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  #16   ^
Old Sun, Dec-10-06, 11:19
Enomarb Enomarb is offline
MAINTAINING ON CALP
Posts: 4,838
 
Plan: CALP/CAHHP
Stats: 180/125/150 Female 65 in
BF:
Progress: 183%
Location: usa
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My experience is like CindySue's- my 3.5 years on LC has normalized my lipids. I eat 14 eggs/week, butter, beef , cheese and shrimp. I also eat olive oil, flax seed, salmon, chicken, and lots of vegies. There are some great articles about metabolic syndrome and LC in the Media Watch/Research area of this forum. For me, having metabolic syndrome and IR makes me fatter and sicker if I eat low fat/high carb and much healthier and thinner on LC. I have not found that saturated fats made a difference, and I'm not even sure about the accuracy of the cholesterol theory of heart disease (but I am not yet willing to make a decision on that-lol.).
Have fun in your research and your journey!
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  #17   ^
Old Sun, Dec-10-06, 11:42
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,842
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaypeeoh
We're all experiments of one. I was on a strict Atkins Diet and my cholesterol went to 280. If carb is the culprit, it suggests I was making excess carb through gluconeogenesis. When I switched to the Zone Diet my cholesterol dropped to 160.

Comparing the two diets, Atkins allowed real gluttony on my part. The Zone was pretty strict about what I could eat and how much. It allowed less food than a CR diet would. At 180 pounds (81kg) I ate less than 1000 calories per day. The Atkins diet had a lot of fat in the meat I was eating. The Zone diet had little meat and what it allowed was extra lean.

Perhaps you kicked in the protectiveness of a CR diet on the Zone? If you'd been that low calorie on Atkins, I wonder what would have happened?

My own Atkins experience was the triglycerides dropped hugely, and they were a problem before, LDL increased slightly and HDL increased a lot.
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  #18   ^
Old Sun, Dec-10-06, 13:07
kebaldwin kebaldwin is offline
Thank you Dr Atkins!
Posts: 4,146
 
Plan: Atkins induction
Stats: 311/250/220 Male 6 feet
BF:45%/20%/15%
Progress: 67%
Location: North Carolina
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when i was eating high carb my cholestorol was around 300 and triglycerides were like 500.

Two months after starting Atkins diet (with supplements) my colesterol was down to 150 and triglycerides were down to 140. Latest (after 3.5 years) triglycerides were less than 100 and cholesterol had gone back up to around 180. I hear that the best cholesterol levels are around 200.

I eat about 3,500 calories per day - try for zero carbs. I don't eat veggies or fruit - But I take supplements (high quality multi-vitamin, 4 g mega fish oil per day, etc).
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  #19   ^
Old Tue, Dec-12-06, 23:38
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
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Whoa182, I think you are missing one important thing regarding your extremely low and potentially hazardous total cholesterol number.

Cholesterol is a precursor for all hormones. If you have low cholesterol you will have low hormone output. Cholesterol is the building blocks of all hormones, simple as that.
I did not notice in your posts if you were a male ,but low testoterone can lead to cardiovascular disease and other life threatning conditions and we all know what low estrogen can do to women as they age.

Another thing that must be noted is that people with low cholestrol have the same amount of heart attacks as people with high cholesterol. So we can conclude that there must be another factor in this equation..

SYSTEMIC INFLAMMATION MY FRIEND.

It is showing to be the main culprit in just about every disease process.

So what we all should be doing is worrying on how we can control inflammation and stop worrying about cholesterol.
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  #20   ^
Old Tue, Dec-12-06, 23:42
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
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Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
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oh I forgot to mention, I've talked to some doctors who say that some of their patients who are on cholesterol lowering meds(statins) show through blood work, a reduction of male or female hormones.

so what is the allopathic remedy?

Put them on artificial hormone replacment therapy!!!!

is that just the craziest thing ever?

Why not get rid of the statins?
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  #21   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 05:39
kebaldwin kebaldwin is offline
Thank you Dr Atkins!
Posts: 4,146
 
Plan: Atkins induction
Stats: 311/250/220 Male 6 feet
BF:45%/20%/15%
Progress: 67%
Location: North Carolina
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Gostrydr:

Where were you on some of these other threads? Glad to see someone understands the importance of cholesterol, hormones, and the dangers of inflammation.

I tried to explain this to some other people. They did not understood the connections between diet, nutrition, inflammation and how many different ways that inflammation ravages your body.

I think the thread was about arthritis. I was trying to explain that if you have an inflammation disease (like arthritis) - you had better get your inflammation under control before you start seeing all the other inflammation diseases pop up.

They were trying to say that arthritis caused all these other inflammation diseases. And I was trying to say - no inflammation causes arthritis and all these other inflammation diseases.

I think that most on this forum understand low carb and insulin. But beyond that - we have a lot of work to do.

Sorry to hijack this thread. It was about cholesterol.
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  #22   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 06:22
Whoa182's Avatar
Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 1,770
 
Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
BF:very low
Progress: 100%
Location: Cardiff
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Quote:
Whoa182, I think you are missing one important thing regarding your extremely low and potentially hazardous total cholesterol number.

Cholesterol is a precursor for all hormones. If you have low cholesterol you will have low hormone output. Cholesterol is the building blocks of all hormones, simple as that.


Yes I know what cholesterol is for... and the cholesterol we need is manufactured for us.

Quote:
I did not notice in your posts if you were a male ,but low testoterone can lead to cardiovascular disease and other life threatning conditions and we all know what low estrogen can do to women as they age.


Its simple, I will not get heart disease, period.

Quote:
Another thing that must be noted is that people with low cholestrol have the same amount of heart attacks as people with high cholesterol. So we can conclude that there must be another factor in this equation..


I'm on the very low end for every possible risk factor in heart disease... which ever one you want to look at. I am virtually protected from it.
http://mednewsarchive.wustl.edu/med...6256E76005D51F6

Quote:
SYSTEMIC INFLAMMATION MY FRIEND.

It is showing to be the main culprit in just about every disease process.

So what we all should be doing is worrying on how we can control inflammation and stop worrying about cholesterol


Totally agree... just got a CRP value back from my doctor and showed my CRP at 0.3mg/L (0.03mg/dL) - virtually no inflammation. My WBC is also 4.0 which also indicates very low inflammation
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  #23   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 09:03
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
Progress:
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Kebaldwin, No I'm new to this site as of last nite!(hey a poem).

Inflammation is our bodies first defense agianst infection ,it is a natural process. But due to genetics,bad diet, environmental "posions" when inflammation goes awry, it can be devastating. It has been linked to cancer,cardiovascular disease,lupus,fibromyalgia,arthritis,alzheimers,asthama..and a whole lotmore.

Whoa182. I have never come across a person who is that sure of their chances of staving off disease. You can never be sure. I have experienced frieds dropping dead of heart attacks who were nationally recognized athletes.

I myself, a person who's blood work was always great,was never overweight,excercised and ate pretty well had a battle with cancer a few years back.

I am now also prediabetic.

So don't ever think you are in the "clear" when it comes to health. Hell a bump in the night could change things in an instant.
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  #24   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 09:08
Whoa182's Avatar
Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 1,770
 
Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
BF:very low
Progress: 100%
Location: Cardiff
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Quote:
Whoa182. I have never come across a person who is that sure of their chances of staving off disease. You can never be sure. I have experienced frieds dropping dead of heart attacks who were nationally recognized athletes.


Because I have decades of evidence that back up my optimism. Optimism is good by itself too... Diet is better at protecting from heart disease than being an athlete.

But why my optimism?

CRP 0.3 mg/L - I have hardly any inflammation in my body
White Blood Count 4.0 - Another indicator of very low inflammation
Fasting Glucose of 81mg/dl - Another thing implicated in heart disease
Very high insulin sensitivty - Higher than most athletes
Very lean - Heart disease rises with every increase in BMI
Normal-high bilirubin - Protects from heart disease
Very low triglycerides - Alternates between 35-50mg/dl
Very low cholesterl (109mg) - no one has ever died of a heart attack in the framingham study with cholesterol below < 150mg/dl
I practice CR - Virtually ameliorates heart disease in every organism tested
Very low blood pressure 90/60 - protecing me from stroke associated with low cholesterol, and protecting me from ischemic stroke.

Last edited by Whoa182 : Wed, Dec-13-06 at 09:55.
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  #25   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 09:54
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
Progress:
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from Cnn


Risk comparisons

Tirschwell studied 587 victims of ischemic strokes and 137 victims of hemorrhagic strokes and compared them to 3,743 healthy people. Among the findings:

--People with cholesterol over 280 were twice as likely as those at 230, the group's average, to have an ischemic stroke.

--People with cholesterol under 180 had double the risk of those at 230 for a hemorrhagic stroke.

--High cholesterol probably accounts for 10 percent to 15 percent of ischemic strokes. Low cholesterol is the cause of perhaps 7 percent of hemorrhagic strokes.

"Our data imply that for stroke, an optimal level may be around 200," Tirschwell said.

http://www.imakenews.com/bioanalogi...SMwM,b2D446ls,w

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2006...rt_heart_01.htm

I know, I know there are studies to the contrary,but there is such an overwhelming amount of evidence done by researchers other than drug companies who are coming around to the fact that cholesterol is not as important of a factor as once believed as a marker for heart disease.

Have you read Colpos the Great Cholesterol Con? How about Nourishing Traditions?
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  #26   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 09:54
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,842
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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I was just reading about something called Postprandial Dislipidemia, or something similar to that. It is where your body doesn't clear fat quickly after a meal. The doctor said taking fish oil at meal time can help wtih that.

Again, not sure if that'll help your cholesterol score, but it should help with artery blockages which is what we're really trying to accomplish here, isn't it?
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  #27   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 09:57
Whoa182's Avatar
Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 1,770
 
Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
BF:very low
Progress: 100%
Location: Cardiff
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gostrydr
from Cnn

--People with cholesterol under 180 had double the risk of those at 230 for a hemorrhagic stroke.

--High cholesterol probably accounts for 10 percent to 15 percent of ischemic strokes. Low cholesterol is the cause of perhaps 7 percent of hemorrhagic strokes.


Sorry I forgot to add this

I have very low blood pressure 90/60 - protecing me from stroke associated with low cholesterol, and protecting me from ischemic stroke.

Japan experienced high number of hemorrhagic strokes because they tended to have low cholesteorl but high blood pressure. okinawa ate little salt, have low blood pressure and low total cholesterol 150-170mg/dl and have the lowest rates of stroke in the world. both types

If you want me to back this up with references, let me know. If you think about it though, it makes sense... If your blood pressure isn't causing damage to the arteries, then why need high cholesterol?

Last edited by Whoa182 : Wed, Dec-13-06 at 10:15.
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  #28   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 10:35
ProfGumby's Avatar
ProfGumby ProfGumby is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,927
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 361/285.0/240.0 Male 5'11"
BF:Shake Hands w/Beef
Progress: 63%
Location: In Da U.P. eh? Menominee
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I think part of the problem here whoa, is you seem to be under the impression that what works for you must be followed by everyone...or else.

Also, I admire your positive attitude and confidence in your health, abilities and knowledge.

That being said, if you come on too strong and you could be construed as confrontational, arrogant and opinionated.

And, for what it is worth, be wary of blowing your own horn so loud about your excellent test results. It is off putting to those who may be stuggling and life has a funny way of sneaking up and MFing a braggard.

I might sugest the book, "how to win friends and influence people", it will go a long way in your life's quest to help people.

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  #29   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 10:48
Whoa182's Avatar
Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 1,770
 
Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
BF:very low
Progress: 100%
Location: Cardiff
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Good points ProfGumby... I'm not trying to be arrogant, but looking back at some of the posts I can see how its interpreted that way.

My idea is that High cholesterol isn't bad in all cases, low cholesterol isn't bad in all cases. Its a complex issue where many studies will shows different things, such as those things I mentioend in my previous post with the glucose, bp, cholesterol, wbc, crp and so on. If you fall into a healthy low risk range for all of them, no matter where you look or which theory you believe in, the outlook is very good.
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  #30   ^
Old Wed, Dec-13-06, 10:59
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,842
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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Cajunboy, have you read this? http://heartscanblog.blogspot.com/s...ortune%20teller

This cardiologist says that cholesterol readings, as they're currently done, are pretty much worthless. At least the LDL number is. The HDL and triglyceride numbers are not worthless.

Read this guys blog and I think you'll see that the thing you SHOULD be concerned about is your LP-a cholesterol, your HDL and your Triglycerides (TG), and of course, the actual status of your arteries.

I just think that fussing over LDL numbers is a waste of time and energy.

I spent the evening reading this guys entire blog. I don't agree with him on everything but I think he's headed in the right direction.

Quote:
Don't even try predicting your future from your cholesterol numbers--it simply can't be done. Every day, I see patients and physicians beating their heads over this dilemma. Telling your fortune using pretended occult powers is illegal. Telling your fortune using cholesterol numbers should be, too.
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