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  #31   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-09, 19:59
gwynne2's Avatar
gwynne2 gwynne2 is offline
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Plan: Lowcarb/IF
Stats: 215/173.9/150 Female 5.5"
BF:
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Grimalkin, I am not good at this kind of post, but my thoughts are with you. My Mom is newly diagnosed, and we found out today that the sentinel node biopsy was positive. It sounds like a slightly different situation (hers for the most part is not hormone sensitive, only HER2?) but any additional info that is garnered from the folks here is greatly welcomed by me. I have another thread going as well.

I'd be very interested to hear how things work out for you, particularly what you discover with regards to diet, supplements and the chemo, so I hope you will continue to post if you feel up to it. Also feel free to PM me. I haven't been able to talk Mom into seeking out online support groups yet, but I'd be happy to pass any info back and forth since it sounds like you're both at the same stage of the process.

Again, best wishes for you.
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  #32   ^
Old Wed, Dec-30-09, 21:20
LarryAJ's Avatar
LarryAJ LarryAJ is offline
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Posts: 702
 
Plan: PP/PPLP
Stats: 150/140/140 Male 68 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Northern Virginia
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This is a small sample of the papers being published on cancer and sugar/glucose. There many more linked at the right side of these web pages.
Breast carcinomas fulfill the Warburg hypothesis and provide metabolic markers of cancer prognosis.

Cancer's molecular sweet tooth and the Warburg effect.

Hypothesis: using the Warburg effect against cancer by reducing glucose and providing lactate.
This is especially irritating to me because the researchers seem TOTALLY oblivious to the ability of the human body to use FAT and ketones for fuel.

Grimalkin, I wish I could "save" you from the traditional medical establishment's approach to cancer. But there is not a GOOD marker for breast cancer progression like there is for prostate cancer. You have been given good advice regarding vitamin D and carbohydrates. I would want to see you taking 10,000 units of D a day (I have taken 8,000 for a year) and cutting down as much as possible on ALL sources of carbohydrates. That is the message in the papers linked above. Since the body will happily make glucose from EXCESS protein don't eat too much protein. If your stats are current the PPLP book says you need 27 grams of protein per meal - three meals per day, though I would get the first book Protein Power and use it's calculations - a bit more complicated by better tailored you your specific need. In looking up the protein requirements, I looked in the index of PPLP for cancer. There is a LOT in there that you should read, more than I can put in here. The paragraph on Qo10 and breast cancer stuck out as I flipped through.

My cancer story is, in June 2002 I had a positive biopsy for prostate cancer after my yearly physical came back with a PSA of 5.0 and a recheck two weeks later came back at 5.6. Several fortunate things happened between the physical and the biopsy, 1. I changed to following Protein Power Lifeplan and reduced my carbohydrate intake to about 20% of what I had been eating. I did that not because of the cancer which I did not know at the time I had, but to lower my triglycerides which were in the 150 to 250 range. 2. I learned of two men at work that had prostate cancer and how one was using the web to learn all that he could about it. 3. For a number of reasons, there was a six month delay between the physical and biopsy, long enough that I think the reduction in carbohydrate intake was starting to have some effect on the cancer.

When I got that gut wrenching call from the doctor saying the test was positive, I immediately called the man at work that had cancer. He told me to take several supplements, some of which I suspect would help you. They were selenium, which I think I remember seeing something recently about saying it inhibited cancer growth, green tea, which I took as capsules since I CANNOT tolerate tea, and vitamins D and E. I also started taking tumeric which I found on a breast cancer site as being anti carcinogenic so I would strongly suggest you take it. I found a paper on the anti metastasis effect of modified citrus pectin, so I started taking it.

So when I went back to my doctor four weeks after the biopsy to find out where I was with my PSA so I could think about what treatment I was going to try, the PSA came back at 5.2, WHAT! It should have gone up! Well that means I have some time to think about the options. Five weeks later my PSA was 3.7, whoa! Then with testing about every month-five weeks my PSA went; 3.2, 3.1, and then was down to 2.5 by Dec 2002, below the 2.7 I had in 1999 and 2000. I have been checking every three months since with the readings mostly between 2.5 and 3.2. but every time it is up for two tests it then is down on the next. My last was 2.7.

I am lucky that I had a set of circumstances that allowed me to "cure" myself without medical intervention. The biggest factor was an easy, reliable way to test/monitor my progress. The "just monitoring" approach is actually being tried with prostate cancer patients and is called "watchful waiting". The idea is to monitor the progression, which is often slow especially in old men, and only do treatment if the cancer becomes aggressive.

I remember reading/hearing of a new test to measure cancer progression that may be useful for breast cancer. BUT, I would bet that your doctors have not heard of it, so you would have to find it yourself so you could tell them. Pubmed.gov would the place to start. I'll try to do some looking as I have time.
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  #33   ^
Old Thu, Dec-31-09, 08:58
Grimalkin's Avatar
Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Plan: PP
Stats: 160/149/125 Female 66 in.
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Thanks Larry. I am all for complementary approaches since at this point I don't think there's any escape from "modern medicine" either, and my worst fear will become future recurrence provided I make it through the treatment. Unless the doctor objects I see no harm in trying anything that might help.

I have actually been ketogenic for many years until around April, when I switched to Kwasniewski and dropped protein to about 60g/day, and raised carbs to about the same. So I haven't exactly been pumping glucose into this thing which is part of why I am so shocked. It seems my own hormones have turned against me, probably aided by liberal amounts of environmental xenoestrogens and maybe a little extra from all of the animal fats I've been eating which is why I'm avoiding most dairy now - from what I understand even the "clean" stuff has hormones. I assume my Vit D status sucks and will test it eventually, and I sure hope that raising it will help!
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  #34   ^
Old Thu, Dec-31-09, 17:11
Grimalkin's Avatar
Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Plan: PP
Stats: 160/149/125 Female 66 in.
BF:
Progress: 31%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryAJ
I looked in the index of PPLP for cancer. There is a LOT in there that you should read, more than I can put in here. The paragraph on Qo10 and breast cancer stuck out as I flipped through.

I'm having trouble finding it; what is the chapter or page no?

Thanks a lot for the info on turmeric and the other herbs, it does make me feel like I might have a little control over whether the treatments are effective and that the disease can be controlled afterwards.
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  #35   ^
Old Thu, Dec-31-09, 20:13
LarryAJ's Avatar
LarryAJ LarryAJ is offline
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Plan: PP/PPLP
Stats: 150/140/140 Male 68 inches
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
I'm having trouble finding it; what is the chapter or page no?
It is in Protein Power LIFEPLAN, the second book that came out in 2000, not Protein Power that came out in 1995. Look in the index under Cancer, there are references in several chapters. Page 241 in PPLP in the chapter Sunshine Superman, starts a section called Sunlight and Cancer Prevention.

While carb restriction helps I don't believe that that is enough on its own. Carb restriction reduces the available energy to the cancer, but it is still going to get some glucose since the red blood cells MUST have it so the liver will make enough to keep the blood glucose levels "in range" from protein. My "take" on how my cancer went into remission is that the combination of reduced energy and anti cancer supplements/vitamins/minerals kept the cancer from growing as it would have otherwise. Just keeping the cancer from growing, partially because of the lack of energy to do so, gives the supplements a chance to work at killing off more cancer cells per time unit than new cells are being created in the same time period.

There is some indication that the supplements do not "KILL" the cancer cells directly but instead "repair" the defective mitochondria which then commits apoptosis ("programed" cell death) as it would if it was normal. Apoptosis is what keeps cell division in check, especially in places like the skin that is constantly growing. The cells that die are pushed to the outside to protect the inner layer of skin and constantly sluff or are worn off. The mitochondria in the cell is the "regulator" of apoptosis and stops working when the cell becomes cancerous. I think that vitamin D is a major player in the "repair" of the mitochondria even in normal cells.

Cosmic radiation has been present through out the existence of the earth. Most people don't know about it but I worked on a project for a group that were studying cosmic radiation. Cosmic radiation is not really radiation like light or TV signals, but is fully ionized atoms that have very high energies. When they hit other atoms on earth they destroy that atom, which if it is in the DNA of a cell will alter or ruin that DNA strand. There are enzymes that "patrol" up and down the DNA looking for damage which they will try to repair. This process must have started very early in the evolution of life and was instrumental in the success of the early cells. ** At least that is my synthesis from a number of diverse sources that I have read.

Back to your cancer. One thing that I found very helpful was a support group. I strongly suggest that you find one, check the local hospitals, etc. They can give a lot of direct experience and information.

Do you have an oncologist besides the surgeon? If not GET ONE! I say that because my experience with listening to a lot of doctors that come and talk to the support group, is the surgeons are so busy that they cannot keep up on the latest cancer research as well as an oncologist since cancer is just one of the things they treat. If you are close enough to the Virginia suburbs of D.C. I could check and get a recommendation from my support group.


EDIT to add:

Objective measurement of remission and progression in metastatic breast cancer by the use of serum tumour markers. This is something that an oncologist should know about and be able to tell you if it has gotten to the practicing clinicians. If it has you could use it to track your progress if you want to try supplements - esp. vit D.

Activated leukocyte cell adhesion molecule: a novel biomarker for breast cancer. Here is another one that I picked from the related articles box as another sample of how much research is going on.

EDIT to add some more that I found:

http://www.apjohncancerinstitute.or...er/breast-c.htm
This has a good synopsis of breast cancer, what it is, how it acts and the stage definitions which the doctors use. It also has a list of supplements that are used with the treatment plan that the doctors at this site/clinic have developed. A number of them are ones that I took/still take with the rational for taking them. If you think that one looks like you would take it, then you can check for papers on it at pubmed. Start here:
Then click on the tab at the top of the white area that says Preview/Index. In the window now will be an entry box that you can enter search terms and to the left is a field selection box so you can specify which of the many data fields is the one you want searched. The TEXT field is what I use the most so a search line might look like, breast[Text Word] AND cancer[Text Word] AND Selenium[Text Word] and you might want to use Publication Date as a field to get recent papers which would look like, 2008[Publication Date]

Then you add each "term" by clicking on the AND button until you have built up your search line. Then up under the black line where your search is being entered and to the right of it are three buttons. I use the Preview one to quickly see if there are any hits and how many. A new page with appear showing your search string and at the right how many hits. The number of hits is a link to the listing of the hits. The page that is linked shows the title of the paper, the authors, where is was published and then at the bottom of each citation are links to either an abstract or the full text (if available). Have "fun" searching.
OH, yes, DO NOT let all the medical/statical jargon put you off. Just read past it since you are just trying to get the gist of what it says NOT the full detail. The more you do the more comfortable you will be with it.

http://www.vci.org/thermoradiotherapy.htm
Interesting alternative approach paper that claims good results. There is a lot more on this site including some gross photos of cancers that look to me like stage 20, i.e. I wonder HOW the person let the cancer get this advanced before they got treatment. These are not lumps underneath the skin but what best could be called eruptions of the cancer through the skin. HOWEVER, two show the progression to cure, so you should come away with the feeling, "if these people can beat cancer, so should I."

Last edited by LarryAJ : Fri, Jan-01-10 at 15:30.
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  #36   ^
Old Wed, Jan-06-10, 21:11
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Kaity Kaity is offline
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Plan: 180DH/W.Price/BED
Stats: 145/135/140 Female 6"
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Progress: 200%
Location: Canada
Default Dr. Hamer's German New Medicine, EFT, and TMK

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
I am all for complementary approaches since at this point I don't think there's any escape from "modern medicine" either, and my worst fear will become future recurrence provided I make it through the treatment. Unless the doctor objects I see no harm in trying anything that might help.

Here are a few more holistic approaches for you check out:
1. Dr. Hamer's German New Medicine - http://learninggnm.com/

They just added video lectures to the site:
http://learninggnm.com/documents/videos.html

2. Emotional Freedom Technique - http://www.emofree.com/

A free manual explaining how to use it and why it works is available for download at the site.

3. The King Institute Method - http://www.kinginstitute.org/index.php

The general self-help sequence is here:
http://www.kinginstitute.org/future...an_sequence.php

I'm fairly new to the ideas of Dr. Hamer. My Natureopathic Doctor told me about German New Medicine a few years ago, but I've only just started looking into it. Initially, I was skeptical. But now that I'm watching the video lectures, I'm starting to think, "Wow, what if he's right?"

EFT on the other had, I've witnessed work dramatically. I've experienced it remove a phobia in two rounds of tapping, which took only a minute or two. The phobia has never returned. I've also used it to deal with upsetting memories, anxiety, insomnia, and other random issues I think it might help. Sometimes it does. I have to be persistent, though. I wonder if it could be used with GNM to assist in resolving conflicts. Hmm...

I've also used The King Institute Method with success. The median sequence helps me get to sleep at night (that's a miracle, because my insomnia is severe), and have more energy during the day (also miraculous). The only other application/position/not-sure-what-to-call-it I've used so far is the one to get rid of nausea. I tried it on my sister and mother when they got sick. It worked.

All three of these approaches sounded crazy to me when I first heard about them. Now my keeps falling open in awe of the human body's ability to heal itself.

My mother had melanoma about fourteen years ago. We didn't know about GNM, EFT, or TMK at the time, but with the support of our Natureopathic Doctor, her friends, and family, she made it. She's now healthy and cancer-free. I hope this will give you hope.

The best of luck to you with whichever treatments you decide to pursue.
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  #37   ^
Old Sun, Jan-10-10, 12:42
Grimalkin's Avatar
Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Plan: PP
Stats: 160/149/125 Female 66 in.
BF:
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Thanks so much! Kaity, I will be trying some of these techniques to help me get through chemo and hormone therapy which will be starting soon. The King Institute sounds really helpful, especially given your testimony which I really appreciate hearing! I am also planning to consult a naturopath too - it sounds like most people who made it through treatment without too much misery did that.

Ken, I am all for these supplements to help my body heal but I doubt that there's much chance the tumor would go away on it's own like yours did... they've determined it's an estrogen driven tumor and as a female my body isn't going to stop making plenty of that while left to its own devices. But I am hopeful they may help prevent recurrence and am busy researching! Many thanks for the links!
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  #38   ^
Old Wed, Jan-27-10, 21:32
jem51 jem51 is offline
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Plan: Mine, all mine
Stats: 160/120/120 Female 5'6"
BF:still got some
Progress: 100%
Location: Oregon
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if i were treating myself, i'd err on the side of dietary caution.
i know you mentioned giving up dairy but i don't think it's any worse that eating meat fat from commercial meat sources....and dairy is probably better if you use no hormone treatment variety. this is mainly since there is little if any hormone residue in milk but in growth hormone treated, there is a spin off hormone.

since we know that chemical residues concentrate in body fat, there is good reason to beware.
mark sisson (i think) says if you can't get pastured meat, cut off the fat.
coconut oil is a good way to add it back. and of course, organic butter is a good choice, since butter has a pretty good amount of O-3.

also, it's nice to have a back up plan for times when food is completely unappealing.
when i could not stomach much of anything (just bad digestion), yogurt was the only thing that would not cause some type of GI problem. i have continued to make my own and it continues to be easy on my gut.
that may not be your choice....but go for something that'll provide good nutritional value. maybe an eggnog (coddled egg if you don't want raw), just a suggestion...smoothies from real ingredients.

hopefully, you'll have treatment that will be relatively easy...but if not, ask your doc to prescribe a phenergan suppository. i think it's phendoz. they are great for keeping nausea at bay.

take care. let us know how you're doing.
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  #39   ^
Old Sat, Jan-30-10, 11:09
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Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Plan: PP
Stats: 160/149/125 Female 66 in.
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Thank you Jem, and I do think I may have been panicking when I decided to swear off all dairy... at the least the active cultures in yogurt may be highly beneficial as the chemo will wipe out my intestinal floras... but yes, I think it had better be organic/free-range/hormone-additive free foods from here on out, and if I look back in 20 years and wonder if all my money was well spent or not that's fine with me...

The stats are really ugly. This chemo is really only giving me an extra 10% of being here in a decade, and "hormone treatments" (aka premature menopause and/or estrogen blockers) offer only another extra 10 or so... pretty depressing how little treatments have improved... but that factors in people who still eat the SAD so maybe I will be one of the lucky ones.
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  #40   ^
Old Sat, Jan-30-10, 12:10
LarryAJ's Avatar
LarryAJ LarryAJ is offline
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Plan: PP/PPLP
Stats: 150/140/140 Male 68 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Northern Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
I have low-carbed since 2003, and since this is an aggressive hormone-sensitive cancer I'm not sure the high amounts of dairy fats I've eaten over the years have done me much good.
It JUST occurred to me, prostate cancer is a hormone sensitive cancer and they do hormone blockade as a therapy for it. You might ask your doctor if there has been any attempt to do hormone blockade for breast cancer.

While I am posting, I HAVE to ask, "What is your vitamin D blood level?" You probably should get it above 100 ng/mL (my level was 134 ng/mL for my Oct. '09 GrassrootsHealth's D*action project test) which I got from taking 7,000 IU of D per day. I use Carlson's jelcaps which have sunflower oil which I think is better than soy bean oil.
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  #41   ^
Old Sat, Jan-30-10, 17:06
Grimalkin's Avatar
Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Plan: PP
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryAJ
While I am posting, I HAVE to ask, "What is your vitamin D blood level?"


After 3 weeks of 10,000 - 15,000 IU daily it was at 55 according to my doctor's lab. That was about 3 weeks ago and I haven't retested yet. Doesn't really seem that low but I've stayed on 10,000/day anyway since then.
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  #42   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-10, 05:05
black57 black57 is offline
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Plan: atkins/intermit. fasting
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
After 3 weeks of 10,000 - 15,000 IU daily it was at 55 according to my doctor's lab. That was about 3 weeks ago and I haven't retested yet. Doesn't really seem that low but I've stayed on 10,000/day anyway since then.


I began taking 50,000 IUs once I realized I was pre-diabetic. My fasting blood glucose is coming down finally, as is the last stubborn 10 lbs that I have endured for the past several months. My point being is that if you are taking vitamin D to fight an ailment don't be afraid to take a higher dosage. I was surprised to see how things are improving for me. So IMHO, if the vitamin D ain't curing what's wrong with you, maybe you're just not taking enough.
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  #43   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-10, 09:50
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Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
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They may be using the lab that has inflated test numbers for Vit. D3, if so it might be 10 points higher than it really is (i.e. 45). You just need to know which lab did the D3 test (Quest is one with inflated numbers due to their testing method).

I'd get to 60 (with the non-inflated test). Being higher won't hurt.
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  #44   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-10, 21:06
LarryAJ's Avatar
LarryAJ LarryAJ is offline
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Posts: 702
 
Plan: PP/PPLP
Stats: 150/140/140 Male 68 inches
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Northern Virginia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
After 3 weeks of 10,000 - 15,000 IU daily it was at 55 according to my doctor's lab. That was about 3 weeks ago and I haven't retested yet. Doesn't really seem that low but I've stayed on 10,000/day anyway since then.
55 is fine for a normal HEALTHY person, BUT you have cancer! You need to have your level at least twice that. In case you might be concerned that over 100 is excessive, I will include a part of the D councel news letter found here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Cannell, MD, Executive Director, Vitamin D Council
The report that your son deteriorated when his dose was reduced from 3,000 to 1,500 IU suggests autistic children need adult doses of Vitamin D. When you reduced the dose from 3,000 to 1,500 IU/day he worsened although his level on 1,500 IU/day was probably still greater than 50 ng/ml. This makes me think that dosage needs to be stable and suggests that Professor Reinhold Vieth's theory of a detrimental seasonal resetting of the intercellular metabolism of Vitamin D may even be true at levels above 50 ng/ml, where the body is storing the parent compound, cholecalciferol, in muscle and fat.

His current dose of 4,000 IU per day is perfectly safe and will give him a level of 80-100 ng/ml, inside the reference ranges of American laboratories. Toxicity (asymptomatic high blood calcium) begins somewhere above 200 ng/ml. Generally speaking, autistic children should take 2,000 IU per every 25 pounds of body weight for six weeks, then have a 25(OH)D blood test and adjust the dosage to get into the high end of the reference range, 80-100 ng/ml.
(my bolding)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimalkin
Ken, I am all for these supplements to help my body heal but I doubt that there's much chance the tumor would go away on it's own like yours did... they've determined it's an estrogen driven tumor and as a female my body isn't going to stop making plenty of that while left to its own devices. But I am hopeful they may help prevent recurrence and am busy researching! Many thanks for the links!
I did not make my question that you should ask your doctor clear it seems. YES, you will always NORMALLY make estrogen just like a man will always NORMALLY make testosterone. BUT there are drugs that stop the production of testosterone. A friend is still alive some 11 years since his diagnosis. His PSA was 113 (normal is less than 4) and all the biopsy cores were 100% cancer. He was put on hormone blockade - it shut sown ALL testosterone production and his PSA went to 0.01 (lowest they can measure) meaning that the cancer had stopped growing.

Since there is much more money spent on breast cancer that prostate cancer, it would seem that someone would have tried to develop a drug for women that would do the same - shut down the production of estrogen. If there has been research done in this area, it might be close enough to final testing that you could become part of the test group. Or better yet it may be available but still in limited supply so you would have a chance of get some.

Always think positively! Cancer research is finding new things every day. It is hard, if not impossible, for the journeyman doctor to keep up with all the new research reports. That is partly why the Us TOO (support group) guys say you must be you own advocate, and research for new treatments in the places I have mentioned. Remember the key to a cure could be announced tomorrow or next week there is that much being done on cancer.

Here is a page at the PBS site on cancer. There are several interesting sections there. I recommend highly the one called Dr. Folkman Speaks.
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  #45   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-10, 23:43
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Grimalkin Grimalkin is offline
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Posts: 741
 
Plan: PP
Stats: 160/149/125 Female 66 in.
BF:
Progress: 31%
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Thanks Larry and as I said I'm staying on the high D supp for now and plan to retest in a few months. But do you have a reference for the 200 ng/ml toxicity ref? (and why on earth did I call you Ken? brains are scrambled, sorry).

Yes they sometimes shutdown/remove the ovaries for women with hormone positive breast cancer, and it is essentially instant premature menopause. I am going to take a shot for this. There are additional drugs to block estrogen made by adrenals and fat that they will want me to take, although sometimes these drugs can increase the chances of developing a non-hormone dependent cancer later. I guess that would be down the road though.
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