Hi there thyroid experts!

I got these results the other day:

OK, here's some results:

TSH: 2.24 (0.30-4.00 mU/l)
FT3: 3.35 (2.59-4.26 ng/dl)
FT4: 1.14 (0.97-1.65 ng/dl)

Ferritin: 29.2 (20.0 - 167ug/l)

B12: 551 (191-663 pg/ml)

Total Cholesterol: 247 (100 - 200mg/dl)

Triglycerides: 203 (0 - 150 mg/dl)

Any comments?

My weight has gone up, too, and my BP also seems to be higher.

TC was stable at just over 200 a few years ago, the trigs were also stable at 74/79.

The doc I went to see said there was nothing wrong with my thyroid...


When I pointed to my TC and trig numbers as indicative of a thyroid problem, he just pointed at my TSH number and said I didn't have a thyroid problem, so it just became a silly circular conversation.

At the end of the discussion, having told me that all my various numbers (adrenal, thyroid and sex hormones) were "normal", he mumbled that I should maybe consider psychological problems as the cause of my health issues.

I left shortly after that little comment...

amanda

hey amanda, i just want to say what a $%(*$ lame doctor. i wonder if you have seen this http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/give-me-a-break/

i read it today and it was really bolstering me while kind of making me livid at the same time.

Incredible!!! Just freaking incredible...

And very very sad...

amanda

And that ferritin...jeez..mine was about the same, but my total chol. before starting Armour Thyroid was higher than yours...way higher...and now my total is 176, and my tri glys are 26.

But that ferritin...if that's not pulled up...you may very well not 'tolerate' incoming thyroid hormone.

I really 'feel for you'....it's hard ENOUGH being here in the US and finding a doctor who knows good thyroid....but I can't imagine....being in Germany (well, figuratively...as I WAS in Germany for a few months...in '75).

I wish you were here....I'd wave my magic thyroid wand (the one that matches my goiter belt...they are an ensemble) and whisk you away to someone who could help you. Hang in there!

If it's any consolation, you certainly are helpful here on the forums to so very many....and deserve much better treatment in the way of thyroid. Sometimes...bringing up the ferritin 'improves T4 to T3 conversion' too.

Oh...green tea was one of the things I couldn't and still can't have...it has pretty high fluoride content, and fluoride can stop a thyroid dead in it's tracks and influence test results. Just a heads up....

http://www.sixwise.com/newsletters/...s-issue-004.htm

Fluoride can also affect the thyroid. Specifically, it suppresses thyroid function, leading to hypothyroidism. This is a well-known fact, as, ironically, the amount of fluoride in a typical cup of tea is actually much higher than amounts that were used decades ago as medication for hyperthyroidism, to reduce thyroid activity

My thyroid doctor discourages his patients from using green tea.

Yeah, 'cause its well documented that psychological problems cause an increase in triglycerides......idiot doctors! Also sexist, as I doubt he'd have said the same if it had been a male patient saying the same thing, but if its a woman its 'psychological' and hysteria.

Lee

Hi neanderpam!!!

I had been hoping you would spot my post!!! Thanks for chiming in.

I'll respond to what you wrote below:



So, in your opinion, those numbers - the relatively high TC (used to always be 200), the high trigs and the low ferritin - could be an indication of some kind of thyroid problem? Obviously, I didn't manage to convince this particular doc of this point, but is that a possible conclusion?



That's good to know!!! Now I now why a lot of the people on a German Hashi's forum I've visited every now and then are so big on getting their ferritin levels up. I thought it was for general health reasons, not that it had a specific connection to the efficacy of thyroid medication.



It does seem that there are a few around, but they have waiting lists... I found one that got rave reviews, here in Stuttgart, rang up and was told that I could try ringing back in April/May 2012. And there's a guy in Cologne who prescribes Armour Thyroid, plus a promising-sounding person in Munich. Not exactly round the corner, but, unless I do find someone more local, I think I might see if I can see one of these guys.





Thanks for the wishes. I am sure I can feel them!!!



Seems that is all I can do for the minute - well, and a few little changes that you have suggested...



I have ordered some iron capsules from iherb.com, which I found recommended on a thyroid forum, I do believe. The people who've bothered to leave reviews say they tolerate it well and don't get stomach problems. I was prescribed iron tablets during my first pregnancy and they went straight through me!!! It was like they just created a new pipe in me, leading straight down, and - ZIP! - through they went. I have also tried "Floradix", which is a German herbal product and that was OK, insofar as I tolerated it, but I have no idea if it made any difference to my iron levels. Plus, I kind of didn't like it as it is basically fruit juice and very high in fructose and carbs. From my reading, I was under the impression that iron from animal sources is better absorbed anyway.

Can you recommend any particular iron tablets? The one I hear about is "Slow Fe", but I don't recall if I've seen that on iherb.com. I could probably use vitacost.com, too, for shipping to Europe.



Now that is also interesting!!! To be honest, I have been meaning to remove the thing about green tea from my signature as I haven't had that concoction for ages!!! But I do have fruit tea in my store cupboard which I could mix the ginger with as an alternative. I did like the ginger infusion, but on its own it's pretty powerful.

I hadn't had any green tea directly before the blood test, so that won't have affected the results.

http://www.sixwise.com/newsletters/...s-issue-004.htm



I only have toothpastes without fluoride, but, I do use an anti-bacterial mouthwash every now and then. I simply didn't find any without fluoride. I have periodontal problems and the mouthwash seems to help if my gums feel sore. That gets rinsed out but I guess some of the fluoride will get into the body via the gum tissues. Hmmm... Any ideas?

I had heard about "regular" tea containing fluoride, but that is interesting about it containing more today than it used to - sounds like what's happened to wheat, with it now containing way more gluten than it used to.

So, shall I give up my one cup of tea in the morning, to be on the safe side?

And, talking of morning beverages, I have been to-ing and fro-ing on the issue of caffeine for the last few years. In the meantime I have morphed back into a full-blown caffeine addict and currently find the idea of giving it up very difficult. It smells so good!!!

However, when I managed to get my caffeine intake down to using a mix of 50% decaf/50% caffeinated, I did have less trouble with the morning dizziness and general hypoglycaemic problems, so I have the feeling that I should probably give it a try. It's just that it is so difficult to get going in the mornings at the moment that I wonder whether I would EVER wake up if I didn't have the caffeine boost...

What's your take on caffeine? I haven't been diagnosed with "official" reactive hypoglycaemia, but I have something along those lines. All the standard advice is to avoid caffeine and alcohol... I could manage without the alcohol, if I tried a bit harder, but coffee???



Don't worry, that's a done deal - no more black or green tea!!!

This is going to be my strategy:

1) No more tea!
2) Start taking my sublingual methylcobalamin tablets more regularly to get those B12 levels up again.
3) Go back to my old weekly dose of calf's liver to get those iron levels up till I get some decent (well, I hope they are) iron supplements
4) I shall also be more vigilant with my Mg glycinate tablets - I haven't been taking them so regularly either lately.
5) And I'll get more D3 in my system again, too!

I have also been taking ashwagandha, which, of course, I had been taking just prior to the blood test being done. I really hadn't expected him to ask me to give blood straight away, which is why I had been taking the ashwagandha - and, also of course, because I had felt so sh*te!!!

I did try to explain to him during our preliminary chat that I had been taking this ashwagandha which can affect the thyroid, but I think he didn't really pay attention to that bit...

I was wondering what to do about that supplement for the future. "Scarlet" (Lynn) told me that I should make sure I hadn't been taking any ayurvedic supplements for at least three weeks before having tests done as they would skew the results. I also use licquorice capsules regularly as they seem to help with night-time "hunger" pangs which sometimes keep me awake. If I take 2 licquorice capsules, I can get back to sleep again without having my stomach rumble. I am wondering whether I should really give them up, though, as my BP does seem to have gone up a few points (which apparently is a side-effect of long-term use of licquorice).

I will run out of them at some point anyway, so I'm wondering whether to just let the run out and not replace them and see what happens and then get re-tested by someone else - if I have found someone who seems promising in the meantime!!!

Sorry to have written such a humongous post - obviously, you don't need to write such a long reply!

Thanks so much once again,

amanda

Hi Lee,

Thanks so much for your comments!!! You're absolutely right about the trigs - no doubt my constant difficulties in getting my Mg levels at some kind of acceptable range where I don't get a stiff neck and cramps are also due to psychological problems!!! Silly me...

And you are absolutely right about the sexist aspect of his comments: I am sure no bloke doctor ever says to his male patients that their complaints are just in their head.

We'll just have to keep on keeping on, hey?

But, the one saving grace is that we do have the support we give each other on this forum: I really really value that and feel a lot less alone because of the feedback I've got here.

At least that will keep my stress levels down a bit!!!

Take care and all the best,

amanda

Hi Amanda, im so sorry your doctor was so rude. You should complain about him to his administrator.

You could tell him that thyroid hormones are sometimes used to treat psychological problems.

Your iron levels are quite low. You're scraping the bottom of the range.

Your triglycerides are quite high. Do you have diabetes or are you eating lots of carbs? They'll also go high if you're actively losing lots of weight.

Your FT3 isn't as low as mine gets, but it isn't in the top 3rd of the range either. It could be an issue.

I'd definitely look into what is causing the high triglycerides and low iron.

Hi Nancy,

Thanks for responding!!! I welcome any and all comments!!!

On the triglycerides: I was a bit alarmed by that number, too! As far as I know, I don't have diabetes and - unfortunately - I'm not "actively losing lots of weight". If anything, I'm gaining.

As for the carbs... Well, I wouldn't say I'm eating "lots" of carbs, but more than is normal for a "low"-carber. I get these hypoglycaemic feelings (never measured the BG numbers, though) and/or get ravenously hungry. If I have a meal which is low in carbs or which contains virtually none, I end up feeling really spacey and weird a while later. It even wakes me up at night!!! I don't get up to eat, though.

As for the ferritin, I'm going to be getting some - hopefully - good iron tabs soon, which I ordered off iherb.com a few days ago. Somebody reviewing the product said it was the only thing which got her ferritin levels up.

Do you have any ideas what can cause high triglycerides and what can be done to reduce them? I know you're a big fan of Dr Davis and are probably more up on all these lipid profiles than I am.

Many thanks in advance,

amanda

Floradix is a GREAT product and my thyroid doctor has his low ferritin patients on that. Causes less stomach upset. Slow FE doesn't seem to be as 'nice' on the digestive tract and promotes more constipation (something you don't need in conjunction with flagging thyroid levels). And you know, it takes six months or more to bring up ferritin levels.

Yeah, I'd drop the ashwaghanda too for awhile, and if you KNOW of a doctor who Rx's Armour in Germany..I'd (and happily, too) wait for that appt.

I am in agreement with NancyLC (ah, we're mostly two thyroid minds who think alike in many aspects, lol) about the FT3. And that TSH..wow...that'd be making me try to crawl on the floor...not walk.

So...now...you need a doctor to 'help you sort' and the one you've labeled as the 'Armour Rx'er' would be my personal 'first choice'.

Fluoride ... if you've been consuming it mostly daily for more than just a few weeks, than stopping it day of test won't help...it's IN there...I went on a green tea thing one time long ago because friends told me 'you'll drop weight'. Hmmm. It dropped my T4 to T3 conversion...(but not any weight).

I know a bit about chemicals and the thyroid...my first go round with a bulging neck (and proptosis in the eyes) was brought about by my little hobby in the late 70's.... pyrotechnics. Perchlorate damage in the body...we think is what first 'triggered' me (although I already had a lengthy family history of Hashimoto's...I wasn't 'feeling it' yet).

So, heavy metals (Stop listening to those bands young lady?..no, just kidding, ha ha), chemicals like fluoride, perchlorates (you shouldn't have to worry too much about those unless you work in a dry cleaners or do large fireworks), even mundane things like soy (phytoestrogens) will 'alter' the thyroid (and the tests).

Best of luck to you! Keep on keeping on there...you know, here even with my thyroid doctor (who I don't see anymore, I'm pretty well seeing the immunologist and the pulmonologist now) it's a five MONTH wait unless it's an emergency...and I realize your situation is much more travel and all...but I'd rather wait for a great doctor than go to one who thinks the way leemack describes (and there's way too many of THOSE!).

Hi Pam,

Thanks again for your comments. I'll respond in more detail later, but just wanted to say thanks for now!

amanda

hey amanda, I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that high triglycerides are indicative of thyroid disease

That's what I thought, but apparently, my high triglycerides are not due to my thyroid being wonky, but due to my unstable psyche!!!

amanda