Hi everyone, I was wondering if anybody has been able to lose weight following NT while still eating nuts, fruits and and higher-carb vegetables. For awhile now I have been doing the modified NT that a lot of people on this forum do where you eat dairy(cheese, sour cream, heavy cream) I think the dairy is not letting me experience the full benefits of NT so I wanted to try to do it exactly as Audette has written. I have done some research and truely believe that humans do not need and are probably not supposed to eat milk past infancy. Also I found some stuff that said milk has the same types of addictive properties as wheat and that the reason people adopted agriculture as a way of life was because they became addicted to these substances, even though agriculture caused people to work longer and harder and shortened their lifespans as compared to hunter-gatherers.

So to try and make a long story short...I want to stop eating dairy but I would like to add more fruits, nuts and veggies as opposed to eating all meat and eggs. I realize the veggies would probably not do much damage but I am wondering if anyone has been able to lose weight while eating 2-3 pieces of fruit a day+a handful or 2 of nuts. If so can you give me some examples of what and how you are eating to make this work.

Thanks,
Aimee

I did, but I stalled around 240. Still, I *think* it was over 100 pounds I lost that last time. However, since this is my second time around, I need to cut carbs in order to lose the weight.

That being said, I'm eating Neanderthin Apple Pie with double the crust ingredients (but with almond flour because I can't find pecan flour locally). However, I eat an enormous amount of apples the week before Halloween for religious reasons. After November 1st, I'll probably be on "induction" levels of carbohydrates until weight-loss starts up again.

thanks for the reply hybrid,

what exactly is neanderthin apple pie. how do you make the crust? is it the same as you would make regular crust only using nut flour. Also do you sweeten it with honey or not. it sounds good. please share the recipe!!
Speaking of pie, I have been wondering if pumpkin and squash are neanderthin. I mean I don't think you cant eat them raw but I don't know if they are post agricultural or not and if they would be okay. Also what about eggplant? I dont think it is mentioned in the book but I would assume it is not NT. I hope somebody convinces me otherwise though because I love it.

Someone copied all the recipes from NeanderThin and put them here: http://xeles.homestead.com/ntrecipes.html

I think pumpkins and squash fall under a Forbidden Fruit category, but I'm not sure which one. I pretty much put "Gourds" as their own No No category. I'm surprised that with less religious symbolism in NeanderThin Fourth Edition, that Ray Audette didn't expand the "Ten Commandments." E.g., mushrooms aren't one of the five "Can Eat" categories, and alcohol isn't one of the five "Can't Eat categories," but there can only be five of each if there are to be "Ten Commandments."

Eggplants, pumpkin and squash are just too nasty tasting to me, personally. I guess your own health reactions are what you'll have to go by. You may wish to search the St. John's list archives before you start cooking, though.

I also use this list to fill in the blanks: http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/rw...ferran08_hg.htm

Hybrid - Thanks for the link to the paleo food lists.

I am a little confused though about the supplemental vegetables list where it says you should eat all those different types of beans, but then it says avoid garlic, onions, cabbage, broccoli and all these other things that I thought were okay to eat. I really hope he is wrong about garlic though -- i am italian and asking me to not eat garlic is like asking me not to breath.
Also whats up with the long list of fruits that you are supposed to avoid. I thought coconuts were very very paleo.
Other than that the list was very informative and I'm sure I will refer to it often in the next few weeks as I try to get the hang of this WOE. thanks again

Aimee

You know, you're inviting a Garlic Breath joke on that one...

Anyway, the list of foods I provided is what someone compiled based on arthritis research. For example, most people have problems with tomatoes because they're in the Nightshade family and such. I have a friend who is horridly allergic to them. Anton S. LaVey claimed to be allergic to garlic, but with a man prone to personal exaggeration as Mr. LaVey, it's hard to verify. Dogs can get very sick from macadamia nuts. I do think that list is a little prejudiced against New World foods and tropical foods.

I can explain the thing about lettuce, though. It's actually a food taboo of the Yezidi sect. Most food taboos have a certain cultural usefulness to them, and in the case of lettuce it is because the number one food contaminated by salmonella is lettuce. I generally use spinach myself, but if someone I live with buys lettuce, I'll use that in my salad.

I personally think that with unlimited access to food, most people will find it harder to lose weight without restricting carbs to some extent. But that is just my opinion and experience. The problem is we have so much food available, so can't just go hungry. I myself can't lose anything unless I cut carbs. It all depends on how big your appetite is as well.

I lost weight (and body fat) very easily when eating only meat, eggs, and veggies. For one thing, I obviously cut many calories doing this, and for another, there was virtually no insulin production causing body fat gain. I got down to my lowest weight and body fat ever. Once I added fruit and nuts back into my diet, my weight and body fat begin climbing right back up. However, one time when I was very disciplined for over four months eating paleo (including even dried fruit and nuts!), I slowly lost weight and body fat and perhaps would have continued losing if I had kept up the paleo eating. I swear, I was eating raisins, dates, figs, all kinds of nuts, but also eating lots of animal fat and eggs, etc. Another time, I was eating small amounts of fruit each day and I lost weight a bit faster. It is true that if you have a lot of weight to lose, your best bet is to get your body to start burning fat and try and burn off the extra fat on your body. Perhaps when you get closer to your goal you can start eating more fruit and nuts. It is sad, but I have never been able to keep up the paleo diet long enough to really find out what would happen. That being said, I do have some concerns that, aside from weight issues, excess insulin in your system may be screwing up one's body regardless of whether or not it results in body fat gain. Life Without Bread is a good book that describes how hormones can get all screwed up (out of balance) if one is too high for instance (as insulin can get if one is eating lots of carbs). Also, it seems that our ancestors had NO WAY of getting all this sugar that we take for granted (including the "new" fruit we eat). They tried to eat it during certain seasons in prep for scarcity, etc. But, even then, it must have been difficult to get even 1/10th of the sugar that we get even when consuming a "low carb" diet.

Hybrid, I checked that link and I don't think it is too reliable at all. The avoid foods for veggies seems very odd. Then, it mentions "blood type"... that is where I had to stop! I think if a person REALLY wanted a "list" of foods they could eat, they would have to go on an elimination diet, starting out with just meat and fat, etc. (total true winter paleo foods).... then, slowly add back in different things to see if there was a problem. I think variety is the "spice of life" when it comes to fruits and veggies (to try and get as many nutrients as we can - nutrients that we have no idea about mostly). Unless you are going to eat lots of organs (how many people do that?), then you NEED nutrients from somewhere! As long as one does not overdue it on sweet fruit (especially dried fruit!), then they can keep their carbs in check (VERY important for good health, not just weight loss!). I don't know what this list is based on, but it seems suspect at best!

BTW... http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/rw...elimination.htm