The funny thing is we have Vegetarian low carbers here and a forum for those who wish to follow low carb in a vegetarian way. Low carbing and being vegetarian or vegan aren't necessarily mutually exclusive of each other.
I personally happen to enjoy being an omnivore, but if meat isn't your thing you can still be a successful low carber.
I do find myself wondering what would motivate someone to obviously spend so much time and effort focusing on proving a way of eating to be unhealthy and to come to a forum that supports low carb to specifically argue against it in the face of so many people who are obviously doing well/thriving on this WOL.
Everyone is entitled to their opinion and is free to express it in a respectful way, but I don't go around preaching low carb to my low fat friends, co-workers and family. If they ask, fine, but I'm not trying to convert anyone. This works well for me and for a lot of other people too. If you can lose weight, feel good and stay healthy on low fat...go for it, but that doesn't make the rest of us wrong, especially when a lot of us have already tried that route and found that it's not the way for us.

Lisa, thanks for bringing this up b/c I started thinking about it after I posted.

I was a vegetarian for 17 years, and not once did I tell anyone else how they should live their lives. Now I am an onmivore and still don't tell others how they should live their lives.

It's about respecting individuality.

Wanda

I keep wondering why some people have this urgent need to tell others how they should live their lives?
There are so many ways to hurt/try to hurt someone.
I've recently moved from Sweden to Germany where my husband got a great job but so far I haven't found any "real work", with salary..you know what I mean. I always worked before.
I take care of the household, reed tons of books, learn german, travel...etc. I have a life.
To the point: I am frequently harrassed by "working" people, asking stupid question, trying to hurt me, trying to tell me how miserable my life is.
"Oh, what do you do all day?"
"Since you have sooo much spare time, could you bake my favourite swedish cakes for me?" *true*
"Don't you feel useless not having a job?"

And now someone wants to put me down about lowcarbing.
The answer is: Get of my life, find your own!

Alina

Okay so your doctor tells you one thing,
My doctor said, Go LC, he told me to research, find what was best for me and let him know. When I went to see him 4 months later I lost 17 more pounds, the fastest I ever lost, my Insulin level was 9, and my cholesterol levels were great.
Tanya

This is from an educational website, basic metabolism course, unrelated to weight or diets. Reading it carefully you will discover that carbs (insulin) are responsible for high production of cholesterol..

http://www.indstate.edu/thcme/mwkin...ml#introduction

Since the intracellular level of cAMP is regulated by hormonal stimuli, regulation of cholesterol biosynthesis is hormonally controlled. Insulin leads to a decrease in cAMP, which in turn activates cholesterol synthesis. Alternatively, glucagon and epinephrine, which increase the level of cAMP, inhibit cholesterol synthesis.
The ability of insulin to stimulate, and glucagon to inhibit, HMG-CoA reductase activity is consistent with the effects of these hormones on other metabolic pathways. The basic function of these two hormones is to control the availability and delivery of energy to all cells of the body.
Long-term control of HMG-CoA reductase activity is exerted primarily through control over the synthesis and degradation of the enzyme. When levels of cholesterol are high, the level of expression of the HMG-CoA reductase gene is reduced. Conversely, reduced levels of cholesterol activate expression of the gene. Insulin also brings about long-term regulation of cholesterol metabolism by increasing the level of HMG-CoA reductase synthesis. The rate of HMG-CoA turn-over is also regulated by the supply of cholesterol. When cholesterol is abundant, the rate of HMG-CoA reductase degradation increases.



danny

It's so sad that some people purposely set out to be just down right nasty. I agree with Ikonzelman no need for us to give this person that much power as they are obviously misinformed to say the least.

HN

and just call her NUT!

Yes I get discouraged but I did get discouraged also after two years paying out the wallet and starving on Weight Watchers while I lost 25 lbs. I got off of it and gained back 18 in three months!
My husband has a BIG family with a BIG history of heart disease. He has lost 5 of his 9 siblings. He had been on Blood Pressure and Cholesterol meds for three years. The numbers did NOT go down, all the meds did was make him tired and tax his liver. The CARDIOLOGIST said "thumbs up" on the Atkins diet for the reasons of Cholesterol and BP. And guess what? After only a few months, the numbers are G R E A T and he has been OFF his meds with a 20 lb. weight loss as a bonus.
So butt out Buckwheat and go eat your wild hickory nuts.

Just a reminder to all to please remember the "No Flames" rule. While it's fine to debate and point out the flaws in another person's arguments pro or con, it's not acceptable to resort to direct personal insults.

Please review the Sticky thread at the top of this forum, titled "The War Zone. Please read before posting here.", and also the Forum Rules, which you can find from the Quick Links column to the right of the page.

thanks,

Doreen

All I know is this:

I have the paperwork from my last three lipid profiles. One was from January of 2002, before I began Atkins (in March). One is from September of 2002 and another from November 2002.

My January paperwork is the worst lipid profile of the three. By September, my triglycerides had dropped over 150 points. Since I am a heart patient, this was a critical improvement - see the book Syndrome X for explanation.

By November, my whole profile was even better than before and my doctor had joined me on the Atkins diet.

First hand experience, while it may only apply to myself, is proof enough that the diet works for me.

I've tried the whole grain low fat route and in one year I lost 26 pounds it's true, but then I started gaining again. I then decided to try Atkins not only have I started to lose again but in the 5 weeks I've been on it I have had no symptons of IBS and my blood pressure has come down. For the first time in 40 years I have gone 5 weeks without some kind of abdominal discomfort. I am quite happy for you to follow the WOE of your choice, but I have never felt so well and no way would I go off the Atkins. If we low carbers are so convinced in the low carb way there is a reason. Go and rant on a nutri nut board I for one am not interested.

A couple of points:

Blood pressure and cholesterol levels can be lowered by losing weight. So it is not accurate to claim that the reduction in these levels is due to eating lower carbs. It's a result of losing weight.

I have been doing research on low-carb eating and am reading "Atkins for Life."

I have been eating low-carb for several weeks now. The weight is not falling off, but I do feel better overall. I had blood drawn Friday to check my cholesterol, so that should be interesting. I will report back with the results.

Gaining weight back after dieting is not unique to any specific type of "diet" plan. It happens because people start eating more calories than they are burning.

I am NOT "putting down" eating low carb. I'm doing it myself (unless it proves more harmful in time). What concerns me is the cultic attitude of some who aren't even OPEN to discussion or considering ALL the information and research. I am researching and reading, so I am keeping my mind open. Are you?

And....I have studied biology, and I know that genetics plays a HUGE role in how our bodies metabolize food. To deny that is simply ignorance.

It isn't the dieters who deny a genetic link, it's the medics. I don't know in the USA but in Britain one hears, 'If a family is overweight they eat too much'. 'It is nothing to do with metabolism, it's over-eating'. 'It doen't matter how little you THINK you eat, you must eat LESS to lose weight'. 'It's a matter of arithmetic, you must consume more calories than you eat to lose weight'. I could go on but do not want to bore you!
I know that I don't process carbohydates like my brother does. At 60 he the same size that he was at 20 and has a diet very high in carbohydrates. I take after my paternal grandmother.
We low carbers know that genetics are involved but we also know that low carbohydrate, with unlimited fat and protein works for us. I do not consider myself a fanatic, after 40 years of battling with my weight I know what works for me. I get annoyed when I'm told that the way I eat, which keeps me well, and my weight down is not healthy. It has been proved that millions on diets like that Atkins are much healthier.

I don't know which medics you are referring to, but the latest studies indicate a link between genetics and weight. It's the reason why my tooth-pick friend can consume more calories than I do, not exercise, and yet stay very thin while I eat much less than she does, exercise, and am not half as thin as she is. Obviously, it's not SOLELY an issue of "eating more calories than you burn."

I may agree that a low carb diet helps reduce weight (although it's not doing much for me right now); however, to suggest that eating fat is actually good for you is another story. I have read studies and reports that say just the opposite. Furthermore, no long-term studies have been done on those who eat low-carb, high protein and high fat diets. So we do not know what the long-term effects are.

If you are losing or maintaining your weight and have good blood pressure, cholesterol, and lipid levels, then whatever you are doing IS healthy. However, that doesn't mean it will be a healthy way of life for everyone else. That is my main argument with some on this board. There seems to be this attitude that it's a fact that healthy eating for everyone includes a diet of high fat/protein and low carbs.

You just have to read through the post on any low carb forum to see that people are doing fine for long periods on low carb. I have read about people who have been on the diet for 18 years and are healthy. As I have said to you before, some people stay well on the whole food vegetarian path and others do well on Atkins. A greek doctor many hundreds of years ago said 'one man's meat is another man's poison'. Nobody seems to be trying to force their ideas on anyone except you. I think it is a fact that you can find scientific studies to back up nearly anything. The medics I refer to are the mainstream British medical opinion. However even the British have had their ground breakers and I refer you to a book first written in 1958 by Dr Richard Markarness 'Eat Fat and Grow Slim'. It is on line. He opened the first Obesity clinic in England and also did some of the first research in how the food we eat can affect the mind. Ref. 'Not All in the Mind'. I agree that loosing weight can cause the blood pressure to go down, but first of all you have to use it and the fact remains, for the first time in 40 years, many spent on a low fat, whole food vegetarian diet, I do not suffer from any symptoms of IBS.

Reading about the long-term experiences of some dieters on a web site isn't scientific.

And I'm not sure how you can claim I'm trying to force my views on anyone.

Whatever.