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  #1   ^
Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 10:07
aj_cohn's Avatar
aj_cohn aj_cohn is offline
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Default Poverty promotes obesity, studies find

Hope this isn't a repeat.

URL: http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/ht...43_obese01.html
Quote:
Poverty promotes obesity, studies find

By Barbara Anderson

McClatchy Newspapers

(FRESNO, Calif.) The smaller the paycheck, the bigger the belly, say many researchers who study poverty and obesity. It might seem like a paradox, but not having enough money for food doesn't mean the poor are skinny. The opposite appears to be true: The lower-income are more likely to be heavy than the well-to-do.

"Obesity is an economic issue," said Cyndi Walter, manager for the California Department of Public Health obesity-prevention program, Project LEAN. Eating well is beyond the reach of many California residents, she said. Health experts say there is no shortage of reasons why poverty is a predictor for obesity — even stress and hopelessness could be factors. Overall, it comes down to food options: Poverty not only limits choices, but also can discourage healthy decisions that have little to do with money, they say.

For starters, the low-income tend to live in neighborhoods that are flush with fast-food restaurants and convenience stores that sell mostly junk foods, the experts say. Supermarkets are few — and the fresh fruits, vegetables and lean meats they carry are more expensive than hamburgers, French fries and sodas. The low-income "are buying what's available to them and affordable to them," said Genoveva Islas-Hooker, regional program coordinator for the Central California Regional Obesity Prevention Program. People still are responsible for making the healthiest food choices possible, she said. But there, too, poverty's powers are hard to ignore.

HABITS START YOUNG

Food habits begin in childhood, Islas-Hooker said. "You grow up in a household where there is limited economic means and your caregiver is purchasing food on what they can afford," she said. "You become ingrained in that type of diet and that type of pattern."

Carmen Solorvano, 30, of southeast Fresno, Calif., grew up in a big family. There wasn't a lot of money for fresh fruits and vegetables and lean cuts of meat. Meals were mostly spaghetti, tacos, rice, beans, potatoes — starchy foods. Solorvano cooks those same foods today. "I'm used to cooking and eating the way I was raised, when I was small," she said. She would like to fix healthier meals. She is 100 pounds overweight and her doctor has warned her she needs to lose weight. But money for healthy foods and time to prepare them are hard to come by.

Solorvano is a part-time food-service assistant. Her husband works part time at odd jobs. The family's combined income is about $900 a month, and they receive food stamps. Solorvano attends classes at Fresno City College in child development. She wants to become an assistant Head Start teacher. By the time she rushes home from picking her children up from school, she has to leave for class. Meals have to be quick — and cheap, she said.

FATTY, SALTY AND SWEET

Foods high in fat and carbohydrates and those full of sugar are cheap, energy-dense, nutrient poor — and filling, said Edie Jessup, a program development specialist who works with Islas-Hooker at the obesity-prevention project. Giving children a package of Top Ramen is an inexpensive, quick meal, Jessup said. "And because it's more carbohydrates, it makes your child feel like they've had more," she said. Fats and sugars make foods taste good, too. "We really like fat, salty and sweet," Jessup said.

Some even suspect the foods are addictive. A number of studies are looking at the physical response to such foods, according to the California Department of Public Health. The department says introducing fats and sugars to children early isn't recommended by pediatricians. They suggest giving infants pureed vegetables before pureed fruits so they can develop a taste for the vegetables and not reject them in favor of the sweeter fruit tastes, the department says.

Researchers who study the relationship between income and poverty speculate that some of the food choices made by the poor are not strictly cost-driven. When you're living paycheck-to-paycheck, making a healthy food choice "is just not the highest priority in life," said Paul Leigh, an expert on health and labor economics and a professor at the Center for Healthcare Policy and Research at the University of California at Davis.

Leigh is senior author of a new study that found minimum-wage workers are more likely to be obese than people who earn higher wages. People who live on minimum wages have fewer options than higher-wage earners, Leigh said. "There is a direct causal relationship between the wages low-income people receive and their risk of obesity," he said. But there also is an indirect emotional reaction. Living in poverty also involves stress, Leigh said. "With a certain amount of stress and unhappiness, you want to have some quick reward," he said. A sugary soda, for example, can provide a cheap, quick emotional lift.

THE FAST-FOOD SOLUTION

By the same token, fast-food restaurants provide an outlet for low-income families: The food is cheap, it tastes good, and there is free entertainment for the children. "The kids love it," Leigh said. People with higher incomes can be selective about restaurants, he said.

Solorvano, the southeast Fresno mother, considers it a treat to take her children — ages 14, 8 and 6 — to McDonald's. The children look forward to it, she said. "They see other people and they go to McDonald's," she said. "They want to fit in." Islas-Hooker understands the draw to fast food. The restaurants are hard to ignore when they're on every corner, a grocery store is several miles away and children are hungry. And the Valley's immigrant population sees images on television of happy people eating hamburgers and fries and drinking sodas, she said. "There's the psychology of the new immigrants wanting to fit in, and part of how they fit in to the new American society is adopting the diet."

In some cases, eating out or serving processed foods may be the only option for a family. The stove in the apartment may not work, they don't have pots and pans to use. They don't know how to cook. "Half of the story is about people making smarter decisions," Islas-Hooker said. "But make sure healthy options are there."

The obesity epidemic among the poor has very little to do with individual motivation or even genetics or metabolism, said Dr. Adam Drewnowski, director of the Center for Public Health Nutrition at the University of Washington. He has specialized in the relationship between poverty and obesity for the past decade. "Obesity is an expression of limited resources," he said. "Solutions really lie in education, instruction, access to healthy foods and being able to afford healthy foods."

Copyright © The Seattle Times Company
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  #2   ^
Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 10:26
Carne!'s Avatar
Carne! Carne! is offline
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That is so true. The poorer someone is the fatter they tend to be (in general). Now the 64,000 question. Why are people poor? A big part of it is they make bad choices and have no future time orientation (yes, external factors play into the picture, but does not amount to 100% of the answer).

So is obesity a side effect of poverty? or a side effect of poor future time orientation of which poverty is also a side effect?

I assume the answer is complicated and different for individuals.
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  #3   ^
Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 12:19
HappyLC HappyLC is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carne!
...Why are people poor? A big part of it is they make bad choices and have no future time orientation (yes, external factors play into the picture, but does not amount to 100% of the answer).


That is exactly right. I read this story in my local paper just this morning...

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...ility-1.1971962

Quote:
Less than two years ago, Rachel Perales made $35,000 a year at a human resources company. She took the kids on vacation, drove a sport utility vehicle, lived in a pleasant three-bedroom apartment.

"I considered myself middle class," said Perales, 35.

Her path from the middle class to desperate poverty began when she was laid off in December 2008. Then-living in Orlando, Fla., Perales moved back in with friends in Westbury, but there wasn't enough room or money for her four children.


I read this and was just shocked. My husband and I had very little money when we were first married. We NEVER went on vacation, we drove a crappy used car, and we lived in a crappy 2 bedroom walk-up over a store. And we were making about the same amount of money, taking inflation into account. We spent as little as possible and put everything into the bank. We probably might have ended up on welfare, too, if we had spent money they way she did.

(I don't mean to take this thread off track, it's just been eating at me all day.)

(Edited: so it would make sense, lol.)

Last edited by HappyLC : Wed, Jun-02-10 at 13:10.
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  #4   ^
Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 17:45
Carne!'s Avatar
Carne! Carne! is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyLC
That is exactly right. I read this story in my local paper just this morning...

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...ility-1.1971962



I read this and was just shocked. My husband and I had very little money when we were first married. We NEVER went on vacation, we drove a crappy used car, and we lived in a crappy 2 bedroom walk-up over a store. And we were making about the same amount of money, taking inflation into account. We spent as little as possible and put everything into the bank. We probably might have ended up on welfare, too, if we had spent money they way she did.

(I don't mean to take this thread off track, it's just been eating at me all day.)

(Edited: so it would make sense, lol.)


OMG i read stories like this all the time. It really is depressing, the way people deal with their money. I live in a lower middle class apt complex in Miami Beach. Due to the depression/housing bubble, the last apt (high price 350k) went for 70k. Our new neighbors have both a Hummer and a Range Rover. WTF is wrong with that picture!?

Oh wait, they're "homeowners" (5k down on a 100k condo paying 30% on a NINJ [no job no income] loan that's gonna reset. YAY DEBT!

While I feel for those that make poor choices, sometimes the solution lies within. Slang for junk food is sh*t. Maybe don't eat sh*t? I dunno....not hard to put 2 and 2 together.

Of course it does not help that our government is in bed with big agriculture. It's embarrassing that science and conventional wisdom from the early 1900s-2010 is still being ignored while we are being turned into a printing press for agri-business, human health/cost be damned.
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  #5   ^
Old Fri, Jun-04-10, 10:07
mathmaniac mathmaniac is offline
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There's something about our society that makes it important to have just about everything you can possibly have. Even if you can't afford it.

It's gotten so that I don't know - and haven't known for a long time - any couple or family that has just one car, for example. Why anyone ever complains about bad public transportation, I don't know, since the only people I ever see on the local bus look like they crossed the border and are here illegally!

If I were poor, would I spend my money at McDonald's instead of buying meat at the supermarket? Probably. I'm looking at tags on packages of meat that say, 16 plus dollars, not for a huge amount. Requiring preparation and time and delivering not all that much.

You can eat more cheaply if you cook at home, and you will eat healthier food. But you will eat a lot of beans if you are on a budget. McDonald's will look mighty good to you after a steady diet of cheap home food.
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  #6   ^
Old Fri, Jun-04-10, 11:22
Carne!'s Avatar
Carne! Carne! is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathmaniac
There's something about our society that makes it important to have just about everything you can possibly have. Even if you can't afford it.

It's gotten so that I don't know - and haven't known for a long time - any couple or family that has just one car, for example. Why anyone ever complains about bad public transportation, I don't know, since the only people I ever see on the local bus look like they crossed the border and are here illegally!

If I were poor, would I spend my money at McDonald's instead of buying meat at the supermarket? Probably. I'm looking at tags on packages of meat that say, 16 plus dollars, not for a huge amount. Requiring preparation and time and delivering not all that much.

You can eat more cheaply if you cook at home, and you will eat healthier food. But you will eat a lot of beans if you are on a budget. McDonald's will look mighty good to you after a steady diet of cheap home food.


I get what you're saying but can't say I agree 100% (except for the bus problem- if you're intersted you should read about GM and other car companies buying up the subways/trolley systems in San Fran and other places in order to destroy them, not to mention the incessant lobbying to make this a car centric country).

Anyway...i digress. My family, especially when I was younger was fairly not well off, not to mention we lived in Peru. However, the food my mom and grandma cooked was delicious. It was very carb heavy (potatoes and rice are staples in Peru) but it was definitely much tastier than McD's and a whole lot healthier too.

I nice cheap cut of meat, tenderized and fried...a good serving of long grain white rice with a fried egg on top. YUM!!!
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  #7   ^
Old Wed, Jun-16-10, 09:56
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Merpig Merpig is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyLC
I read this and was just shocked. My husband and I had very little money when we were first married. We NEVER went on vacation, we drove a crappy used car, and we lived in a crappy 2 bedroom walk-up over a store.
I do think you are being awfully hard on this poor woman though. What do we *really* know about her? Not to mention the the reporter might easily have "puffed up" her assets to contrast them sharply with her letter poverty. We don't *know*, for example, what sort of car she drove. It might easily have been a used and economical Honda CR-V. Just calling her car a Sport Utility Vehicle does not imply she drove a brand-new enormous gas-guzzler. And "vacations" does not mean 3-week trips to Europe either. Maybe it means weekends at the beach, or a camping trip. I don't think there is anything the least bit wrong with a mother wanting to do things for her kids. I was a single mom and I took my son on vacations every year. We didn't spend fortunes, but I felt it was important to get away and see and do other things.

You seem to denigrate her seemingly nice apartment too. If she could pay the rent what is wrong with a nice homelife for your children? So much depends on the area of the country, or the country, where you live as well. I could rent a lovely 3-BR apartment in the Jacksonville, FL area (where my son is moving) for a monthly rent that would barely rent me a garage here in NJ.

I don't think MOST of us base our lifestyles on the idea that he might get laid off at any minute. Well maybe many of us do now in the current economic climate. Heck, I was just laid off myself - last day of work was May 31. But a couple years ago I don't think most people were thinking that way.
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  #8   ^
Old Wed, Jun-16-10, 13:25
HappyLC HappyLC is offline
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Making a nice life for your children doesn't hinge on an apartment in the suburbs, vacations, etc. If you have no savings and must go on welfare as soon as you lose your job, then you have been living above your means. We - and our two children - lived in a small, four room, three-story walk-up over a store in Queens. We pounded every penny into savings, my husband went to school after work, and eventually we were able to move up. But a lost job would not have meant welfare...not for a very long time. And we had a wonderful family life because we gave our kids ourselves, not things.
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Old Wed, Jun-16-10, 14:04
mathmaniac mathmaniac is offline
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HappyLC,
I think the key to your post is the phrase, 'If you have no savings....' Who cares how you live or where you live if your choices and discipline make it possible to save. Anything that interferes with that is what causes problems.

A house is not savings. Not if it has a mortgage you won't be able to afford. Even mutual funds are not savings - sorry to say. Keeping most of your savings in CDs, I guess that would be safe. But there has to be that SOMETHING that keeps you afloat in desperate times.
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Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 10:48
Altari Altari is offline
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I definitely understand the logic when you combine all the factors. Someone my age who is poor and has children probably doesn't know how to cook. I'm long past the point of surprise when a friend says, "How did you make that? It's like something from a restaurant!"

We can't solve the problem of poverty, at least not on a large scale. We can solve the problem of not knowing how to cook. Rachael Ray and Jamie Oliver may not suggest food that we LCers think is healthy, but it's definitely a huge step up from boxed Mac n' Cheese, Rice-a-Roni and McDonald's.

The government yammers on about the obesity epidemic, poverty and malnutrition in children. To steal from Carne, the $64,000 question is: why isn't the government fixing the obvious problem?
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Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 11:02
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KarenJ KarenJ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altari
The government yammers on about the obesity epidemic, poverty and malnutrition in children. To steal from Carne, the $64,000 question is: why isn't the government fixing the obvious problem?


I was standing in line behind a single mom who was using food stamps, and practically everything she was buying was carb overload. The fact that the government is misleading her into buying poison had less impact on me than the fact that the future generation (her kids) are being robbed and brainwashed in their nutritional education. We expect the government to educate the people and this is what we get: uneducated people.


Quote:
Foods high in fat and carbohydrates and those full of sugar are cheap, energy-dense, nutrient poor — and filling, said Edie Jessup, a program development specialist


That's a problem right there. The "specialist" does not recognize that those carbohydrate foods are NOT "filling"--- they in fact MAKE YOU HUNGRIER! And again they complain about the fat.... (antidote)
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Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 11:10
Altari Altari is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarenJ
I was standing in line behind a single mom who was using food stamps, and practically everything she was buying was carb overload. The fact that the government is misleading her into buying poison had less impact on me than the fact that the future generation (her kids) are being robbed and brainwashed in their nutritional education. We expect the government to educate the people and this is what we get: uneducated people.

Of course it was. That's the only thing that's shelf stable and easy to prepare.

TBH, our basement pantry is filled with the "bad stuff." We live in the middle of nowhere, so inclement weather greatly affects our ability to get "real food."

So, when you don't know how to cook and your choices are a healthy roasted chicken from the deli (which you can't buy with foodstamps, of course) or 5 boxes of boil-n-serve dinner (which you can buy with foodstamps)...the decision is clear.

I really feel bad for them. But, like you said, I feel worse for their kids.
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  #13   ^
Old Fri, Jun-04-10, 08:25
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TheCaveman TheCaveman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KarenJ
We expect the government to educate the people and this is what we get: uneducated people.

Hi Karen, speak for yourself. YOU expect the government to educate the people.

At some point in this conversation--like all others we have here about the government--is that we have no policy model anywhere to effectively allow a government to "educate" people about health. The only model that has any evidence of working is the regulatory model. Varying degrees of regulation. We have hundreds of years of hundreds of countries worth of data.

You might even agree with me that any education along these lines would be futile, especially in America. If the government educated us that we should eat less sugar (it does), would we (we don't)?

Why does the government need to educate the people when it has the power to regulate? Why do food corporations advocate diet education the same way you do?

So, why doesn't the government do something? The food corporations that have selected your government don't want the government to do something.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carne!
Why are people poor? A big part of it is they make bad choices and have no future time orientation (yes, external factors play into the picture, but does not amount to 100% of the answer).

So is obesity a side effect of poverty? or a side effect of poor future time orientation of which poverty is also a side effect?

I assume the answer is complicated and different for individuals.

Why did everyone ignore this?

Carne, what is "future time orientation"? Is it anything like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discounted_cash_flow , where it is a presumption of human behavior that the future is heavily discounted to the present? (Folks: "I can't resist this cupcake, even though I KNOW it will make me fat." "Impulse control", etc.)
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Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 11:46
Carne!'s Avatar
Carne! Carne! is offline
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Plan: Atkins OWL Rung 4/ IF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altari

We can't solve the problem of poverty, at least not on a large scale. We can solve the problem of not knowing how to cook. Rachael Ray and Jamie Oliver may not suggest food that we LCers think is healthy, but it's definitely a huge step up from boxed Mac n' Cheese, Rice-a-Roni and McDonald's.



I would completely agree. Most people did not get fat from eating meat and potatoes back in the good old days. It was the introduction of HFCS and wheat based non food (to replace "real food") that has really messed us up. Asians have done well on a high carb diet (rice) for centuries, but now many Chinese and Koreans (especially in the cities) are facing obesity due to the fact that sugar and wheat products have began to take over their supermarkets. When I lived in Seoul, I was amazed at the amount of sugar those kids ate.

I have a feeling it's not so much the carbs in general that make us really fat (not that high carb is optimal), it is the sugar and the wheat and mostly the Junk Food.
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Old Wed, Jun-02-10, 12:12
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rpavich rpavich is offline
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Personally, I think the studies' findings are accurate and their reason or connection from one to another is bull crap.

When I was poor, I was on food stamps (I believe it was called Aid to dependant children) at the time...I could have bought healthy things...nobody twisted my arm....I bought what I liked to eat....Just as I do now that I have more money than I used to have.

Personal responsibility...that's what it comes down to.

A whole chicken at Kroger is .88 per lb most of the time, and it's been .55 a lb recently. If somebody doesn't buy one but buys a box of ho ho's instead...who's fault is that?
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