It's not a question of whether or not they can. The question becomes will they? Vegetable shortening is cheap and extends the shelf life of the product so manufacturers don't have a lot of motivation to switch to a non-transfat formula unless the consumers begin demanding it and stop buying their product because of it. With government regulations looming that will soon begin requireing manufacturers to list the amount of transfat in a product, some are beginning to change their formulations now but not many.
Even if they were to remove the transfats, it still leaves us with a product that contains high fructose corn syrup and highly refined white flour...two more things that the Atkins plan says to avoid.



The difference is that the majority of pork rinds on the market (read the labels, folks...some are fried in partially hydrogenated oils) don't contain transfats while Ritz crackers currently do. While pork rinds (fried in oil that is not partially hydrogenated) are not on the "allowed" list, they do still meet with the principle of Atkins being 0 carb (for the unflavored ones) and not containing any ingredient forbidden. Still...pork rinds are terribly high in sodium and something that I might eat once or twice a year at most. There are far better things for me to snack on than a product that is guaranteed to cause me at least a couple of pounds of water retention.

For more information on transfats read here:
http://atkins.com/Archive/2002/6/21-900677.html
http://atkins.com/Archive/2001/12/15-513651.html

Pork rinds are actually approved on induction, if they are cooked naturally (just pork skin, and maybe salt).

"All meat
including ..... pork,"

That's what a pork rind is-- it's pork (leftover skin), deep fried.

The reason so maybe Atkins folks eat them (not me-- yuck) is that they are approved foods.

you don't think 3 Ritz that William is eating has an impact? How 'bout 84 of them per month [and probably much more on some, or most.... or even possibly all days, if we're going to be realistic here] or isn't the thought of just even the minimum of 84 per month enough for you to grasp as an ''impact''? lol. I'm still waiting to hear how many ARE in a box.... could be 84 and he's eating a WHOLE box of Ritz crackers every month... on ATKINS? That would be astounding on ANY 'diet' much less Atkins. You don't think thats significant? Think again *smile*

Also, who said pork rinds weren't allowed? That IS the staple of this diet's 'snack' munchie alternative, and always has been since 1972.... for only over 30 years! read the ''original'' book. He himself told ME to eat them when I was in my early teens or just entering them, and went to him with my mother for her diabetes, and just started as his patient. OF COURSE pork rinds are legal. The most legal and popular thing there always has been on his diet.

I have been buying them by the case that I found on the internet, since this time around back strictly on atkins for my diabetes. They are plain [don't ever get the other flavors] and although I AM sick of them, especially eating them throughout all my years growing up on this way of eating and INTO my adulthood.... but thank god for them for putting in my soup/broth with parmisian and a dab of sour cream, or whenever needing a crunch badly [with cream cheese that I've flavored myself], with chedder and other hard cheeses, my soy butter [experimenting lately with as a replacement for peanut butter] and a million other uses.

And yes, I do agree that it would be a simple thing to leave trans fats out of Ritz and everything else that they would have to leave out of it.... but they would no longer be the ritz that all know and love, just like adding them into Atkins diet ceases to make it "Atkins" anymore. Ritz is a VERY fatty cracker, it practically OOOOZES grease, that's it's characteristic. Just like NOT allowing things like that is ATKINS characteristic, tampering with either transforms it into something else entirely. They'd lose a fortune from the general public who has a lot of catching up to do with health and nutrition. And it's a very risky and unprofitable proposition to experiment with a second version out on the market... especially if it fails... and we are still in the minority of the rest of the world.

Could someone please explain to me what is meant by "refeeds"? I'm not familiar with Atkins, except in a general way. I am a diabetic who follows Dr. Bernstein's low carb plan as described in his book Dr. Bernstein's Diabetes Solution, and I've never come across that term before. Thanks.

Karen

I've never heard that expression either, Karen.... not in all the years since 72 when Atkins first book came out nor in any discussions of Bernstein either, and not until on this very thread lol.... would also love to know. I am assuming it's a 'cheating day' from what i've gathered from reading here, but it's not a word from Atkins itself. Just something that was adopted on this thread I'm assuming? Haven't seen it on any of the other threads, nor any other sites. Would also love to know the origin of the actual wordm if it can be explained to both of us *smile*. Thanks [PS... i just received Bernstein's book in the mail, and waiting for his new one on diet for diabetes, which is not out yet and on backorder for september arrival. Would love to discuss it if you'd ever like to PM me. Thanks.

I've just tried to pm you, Mamzelle, but my message was too long. (Does that mean I talk too much?) I've now sent you a short pm giving you my e-mail address so you can contact me that way if you'd like to carry on our discussion of Dr. Bernstein.

Karen D.

"Refeeds" or "Carb-up days" are used primarily by those following the CKD program. A true Carb up day is primarily sugar and very low fat for the purpose of replenishing the muscle's glycogen stores and is then followed by several days of heavy weight training while following a very low carb diet. It's a body building program.
There is also a theory that a carb up day can replenish Leptin stores and jump start weight loss when a stall occurs and some have been using it for that purpose but instead of making it high sugar/low fat, most people just eat whatever they please for a day or so which doesn't follow any established formula that I'm aware of. The closest thing I can think of in an established plan is the Carbohydrate Addict's Diet which allows one "reward meal" per day, but even that meal is to be balanced as 1/3 protein, 1/3 vegetable and 1/3 high carb food. If seconds are desired, they must be balanced as the first helping was (ie no having 3 desserts without also having 3 servings of protein and 3 servings of vegetable).
Do a forum search for "Refeed", "Carb up" and/or "Leptin" and you'll probably find quite a few threads on the subject.

re - Atkins and "refeeds" ..

In the 1992 and 1999 editions of Dr Atkins' New Diet Revolution, he mentions eating very high-carbs/low- to no-fat as a method of giving in to cravings in a planned, controlled manner in order to stave off an all-out binge. He called it "Breaking With Intent", and it's in the chapter on lifetime lowcarbing in the Real World, for later stages of OWL and Maintenance. You can read more about this in a previous thread in the Atkins forum .. Reversal Diet?.

Unfortunately, many readers misinterpreted this to be a "stall buster" method and it has often been tossed about as such. AFAIK, there is no mention of this "reversal diet" in any later editions of Atkins' books. The reversal diet was NEVER intended to be a stall breaker. It was simply offered as a way to deal with cravings in a controlled manner, then get right back to low-carbing. Atkins also made it very clear that this was not to be indulged in regularly, as there are serious metabolic consequences to such yo-yo'ing back and forth.

He also stressed that any reversal diet MUST be just that, a complete reversal If you absolutely must have high carbs (temporarily) then you must also keep it very low fat. High carbs and high fat are a deadly mix.

(note - as Lisa mentioned above, in the case of the CKD - Cyclic Ketogenic Diet - the metabolic effects of alternating between high-carbs/low-fat and high-fat/low-carb diet are controlled by a carefully planned regimen of exercise, including intense weightlifting and cardio).


Doreen

That's very interesting. Thank you. I never heard it referred to that but have been doing it through all the years and
even forgot that Atkins himself recommended it lol, maybe it WAS in my subconsience from back in those days
because it always worked for me to just go OFF the diet for a few days or even a week, to ''jump-start'' it, which is
what I always called it, and have always suggested to everyone I knew who was stalled, to do the same just from
having accidently done it myself the first time, and having great results.

I've never done it in an orginaized way, nor consciously planning what to eat.... just took advange of the things I
missed the most and it didn't create nor lead to binging, luckily, but I prefer real foods, protein etc., to sweets
anyway so had no problem.... I ate pasta, eggplant parmisian, and things like that, Oh, and of course my favorite
chocolate ice cream out at the time, and dark semi-sweet chocolate [my favorite] so I didn't do it correctly, I now
see, but I do know 'reversing' it always worked... and what fun.... one would almost WISH to get stalled lol

I didn't add high fats to it mainly because I was sick of them and ONLY wanted to eat the foods I missed, unlike more
curbed 'maintenance'. Things like bacon and such I stayed away from just to have new foods but also always
having known that high carbs with high fat *IS* deadly. Now though, I can't do that anymore, because of my high
sugar and not being able to 'reverse' at all because I'm afraid to touch any of those things, and forgot what ice cream
and chocolate even taste like, and things like large doses of tomatoes, tomatoe sauces, onions, etc., would now be
my only splurges, but I don't even do that anymore.

I'm not concerned with weight, just my sugar condition, which is the main reason that I'm on it so strictly again,
staying on induction for months so far. I DID try Dreamfields pasta [5 grams per 2 oz. and even ate larger
portions than that] and ragu's carb options italian w/sausage [and their alfredo and cheddar cheese sauce... even a
little lower in carbs] and ate that every day for a week and lost 5 lbs., but was afraid to push it till I hear more info on
it. It was just too good to be true, but am going to try some again soon and have 11 lbs of it in my house and 9 jars of
the sauces in those assorted flavors, but am a little hesitant. Don't know why, I shouldn't be since it worked great
the first time.... I'm just terrified of 'everything' these days.

That was very comprehensive information. Thank you both, Karen will love it too, I'm sure. I don't know if I posted
the article on ''why we should be eating fats'' on this board, but will check. It's the best I've read so far, and also
extremely comprehensive and especially so understandable for the layperson. I know I posted it 'somewhere'.
Actually, I 'will' follow your guidlines of balance, If I ever do a refeed, or 'jump start' again. Wonder though, if it does
apply to diabetics. Better be careful. I'll save and file both of your posts. Again, thank you.

It's a shame that Atkins' "DIABETIC Revolution'' is coming out AFTER he's gone [Wednesday] and by someone else.
He was mainly a diabetic specialist when my mother and I went to him [long before I developed it] and a cardiologist,
but never put out a book on diabetes in all these years. Very strange because it IS so related to his diet, and what he
developed it FOR basically.

Quote: Mamzelle,
That's very interesting. Thank you. I never heard it referred to that but have been doing it through all the years and even forgot that Atkins himself recommended it lol, maybe it WAS in my subconscious from back in those days because it always worked for me to just go OFF the diet for a few days or even a week, to ''jump-start'' it, which is what I always called it, and have always suggested to everyone I knew who was stalled, to do the same just from having accidentally done it myself the first time, and having great results.

I've never done it in an organized way, nor consciously planning what to eat.... just took advantage of the things I missed the most and it didn't create nor lead to binging, luckily, but I prefer real foods, protein etc., to sweets anyway so had no problem.... I ate pasta, eggplant parmisian, and things like that, Oh, and of course my favorite chocolate ice cream out at the time, and dark semi-sweet chocolate [my favorite] so I didn't do it correctly, I now see, but I do know 'reversing' it always worked... and what fun.... one would almost WISH to get stalled lol

Mamzelle, thank you, thank you, thank you!!!

Finally someone other than a body builder who supports a “Refeed - Carb Up - Pig Out - Jump Start - Reversing” method of breaking a stall. I’ve done this twice with wonderful results. Both times breaking a stall and jump starting my weight loss. I simply go to a restaurant for two days and indulge in things that I miss. Never anything sweet, just high carb things like potatoes. After that I go back to my almost induction level + Ritz way of eating. Works for me and I’m about ready to try it again.

William

Thanks for the explanations. It might work for people eating low carb for weight loss or general health reasons, but doesn't sound like a good idea for diabetics like me who are eating this way to control blood sugars.

Karen

William, the "Heavin" diet by Gary Heavin the founder of Curves (workout for women gym) also has a diet something like this, the goal of it is to slowly raise your metabolism level, so you diet (reduced cal or carb your choice) until you lose some pounds then you eat at high levels till you gain 3, then you diet untill you lose those 3 and eat at a higher level again, at some point you diet until you have lost more than the 3 that were lost and then resume the cycle. I only have the small book that was given out free to members of curves, there is a hardcover more detailed book available in stores.

I'd like to make it perfectly clear for anyone who
is new to these boards, lurking, [and might be just
partially scanning and not fully reading each
post], and who might be prediabetic or diabetic that the
quote above is out of context and missing where I
say the rest... that this was through the years
when I was NOT diabetic, and to please read the
full version if liking how that sounds too much
and wanting to try it. NO!!

I do not recommend just going out and buying ice
cream, chocolates, etc., even if just merely on
the 'diet', much less with a high sugar problem! I
had already been doing this diet for many years
and knew it's ups and downs and how things
affected my personal metabolism and weight loss
and this wasn't often, and I repeat... without any
kind of high sugar problem then, [though heavily
in my genes on both sides].

Also, carbs always made me feel HORRIBLE and I
never kept them in the house, and certainly ice
cream, which could tempt me to eat too much
that's why when i did have my 'fix' it was only
when dining out or only the smallest container at
home, and only ONE lol and i dragged that out a
long time but resistance is hard when things are
in the house so I didn't live with large storage of
THOSE things as I do all my healthy household
foods.... even when trying to jolt a stall.

Even if I 'eased up' a bit on the strictness of the
diet, which was only long AFTER induction,
[during... I NEVER did and especially now still
don't, and kept on induction for weeks and
sometimes months, or basically always about
95% as a way of life] it was only like one pint of
ice cream that sat in the freezer for a whole week
with spoonfuls, I mostly ate the healthier carbs to
break the stall, like pasta, other italian foods,
some things breaded in fancy seafood
restaurants [like clams casino, oreganato, etc.]
but not basically sweets. And even that was
after being well into the diet already. [I'm not a
potato, bread, or rice eater so that was never a
problem either.... only really missed pasta].

We never know who could be reading these
things and it could be kids who are diabetic and
think they suddenly have license to run out and
do this with the very handy 'excuse' of a stall....
that is not true.

Just want to make that perfectly clear so no one
gets the wrong impression and feels they now
have a reason to start doing this.
Please stick to what Atkins advises.... he's the
''Doctor'.

Sorry Mamzelle, I only meant to quote what William said, I have edited my post to remove your part of the quote, please forgive.

No, no, no... that's OK, I just thought I should put a disclaimer also for what I originally said, for any young people out there. I didn't mind you quoting me at ALL, nor William, nor even partially. That was fine :-) It just suddenly hit me that young, inexperienced dieters who may HAVE to follow this for medical reasons, might get the wrong impression at what *I* said. You did nothing wrong, nor did William! *smile* Actually, I did it only to cover MY OWN words, nothing that anyone else really did. We ALL do partial quotes. [lol, I wrote a ''quart'' at first by mistake... and changed it to a pint afterwards, but you caught the first version when quoting it again lololol..... not a quart, a PINT. Actually, haven't bought ice cream in SOOO long that i literally forgot that those little ones were pints! :-( You're too fast for me hahaha]