Hello,

I have perused through many of the posts, and find information in all of them.

This isn't a low-carb bashing post, but a post that questions the way we apply the LC eating plan/life style.

I believe that the anti-LC viewpoint evolves from a skewed perception they get from LC diets (particularly Atkins) when they watch a low carb dieter eat. Which then instigates the fervor with which non-LC's go at us.

Probably the best example I can give is from a few months ago.

I was sitting in the staff lounge and didn't feel (tummy ache) great during lunch break. A co-worker wandered in and offered me one of her "traditional" Slimfast shakes. Chocolate. Well, of all the things to offer, that kind of sounded good. So, I took her up on it.

There I sat, drinking a Milk Chocolate Slimfast shake.

In walks in another employee. He's been lo-carbing for a year and lost 100 pounds (excellent for him!). He really does look a lot healthier than he did, and he says he feels better.

He asks me what I'm doing. "Drinking lunch!" I replied.

The he went into a lecture about how much sugar is in Slimfast (which I am well aware of), how bad it is for me (hey, it has vitamins!), and so on. He even took the can away from me and read the ingredients. I'm pretty patient, so I didn't get bent out of shape.

But, what really irritates me, is the whole time he is doing this, he is eating a WHOLE bag of pepperoni. I do not recall, anywhere in The New Diet Revolution reading that a WHOLE bag of pepperoni is appropriate!

Bottom line, I think that the Atkins Diet (And others), as they are written, are excellent. What goes wrong is when practitioners of such diets sit down in front of others and eat a whole bag of pork rinds, a can of Spam, or a bag of pepperoni.

It isn't the diets that are wrong, it is the application that gives non-low carbers the ammo to launch their diatribes.

So, to get more respect, I think those of us who are low carbing need to "clean up" our eating a bit (whether it is a low carb food or not), and start putting into practice what has been suggested, i.e. meats/fish/poultry, eggs, low carb fruits (berries, etc.), 3-4 servings of appropriate vegetables per day, and so on...

Nothing wrong with that.

Jon

I wouldn't argue with someone who has lost 100 pounds and is healthy . If it works, which it obviously did, who cares what anyone thinks about eating a whole bag of pepperoni? The results are obvious so I say "Eat the Pepperoni" in front of God and everyone .

Orchid

Let's face it a lot of the low carb critics have closed minds, and are looking for any "evidence" from their perspective that low carb is evil incarnate. They continue to prattle on about "a calorie being a calorie."

Quite frankly, I'm not looking for "respect" from other people about what I eat or my lifestyle. I see no reason to waste my time worrying about what others think; if they have nothing better to do than watch what I eat then they are leading pretty shallow lives with their small closed minds.

Remember just a generation ago, ulcers were believed to be caused by stress, when in fact it was discovered that H. Pylori is responsible for most ulcers.

Pork rinds are very good for you - no carbs, no trans fats, just healty animal fat and protein.

Really, one of nature's perfect foods.

On the other hand, it WAS pretty obnoxious of the low-carb/pepperoni eating guy to go on and on about how "bad" the slim-fast was! He was doing exactly what we low-carbers complain about when people criticize what we eat!

Liz

I agree - going off on you about a Slimfast shake is pretty obnoxious. Clearly, you knew what you were doing, and aware of all the sugar and crap in it, as well as the good stuff in it, and it was your choice.

I also agree that a lot of folks start off on an Atkins diet WITHOUT READING THE BOOK. They just decide to cut out all carbs, altogether. This leads to eating 20 oz steaks by themselves, without any LC veggies - doesn't DANDR (Atkins) recommend green leafies and additional LC veggies, every day, even during Induction? Apologies if I'm wrong on this, but I know that it recommends some veggies at first.

Someone who hasn't read the book is also liable to eat high processed meats (salami, etc), which not only may have salt, but even sugars added, obviously undermining the diet. As for eating an entire can of Spam, well, I've personally witnessed this, and I'm speechless.

I tend not to confront people directly when I see this. The spam-eater was a friend, and I believe I suggested (after some gentle teasing, which he can handle with grace and I know it) - that maybe he should read the book.

I no longer am in the habit of telling random people about me LC-ing - instead, if they ask, I tell them that I'm doing a whole foods, natural diet. Usually, I'm eating so many veggies, they don't question my diet, too.

I'd have to agree. In a perfect world, people would keep their noses out of other people's business. By pushing you about the Slimfast, he would invite criticism himself, IMO.

By spouting the evils of the sugary slimfast shake, then settling down to eat an entire bag of processed, greasy pepperoni, he may well be one of the reasons the lc style gets the "press" it does.

I'm hardly about to read every book for every diet plan out there, so if I saw someone eating and they're going on about how great their diet is...I'd naturally take a look at their plate and make some assumptions. People around this guy would be making a logical assumption that Atkins was the "whole-bag-of-pepperoni" diet based on his behavior that day...

We sometimes lose sight of the fact that there ARE obnoxious blowhards bashing anything that isn't low-carb out there too...

Just a comment; although he may have gone about it the wrong way, I believe his intentions were probably good.
It's natural that when you find something this exciting you want everyone to see what you see...don't you feel that way?

It's a tightrope act to share this wol with people without alienating them for sure...

bob

I want people to know that I have lowered my cholesterol and triglycerides. I have good glucose, yet, I eat pork rinds, pepperoni, lettuce wrapped hunks of burgers and grease. They see the fatty foods easlily. But, do they see the, strawberries, vegetables or sparkling water that I also eat? No they don't. Those are invisible to them. I don't have time to worry about their misconceptions. Hell, it is time to eat!

Bob-- and the jerks who tell us we're going to kill ourselves with Atkins MAY have good intentions as well. There are people who have good AND bad intentions for bashing other diets. It has to do with the "issues" of the person doing the lecturing I guess. Some people ARE trying to be helpful, others just want to be right.(Or more importantly, prove someone else WRONG.) IMHO, unsolicited opinions in EITHER direction are uncalled for.

I think that sort of attitude is, sadly, very typical of the new LC revolution. It's just like in the 80s when dietary fat became an unspeakable word, yet all those low fat dieters were loading up their plates with tremendous servings of blood sugar spiking refined starch and sugar instead. Everyone was so fixated on the stomach-bulging potential of high-fat energy dense food, that we completely forgot a) a little fat is essential, b) fat satiates and c) carbs have calories too, especially energy-dense pure sugar & starch foods (rolls, breads, sugar candies and juices, etc)... too many sugars and starches (coupled with too little fat) leads to metabolic disturbances which result in, among many things, obesity. Before the low fat craze we had a much more balanced nutritional outlook.

Here's a typical example of the extremism that was the low fat craze. For example, a 6 ounce up of low fat yogurt has a ridiculous 190 calories. Why are they so high? Because in order to make the yogurt palatable after removing the small bit of fat, they had to load it up with sugar and artificial flavors. Such yogurts are absolutely teeming with carbs even by an average person's standards. Net result is you now have a product which tastes inferior, is less satiating and less healthy, for about the same amount of calories. This method NOT going to promote sustainable weight loss or health, as most discovered.

The problem today is the pendulum is swinging too far in the opposite direction, and it is a direct consequence of the low fat dogma. It would be naive to think things like sour cream, cream cheese, heavy cream, pepperoni, etc are very good for you. They contain virtually no vitamins or minerals and TONS of energy -- in other words, they are empty calories. Just like any junk food item (be it a rice cake or a bag of pork rinds) eating too much at the expense of more nutrient-dense food is going to not lead to optimal health.

Then you have the same low carb food replacements that marked the low fat trend. I see the silliest stuff marketed as low carb, like salad dressing. The bottle says "1 net carb" but then flip it over, and the stuff is so high in fat that the calorie count is astronomical. For most people to achieve their goal weights, they have to consciously limit energy consumption and make sure not to choose foods which are quite so energy-dense, and many low carb products are therefore counter productive.
Most low carb breads are not only ridiculously expensive, but they contain the same or more calories as regular breads and are, therefore, only slightly helpful. Regular old lite white bread is (surprise) not only low carb (6-7 net per slice), but it tastes very similar to real bread and is very low cal (usually about 40 cals per slice). Best part? It costs about the same as regular bread .

There are some low carb products which are a big improvement, don't get me wrong. Low carb dairy products are excellent - the yogurts and milk which remove natural and artificially added sugars - result in a high nutrition, low calorie, low carb alternative. Unfortunately, most of them fall into the snackwells category of completely counter productive for losing weight & promoting health.

Hmmmm - sorry to disagree with you Wooo, but it has been my understanding that sour cream, cream cheese, butter, and heavy cream are very, very good for you. The saturated animal fats contained in them are important sources of EFA, and these fats are vehicles for fat-soluable vitamins, such as vitamin A. Plus, these fats are natural, and your body knows what to do with them.

About an eighth of the fat in butter is medium chain triglyceride. MCT oil is actually sold in supplement stores for bodybuilders to help shed fat and as an energy source. And cream cheese is full of protein and calcium.

For low-carb, ketogenic, Atkins style dieting, it is extremely important to keep dietary fats as the highest source of calories. For most keto dieters, this means somewhere in the range of 65-70% of calories from fat. These dressings and toppings are essential nutrients in terms of keeping our fat intake at a healthy and high level, especially when consuming otherwise fat-free foods like broccoli and salad. And since polyunsaturated fats should generally be avoided, keeping saturated animal fats high is an excellent way to ensure adequate fat intake.

I agree with the high-fat, but in INDUCTION. The later stages of most lc plans are moderate fat at best.

A high fat (natural, saturated fat) diet is the optimal way for a human to nourish himself, period.

The members of this forum are on a variety of different 'diets'. I keep my fat intake high... around 70% of total cals. Much of this comes from saturated fat. I keep my carbs around 20 g. most days.
It is my understanding that if a person is going to be eating a lot of saturated fat... they also must keep carbs very low. If a person is eating 150 g. of carbs/day... I don't think that person should eat as much saturated fat.
Agree? Disagree? Isn't this what research would suggest is safe and healthy?