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  #31   ^
Old Sat, Apr-10-10, 14:32
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,843
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
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Location: San Diego, CA
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Beth, your philosophy sounds like mine. I think Yoda would say, "There is no purpose, only is". Or something like that.
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  #32   ^
Old Sun, Apr-11-10, 13:31
dan_rose dan_rose is offline
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Posts: 187
 
Plan: None, limit carbs, Omega6
Stats: 161/140/140 Male 5'10"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Loughborough, UK
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From what I've read on the net, a full therapeutic fast requires rest over the entire period. Thus, unless you're willing to sacrifice a holiday, it doesn't seem feasible.

Has anyone thought about trying it?

In the Jimmy Moore interview he states 7-10 days fasting - Does the amount of time depend on the individual? Who would do 10 if 7 is enough!

At 16.45, he mentions that a low calorie fast may work e.g. 600kcal per day max. One fried egg is about 100kcal, so if I had four or five and drank black coffee and water, I could probably make it through a working week (desk job).

Does anyone think that would work?

What we need to do is find the most practicable way to achieve a similar result.
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  #33   ^
Old Mon, Apr-12-10, 03:12
Hutchinson's Avatar
Hutchinson Hutchinson is offline
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Posts: 2,886
 
Plan: Dr Dahlqvist's
Stats: 205/152/160 Male 69
BF:
Progress: 118%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dan_rose
At 16.45, he mentions that a low calorie fast may work e.g. 600kcal per day max. One fried egg is about 100kcal, so if I had four or five and drank black coffee and water, I could probably make it through a working week (desk job).

Does anyone think that would work?

What we need to do is find the most practicable way to achieve a similar result.
This was the section that interested me and I think I may give this a trial sometime to see how it goes. I think there may be some benefit in raising ketones (ay with medium chain triglyceride oil) in the context of a calorie deficient diet. Jimmy Moore's eggfest is heading in that direction but without the calorie restriction.

I think if you are trying to boost metabolism and improve the functioning of mitochondria the calorie restriction may be needed. I think our DNA is more geared to dealing with food shortages than food surplus and it's possible short periods of deprivation may improve it's efficiency.
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  #34   ^
Old Mon, Apr-12-10, 05:53
Valtor's Avatar
Valtor Valtor is offline
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Posts: 2,036
 
Plan: VLC 4 days a week
Stats: 337/258/200 Male 6' 1"
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: Québec, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutchinson
...I think our DNA is more geared to dealing with food shortages than food surplus and it's possible short periods of deprivation may improve it's efficiency.

Absolutely! This is very well supported by nearly all the scientific literature.

Patrick
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  #35   ^
Old Sun, May-02-10, 16:56
sln88 sln88 is offline
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Posts: 1,599
 
Plan: ZC/VLC
Stats: 243/220/140 Female 64 inches
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Progress: 22%
Location: wisconsin
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again- this study mentions cancer and glutamine. Is this the same stuff I take for my sugar cravings? L-glutamine?

Conclusions
Evidence is reviewed supporting a general hypothesis that cancer is primarily a disease of energy metabolism. All of the major hallmarks of the disease can be linked to impaired mitochondrial function. In order to maintain viability, tumor cells gradually transition to substrate level phosphorylation using glucose and glutamine[B] as energy substrates. While cancer causing germline mutations are rare, the abundance of somatic genomic abnormalities found in the majority of cancers can arise as a secondary consequence of 31 mitochondrial dysfunction. Once established, somatic genomic instability can contribute to further mitochondrial defects and to the metabolic inflexibility of the tumor cells. Systemic metastasis is the predicted outcome following protracted mitochondrial damage to cells of myeloid origin. Tumor cells of myeloid origin would naturally embody the capacity to exit and enter tissues. Two major conclusions emerge from the hypothesis; first that many cancers can regress if energy intake is restricted and, second, that many cancers can be prevented if energy intake is restricted. Consequently, energy restricted diets combined with drugs targeting glucose and glutamine can provide a rational strategy for the longerterm management and prevention of most cancers.
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  #36   ^
Old Mon, May-03-10, 03:50
Hutchinson's Avatar
Hutchinson Hutchinson is offline
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Plan: Dr Dahlqvist's
Stats: 205/152/160 Male 69
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I thought this was quite interesting.
The pivotal roles of mitochondria in cancer: Warburg and beyond and encouraging prospects for effective therapies.
Quote:
Tumors usurp established metabolic steps used by normal tissues for glucose utilization and ATP production that rely heavily on mitochondria and employ a route that, although involving mitochondria, includes a much greater dependency on glycolysis. First described by Otto Warburg almost nine decades ago, this aberrant phenotype becomes more pronounced with increased tumor malignancy.
Thus, while maintaining their capacity for respiration, tumors "turn more parasitic" by enhancing their ability to scavenge glucose from their surroundings.
With excess glucose at hand, tumors shunt their metabolic flux more toward glycolysis than do their normal cells of origin, a strategy that allows for their survival when oxygen is limiting while providing them a mechanism to poison their extra-cellular environment with acid, thus paving the way for invasion and metastasis.
Significantly, tumors harness a crucial enzyme to regulate and support this destructive path-to entrap and channel glucose toward glycolysis.
This enzyme is an isoform of hexokinase, referred to as hexokinase type II, and also in abbreviated form as HK-2 or HK II.
Due to many-faceted molecular features at genetic, epigenetic, transcriptional, and enzymatic levels, including sub-cellular localization to mitochondria, HK-2 facilitates and promotes the high glycolytic tumor phenotype.
Thus, HK-2 represents a pivotal model gene or enzyme that tumors "select for" during tumorigenesis in order to facilitate their destructive path. In this review, we examine the roles played by mitochondrial bound HK-2 within the context of the highly choreographed metabolic roulette of malignant tumors.
Recent studies that outline how the aberrant glycolytic flux can be subverted toward a more "normal" metabolic phenotype, and how the glycolytic flux affects the tumor microenvironment to facilitate tumor dissemination are also described, including how these very features can be harnessed in new metabolic targeting strategies to selectively debilitate tumors


The ability of Vitamin D to reduce HK-2 may be the route by which higher vitamin D status reduces cancer incidence and improves prognosis.
Calcitriol Directly Sensitizes Renal Tubular Cells to ATP-Depletion- and Iron-Mediated Attack
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  #37   ^
Old Fri, Jul-06-18, 06:38
RawNut's Avatar
RawNut RawNut is offline
Lipivore
Posts: 1,208
 
Plan: Very Low Carb Paleo
Stats: 270/185/180 Male 72 inches
BF:
Progress: 94%
Location: Florida
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Here's a recent interview of Thomas Seyfried. Discusses ongoing studies.It appears he's now against mixing current standard of care treatments with metabolic therapies. Did I hear that right?



https://player.fm/series/the-meat-o...thomas-seyfried
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  #38   ^
Old Fri, Jul-06-18, 19:52
Valtor's Avatar
Valtor Valtor is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,036
 
Plan: VLC 4 days a week
Stats: 337/258/200 Male 6' 1"
BF:
Progress: 58%
Location: Québec, Canada
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Interesting. Thanks!

Patrick
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  #39   ^
Old Fri, Jul-06-18, 23:25
whynot18 whynot18 is offline
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Posts: 99
 
Plan: Modified Atkins
Stats: 210/191/150 Female 5 feet 7 inches
BF:38/37.2/??
Progress: 32%
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Check out the book "Tripping Over the Truth." It discusses many of these issues, but in an easy-to-read style. I see there also is a book called "Keto for Cancer."
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  #40   ^
Old Sat, Jul-07-18, 04:39
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,368
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RawNut
Here's a recent interview of Thomas Seyfried. Discusses ongoing studies.It appears he's now against mixing current standard of care treatments with metabolic therapies. Did I hear that right?



https://player.fm/series/the-meat-o...thomas-seyfried


I’ve not heard him say that. If standard of care is available, should use it, but often the clinics he advises are beyond that stage.

You have brought up a very old thread, there have been many newer ones here. Here's a long one.
http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=455513

But Seyfried's most important new paper is on his Press-Pulse treatment, using standard chemo after "pressing" with fasting, LCHF, HBO, etc

Press-pulse: a novel therapeutic strategy for the metabolic management of cancer. Feb 2017. https://nutritionandmetabolism.biom...2986-017-0178-2
New paper by Dr. Seyfried, et al. on how the Keto Diet works WITH standard of care treatment, on video. https://youtu.be/9WFxjO3OHy0


WhyNot, Both books are excellent if interested in cancer. I highly recommend the Keto for Cancer book for practical advice, esp if in treatment. My (top) review is on Amazon.

Last edited by JEY100 : Sat, Jul-07-18 at 04:56.
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  #41   ^
Old Sun, Jul-08-18, 20:15
whynot18 whynot18 is offline
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Posts: 99
 
Plan: Modified Atkins
Stats: 210/191/150 Female 5 feet 7 inches
BF:38/37.2/??
Progress: 32%
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JEY: I appreciate all the info you have provided on this site. I have learned a lot from your posts. I especially appreciate finding out about Dr. Westman.
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  #42   ^
Old Mon, Jul-09-18, 03:44
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,368
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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You're welcome, though not sure how I linked you up with Dr Westman. But it reminds me, should update his thread. He has quite a few events coming up, many short explanation videos on the AdaptYourLife FB Page, and you can watch a video of all the monthly support meetings this year at the HEALClinic Page.
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