Diabet Med. 2005 Jun;22(6):808-11. ~ Avoiding milk is
associated with a reduced risk of insulin resistance and the
metabolic syndrome: findings from the British Women's Heart
and Health Study.

Lawlor DA, Ebrahim S, Timpson N, Davey Smith G.

Department of Social Medicine, University of Bristol, Canynge
Hall, Bristol, UK.

Objective To examine the association of milk consumption with
insulin resistance and the metabolic syndrome. Methods The
association was examined in 4024 British women aged 60-79 who
were randomly selected from primary care centres in 23 towns.
Results Women who never drank milk had lower homeostasis model
assessment insulin resistance (HOMA) scores, triglyceride
concentrations and body mass indices, and higher high-density
lipoprotein (HDL)-cholesterol concentrations, than those who
drank milk. The age-adjusted odds ratio for the metabolic
syndrome comparing non-milk drinkers with drinkers was 0.55
(0.33, 0.94), which did not attenuate with adjustment for
potential confounders. Diabetes was less common in non-milk
drinkers. Conclusion Individuals who do not drink milk may be
protected against insulin resistance and the metabolic
syndrome. However, randomized controlled trials are required
to establish whether milk avoidance is causally associated
with these outcomes. Diabet. Med. 22, 808-811 (2005).

PMID: 1591063

Kev wrote:
  > Diabet Med. 2005 Jun;22(6):808-11.
  >
  > Avoiding milk is

Are you a brain dead shill for that other idiot?

Simm Webb wrote:
  > Kev wrote:
     > > Diabet Med. 2005 Jun;22(6):808-11.
     > >
     > > Avoiding milk is
  >
  > Are you a brain dead shill for that other idiot?

Are you a brain dead shill for the dairy interests?

I avoid milk a long time now, 5 years? or so. It drives my BG
up. 1 up of milk has minimum 13 gr sugar, more they take out,
2%-1%- no-fat milk, the more sugar is put in. No-fat milk has
17-18gr sugar per cup. Too much for a diabetic. Goat milk,
yogurt is the lowest, 6-7 gr sugar/carb per 1 cup, half what
cow milk has. JS

"Kev" <kevinrog~aol.com> wrote in message
news:BEBF2018.30003%kevinrog~aol.com...
  > Diabet Med. 2005 Jun;22(6):808-11.
  >
  > Avoiding milk is associated with a reduced risk of insulin
  > resistance and the metabolic syndrome: findings from the
  > British Women's Heart and Health Study.
  >
  > Lawlor DA, Ebrahim S, Timpson N, Davey Smith G.
  >
  > Department of Social Medicine, University of Bristol,
  > Canynge Hall, Bristol, UK.
  >
  > Objective To examine the association of milk consumption
  > with insulin resistance and the metabolic syndrome. Methods
  > The association was examined in 4024 British women aged
  > 60-79 who were randomly selected from primary care centres
  > in 23 towns. Results Women who never drank milk had lower
  > homeostasis model assessment insulin resistance (HOMA)
  > scores, triglyceride concentrations and body mass indices,
  > and higher high-density lipoprotein (HDL)-cholesterol
  > concentrations, than those who drank milk. The age-adjusted
  > odds ratio for the metabolic syndrome comparing non-milk
  > drinkers with drinkers was 0.55 (0.33, 0.94), which did not
  > attenuate with adjustment for potential confounders.
  > Diabetes was less common in non-milk drinkers. Conclusion
  > Individuals who do not drink milk may be protected against
  > insulin resistance and the metabolic syndrome. However,
  > randomized controlled trials are required to establish
  > whether milk avoidance is causally associated with these
  > outcomes. Diabet. Med. 22, 808-811 (2005).
  >
  > PMID: 1591063

banmilk~hotmail.com wrote:
  >
  > Simm Webb wrote:
  >
     >>Kev wrote:
     >>
       >>>Diabet Med. 2005 Jun;22(6):808-11.
       >>>
       >>>Avoiding milk is
     >>
     >>Are you a brain dead shill for that other idiot?
  >
  >
  > Are you a brain dead shill for the dairy interests?
  >
Hmmm.

Kick a mouldy wall, and lots of cockroaches seem to
scurry out.

On Mon, 30 May 2005 09:34:32 +1000, Ozgirl wrote in <news:429-
a51d7$0$17002$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.net> on
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition :

  > Enrico C wrote:
     >> On Sun, 29 May 2005 14:49:36 -0700, Szaki wrote in
     >> <news:8dmdnZwI45lopQffRVn-jg~comcast.com> on
     >> alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition
  >:
     >>
       >>> No-fat milk has 17-18gr sugar per cup.
     >>
     >>
     >> The USDA data base (Milk, non fat, fluid) says 12g per
  > cup.
     >>
     >> http://www.calorie-count.com/calories/item/1151.html
  >
  > Non fat milk varies from brand to brand re carb counts.

I would expect that USDA computes an average of the main
brands...

X'Posted to:
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition

--
Enrico C
==================================

On Sun, 29 May 2005 17:32:17 -0700, Szaki wrote in
<news:UY-dnaiSpp-LwgffRVn-tQ~comcast.com> on
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition :

  > "Enrico C" <use_replyto_address~despammed.com> wrote in
  > message news:1t350i3dtf06j$.dlg~news.lillathedog.net...
     >> On Sun, 29 May 2005 14:49:36 -0700, Szaki wrote in
     >> <news:8dmdnZwI45lopQffRVn-jg~comcast.com> on alt.health.d-
     >> iabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition :
     >>
       >>> No-fat milk has 17-18gr sugar per cup.
     >>
     >>
     >> The USDA data base (Milk, non fat, fluid) says 12g per cup.
     >>
     >> http://www.calorie-count.com/calories/item/1151.html
     >>
     >>
     >>
  > Go to the store and look it the containers label, smarty!

I will... but I can only tell you about stores in Rome, Italy,
where I live
  

  > Milk has to "TASTE GOOD" for kids, so the more fat they take
  > out, other stuff has to go in, otherwise taste like water.

I see... Anyway, if there are brands with lower contents, just
buy those, not the "tasty" ones.

Ozgirl said she has seen "between 12 gr and 18 gr carb per 250
ml cup. 6 "

And if you don't really need "non fat", why not use "low
fat" instead?

X'Posted to:
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition

--
Enrico C
==================================

In article
<429a86b3$0$37514$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.net>,
Ozgirl <youse~privacy.net> wrote:
  >George Lagergren wrote:
     >> "Szaki" <szaki10~comcast.net> wrote:
       >>> Go to the store and look it the containers label, smarty!
       >>> Milk has to "TASTE GOOD" for kids, so the more fat they
  >take out,
       >>> other stuff has to go in, otherwise taste like water.
     >>
     >> So what other stuff is put in low-fat cow's milk?
  >
  >It is bulked out with lactose so it doesn't seem so watery
  >and insipid. That's why skimmed milk has more carbs than full
  >fat milk.

Are you sure about the lactose? The source I found said "milk
solids", which didn't seem like quite the same thing.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "I don't
need someone to tell me that George W. Bush is a deceitful,
corrupt, clever and destructive man--that's pretty clear on
the face of it." -- Garrison Keillor

In article <vze23t8n-CC8CEA.17105730052005~news.verizon.net>,
Priscilla Ballou <vze23t8n~verizon.net> wrote:
  >In article <O4Kme.1159$iA6.764~newssvr19.news.prodigy.com>,
  >wright~l1000.prodigy.net (David Wright) wrote:
  >
     >> In article
     >> <429a86b3$0$37514$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.net>,
     >> Ozgirl <youse~privacy.net> wrote:
     >> >George Lagergren wrote:
     >> >> "Szaki" <szaki10~comcast.net> wrote:
     >> >>> Go to the store and look it the containers label,
     >> >>> smarty! Milk has to "TASTE GOOD" for kids, so the more
     >> >>> fat they
     >> >take out,
     >> >>> other stuff has to go in, otherwise taste like water.
     >> >>
     >> >> So what other stuff is put in low-fat cow's milk?
     >> >
     >> >It is bulked out with lactose so it doesn't seem so watery
     >> >and insipid. That's why skimmed milk has more carbs than
     >> >full fat milk.
     >>
     >> Are you sure about the lactose? The source I found said
     >> "milk solids", which didn't seem like quite the same thing.
  >
  >If "milk solids" is dehydrated skimmed milk, then I would
  >expect it to contain a fair amount of lactose.

I'm not arguing that -- but it's not the same as just dumping
pure lactose into milk, which seemed to be the claim.

-- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net These are my
opinions only, but they're almost always correct. "I don't
need someone to tell me that George W. Bush is a deceitful,
corrupt, clever and destructive man--that's pretty clear on
the face of it." -- Garrison Keillor

Enrico C wrote:
  > On Mon, 30 May 2005 09:34:32 +1000, Ozgirl wrote in
  >
<news:429a51d7$0$17002$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.ne
t> on
  > alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition
  :
  >
     >> Enrico C wrote:
       >>> On Sun, 29 May 2005 14:49:36 -0700, Szaki wrote in
       >>> <news:8dmdnZwI45lopQffRVn-jg~comcast.com> on
       >>>
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition
     >>:
       >>>
       >>>> No-fat milk has 17-18gr sugar per cup.
       >>>
       >>>
       >>> The USDA data base (Milk, non fat, fluid) says 12g per
     >> cup.
       >>>
       >>> http://www.calorie-count.com/calories/item/1151.html
     >>
     >> Non fat milk varies from brand to brand re carb counts.
  >
  > I would expect that USDA computes an average of the main
brands...

Whatever, but one important point is that when type 2's are
highly insulin resistant, every gr of carb counts towards
control or not. There was a time when I was highly resistant
when a difference of 5 gr carb made a lot of difference. So I
feel under those circumstances it is preferable to get an
exact carb count i.e.directly off a label of the actual
product you are using. I prefer to be a bit anal and preserve
any remaining beta cells. I also don't think it coincidence
that the anal type 2's I know aren't "progressing" over the
years. I am one who doesn't beleive that type 2 diabetes has
to be progressive. With good care and adherence to a carb
amount per meal that doesn't allow spiking I feel that type 2
can be halted in it's progression. So while this debate over a
few carbs might seem insignificant, to those who are proving
to themselves that every carb does count, it is rather more
significant. Having said that, I don't spend all my time
thinking about what to eat, it's like driving, once you know
how to do it it becomes second nature. I barely a give a
thought to my diabetes apart from an odd day of testing here
and there and an annual eye test and endo visit for labs.

Enrico C wrote:

  > Ozgirl said she has seen "between 12 gr and 18 gr carb per
  > 250 ml cup. 6 "
  >
  > And if you don't really need "non fat", why not use "low
fat" instead?

Low fat or non fat both have added non fat milk solids added.
Which means more lactose and depending on the resulting milk
required it can be significant - i.e. the difference between
getting a 12 gr per cup milk and an 18 gr cup. For the amount
of milk I drink I wouldn't be bothered about the amount of
cholesterol per cup in full fat but I hate the taste of full
fat, to me it is like drinking cream. The advantage of full
fat, if you don't mind the creaminess, is that fat can help to
flatten any spike you might get plus you probably wouldn't
need to check the labels between brands as I have found full
fat milk to have pretty much the same carb count per cup
whatever the brand.

In article <O4Kme.1159$iA6.764~newssvr19.news.prodigy.com>,
wright~l1000.prodigy.net (David Wright) wrote:

  > In article
  > <429a86b3$0$37514$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.net>,
  > Ozgirl <youse~privacy.net> wrote:
     > >George Lagergren wrote:
     > >> "Szaki" <szaki10~comcast.net> wrote:
     > >>> Go to the store and look it the containers label,
     > >>> smarty! Milk has to "TASTE GOOD" for kids, so the more
     > >>> fat they
     > >take out,
     > >>> other stuff has to go in, otherwise taste like water.
     > >>
     > >> So what other stuff is put in low-fat cow's milk?
     > >
     > >It is bulked out with lactose so it doesn't seem so watery
     > >and insipid. That's why skimmed milk has more carbs than
     > >full fat milk.
  >
  > Are you sure about the lactose? The source I found said
  > "milk solids", which didn't seem like quite the same thing.

If "milk solids" is dehydrated skimmed milk, then I would
expect it to contain a fair amount of lactose.

Priscilla
--
"Inside every older person is a younger person -- wondering
what the hell happened." -- Cora Harvey Armstrong

On Mon, 30 May 2005 22:20:49 +1000, Ozgirl wrote in <news:429-
b057d$0$17052$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.net> on
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition :

  > Enrico C wrote:
  >
     >> Ozgirl said she has seen "between 12 gr and 18 gr carb per
     >> 250 ml cup. 6 "
     >>
     >> And if you don't really need "non fat", why not use "low
  > fat" instead?
  >
  > Low fat or non fat both have added non fat milk solids
  > added. Which means more lactose and depending on the
  > resulting milk required it can be significant - i.e. the
  > difference between getting a 12 gr per cup milk and an 18 gr
  > cup. For the amount of milk I drink I wouldn't be bothered
  > about the amount of cholesterol per cup in full fat but I
  > hate the taste of full fat, to me it is like drinking cream.
  > The advantage of full fat, if you don't mind the creaminess,
  > is that fat can help to flatten any spike you might get plus
  > you probably wouldn't need to check the labels between
  > brands as I have found full fat milk to have pretty much the
  > same carb count per cup whatever the brand.

Besides, "full fat" should be a better source for vitamins and
minerals...

I personally think "reduced fat" (1,5-2% fat...) is the best
compromise between taste and nutrients, and fat.

X'Posted to:
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition

X'Posted to:
alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition

--
Enrico C

Enrico C wrote:
  > On Mon, 30 May 2005 22:20:49 +1000, Ozgirl wrote in
  >
<news:429b057d$0$17052$892e7fe2~authen.white.readfreenews.ne
t> on
  > alt.health.diabetes,misc.health.diabetes,sci.med.nutrition
  :
  >
     >> Enrico C wrote:
     >>
       >>> Ozgirl said she has seen "between 12 gr and 18 gr carb per
       >>> 250 ml cup. 6 "
       >>>
       >>> And if you don't really need "non fat", why not use "low
     >> fat" instead?
     >>
     >> Low fat or non fat both have added non fat milk solids
     >> added. Which means more lactose and depending on the
     >> resulting milk required it can be significant - i.e. the
     >> difference between getting a 12 gr per cup milk and an 18
gr
     >> cup. For the amount of milk I drink I wouldn't be
bothered
     >> about the amount of cholesterol per cup in full fat but I
     >> hate the taste of full fat, to me it is like drinking
cream.
     >> The advantage of full fat, if you don't mind the
creaminess,
     >> is that fat can help to flatten any spike you might get
plus
     >> you probably wouldn't need to check the labels between
     >> brands as I have found full fat milk to have pretty much
the
     >> same carb count per cup whatever the brand.
  >
  > Besides, "full fat" should be a better source for vitamins
and
  > minerals...
  >
  > I personally think "reduced fat" (1,5-2% fat...) is the
best
  > compromise between taste and nutrients, and fat.

Well they add vitamin D to full fat milk as well but low fat
milks have to have added vitamin A as well and of course the
milk solids but I doubt there's any problem with that, makes
the price of low fat milk more though. When my 15 yr old was
born he vomited up breast milk so we tried cows milk formula,
he did the same, we tried straight milk with water and lactose
and same, ditto soy milk formula. He was very underweight and
allergy tested. Strangely he had no problem with the raw milk
test, only the pastuerised milk. No one could tell me why. He
ended up on an artificial formula of all sorts of oils and
sugars for 1 year, so expensive I had to get Govt permission
to buy it subsidised. he grew out of his food intolerances by
age 2, luckily. Wheat was another, as in wheat type breakfast
cereals but not white bread. Walking through perfume sections
of dept stores caused his eyes to puff and water.

"Simm Webb" <edvanhuffel~csx.net> wrote in message
news:OuPme.61891$sy6.37285~lakeread04...
  > David Wright wrote:>>full fat milk.
     > >
     > >
     > > Are you sure about the lactose? The source I found said
     > > "milk solids", which didn't seem like quite the same
     > > thing.
     > >
     > > -- David Wright :: alphabeta at prodigy.net
  >
  > A group of have done a definitive study regarding lactose
  > intolerance. In our research, we have discovered a mu factor
  > which is the direct cause of rejection of milk substances.
  > Currently we are working to develop a mu blocker or mu
  > inhibiter which will again make milk available to people
  > with problems. However, it is difficult to isolate and
  > separate the mu from a cow, and will take some time to
  > provide answers for this group.
  >
  > mu is the greek m
Isn't it the sound that cows make? Are you sure it's not
spelled Moo.