your interpretation of it.

Quote:
Atkins, past induction, while it works for many, many people does not work for severe carbohydrate addicts.

Again, I refer you to the many thousands of folk, most of whom are carbohydrate addicts. All low carb plans are useful for carb addicts - that's why we need such plans.

I agree totally with you that we all have different needs in our plans. However, it is your untrue statements about Atkins such as leaving Induction causes hunger to come screaming back that concern me.

Rosebud
Reply With Quote
  #5   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 12:12
VickiP VickiP is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 153
 
Plan: IR Diet
Stats: 165/155/135 Female 5'5"
BF:
Progress: 33%
Location: Boston
Default

Zuleikaa,
Thankyou very much for your helpful post. I am trying to follow CAD and I'm having trouble with it. I end up eating a ton of junk food during my RM. I eat my RM for dinner, and I have turned it into allowing myself to eat whatever I want for the rest of the evening. My problem with having it at lunch, is that I usually don't have an hour for lunch. Dinner is my relaxing time of day and I like to enjoy it as much as possible. I'm going to start trying to control my portions more, maybe by measuring out or something. Do you think that splenda causes problems?
Also, about the restricting carbs too much for too long changing your metabolism debate, there is proof that doing that can alter your metabolism. This happened to me definately. It can affect your T3 levels (or T4 I can't remember). I got mine tested not low carbing, they were fine. I got them tested lowcarbing (Atkins, severe carbs restriction), they were too high (hypothyroidism) I got them tested again not lowcarbing and they were fine again. I also did read this in a few places. I'm sure staying on induction helps some people lose. Starving yourself also works on some people, in the aspect that they lose weight, doesn't mean that it is good for you.
That's just my $.02
Tori
Reply With Quote
  #6   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 12:21
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Vicki P

Thanks for your support.

Overuse of fake sugars can cause insulin surges and result in carb binging at reward meals. As the Hellers mention--if it tastes sweet, your body thinks it's carbs and releases insulin to process it.

I suggest that you limit your use of fake sugars to no more than 4 a day, including the amounts in softdrinks. I further suggest that you only use these sugar replacements when ingesting them with your meals.

So my short answer is yes, Splenda definitely causes problems. So does MSG.
Reply With Quote
  #7   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 16:15
Karen's Avatar
Karen Karen is offline
Forum Founder
Posts: 12,775
 
Plan: Ketogenic
Stats: -/-/- Female 5 feet 4 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Vancouver
Default

Quote:
Do you think that splenda causes problems?


Being a sugar junkie, I used to think that artificial sweeteners cause an insulin rise so I finally - after low-carbing for three years - bought a glucometer to check the theory I was dead wrong about it (results are in my Journal). So, what I'm assuming it did was start a process that stimulated seratonin and beta-endorphins. Just like a junkie switching methadone for heroin.

What matters most is not necessarily what you eat, but why you eat it. Supporting the behaviours and beliefs that got you to where you are now will foil any progress. Finding other non-addictive sources of seratoniin and beta-endorphin stimulation works too!

Addiction is a complicated physiological, psychological and spiritual disease. Abstinence is the beginning of recovery, but the other aspects have to be addressed too.

CALP is a solid plan and like any other plan should be followed as written until you're "out of the woods" and are completely comfortable with it as a lifestyle. The Heller's have a lot of sound advice and it's always best to turn back to the source every once in a while for a refresher.

Karen
Reply With Quote
  #8   ^
Old Fri, Nov-01-02, 17:39
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Sorry I did not mean to offend anyone or to slight Atkins. However the thread of CAD overview and general rules was comprised of answers to questions on various threads. I thought it would be helpful to have them in one place. Also, this is the forum for CADers and is meant, I understand, to support and affirm the choice of those who chose this WOE.

I didn't mean to cause such an uproar and thought I would also show some of my other comments on the CAD board:

Quote:
Again, there are different levels of carb addiction and for some levels perhaps Atkins works for the long term. However, for the severe carb addict, (just my opinion) being stuck forever to induction for control of your disease is not living.


Quote:
The levels of carb addictiion can be even further complicated by SAD (seasonal affective disorder). SAD creates carb addicts in winter by the chemical reaction (lack of) in the brain serotin levels caused by lack of light intensity. You can imagine what effect carb addiction on carb addiction has. Often people are not carb addicts or can keep their addictions under control during late spring and summer month's, but when winter comes Look Out!!!


Quote:
I can not tell you what plan to choose. I can only recommend that you read through "Which low carb plan is right for me", but I can recommend that you read through the CAD book and see if it describes you. There is also a test in the book that helps determine your level/severity of carb addiction.


Quote:
If you are not a carb addict, perhaps you are not getting enough calories and have damaged/slowed your metabolism.
The solution to that is more food, limits of 12-16 ounces of protein (my suggestion) and patience. The body is a miracle of adaption and you abuse it at your own risk. It's a shame to say that many on Atkins cut calories by cutting out veggies when they should be adding them. However when adding, especially at first I would recommend sticking with the very low carb ones. However, you can still eat a lot of veggies for very few carbs.
Reply With Quote
  #9   ^
Old Thu, Nov-14-02, 08:19
AlluraD's Avatar
AlluraD AlluraD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,312
 
Plan: Lchf
Stats: 340/283/160 Female 5'6"
BF:
Progress: 32%
Location: Maine
Default Glad this thread is here~

Hello~ *s* I'm glad this thread is here......it's true that everything works for someone. I've been stalled for a long time on Atkins and I have to religiously stick to induction or I do crave sugar horridly........I don't eat it but I WANT it!!!! Aaaaaggggggghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!

I am seriously going to give this plan a try just not sure which one to do if there is a difference?? Any suggestions.......I'm still reading thru the site.
Reply With Quote
  #10   ^
Old Thu, Nov-14-02, 08:48
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Why don't you give CAD a try first. It's the simplest plan. Just be sure and include some veggies. Also keep taking your fiber. Later you can add CALP options.
Reply With Quote
  #11   ^
Old Thu, Nov-21-02, 11:17
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Update
Reply With Quote
  #12   ^
Old Thu, Nov-28-02, 21:01
skyspinner's Avatar
skyspinner skyspinner is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,372
 
Plan: Six week Body Makeover
Stats: 251.4/220.4/135 Female 65 inches
BF:
Progress: 27%
Default

Good basic info here.....
Reply With Quote
  #13   ^
Old Thu, Nov-28-02, 23:00
need2bthi2's Avatar
need2bthi2 need2bthi2 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 728
 
Plan: CAD/Atkins/CALP
Stats: 265/176/150 Female 164 cms
BF:
Progress: 77%
Location: Sunny Australia
Default

You know I have done both plans and find that it depends on the individual to how successful it all is. But one thing I noticed is that at night I have a cup of herbal tea (I dont like it without sugar) so I use Stevia which does not seem to have a reaction at all with me. But I would not like to risk any other sweetner.
Reply With Quote
  #14   ^
Old Fri, Nov-29-02, 19:13
skyspinner's Avatar
skyspinner skyspinner is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,372
 
Plan: Six week Body Makeover
Stats: 251.4/220.4/135 Female 65 inches
BF:
Progress: 27%
Default

I have tried so many different stevias, and have never found one I like......do you have a brand you could recommend?

Thanks in advance....
Reply With Quote
  #15   ^
Old Wed, Dec-18-02, 09:44
Zuleikaa Zuleikaa is offline
Posts: 16,630
 
Plan: Mishmash
Stats: 365/350.4/160 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 7%
Location: Maryland, US
Default

Update
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Cad/calp Quotes Zuleikaa CAD/CALP 31 Sun, Mar-08-09 09:57


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 16:53.


Copyright © 2000-2017 Active Low-Carber Forums @ forum.lowcarber.org
Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.