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  #46   ^
Old Sun, Aug-29-04, 12:18
carrottop carrottop is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 390
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 200/190/150 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress:
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Thank you Watcher16. What you say is doable. I will try it and see how it goes.
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  #47   ^
Old Tue, Sep-28-04, 23:14
tmayder tmayder is offline
New Member
Posts: 3
 
Plan: atkins/warrior
Stats: 205/194/140 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 17%
Default Updates, please?

I tried the Warrior Diet for the past week. I didn't buy the book, just tried what I have read about it online. I may have done something wrong, because I gained 2 pounds The good thing I can say about it is that I felt better than I have felt in months.

Before I run out and try to find the book, I was wondering if anybody is still using this plan and what their experience has been so far.

Cheers!
Linda
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  #48   ^
Old Wed, Sep-29-04, 17:10
carrottop carrottop is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 390
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 200/190/150 Female 66 inches
BF:
Progress:
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I too gained weight. Five pounds in a week and I was starving during the day. I decided that my metabolism is too messed up and I am leaning toward Schwartzbein.

I did try Atkins and lost 15 pounds on it but I found that I was jittery on it. I am bipolar and I need something that smooths out my moods.
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  #49   ^
Old Thu, Sep-30-04, 05:08
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmayder
I tried the Warrior Diet for the past week. I didn't buy the book, just tried what I have read about it online. I may have done something wrong, because I gained 2 pounds The good thing I can say about it is that I felt better than I have felt in months.

Before I run out and try to find the book, I was wondering if anybody is still using this plan and what their experience has been so far.

Cheers!
Linda

My experience with women is that some have such strong motivation they can starve themselves. So it maybe if you start feeding right your body will start building muscle and repairing tissue, and if you exercise and eat not too much, lose fat.

My wife and her best friend are exemplary, but now my wife (doing a moderate form of low carb and warrior diet) is loosing her little rest fat, and even the cellulitis.

Her friend is still a bit too fat under the skin all over her body. She is vegetarian btw.
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  #50   ^
Old Thu, Sep-30-04, 05:10
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Im still busy with my belly fat. I saw on Oprah how that looks like on a fat corpse...

Good motivation.

The rest of my body is ok now
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  #51   ^
Old Thu, Sep-30-04, 05:53
serrelind serrelind is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,649
 
Plan: paleoish
Stats: 130/104/105 Female 5'1"
BF:-
Progress: 104%
Location: Florida
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Based on the book Mastering Leptin, Byron Richards said that eating too many calories at once or in a very short period of time will cause an insulin spike and fat storage. Even if you ate mostly fat or protein and little carbs.
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  #52   ^
Old Thu, Sep-30-04, 12:07
tmayder tmayder is offline
New Member
Posts: 3
 
Plan: atkins/warrior
Stats: 205/194/140 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 17%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by watcher16
My experience with women is that some have such strong motivation they can starve themselves. So it maybe if you start feeding right your body will start building muscle and repairing tissue, and if you exercise and eat not too much, lose fat.

My wife and her best friend are exemplary, but now my wife (doing a moderate form of low carb and warrior diet) is loosing her little rest fat, and even the cellulitis.

Her friend is still a bit too fat under the skin all over her body. She is vegetarian btw.


Everybody, thanks for the input!

Watcher, I am not one to starve myself. I am very aware of how going into the survival mode will put a halt to weight loss. I just hate that I didn't lose on this diet, because the one thing it did do was help my metabolism. I felt great all week! It is also true for me that I exercise much better on an empty stomach. My exercise consists of 20 minutes of cardio and then weight training for about another 20 or 30 minutes, 3 times per week. That's all other than walking the dog or taking my bike out for a pleasure ride. I would come home from the gym and either make a balanced nutrients smoothie or have a boiled egg. If I got hungry during the day, I would have either a yogurt, or a slice of cheese, or an apple with low carb peanut butter, or some almonds. I ate until my fill at night, no bread or sweets and I cooked every meal. I averaged 1400 calories per day.

Please tell me I did something wrong! I really felt good all week on this diet and I was terribly disappointed that I gained 2 pounds.

Thanks again!
Linda
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  #53   ^
Old Sat, Oct-02-04, 14:40
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Linda,

It looks great to me. Only check your calories on one of the sites, it may be low. I believe you have to check in some of the posts of Built if you shouldn't do the cardio after your weight training.

I may say that as I posted somewhere, dealing with frustration is the biggest trouble of this whole thing. Like stated before, almost all of the fat under my skin has gone now, and I'm busy like hell to get the fat out of my belly. I have no idea what goes wrong with that, if I'm on the right track and just need patience or not.

But then, my initial state of diverting from the sure heart attack status to healthy weight and looks has changed to the target of going to the Mens Health kind of look, so I really should not complain about progress. But ratio and emotion are two different things!
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  #54   ^
Old Sun, Oct-03-04, 20:58
TerJan58 TerJan58 is offline
New Member
Posts: 9
 
Plan: CAD
Stats: 183/183/140 Female 66"
BF:
Progress:
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I have just been reading about the WD. I have a question and wanted to know if anyone could answer. I am hypoglycemic and wondered if this would be an advisable way to eat? Would spirulina be ok to take to help blood sugar levels?
I remember eating somewhat similar to this years ago, only eating two meals a day and fasting the rest. I lost quite a bit of weight. I am reluctant to try anything too drastic today because of low blood sugar levels. Anybody tried this who has the same condition? Thanks for any answers.
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  #55   ^
Old Mon, Oct-04-04, 23:19
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerJan58
I have just been reading about the WD. I have a question and wanted to know if anyone could answer. I am hypoglycemic and wondered if this would be an advisable way to eat? Would spirulina be ok to take to help blood sugar levels?
I remember eating somewhat similar to this years ago, only eating two meals a day and fasting the rest. I lost quite a bit of weight. I am reluctant to try anything too drastic today because of low blood sugar levels. Anybody tried this who has the same condition? Thanks for any answers.

Hi there,

I have, when I started my WOL, checked as deep as I could how low carb and fasting would raise the danger for getting diabetes. To my surprise I found it was very good for those having diabetes II, and in an insulin simulator program I found that my eating pattern kept the insulin low and even during the day. A higher level ofcourse in the evening, but because of the most complex carbs a pattern without peaks.

www.2aida.org has the simulator, feed your own pattern of food and medicine and check how it goes.

Good luck with finding your way!
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  #56   ^
Old Mon, Oct-04-04, 23:25
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrelind
Based on the book Mastering Leptin, Byron Richards said that eating too many calories at once or in a very short period of time will cause an insulin spike and fat storage. Even if you ate mostly fat or protein and little carbs.

Ah.. that would be disastrous! Ill have to check this Im afraid....
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  #57   ^
Old Wed, Oct-06-04, 00:56
nutty nutty is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 65
 
Plan: reduced carb
Stats: 133/96/96 Female 5'3
BF:
Progress:
Default

I am here to back up Watcher!

I am 97-99 LB, work 70+ hours /week and NEVER run out of gas.

I eat 1800+ cal everyday, ok, 1500 of the 1800 eaten at night, everyday.

I am physically extremely fit and healthy, no even a cold in FIVE years.

I rarely eat during the day and rarely realize it.

Life is SOOOO roomy with the warrior living style, I get so much more done than those who have to eat a "decent lunch" followed by a nap.

Go Watcher go!
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  #58   ^
Old Thu, Oct-07-04, 13:12
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nutty
I am physically extremely fit and healthy

Go Watcher go!

Well congrats and thank you!

It is a happy WOL for those who find themselves to be compatible with it
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  #59   ^
Old Thu, Oct-07-04, 13:39
watcher16 watcher16 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 969
 
Plan: Warrior LC
Stats: 222/201/191 Male 180 cm
BF:30%/12%/12%
Progress: 68%
Location: Holland
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by serrelind
Based on the book Mastering Leptin, Byron Richards said that eating too many calories at once or in a very short period of time will cause an insulin spike and fat storage. Even if you ate mostly fat or protein and little carbs.

I can find only little info on this (google: Leptin insulin "warrior diet"), I found nothing stating in the above direction. I did only find some info indicating there should be no problem:

<<
I'm looking for opinions on eating less frequently. I have some theories as to why it may prove to be a greater advantage than eating more often. 1st off, I'm unable to use protein powders. I have allergies to whey, casein, and egg protein (and don't wish to use soy/rice, etc). My only option is real foods so the ability to ingest protein frequently is more difficult w/ my school/work schedule.

1st reasoning is based on an evolutionary base. I've talked to Lyle about this a few times and even Dr. Cordain (author of the paleo diet) and they agree that through most of our existance we evolved to hunt, kill an animal, and eat a huge amount of protein at one time. As a general rule, our ancestors were much leaner and more muscular than modern humans. Of course there is the activity factor, but regardless they were active and ate meat in this type of fashion, and still had muscle mass and leaner physiques. Protein absorption from meat is always going to be 90+% effecient, so there isn't going to be more of a waste or passing of aminos and Berardi even mentioned that protein is more efficiently absorbed in large amounts (although I found no sources). My understanding is if you gorge on a large amount of meat, the amino acids are just released slowly into the bloodstream. So it would stand to reason that say over a 12 hour period, if one were to eat 50g protein every 12 hours (8AM, 12PM, 4PM, 8PM), this would equal 200g protein, the same nitrogen balance should be achieved with one meal of 200g protein at 8AM. Although we are not carnivores examples in nature show that most meat eating animals hunt their prey, gorge on it and are generally large, muscualr and lean. Humans are the only animals that now graze on meat, where most grazing animals live off of greens.

I'm not talking about the warrior diet because this allows too much time in a fasting state (18 hours), but perhaps 2 meals spaced 12 hours or 3 meals evey 8 hours could work just as well as the 6 meals a day. There was a study looking at the same protein eaten in 10 hourly feedings or 3 distinct meals, the 3 distinct meals group had a higher nitrogen balance. Based on this study and a few others, ingesting protein too frequently seems to cause the body to stop responding. This is also the case w/ infusion studies w/ amino acids, where the body stops response somewhere after the 2hr mark. Regarding the protein pulse research, it worked on the older women but not younger (80% protein in 1 meal). It also worked on stimulating muscle protein synthesis in older rats. I understand the problems w/ extrapolating this data to bodybuilders, but sometimes these type of studies are all we have. Perhaps 2 pulses (spread 12 hours) could provide superior to frequenct small meals. Also, perhaps w/ the protein pulse studies, the research w/ the older women would be more applicable b/c the older women were in more of a negative nitrogen balance than the younger women. Wouldnt bodybuilders be in a similar situation after a workout, so ingesting a larger than normal amt. of protein (protein pulse) perhaps would be advantageous at this time. This is the way our ancestor prob. ate, hunting, anaerobic like lifting, then gorging on meat. 250g protein from chicken, turkey, lean beef provides about 15g leucine, an important stimalator of muscle protein synthesis. Another theory that I talked about w/ Dr. Cordain, is similar to carbohydrate depletion and loading. Similar to what bodybuilders do in a CKD, w/ carb depletion and low carb intake, there is an upregulation of (I believe GLUT-4 transporters) that basically makes the body more sensitive to uptaking more carbohydrates than normal into glycogen storage (supercompensation). Perheps there is a similar ability w/ a short (less than 12 hr) fast from protein followed by an increase in absorption, utilization. One study showed that the effects of fasting are altered after the ingestion of a high protein meal.
"The HP diet but not the control diet caused a significant retention of nitrogen. Postabsorptive leucine kinetics as assessed with [1,2-13C]leucine were similar in the two groups. In the control subjects, the rate of nitrogen excretion did not change in response to fasting, but leucine oxidation increased. In contrast, nitrogen excretion progressively decreased with fasting after the HP diet. Leucine rate of appearance was increased after fasting after the HP diet but oxidation was not increased, meaning that the calculated rate of whole-body protein synthesis was higher than in the control group. The response to a short period of food deprivation is dependent on prior protein intake."

After having read as much research as possible on pubmed, it seems meal freq. isn't overly important in terms of weight loss and even fat loss. An summary of the meal freq. research even states there are no significant differences. Lyle had an article stating that 3 meals at 600 cals vs 6 meals at 300cals show basically no difference, metabolic rate is either raised more freq. but less, or less freq. but more. End of the day results are the same. And no the body does not go into starvation mode if you dont get food for a say 12 hours, its more related to too low a calorie intake and days w/out food. I also found a study (have to look it up) that showed that leptin levels didnt even drop until at least 12 hours of no food intake.

One other case regarding this subject relates to the overnight fast. Generally there is an 8-12hr period w/ no food when sleeping. So you eat 4-6 small meals during waking hours, then go a long time w/ no food. Well what if you wake up, eat a large protein meal, say 8 AM. And potentially, this will keep a positive nitrogen balance for at least a 12hr period, then another large meal at 8PM, this will keep a positive nitrogen balance over night. Perhaps this is even better than eating freq. during the day where only a small meal is eaten at night, b/c this large meal will keep aminos steadily flowing into the body at night. Yes, theres the nightime proteins and the Biore study looking at fast vs slow proteins (whey vs casein) Which supports this idea even more. If a 30g serving of casein protein keeps nitrogen balance for 7+ hours, how would it not be possible for the ultimate slow protein (real food), ingested in a large amount (say 100-150g protein at once), to not maintain a balance even higher and longer than the 7 hr period experienced w/ the casein group. It seems like the idea of small frequent meals was started to sell supplements like MRP's and protein drinks, since eating 6 meals a day is next to impossible make people think its necessary and the only way they would be able to do it is to get some meals w/ the MRP being sold. The original freq. feeding recommendations were for diabetics fed a high carb diet, as eating every 3 hours was necessary to maintain blood sugar levels. But on people on a lower carb diet, this is less an issue. And according to Dr. Cordain, during a short fast, after a protein based meal, blood sugar is maintained by a small amt. of dietary amino acids, and insulin levels are dropped significantly (good for fat loss, avoidance of degenerative disease, and perhaps expanding lifespan as insulin is being recognized as on of the regulators, along/ w calorie restriction). In addition, some new research on mice found fasting every other day, even if calories were compensated for on the following day of eating, provided the same benefits as calorie restriction. Sorry for the long post, I have more points to make but will cut it short here for now. Next i'd like to talk about the potential psychological benefits and convenience issue as well. >>

So if you have part of his argument about the warrior diet could you post it?
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  #60   ^
Old Wed, Jan-19-05, 02:11
Yakumo Yakumo is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 308
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 143/143/200 Male 6 foot 2 inches
BF:
Progress: 0%
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Very interesting diet. I considered it a while back but I'm kind of afraid of it having already messed up my metabolism with various diets. I also have a pecular insulin response so it may not work as well for me. I do believe that dry fasting (no eating at all) before the big meal is potentially a bad idea. You will lose weight, but some of it will be lean weight (your body breaks down muscle for fuel in the absence of food). This is bad in the long term. I may be wrong though. but it seems that Ori includes the small meals to prevent muscle breakdown. I also believe exercise is important on this (and any) programme.

Last edited by Yakumo : Wed, Jan-19-05 at 02:17.
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