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  #31   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 16:54
Lisa N's Avatar
Lisa N Lisa N is offline
Posts: 12,028
 
Plan: Bernstein Diabetes Soluti
Stats: 260/-/145 Female 5' 3"
BF:
Progress: 63%
Location: Michigan
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Quote:
I have adopted the WW philosophy and related it to low carb. Meaning, that I have a carb target of between 50-100g/day, and eat accordingly. If I want a high carb food, I have to see if it would make me go > 100. If not, I eat it. I then know that, depending on the grams, what I can eat the rest of the day. It is modified eating behavoir just like WW.


This approach may work of you don't have hyperinsulinism and insulin resistance. If you do, then eating even one high carb item, even if you keep your carb intake low for the rest of the day, will provoke an insulin response and only continue the insulin resistance because with those conditions, it's not the total amount of carbs you eat in a day that matters, it's the total number carbs (and their glycemic value) that you eat at one time.
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  #32   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 17:00
PaulInTX PaulInTX is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 50
 
Plan: general low carb
Stats: 208/187/180 Male 6' 1"
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: Plano, Texas
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lisa N
This approach may work of you don't have hyperinsulinism and insulin resistance. If you do, then eating even one high carb item, even if you keep your carb intake low for the rest of the day, will provoke an insulin response and only continue the insulin resistance because with those conditions, it's not the total amount of carbs you eat in a day that matters, it's the total number carbs (and their glycemic value) that you eat at one time.


do you have the scientific data to back that statement up? I have seen no scientific data to back up what you say regarding "insulin response" and it preventing weight loss...
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  #33   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 17:22
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,489
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Quote:
do you have the scientific data to back that statement up?

You could start with page 52 of Dr Atkins new Diet revolution...

Rosebud
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  #34   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 17:46
Lisa N's Avatar
Lisa N Lisa N is offline
Posts: 12,028
 
Plan: Bernstein Diabetes Soluti
Stats: 260/-/145 Female 5' 3"
BF:
Progress: 63%
Location: Michigan
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Quote:
do you have the scientific data to back that statement up?


http://www.mendosa.com/talking.htm
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  #35   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 18:02
dcbrowne's Avatar
dcbrowne dcbrowne is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,005
 
Plan: south beach (CAD)
Stats: 314/284/150 Female 5 ft 4 in
BF:49
Progress: 18%
Location: Massachusetts, US
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The Doctors Heller also go into depth about the reaction you describe in their Carbohydrate Addicts book Chapter 2.
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  #36   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 18:26
PaulInTX PaulInTX is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 50
 
Plan: general low carb
Stats: 208/187/180 Male 6' 1"
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: Plano, Texas
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lisa N
http://www.mendosa.com/talking.htm

awesome, thanks
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  #37   ^
Old Sun, Jun-15-03, 20:35
PaulInTX PaulInTX is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 50
 
Plan: general low carb
Stats: 208/187/180 Male 6' 1"
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: Plano, Texas
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that was an interesting read. What I gathered from that is that, for most people who aren't greatly overweight (I put myself in that category, for example), then my system of total carbs is valid, as each type is probably moot as it relates to weight lose and my bodies ability to regulate insulin correctly.

However, for greatly overweight people (and perhaps overweight people with a predisposition to diabetes), it could make a big difference in their health. How much that affects weight loss is debatable, from what I read, but I can see how the other affects caused by it lead to a lack of weight loss.

Also interesting was that I was at healthcentral.com today and saw that the CDC is predicting that the diabetes numbers in this country will approach 33% in children born in 2000 unless our eating habits change (http://www.healthcentral.com/news/N....cfm?id=1502234)

Given that I have two kids and one in progress, that is certainly something to be concerned about.
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  #38   ^
Old Mon, Jun-16-03, 04:23
Lisa N's Avatar
Lisa N Lisa N is offline
Posts: 12,028
 
Plan: Bernstein Diabetes Soluti
Stats: 260/-/145 Female 5' 3"
BF:
Progress: 63%
Location: Michigan
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The article doesn't mention this, but it is mentioned in several of the low carb books that I have read; if you tend to accumulate fat in your belly instead of your hips, butt and thighs (the infamous beer gut or apple shape), it's a good sign of insulin resistance regardless of how overweight you are.
Insulin resistance is also the precurser to diabetes; if you have it and don't do something about it, you will eventually develop diabetes (more likely sooner than later).
Of course, the only scientific absolute way to determine insulin resistance is to have your circulating blood insulin levels checked, but often a diagnosis is made based on presenting clinical symptoms.
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  #39   ^
Old Mon, Jun-16-03, 05:37
justcindy justcindy is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 391
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 316/273/180 Female 68 inches
BF:
Progress: 32%
Location: PA
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Ok, I don't understand something...why the hostility about WW? I mean, who cares what someone else eats? Everyone should eat how they see fit and really, it is nobody else's business. I too think low carbing is the absolute best way to eat but hey...who am I to tell someone else how to eat?
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  #40   ^
Old Mon, Jun-16-03, 06:01
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,489
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Quote:
Originally posted by justcindy
Ok, I don't understand something...why the hostility about WW? I mean, who cares what someone else eats? Everyone should eat how they see fit and really, it is nobody else's business. I too think low carbing is the absolute best way to eat but hey...who am I to tell someone else how to eat?

Hostility? No, no hostility. It's simply a matter of what we support here. This is a low carb support forum. End of story.
We don't offer support to people who wish to lose weight any other way. We wish them well, and even go so far as to offer them URLs for support forums where their diets are supported, but we only welcome low carbers here.

Rosebud
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  #41   ^
Old Mon, Jun-16-03, 07:34
gretchend's Avatar
gretchend gretchend is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 276
 
Plan: CAD with a few modificati
Stats: 193/141/120 Female 64 inches
BF:
Progress: 71%
Location: Virginia Beach, Virginia
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That's a little harsh, I know this is a low carb forum, but we as humans should support anyone when they are trying to lose weight. It is a hard thing to do and anyone trying needs all the support they can get however they are trying to do it. C'mon have a heart.
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  #42   ^
Old Mon, Jun-16-03, 10:24
doreen T's Avatar
doreen T doreen T is offline
Forum Founder
Posts: 35,498
 
Plan: DANDR '92
Stats: 236/180/140 Female 165 cm
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: Eastern ON, Canada
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Quote:
Originally posted by gretchend
That's a little harsh, I know this is a low carb forum, but we as humans should support anyone when they are trying to lose weight. It is a hard thing to do and anyone trying needs all the support they can get however they are trying to do it. C'mon have a heart.
hi there,

I think folks misunderstand where we're coming from here. We are not condemning WW or other low-fat, low-calorie programs. We're simply saying that the focus of Active Low-Carber forums is exclusively for persons who choose a low-carb, high-fat WOE .. either for weight loss or other health reasons. Period. There is no malice or ill will toward folks who choose another dietary approach ... and we will continue to offer links to websites where those other approaches can be supported.

If a person following a low-fat, low-calorie program (whether or not it's super-duper low in carbs) gets stuck, or has a question and seeks support .. they are going to be offered suggestions to increase their fat and calorie intake, which will be in conflict with their personal beliefs about their diet. This isn't an issue of ill-will, it's simply an issue of different nutritional beliefs. We do not wish to create conflict or upset for anyone, and so we will continue to respectfully suggest that persons desiring to pursue a low-fat, low-calorie diet or "points" system of eating would be better served to seek that support elsewhere.


hth,

Doreen
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  #43   ^
Old Fri, Jun-20-03, 14:25
MsJinx's Avatar
MsJinx MsJinx is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,249
 
Plan: Schwarzbein II, BA, IS
Stats: 125.4/119.2/115 Female 5'1" small frame
BF:33% /??? / 20%?
Progress: 60%
Location: Texas
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I did Weight Watchers and they do have very active boards. I tried doing WW low carb, higher protein, and I just couldn't do it due to it being such a low calorie plan (I was on 18-23 pts).

Also, don't think that Atkins or any of the other low carb plans would get a great reception on the WW boards. Over on EDiets.com they HATE that Atkins is now available.

I just say go where you're most supported in the choices you make.

Good luck!
Jinx

PS There are enough plans out there that you should be able to find something that fits you perfectly.

Last edited by MsJinx : Fri, Jun-20-03 at 14:28.
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  #44   ^
Old Fri, Jun-20-03, 18:08
rebsee's Avatar
rebsee rebsee is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 338
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 232/205/147 Female 73"
BF:
Progress: 32%
Location: Nottingham, UK
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I have to go with Gretchend here as the lady who started the thread is trying to tailor herself a form of LC. I don't see why she should leave this forum, she was just asking some questions about the theoretical compatibility of the two plans. Who knows, it may work for her.
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  #45   ^
Old Fri, Jun-20-03, 18:33
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,489
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Quote:
Originally posted by rebsee
I have to go with Gretchend here as the lady who started the thread is trying to tailor herself a form of LC. I don't see why she should leave this forum, she was just asking some questions about the theoretical compatibility of the two plans. Who knows, it may work for her.

Rebsee, if you go back and reread the last few posts, you'll see that no one at any time asked the poster to leave the forum because she wanted to combine WW with low carb. We merely explained that the focus of this board is low carb, and that she may be happier elsewhere.

If you read the whole thread, you will understand why we feel that counting WW points is not compatible with low carb. Nothing about the WW plan is compatible with low carb - it is a low fat, low calorie plan. If anyone prefers to follow WW, or any other low fat, low cal plan, that is their right, and we wish them all the luck in the world.

But this board is for the exclusive support of members following published low carb plans.

Many of us tailor or "tweak" those plans - that is fine. Tailoring other non low carb plans is not low carbing. As we have said several times now, we wish them well, and will offer URL's of other boards for them.

Rosebud
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