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  #16   ^
Old Mon, Dec-14-09, 14:25
Samantha22's Avatar
Samantha22 Samantha22 is offline
7 yrs and counting!
Posts: 8,623
 
Plan: Vegan/Crossfit
Stats: 285/212/199 Female 5'7
BF:33.4%
Progress: 85%
Location: Seattle, WA
Default

Welcome to our forum
And welcome fellow healthcare worker!
I am a Registered Nurse, and often have to bite my tongue when it comes to our "dietary" department.
I work on a busy Orthopedic Surgical Floor in a hospital.
Its nice to have a Doc on our LC forum team!

I wish I could give some insight about the "drop-out" rate...but I know that it is not specific to Low-carb eating.
I do have some opinions, but they are just that, opinions

You have a few Arizona folks here on the forum....welcome again and goodluck to you!
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  #17   ^
Old Mon, Dec-14-09, 14:40
serenity77's Avatar
serenity77 serenity77 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 445
 
Plan: Low Carb<30day + Exercise
Stats: 295/265/180 Female 5' 6"
BF:ToO MUch!
Progress: 26%
Location: Pacific Northwest
Default

I'm also interested in the drop out rate as I get more and more involved here. For me, and others perhaps, I think a lot of it boils down to planning. If you're doing low-carb correctly your hunger is under control and cravings are non-existant most of the time and are at least under control as well. But if you get stuck in a situation without your foods or make one mistake that can send you off into a cheat. And once cheated a lot make the mistake of having another cheat, another cheat, and it snowballs into going off plan and staying that way.

I was once at 303 (at least) and worked my butt off for a couple of years to lose 80 pounds doing low calorie and exercise. I always felt deprived and I always felt hungry. It was horrible.

On low carb I never feel deprived, for the most part, and the hunger just isn't there. I feel satisfied while losing weight - something I never thought would be possible.
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  #18   ^
Old Tue, Dec-15-09, 08:50
KMD's Avatar
KMD KMD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 135
 
Plan: Low-Carb Mediterranean Di
Stats: 173/168/160 Male 71 inches
BF:
Progress: 38%
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona USA
Default

I appreciate you guys making me feel welcome!

GypsyByrd: Jimmy Moore at his Livin' La Vida Low-Carb blog maintains a list of low-carb sympathetic doctors. Not sure of one in St. Petersburg, FL.

Samantha22: I bet a lot of your ortho patients could stand to lose some weight to take the strain of their joints, artificial or natural joints. Twenty years ago we turned down joint replacements on people who were too heavy - the hardware couldn't handle the weight. We seem to be doing joint replacements on heavier people now - I guess the technology is better.

Serenity77: regarding drop-out rates. You reminded me of a recent road trip involving a motel with a "continental breakfast." It was a room full of carbs. The only things I could eat were half-and-half and butter. Luckily, I had a can of tuna and some cheese in my car. My point? Carbs are ubiquitous, whereas fats and proteins are not.

-Steve
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  #19   ^
Old Wed, Dec-16-09, 10:34
chessnut chessnut is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 402
 
Plan: PaNu (lacto-paleo) & VLC
Stats: 267/235.2/195 Male 71 inches
BF:40/35/20
Progress: 44%
Location: Northern Virginia
Default

Perhaps the reason for the drop out rate is that carbs are so addictive! My half-Italian wife can't face the idea of no pasta, bread, rice, potatoes, ice cream, etc. What I work on is lowering carb portions (and increasing fat) and finding workable alternatives so that she doesn't feel deprived.

I've found so many great ideas here, for example frozen blueberries (or other berries) in heavy cream with a little stevia makes a cold creamy treat that can satisfy the desire for ice cream. Lately, I've been adding greek yogurt to it, and its even more like ice cream.

For Thanksgiving I made garlic cauliflower mashed "potatoes" and a pumpkin cheesecake - partly for myself of course. But my kids had some of the regular and the faux mashed potatoes. They came back for seconds on the caulifower!

Another point is that low carb can be delicious and satisfying (and healthy) - but you have to get comfortable in your kitchen. It really requires that you prepare stuff yourself, so that you can control the ingredients. This, of course, is a bit of a time commitment. I think its much harder to sustain a healthy low carb lifestyle by eating packaged or restaurant food.
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  #20   ^
Old Wed, Dec-16-09, 11:15
Melesana's Avatar
Melesana Melesana is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,900
 
Plan: LCHF, IF
Stats: 265/205/135 Female 5'2"
BF:
Progress: 46%
Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA
Default

Hi Steve. I'm in Phoenix - good to see another local.

Taubes said low-carb works for about half the people who try it. I lost about 30 pounds and then got stuck. I'm doing it right, and I'm losing fat but not pounds. People in my situation often drift away, and count as dropouts. I'm sticking with it because I do continue to lose fat, and I feel better with my weight holding steady here than if I were eating carbs and gaining.

Meg
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  #21   ^
Old Thu, Dec-17-09, 12:32
KMD's Avatar
KMD KMD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 135
 
Plan: Low-Carb Mediterranean Di
Stats: 173/168/160 Male 71 inches
BF:
Progress: 38%
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona USA
Default

ChessNut, thanks for the ideas. I need to try the mashed caulifower trick. Sounds yummy. We had stopped eating cauliflower a few years ago when it got expensive.

Melesana, that's a nice-looking rooster! We have two geese, two roosters, and five hens. One of our roostes is so mean, we're afraid of it. But he's pretty!

-Steve
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  #22   ^
Old Fri, Dec-18-09, 00:12
DaddioM's Avatar
DaddioM DaddioM is offline
Posts: 20,674
 
Plan: This time? LOL..
Stats: 251/228/190 Male 73 inches
BF:Weight in journal
Progress: 38%
Location: Houston, TX
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMD

They say that after a certain amount of time eating low-carb, you lose your desire for sweets. I don't think that will ever happen for me.


Hi Steve.. a couple of thoughts.

1) Although I haven't lost a desire for sweet.. my taste buds have changed. Melon and strawberries taste much sweeter to me after being off sugar for awhile, so although I still crave sweets from time to time, when I'm actually being consistently "good", what I consider sweet changes.

2) Some things are sweet without artificial sweetners.. cream for example. You know the redi-whip in the can? No artificial sweetners, just whipped cream.. yum.

Hope things are still going well for you. Although I met goal a few years ago, I still struggle day to day and have gained a fair amount of weight back, but I don't think that's specific to LC, I think that's true with any way of eating. If you stray, you gain.

Mike
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  #23   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 00:51
mark91345's Avatar
mark91345 mark91345 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 134
 
Plan: Low-carb/High-Fat
Stats: 345/335/180 Male 71
BF:
Progress: 6%
Default huh?

Hi Meg,
I am not sure I understand your post. You wrote you are not losing weight but you ARE losing fat (but not as pounds).

How are you able to measure the fat loss? (Congrats, by the way!)
Mark




Quote:
Originally Posted by Melesana
Hi Steve. I'm in Phoenix - good to see another local.

Taubes said low-carb works for about half the people who try it. I lost about 30 pounds and then got stuck. I'm doing it right, and I'm losing fat but not pounds. People in my situation often drift away, and count as dropouts. I'm sticking with it because I do continue to lose fat, and I feel better with my weight holding steady here than if I were eating carbs and gaining.

Meg
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  #24   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 00:56
mark91345's Avatar
mark91345 mark91345 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 134
 
Plan: Low-carb/High-Fat
Stats: 345/335/180 Male 71
BF:
Progress: 6%
Default welcome

It's very comforting to have a doctor on-board.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KMD

My particular interests at this point are:

-----how to overcome the high drop-out rate seen with low-carb eating
-----low-carb recipes
-----application of low-carb eating to people with type 2 diabetes, overweight or not.
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  #25   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 03:38
kathleen24 kathleen24 is offline
Monday came.
Posts: 4,332
 
Plan: my own
Stats: 275/130/155 Female 5'4"
BF:ummm . . . ?
Progress: 121%
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Hey doc Parker (don't mean to cheat you of your title--no capital d--long boring story),

Welcome. I'd ask you to look at the long-term success stories here before you define drop-outs. Many of the folks that I know that are successful at this, especially those who have had a massive amount to lose, had to take more than one run at it. A lot of those folks who did it for awhile and fell away have tried a lot of other ways to lose weight; I know I did. It's easier to say what I haven't tried than what I have. But once I'd tried LC, there really wasn't ever going back to any of the rest of that. I knew after my first time losing weight on LC that this is what worked for my body, and a vast relief it was to finally have found it.

Sweets? I eat a large bowl of whole-fat plain yogurt daily w/crushed walnuts, cinnamon, shredded unsweetened coconut, sweetener, and frozen blueberries, raspberries, or blackberries. It's surprisingly easy not to feel remorse or deprived. I hydrate thoroughly, and that also helps. If I get a craving for chocolate, I eat Lindt 85% (found in grocery stores) with walnuts or almonds, prn--seriously. I also have come to find many of the veggies in my generous daily salad quite sweet: tomatoes, bell peppers, even the spinach. I think the more my nutritional needs are met, the less I am undone by cravings.

I also think that it's kind of like question, "What's the difference between the pig and the chicken when it comes to breakfast?: The chicken's involved, the pig's committed." People who have ten or fifteen pounds to lose are involved, but some of us start out with this as a life-or death, or a quality of life, question may be more motivated to make it work.

Just a thought . . . .
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  #26   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 14:48
KMD's Avatar
KMD KMD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 135
 
Plan: Low-Carb Mediterranean Di
Stats: 173/168/160 Male 71 inches
BF:
Progress: 38%
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona USA
Default

Hi, Mark91345 and Kathleen24. Thanks for the comments.

Regarding drop-out rates:

Successful weight loss and long-term management is a little like quitting cigarettes. Most successful quitters have tried 6-8 different times and mutliple methods before finding what works for them. Or perhaps something happens that finally triggers full commitment, like a diagnosis of lung cancer in a smoking relative.

And American culture could do a lot more to make low-carbing easier.

-Steve
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  #27   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 16:15
DaddioM's Avatar
DaddioM DaddioM is offline
Posts: 20,674
 
Plan: This time? LOL..
Stats: 251/228/190 Male 73 inches
BF:Weight in journal
Progress: 38%
Location: Houston, TX
Default

Hi again,

In rereading your original post, it struck me that maybe you were as interested in information for your patients as for yourself. Interestingly enough, that sparked some different ideas in my head. btw, I totally agree that one size does not fit all. My family was very concerned when I went on a LC diet, but I told them the biggest risk to my health was staying at my previous weight. Although my bad cholesterol has not gone down, my HDL has gone up and my triglycerides have gone WAY down.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doc parker... just because I think it's a cool name.. lol
My particular interests at this point are:


Quote:
-----how to overcome the high drop-out rate seen with low-carb eating
I don't believe the drop out rate is higher with LC (but if you've got facts, please share), but let me lay out a couple of the reasons I've seen people drop out.



1) They hit a stall in weight loss - most people experience them. During my first stall I lost at least a couple inches in my waistline. I was ok with the idea of a stall knowing that I was trading fat for muscle (see picture below) but a lot of people get frustrated with the scale not moving and give up. btw.. I have no scientific facts, but I "believe" LC is more likely to make you trade fat for muscle than other diets (see the other picture).



2) They are doing LC, but they are overindulging on sweets with low "net carbs", i.e. with sugar alcohols. For me, the only carbs I subtract from the carb count are fiber. Russell Stover sweets are notorious for this (unless they've changed since the last time I looked)
3) LC is different than other diets because it actually diminishes cravings. Since going LC actually cuts out cravings, falling off the wagon brings cravings back. So do you want a diet that helps you with the cravings or one that makes you deal with them every day.. for me LC was the way to go... but some people fall off hard, and never make it back.



Quote:




-----low-carb recipes
The forum here is a GREAT source.
Quote:
-----application of low-carb eating to people with type 2 diabetes, overweight or not
Well, you are the doctor, so you make the call. You said you were no longer concerned with any cardiovasular risks from LC. If you're not concerned about the fat aspects of a LC diet, LC eating would be AWESOME I would think for people with diabetes. It's low to zero sugar, and when people do eat carbs, they usually look for those with lower absorption rates... and here's the thing.. LC actually tastes GREAT.

Quote:

In 2009 I spent 80 hours reviewing the scientific literature supporting the reigning medical establishment's position that dietary fat, saturated fat, and cholesterol are detrimental to cardiovascular health.

I found the evidence weak or nonexistent.


Do you have any of the information or links anymore that led you to that conclusion?

Hope your own LC success continues!

Mike



Last edited by DaddioM : Mon, Dec-28-09 at 16:24.
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  #28   ^
Old Mon, Dec-28-09, 18:05
Gypsybyrd's Avatar
Gypsybyrd Gypsybyrd is offline
Posts: 5,906
 
Plan: Atkins '72 It works best!
Stats: 270/232.5/160 Female 5'3"
BF:mini goal 229
Progress: 34%
Location: St. Pete, Florida
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KMD

And American culture could do a lot more to make low-carbing easier.

-Steve


Yes, it could.
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  #29   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-09, 08:32
KMD's Avatar
KMD KMD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 135
 
Plan: Low-Carb Mediterranean Di
Stats: 173/168/160 Male 71 inches
BF:
Progress: 38%
Location: Scottsdale, Arizona USA
Default

Thanks for the comments DaddioM and GypsyBird.

DaddioM-

Drop-out rates are high with all diet programs, and I'm not aware of any data that say it's higher with low-carb eating. Many different diets lead to weight loss over three months, but 6-9 months later people are back to pre-diet weight, usually because they're not following the plan.

It's clear now that low-carb diets work very well for people with type 2 diabetes, in general. Multiple published scientific studies support this statement.

I'm more interested in helping my overweight and diabetic patients than in my own weight and eating habits.

At the risk of violating the "terms of use" of this website, I'll provide a link to an article I wrote at NutritionData on the scientific studies contradicting the standard diet-heart hypothesis. It lists 11 studies.

http://blog.nutritiondata.com/heart...lar-health.html

-Steve
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  #30   ^
Old Tue, Dec-29-09, 09:24
cmsmith22 cmsmith22 is offline
New Member
Posts: 18
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 211/186/140 Female 60 inches
BF:
Progress: 35%
Location: Belen, NM
Default My reason for Dropping Out

I did Atkins in the early 80's. It worked well and I lost and maintained the loss for approx. 4 years. The reason for going off? I went to work and did not have the time with raising a family to plan meals and have the time to cook. We have become a fast food world, and it does not support the LC diet. simply put it was easier to give in than fight it. Addiction is hard.
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