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  #3641   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 20:31
ItsTheWooo's Avatar
ItsTheWooo ItsTheWooo is offline
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Plan: My Own
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
Insulin is not a 'protein' per se, it is a high activity hormone which is destroyed by stomach acid- as are a great many biologically active agents. Please, do not trumpet your ignorance

Time for someone to actually learn what hormones are made of!
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  #3642   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 20:34
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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Might I point out that the bogus results pointing to 'glycogen depletion ' are based entirely on a HIGH CARB diet? Zero-carb results utilising the same tests show no depletion takes place.

Hormones are 'made of' many kinds of molecules, the most important ones are based on cholesterol.
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  #3643   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 20:38
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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Yes- excess caloric intake over daily requirements on a zero-carb regime is ejected from the body as waste. Uneconomic this may well be. However, it is much easier to eat your meals without having to count the calories. If you are very poor then you might want to go to the trouble of measuring everything- the major difficulty is finding out what the energy requirement actually is for each day. 75% of the stomach surfaced produces hydrochloric acid, which dissolves meat, and does so very quickly. The enzymes needed for vegetation are slow to secrete, and the remaining 25% of the surface is divided between several enzymatic systems. The pylorus responds to acidity and several other indicators as to when to open and allow the stomach contents to exit into the duodenum. This occurs about 45 min to one hour with a pure meat meal and up to 3-4 hours after an mixed or vegetable meal. Once the stomach is called upon to produce enzyme systems, it continues to do so after emptying, and this can cause distress and 'hunger pangs' experienced in the stomach region. When adapted to straight meat, the stomach relaxes and rests until the next feeding, no matter how long the interval.

Peanuts are toxic, as is wheat (most of the toxins are in the bran and germ). Yes macadamia nut oil is the lowest fluid oil in unsats.

If a person does not like what I have to say, why waste my, and everyone else's time on constant point by point dissension? It will not deter me nor anyone who is seriously interested in getting normal. I already know you are in deep denial about the real diet, so why not let go: Stay fat, get a life.

Interesting: If grass appears to be the same as 'red', you have what is called as red-green colour blindness, the most common kind. Yellow and blue will be the only 'real' colours for you, and you will see lots of 'beige'.

Coronary blockage is due to scar tissues and infiltrated adipose cells to buffer it. While starvation (severe fasting) may collapses the fat cells, nothing in diet will reduce the scar tissue. MY blockage dated from my teens. Of course YOU are more prepared to judge that than both the top cardiologist in Australia at the time, and one of the world's finest heart surgeons? Both confirmed the blockage as dating from my early teen years. Angina has been demonstrated in 10 year olds with congenital conditions. There is no time/age constraint for insufficient circulation to the heart muscles.

Of course you don't think all meat is healthy, that is a salient denial feature of intense, resistant acculturation. Please, don't bother complaining and offering whinging excuses as to why you cannot go this way. I said previously that this path is so difficult that 99.999% of people will never be able to overcome their acculturation and permanently adopt it. You have to have nearly superhuman will power and determination. Most people have neither to any large degree.

People who have bypass surgery are put on a low fat, high carb diet and surprise, surprise! Most require another bypass inside of 5-10 years. When I was in prep for my operation, I met men there for a third and even fourth bypass. Two started with a quadruple at less than age 39. Carbs are truly your deadliest enemy. There are reports of autopsies on very young kids killed in accidents which supports this very early commencement of arterial damage. Children showed the precursors of coronary blockage as young as 9 or 10, serious signs by 15. The autopsies of young (18-20) soldiers killed in Korea already showed established lesions. No Inuit who died after living his entire life on all meat was ever found by autopsy to have even the slightest trace of coronary obstruction.

But the doctors treating cancer DO work on the 'black box' principle- they really don't know exactly how much radiation or chemo (even which chemo) is correct for each case. The know only that if they give you the maximum the body can accept and stay alive they can cure, say, 40% of patients. They know if they give you a considered amount of a certain chemo agent the cure rate can rise to 80%. Each cancer is different, some cannot be done in by the max and some might let go with less than half. This is 'black box' medicine at its purest. Which is why western medicine is better than 'alternative' so far as cancer is concerned- it has proven, 'black box' results.
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  #3644   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 20:47
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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I am not speaking from ground zero based on my own experiences alone. Over the last 47 years I have interacted with literally hundreds of people of all body types and cultures. I have had plenty of 'coalface' experience in diet, exercise and health. I do not feel that I am in any way unqualified to advise any and all people, on the internet or anywhere else, about the reality of the human diet. The point of all this is that my detractors all have zero experience in either dietary practice or lifetime study and practice. They are merely compulsive, very naive readers. They remind me of children who, having read something 'new' (to them), try to lecture every adult on it that they can find.

I do not care WHAT you have read nor who has told you stuff. I am presenting a working, safe and very healthy long term way to live, enjoy life and food, and easily attain and retain a perfect body shape and size. No one is under any obligation to even try it.

Sorry, the contents of the duodenum cannot be ejected in vomitus. The pyloric valve- which is normally closed, convulses along with the stomach when vomiting- in addition, the duodenum does not have the muscularity to forcibly eject anything against the pressure of the convulsing stomach. Indeed, if the pyloric valve was defective and leaked, the stomach's content would be ejected down into the intestines, not up into the esophagus. Try thinking logically just once.

Yellow matter seen in vomitus is digestive juices, not bile. If fluids did not always flow from high pressure to low, you could not draw water from a tap. The basic laws of physics are very simple- and inviolable.

The anti-scurvy activity of fresh uncooked meat is not due to Vit C, which is not found in meat. How it prevents this deficiency syndrome is not known. Scurvy is NOT a 'disease' and is not 'caused' by a lack of vitamin C.

The root cause of the scurvy syndrome has never been established. Vit C is assumed to be something lacking, but only because it reduces the syndrome when taken.

It is just another metabolic 'black box', and is treatable by either raw/rare fresh meat or ascorbic acid. The meat treatment is well known to people familiar with the Inuit and that includes all Arctic explorers. Stefansson describes the history of the treatment of scurvy by fresh meat very well. The meat does not have to be 'all raw', rare is good enough. The sailors who developed the syndrome were eating nothing but salted meat and hard biscuits- washed down with rum. There is no reason that the simple acidic carb known as vit C per se, is necessary, or is made in the tissues.

Our anorectic detractor needs to type while sitting down, his pathologically low blood pressure causes giddiness when he stands up to post. Or is it his starvation level of triglycerides?

I am constantly amazed at the the lengths (drivel) to which some of the 'denialists' will stoop. (i.e.fluff, who has so far said nothing whatsoever of any value- Get a life, will you?).

Cooked meat is not as soluble in HCL (the digestive juice produced for meat)- as raw meat is.
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  #3645   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:00
fluffybear fluffybear is offline
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Plan: low carb/low fat
Stats: 255/236/155 Female 5 ft. 9 in.
BF:32%/?/20%
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Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear


I am not addressing the unfortunate lost souls who cannot accept the title of this thread.




More proof that this is beginning to sound like a religious cult.

So far Bear has said that those who don't agree with him need to "see the light", can't stay on "the path" and now they are "lost souls."

Now let's all turn to page 100 of our hymnbooks.
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  #3646   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:07
fluffybear fluffybear is offline
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Plan: low carb/low fat
Stats: 255/236/155 Female 5 ft. 9 in.
BF:32%/?/20%
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Location: USA
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ps: Bear, what difference does it make what I do or don't say? You are going to discount it anyway. The only people you have agreed with are the ones who fawn all over YOU. Kinda bothers you when I don't, doesn't it? If it didn't you wouldn't be mentioning my name. LOL

Oh and FYI I really haven't disagreed with your premise that humans can live on an all meat diet. I have only disagreed that they should be made to feel like they have to in order to be healthy. I do not believe in the all or nothing approach to anything in life. I like variety. That is not acculturation. That is preference. I come from a family of long-lived people. I am 60 years old and hope to live a long time myself and I don't think that extreme deprivation is something I want to live with for the next 20 or 40 years. Yes, I am overweight as are many on this board and yes I would like to lose that weight, but not to the point of denying myself of EVERYTHING but meat and psychedelic drugs!

Last edited by fluffybear : Fri, May-05-06 at 21:30. Reason: typo correction
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  #3647   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:08
sailsouth sailsouth is offline
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Plan: General Controlled Carb
Stats: 225/180/180 Male 185 centimetres
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
Might I point out that the bogus results pointing to 'glycogen depletion ' are based entirely on a HIGH CARB diet? Zero-carb results utilising the same tests show no depletion takes place.


If that is the case you have a unique perception of what the word "NEVER" means and I would be delighted to see the references to the studies you refer to. If you have "lost" them can I suggest, or could I perform for you, a simple net search for these papers? Lets start with the authors and the publication they were presented in, and an approximate date would also help.
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  #3648   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:10
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paulm paulm is offline
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Plan: Atkins
Stats: 215/185/190 Male 6'1"
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Location: Arizona
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
I am constantly amazed at the the lengths (drivel) to which some of the 'denialists' will stoop. (i.e.fluff, who has so far said nothing whatsoever of any value- Get a life, will you?).


Bear, don't you think that maybe you bring some of this upon yourself since you just blast people when you don't agree with them? It's kind of human nature to react when attacked, threatened or insulted....don't you think?

From the very first person who even hinted that they didn't agree with what you were saying you just flamed them big time. If you want to correct someone who you think is wrong, basically calling them a dumb~ss is not going to get them to stop, smack their forehead and say..."Oh you're right, what was I thinking!!!'.

Anywho, not trying to insult you or start a fight, just pointing out some observations.
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  #3649   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:26
nraden nraden is offline
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Plan: Lights Out
Stats: 255/225/190 Male 72"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
But the doctors treating cancer DO work on the 'black box' principle- they really don't know exactly how much radiation or chemo (even which chemo) is correct for each case. The know only that if they give you the maximum the body can accept and stay alive they can cure, say, 40% of patients. They know if they give you a considered amount of a certain chemo agent the cure rate can rise to 80%. Each cancer is different, some cannot be done in by the max and some might let go with less than half. This is 'black box' medicine at its purest. Which is why western medicine is better than 'alternative' so far as cancer is concerned- it has proven, 'black box' results.


I'm sorry Bear, that's just ridiculous. There is no cure for cancer. You mean "survive." Survival is a statistic, it's not a state. 5-year survival, 10-year survival. You admitted yourself that you're not "cured," you have lingering, substantial damage (swallowing, saliva). If I have a broken arm and they amputate it, am I cured?

Have your way about the WOE, but stop talking about cancer. You don't get it and you're in denial. You have "survived" a year or two. That isn't cured. I really wish you the best, but I'm afraid you've been suckered into the Conspirarcy of Optimism that surrounds cancer.
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  #3650   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:43
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nawchem nawchem is offline
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Plan: No gluten, CAD
Stats: 196.0/158.5/149.0 Female 62
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Progress: 80%
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Bear I hope that I have not offended you. I think you are a wonderful resource to this site and a truly interesting person. Being a chemist I am interested in the details of experiments you refer to, but am not being judgemental, just interested. I would like to try to do what you do but I seem to have some type of physical problem that prevents me from even eating induction level carbs. My dr thinks it is pituitary related. I have tried LC for nearly 5 years and have ended up in the ER 5x because I don't retain potassium at the right levels and have heart arrythmias. I am interested in your insight and hope telling you a little about my problem will show why I am so interested in your experiences. I just had my insulin levels tested but have not gotten the results back yet.
Nancy
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  #3651   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 21:57
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ubizmo ubizmo is offline
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Plan: mumble
Stats: 273/230/200 Male 73 inches
BF:yup
Progress: 59%
Location: Philadelphia, USA
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Anyone who says that muscle cells get energy from the ATP-ADP cycle but *not* from glucose obviously doesn't understand that the glucose-pyruvate-acetyl CoA oxidation pathway contributes the electrons that regenerate ATP from ADP. This is such a fundamental process that to misunderstand it while pretending to knowledge of metabolism is worse than incompetent. It's grotesque. To further insist that anyone who does understand this simple metabolic pathway is "in denial" is pathological.

I think if were committed to the all-meat diet I would be furious to see it championed by someone whose knowledge is so faulty.

theBear could have silenced all his critics weeks ago by simply producing the evidence he claims to have. He claims he has no time or interest in doing so, yet he has time every day to repeat his errors and to berate those who spot them. What does that tell you?

Last edited by ubizmo : Fri, May-05-06 at 22:12. Reason: omitted word
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  #3652   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:37
theBear theBear is offline
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Boy, now I am even getting gratuitous remarks about my relationship to my cancer- from someone without any cancer experience and/or knowledge. Amazing the lengths people in severe dietary denial will go to divert attention from the topic at hand. If you want to really know how I feel about my experience with neck cancer, go back and read what I have previously posted. Incidentally the literature (and my specialists) talks about cancer therapy in terms of 'cure rates', and then lists the chances of survival based on 2, 5, 10, etc. years- by the percentages of treated patients expected to be found in remission. I understand that being presented with this type of linguistic differentiation is causing you some degree of mental pain. You, like many of the mentally challenged detractors lurking on the thread seem to have a need to assign as low a level of intelligence and competence to me as you suffer yourself (otherwise why stoop so low and avoid the real subject so assiduously). Big mistake.


Incompetence extends right down to self-assessment. It is found in evidence in all the person's outputs. It is obvious even to a casual observer, but is never noticed by the incompetent.

And yes, in one meaning, if you have a badly broken arm amputated, you are then definitely 'cured' - of the condition of having a broken arm. However, the term 'cured' is not properly applicable to cases of trauma, it is a term for the reduction and elimination of a pathological state.

Once more, slowly: YOU DO NOT HAVE TO ACCEPT THIS DIET. YOU DO NOT HAVE TO EVEN ATTEMPT IT. The problem all of you have is purely cultural.

The statement: " I would like to lose that weight, but not to the point of denying myself of EVERYTHING but meat ..."

...Is the purest example of dietary denial based 100% on culture I have heard so far. The truth is, you will continue to struggle and remain fat until and unless your body size and shape as well as your health becomes a strong enough impetus for you to change this attitude. You will then become able to 'deny' yourself your addiction to the wrong food. It is our will power and determination. Don't feel any different, acculturation is the single most powerful thing human, it is what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom. It completely overwrites intuition. I is far beneath he conscious mind. It takes a serious amount of real will power to overcome and change it.

Yes, I do not expect very many to succeed, but if anyone can manage to get along, I want to be here to support them.

It can be done. Not easy at first, but it is not impossible.

I feel strongly that accepting this path as 'the real human diet' makes your resolve firmer in the face of near universal social opposition.

Nothing I do or say here is random, arbitrary or experimental.

I have misplaced many of my research papers and at the present I am unable to ref the authors and pubs. A pure meat (80/20) diet should in time rectify any mineral unbalances like potassium etc, in a few weeks to months. Potassium pills are an easy temp solution. I would not complain about not tolerating carbs- sounds like a blessing in disguise.

I am spending all (too much) of my spare time dealing with the thread and thus cannot search for the papers.
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  #3653   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:46
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Rosebud Rosebud is offline
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Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
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Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ubizmo
I'm trying to tally up what we know and what we can reasonably infer, in the course of this long thread.

We know that theBear has made a number of claims, including:

1. The human body produces little or no insulin in response to dietary protein.
2. The human body produces its own EFAs.
3. Skeletal muscle cannot use glucose as fuel without first converting it to fat.
4. Animal fat is 90% saturated.
5. A person on an all-meat diet secretes no ketones.
6. Acetone is not one of the ketones produced from the metabolism of fat.
7. Dietary fat is never stored in adipose tissue.
8. Paleolithic people ate no plant foods at all.

The first seven claims are easily shown to be false by basic science sources that are readily checked by anybody who cares to do so. Online sources have been provided by people in this thread. Although theBear modified claim 4 a bit, limiting it to suet fat, the claim is still false. USDA figures show that whole suet is 94% fat, and that fat--indeed the most saturated fat found in animal bodies--consists of about half saturates.

The eigth claim is more speculative, owing to the difficulty of finding traces of plant consumption from the paleolithic period. More refined methods of analysis are beginning to shed some light on this, but there's a long way to go. See http://www.pubmedcentral.gov/articl...cgi?artid=58583 for example. What we can say is that no one is in a position to state categorically that paleolithic people ate no plant foods at all.

Now let's add another claim, from post 1185:

9. "There are NO errors in any of my statements."

This, obviously, must be added to the list of claims easily shown to be false.

More recently (post 3354), we read, "I make various statements about how things work. I may or may not 'substantiate' them with references. That I don't choose to do so does not make the statements of less value."

In fact, it does make the statements of less value. theBear has repeatedly taken the position that because he has followed the all-meat diet for 47 years, anything he has to say about it is immune to criticism, because his statements are based on "experience." But, as has already been pointed out, claims 1-8 are not the sort of thing that can be arrived at simply through experience. Following a diet, any diet, for 47 years doesn't put anyone in a privileged position to make any of those claims.

A person who persists in making claims that are easily shown to be false, and who insists that none of the claims are erroneous, and who claims that unsubstantiated statements are no less valuable then substantiated ones, as long as he is the one making them--is not entirely rational. That's perhaps an understatement.

The irrationality of a dieter doesn't invalidate a diet. theBear's *experience* provides a model and some reassurance for anyone who may be inclined to emulate it. His experience does not, and cannot, establish that the "real" or "best" human diet is a totally carnivorous one. One person's experience cannot, in principle, establish such a thing. In particular, it doesn't establish that a totally carnivorous diet is the best possible way to achieve insulin control. theBear may be, for all we know, the only living person who has eaten nothing but meat for over four decades. He is not, however, the only man in his 70s who enjoys vibrant good health, nor has he claimed to be. Moreover, his experience is not the only experience that is relevant to the question of insulin control. My own opinion, based on evidence but by no means conclusively established, is that a fasting BG of 100 is not indicative of a level of insulin control that I would consider ideal, especially in a person with low body fat.

Edit: I meant to add this reference: http://www.aafp.org/afp/20040415/1961.html, in particular this definition of impaired fasting glucose: "IFG is defined as fasting plasma glucose values of 100 to 125 mg per dL (5.6 to 6.9 mmol per L); normal fasting glucose values are below 100 mg per dL (Table 1)."

Ubizmo, you need to add "Insulin is not a 'protein'" to the above list.

Rosebud
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  #3654   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:49
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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Say whatever you like- it will not change how the muscles work. I have said before that your sources in re glucose as a power source in muscular contraction are 'bogus': Definition- it looks good, but is not true to real life. I don't understand why you bother spitting out this stuff all the time. Why not just try to eat right according to your own preferred plan, and get on with your life?

Or are you just addicted to indulging in a bit of public self ego-stroking after the fashion of: "Look folks, see how I can repeatedly refute bear's info again and again using the same tired old data".

Good show. Not.
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  #3655   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:53
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Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
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Posts: 1,770
 
Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
BF:very low
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Location: Cardiff
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Quote:
Our anorectic detractor needs to type while sitting down, his pathologically low blood pressure causes giddiness when he stands up to post. Or is it his starvation level of triglycerides?


Why you keep talking crap for?

First I am not anorectic and my doctors think that I am in very good health, they know my situation and I go for regular checkups and blood tests. I have not been diagnosed with anorexia. Eating 1800k/cal is NOT exactly starvation.

I do not get dizzy when I stand up

My lipids show the opposite of what one would expect if I had AN. AN causes an increase in lipids. http://www.biomed.cas.cz/physiolres/pdf/2005/54_443.pdf
Look on page 4 you can see a full lipid panel: "Women with anorexia nervosa had increasedlevels of plasma TC, TG, PL and HDL-C." Triglycerdies in AN were 1.21

Heres another one http://www.nutritionsociety.org.uk/.../BJN0910959.htm
"Total cholesterol and LDL-cholesterol were higher in AN (5·5 (sd 1·3) v. 5·0 (sd 0·8) mmol/l, P=0·023; 3·6 (sd 1·1) v. 3·2 (sd 0·7) mmol/l, P=0·025 respectively). LDL particles were significantly more enriched in cholesterol and triacylglycerol in AN."

Last edited by Whoa182 : Fri, May-05-06 at 22:59.
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  #3656   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:54
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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Yes rosebud, by all means, repeat and repeat and again repeat these classic lines of nonsense... shows excellent good taste, and of course, all this is very pertinent in assisting those following this dietary path, right?

Sorry, I tend to forget, that's not your strong suit. Playing cop is, however.
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  #3657   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 22:57
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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'...women with anorexia...'

So now you are a woman? Had your sexchange operation yet?
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  #3658   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:03
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paulm paulm is offline
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Plan: Atkins
Stats: 215/185/190 Male 6'1"
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Location: Arizona
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Wow Bear, you are really getting ugly. I wonder if this thread can sink any lower...
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  #3659   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:03
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Rosebud Rosebud is offline
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Ah, Mr Bear, my comments were not aimed at you, as I know you will simply ignore any comments I make.

I merely wanted to make clear to everyone else that insulin is a protein, and all your protestations cannot make it not so. Anyone can find this information quite simply on the internet, or by looking at any medical or scientific text book.

Rosebud
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  #3660   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:09
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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You are a walking stick-figure, your online picture resembles the images from the famine in Africa.

I was a very skinny, active kid, and at 18 I was 5'7' and weighed just 125. At 110 you are skin and bone- no muscles, as shown in your pic- how do mange to stand up and walk around? If your doctors think you are fit and healthy- you are in a world of trouble. You are not qualified to criticise anything concerning a proper diet.
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  #3661   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:17
nraden nraden is offline
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Posts: 144
 
Plan: Lights Out
Stats: 255/225/190 Male 72"
BF:all
Progress: 46%
Location: California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
'...women with anorexia...'

So now you are a woman? Had your sexchange operation yet?


OK everybody, the cuckoo bird has finally come out of his head.

Bear, I don't give a toss about your WOE, have it your way. But I know a great deal more about cancer than you do. Your doubletalk is ineffective. Stop giving people advice, it's irresponsible. Tell them about the carnivore diet. Leave cancer alone. You don't have the background or the tools to understand it. Just because you have it doesn't make you an expert.

Here is one clue - how does cancer start? Do you think it was just a random event in your throat, or was it part of a bodywide phenomenon?
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  #3662   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:19
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cbcb cbcb is offline
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Posts: 791
 
Plan: South Beach-esque
Stats: 194/159/140 Female 5'3"
BF:34% / 28% / 20%
Progress: 65%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nawchem
I seem to have some type of physical problem that prevents me from even eating induction level carbs. My dr thinks it is pituitary related.


Nancy,

Hi - I am intrigued.... are you saying you can't lose weight even on induction level carbs and your doc thinks perhaps pituitary related? (Would be interested in any further rationale on how and what of the potential pituitary issue.)

The reason I ask, and my reason for writing this note, is that I wonder if you've ever had a glucose tolerance test (in which you drink something sweet and they measure your blood levels over a few ensuing hours) - and a weird result?

Kind of a long shot, but thought I'd ask. I had mine tested at the Atkins Center in the 90s and had a weird result about which close to zippo info was available... the only info I did find was in a chart book of results that showed a pattern like mine and mentioned (vaguely) that it was pituitary-related. (I also have an extremely tough time losing on whatever I do or don't eat.) The glucose tolerance test result was basically that at the beginning my blood glucose was normal fasting. Upon challenge (drinking the sweet stuff) it shot up to where it normally is supposed to upon challenge, and then instead of tapering back down to normal over a few hours, all the extra glucose evacuated my bloodstream in the first half hour. Right back down to about normal fasting. (This explains what insulin must do in me.) But anyhow, I've always been curious about what the heck might be going on w/the pituitary - if anything. (I do take thyroid hormone for mild hypothyroidism but have never been diagnosed w/anything exotic related to the thyroid or pituitary.
Kind of a long shot, but thought I'd ask. I had mine tested at the Atkins Center in the 90s and had a weird result about which close to zippo info was available... the only info I did find was in a chart book of results that showed a pattern like mine and mentioned (vaguely) that it was pituitary-related. (I also have an extremely tough time losing on whatever I do or don't eat.)

The glucose tolerance test result was basically that at the beginning my blood glucose was normal fasting. Upon challenge (drinking the sweet stuff) it shot up to where it normally is supposed to upon challenge, and then instead of tapering back down to normal over a few hours, all the extra glucose evacuated my bloodstream in the first half hour. Right back down to about normal fasting. (This explains what insulin must do in me.) But anyhow, I've always been curious about what the heck might be going on w/the pituitary - if anything. (I do take thyroid hormone for mild hypothyroidism but have never been diagnosed w/anything exotic related to the thyroid or pituitary.)

CB

Last edited by cbcb : Fri, May-05-06 at 23:27.
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  #3663   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:22
theBear theBear is offline
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Insulin is a HORMONE. It is different in structure to the proteins found in food. The word protein is a generic term that covers a large number of organic molecules consisting primarily of complex chains of amino acids, which can be found in more than one physical form. Insulin is rapidly degraded and rendered inactive by stomach acid, the proteins in meat are not hormonally active to begin with, and are not degraded as insulin is, nor are they reduced to amino acids either.

I know you have very knowledge of science and biochemistry, so I think in the interest of fairness you please try to resist your constant impulse to go nattering on about everything I say you disagree with, ok?
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Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:24
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Whoa182 Whoa182 is offline
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Plan: CRON / Zone
Stats: 118/110/110 Male 5ft 7"
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Location: Cardiff
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You are a walking stick-figure, your online picture resembles the images from the famine in Africa.


I am 113lbs (BMI 17.7), which is 5lbs from my pre-CR weight (BMI 18.5). I do not do this because of weight, I do not care whether I have a low bmi or a high bmi, CR is about energy intake not weight.

Quote:
At 110 you are skin and bone- no muscles, as shown in your pic- how do mange to stand up and walk around?


Played football (soccer) just last week for 5-6 hours as I have done for the past 7+ years before starting CR. I manage fine

Quote:
If your doctors think you are fit and healthy- you are in a world of trouble.


Why am I in a world of trouble? Do you know my health status? do you have all my test results? I know people that are skinnier than me and have been on CR for 10-30 years with BMI in the 15 range. What I do is backed up by 70 years of research... this shows that its safe enough if done right.

Quote:
You are not qualified to criticise anything concerning a proper diet.


Not yet...

This thread is all about you! Stop ignoring the real issues, which is your poor health caused by your poor diet and your ignorance.

Last edited by Whoa182 : Fri, May-05-06 at 23:30.
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Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:26
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cbcb cbcb is offline
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Plan: South Beach-esque
Stats: 194/159/140 Female 5'3"
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Bear, again - wanted to ask you - seriously - do you have any theories on why some people in our society tolerate carbs better than the rest of us (I'm clearly in the latter camp). Specific genes, coding proteins, haircolor, music preference - what?
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  #3666   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:29
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Rosebud Rosebud is offline
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Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theBear
Insulin is a HORMONE. It is different in structure to the proteins found in food. The word protein is a generic term that covers a large number of organic molecules consisting primarily of complex chains of amino acids, which can be found in more than one physical form. Insulin is rapidly degraded and rendered inactive by stomach acid, the proteins in meat are not hormonally active to begin with, and are not degraded as insulin is, nor are they reduced to amino acids either.

I know you have very knowledge of science and biochemistry, so I think in the interest of fairness you please try to resist your constant impulse to go nattering on about everything I say you disagree with, ok?

Oh dear, Bear. Do you not know that hormones are proteins?
I don't think anyone here has tried to say that hormones are the same as the proteins we eat. But they are still proteins.
And you have no idea of my knowledge of science and biochemistry.

Rosebud
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Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:30
theBear theBear is offline
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Plan: zero-carb
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Amazing you STILL feel qualified to lecture me on cancer? Either you have a massive twisted ego filled with self importance or you seriously underestimate me and my knowledge on the subject. What gives you expert status?

I think if you read my posts carefully you already know two things: I am completely aware of the cancer I had, and I have an extensive knowledge of it and the methods of treatment. I have also demonstrated my extreme level of interest in my body, nutrition and the way everything in the universe works. Why on earth would a total stranger, and outsider, even consider making such totally specious and inaccurate statements about MY cancer and my relation to it? You must be very unhappy with your lot in life, is all I can say. Relax, you are always going to meet people who are smarter or more knowledgeable than you are.
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  #3668   ^
Old Fri, May-05-06, 23:42
sailsouth sailsouth is offline
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Plan: General Controlled Carb
Stats: 225/180/180 Male 185 centimetres
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Originally Posted by theBear
Relax, you are always going to meet people who are smarter or more knowledgeable than you are.

So glad you appreciate how lucky you are that so many of them have contributed to this thread!
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