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  #1   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 09:58
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
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Posts: 7,582
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
Default Help for my sister

Wow, I had a shockeroo phone call this morning from my "baby" sister - age 58. She had a heart attack last night! She is in her small local hospital but is being taken by ambulance this morning to a larger hospital for an angiogram and possible stenting.

I can hardly believe it. This is the sister who is 6 feet tall and has never weighed more than 145, and only that "fat" since she hit menopause. Prior to that she never exceeded 125 pounds. She has done everything "right" per Conventional Wisdom. She is a pescatarian and has not eaten red meat in 50 years. She walks two miles every day. She goes to Tai Chi once a week. She eats lots of veggies. She has always been scrupulously careful about her diet.

Like me she does have Hashimoto's, but has only ever taken Synthroid for it. She worried that her cholesterol was high, but at last check it was 227, right in the sweet spot for women, with excellent ratios. She eats her good fats and takes coconut oil daily. Other than that she only uses butter and olive oil.

Now I'm worried they are going to push statins on her, and the whole low fat nine yards. Her doctor has been very mad at her for using coconut oil so will probably use that as an "I told you so" demand that she quit. I wish I knew why this happened to her, and how I can help her.

Anyone have an idea of good resources where I can start. I'm looking myself but extra ideas are way more than welcome.

Last edited by Merpig : Thu, Jan-28-16 at 10:43.
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  #2   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 10:43
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,843
 
Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
Default

I'm guessing she also eats lots of "healthy" whole-grains? How about Dr. Davis's book, "Wheat Belly"?

I'm sorry about your sister, though. :-(
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  #3   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 10:44
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
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Posts: 7,582
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
Default

True, she does eat lots of healthy whole grains.
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  #4   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 11:28
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bluesinger bluesinger is offline
Doing My Best
Posts: 4,924
 
Plan: LC/CancerRecovery
Stats: 170/135/130 Female 62 inches
BF:24%
Progress: 88%
Location: Nevada Desert, USA
Default

If I've learned anything from a lifetime of study into "why I'm fat," it's that everybody, including the doctors, are experimenting because nobody knows what is really happening. Study shows us what processes "should" be running and what "healthy" lifestyle medicine is, but none of that keeps what is really happening inside the individual from taking place.

Who knows? Nobody. Your sister could have a defect the doctors never saw because they didn't look. The electrical system of the heart sparks when it's supposed to - until it doesn't. The doctors are still trying to fix DH's AFIB with no success.

I'm sorry that you are experiencing this feeling of helplessness, and I hope your sister's recovery is quick.
g
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  #5   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 12:07
jschwab jschwab is offline
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Posts: 6,378
 
Plan: Atkins72/Paleo/NoGrain/IF
Stats: 285/220/200 Female 5 feet 5.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 76%
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I hope she feels better soon. And I hope you don't feel too guilty for your inevitable "Well now!" feelings because those are inevitable no matter how she's suffering or how scary it is. The reality is that no one can really predict or know and she probably is doing more damage than she thinks with those grains but the real, immediate thing now is all the stuff they will want to put her on. I don't really have any advice. I have a friend in the same boat and they put her on everything, just threw everything at her. She's in cognitive decline, IMO, from the meds and it's hard to watch.
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  #6   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 12:24
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Meme#1 Meme#1 is offline
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Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/194/160 Female 5'4"
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Progress: 32%
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesinger
Who knows? Nobody. Your sister could have a defect the doctors never saw because they didn't look. The electrical system of the heart sparks when it's supposed to - until it doesn't.


I just found out from the exam last week that I have a heart murmur...She asked if anyone had ever told me that and of course no, no one has...
Who knew?
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  #7   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 14:52
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is online now
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Posts: 5,283
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meme#1
I just found out from the exam last week that I have a heart murmur...She asked if anyone had ever told me that and of course no, no one has...
Who knew?


I was told the same thing the last time I saw my doctor for my annual exam and I was asked the same thing. My answer was the same as yours. Having gone through battery of heart tests a little over a decade ago for something that turned out to be nothing there is apparently no reason to be concerned about this or look into it further. I'm fine with that.

The truth is that there is simply a lot that medicine doesn't know and however healthy we believe our lifestyles to be something could always happen to any of us at any time. We can try to stack the odds in our favor but we simply can't prevent all bad things from happening.

I'm sorry about your sister. I hope she can stand up to the pressure to conform but that can be very hard to do.

Jean
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  #8   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 15:19
Nrracing Nrracing is offline
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Posts: 747
 
Plan: Custom 22/2 Clean Fast
Stats: 290/258/210 Male 72.5
BF:
Progress: 40%
Location: Missouri
Default

First I will say I am sorry to hear about your sister.

I think Since I have had a heart transplant, and have been through the mill on this I will tell you one thing. When it comes to heart docs, it still an up in the air thing when they are diagnosing an issue, and they cannot truly tell you what wrong. they can do the so called educated guess.

I used to be in the mind set of bigger people ( like I was) were the people that had heart problems, but that is not the case.

You all would not believe the stuff they say after you get your new heart. Things like, you can have some pizza, and a burger and fries. well I was like that but now I am far from it.

I also see many transplants get the new organ, and then the just go from a nice small size to hog wild and gain 50 plus pounds. For me that sad know that they will not take care of their selves knowing they received a gift that many will never have.
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  #9   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 16:06
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,370
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

Quote:
I wish I knew why this happened to her, and how I can help her.


First I send your sister good wishes for a speedy recovery and that you also can remain calm through this shock of unexpected news.

Dr. Malcolm Kendrick has put his thirty years of thinking about what causes heart disease to work just last week, writing a series on "so what does cause heart disease?" Only three parts up so far, but the story is...many different and seemingly unrelated immediate causes. (But not cholesterol) It needs an approach from another angle. http://drmalcolmkendrick.org

As I remember his book "The Great Cholesterol Con" he wound up where many doctors were before the lipid hypothesis..with stress. But stress of the societal or psychological kind, the displaced peoples of Finland being an example. While Keys would point to high fat consumption in the country, Finland had absorbed large numbers of other non-Finn ethnic groups; who could not get jobs, no way to support their families, no one could speak the language, they were outsiders, struggling to find a place in society.

Last edited by JEY100 : Thu, Jan-28-16 at 18:10.
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  #10   ^
Old Thu, Jan-28-16, 19:46
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
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Posts: 7,582
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
Default

Well more to investigate. My sister had an angiogram, and they found NO sign of heart damage, no blockages of any sort, all her arteries were perfectly clean and clear. Some googling indicates there could still be something called coronary microvascular disease which seems to be more common in women, however.
http://myheartsisters.org/2010/04/2...omen-blockages/
Quote:
Problematically, coronary microvascular arteries are too small to detect with the standard cardiac tests that cardiologists would normally use to see larger vessels, so women in particular are often dismissed and sent home with a misdiagnosis in spite of severe and distressing cardiac symptoms.

For example, in typical patients with coronary artery disease, coronary angiography – considered the ‘gold standard’ of cardiac diagnostics – usually shows a clearly blocked artery that slows blood flow to the heart muscle.

But in patients with coronary microvascular disease, these test results are completely normal – even though symptoms may be as debilitating as those experienced during a heart attack.

Dr. Noel Bairey Merz adds that angiograms that would clearly spot blockages in major heart arteries can miss coronary microvascular disease altogether. As a result, many women who have gone to their doctors with chest pain have gone home with a clean bill of heath – and most likely feeling very embarrassed for having made a fuss over nothing. She says:

“Historically, women have been told that it was in their head.”
<sigh> and good hearts was the one thing I thought our family had won in the genetic lottery. Lots of cancer in the family but no one - parents, grandparents, great grandparents, cousins, aunts, uncles, etc had ever had a heart attack - except for one cousin who was living in NYC where he was heavily into smoking, drinking, cocaine, and riotous living in general, which we figured was his cause (and that was 30 years ago and he is a reformed character now).
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  #11   ^
Old Fri, Jan-29-16, 07:47
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leemack leemack is offline
NEVER GIVING UP!
Posts: 5,030
 
Plan: no sugar/grains LCHF IF
Stats: 478/354/200 Female 5' 9"
BF:excessive!!
Progress: 45%
Location: UK
Default

So sorry about your sister, Debbie, I hope she feels better soon.

Are her docs investigating for coronary microvascular disease? If not they need to be pushed to.
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  #12   ^
Old Sat, Jan-30-16, 10:52
Merpig's Avatar
Merpig Merpig is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 7,582
 
Plan: EF/Fung IDM/keto
Stats: 375/225.4/175 Female 66.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 75%
Location: NE Florida
Default

Well my sister is home now and happy to be there. After all the testing the cardiologist says she didn't have a "heart attack" in the classic sense, but something known colloquially as "broken heart syndrome", or stress-induced cardiomyopathy or takotsubo cardiomyopathy, which happens to people with an otherwise perfectly healthy heart after a great shock or stress - even a *good* shock like winning the lottery can cause it! It happens primarily (90% of the cases) to post-menopausal women.

Apparently it can even be fatal in rare cases, but assuming it's not, the person who experiences it makes a full recovery, and their heart is still healthy and undamaged.

The cardiologist said my sister's heart is in such good condition that he would trade hearts with her any day.

He said that in such cases he would normally prescribe a statin since her cholesterol is slightly elevated, but since her HDL is very high, tri's very low, and her heart looks perfect he wasn't going to prescribe them. (or as my sister said to me, "good, because I would never take a statin anyway, and now I have good ammunition if any other doctor ever tries to force them on me")

He said she may feel tired and weak for a day or two as it take a little while for the heart to fall back into its normal rhythm, but said she would be perfectly okay to go back to work on Monday.

However my sister says it's work that caused the issue. She's been under stress there and on Thursday was in a meeting where she said she felt "betrayed" and that she had been "thrown under the bus". I have no more details as she can't talk about it, that just thinking about it makes her heart start to race again! But she is already writing a letter of resignation, effective immediately!

But it was while driving home from the meeting that she developed this terrible crushing pain in her chest - which is apparently how this syndrome manifests, fairly acute onset not too long after the stressful event that triggered it.

See: http://www.webmd.com/heart/features...-cardiomyopathy

My sister now credits her 50 years of a near vegetarian diet as the reason her heart is in otherwise excellent shape.
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  #13   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-16, 05:32
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is online now
Posts: 13,370
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

Good info to know, connected to what Dr Kendrick wrote about years ago.
Thank you for the update, glad she is doing better and it was not a heart attack. Taking some time to consider all her options may help her accept whatever changes are ahead with less stress. Consulting with an employment attorney before resigning may benefit her heart health as well as job. She certainly has a valid reason to take a week sick leave and review options when can do so without becoming stressed.

Last edited by JEY100 : Sun, Jan-31-16 at 06:02.
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  #14   ^
Old Sun, Jan-31-16, 09:18
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Seejay Seejay is offline
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Posts: 3,025
 
Plan: Optimal Diet
Stats: 00/00/00 Female 62 inches
BF:
Progress: 8%
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Wow Debbie. Glad you could be a sounding board for your sister. And good to know her heart is so otherwise healthy! scary thoug. I didn't know about microvascular so thanks for sharing.
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