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  #1156   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 06:40
ParisMama's Avatar
ParisMama ParisMama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,370
 
Plan: AIP (autoimmune paleo)
Stats: 235/185/165 Female 5'5"
BF:
Progress: 71%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cactusrose
Clarification: BMR, yes basal metabolic rate. Minimal calories to survive doing nothing but sleeping 24/7. Mine is about 1300.

TDEE: Total Daily Energy Expenditure. Total calories you expend based on your sex, age, and activity level. Mine is about 1900.

Subtract 200 from that 1900, not 200 from 1300 to get a good daily calorie goal to start losing weight. We have been taught for so long to eat low cal and exercise to lose weight, which usually does work at first, but not long term. We actually need to eat more calories, and apparently more protein from what I am reading if we are to keep our muscle mass as we lose weight...and that fits in nicely with low carb...I am supposed to eat about 125-140 g protein daily.


Are you doing a lower-carb version? I've been playing with higher protein levels these past couple of months (but still low carb) and I'm finding it interesting, but I'm not yet convinced. (well, mostly I'm frustrated that the scale isn't moving much). I've also begun exercising (nothing extreme, but I was really sedentary for a long time before). I am still very low carb though.
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  #1157   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 07:24
Liz53's Avatar
Liz53 Liz53 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,088
 
Plan: Mostly Fung/IDM
Stats: 165/138.4/135 Female 63
BF:???/better/???
Progress: 89%
Location: Washington state
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cactusrose
Clarification: BMR, yes basal metabolic rate. Minimal calories to survive doing nothing but sleeping 24/7. Mine is about 1300.

TDEE: Total Daily Energy Expenditure. Total calories you expend based on your sex, age, and activity level. Mine is about 1900.

Subtract 200 from that 1900, not 200 from 1300 to get a good daily calorie goal to start losing weight. We have been taught for so long to eat low cal and exercise to lose weight, which usually does work at first, but not long term. We actually need to eat more calories, and apparently more protein from what I am reading if we are to keep our muscle mass as we lose weight...and that fits in nicely with low carb...I am supposed to eat about 125-140 g protein daily.


Thanks for the clarification, cactusrose. Another clarification - livinright's plan is not necessarily 200 calories below BMR, it is within 200 calories so just as easily could be 200 calories over.

That said, your plan is indeed different. What energy expenditure calculator are you using? I found one online which seemed quite precise - you dial in the minutes of various activities done during the day. It came up with 1300 BMR for me (about what all of them say) and 24-2700 for TDEE. Never in my life have I been able to eat that much without gaining. I can't imagine it is right. I'd like to compare with another calculator, at which point I may experiment with it a bit. And if you are eating JUDDD, the up days are at your TDEE and down days lower? By how much?

And, reading your tag line, do I understand that you basically cycle up and down 10-15 lbs per year?

Sorry for all the questions. I have always been leery of long term calorie restriction because I know it slows metabolism. Dr Jason Fung talks about it on his IDM site and I'd love to learn more about it from another perspective.
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  #1158   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 07:59
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 946
 
Plan: Low-Glycemic (low carb)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Florida
Default

I think my after-vacation weight loss has stalled, so I'll give it a couple of days and if it still holds, I'll try a day with brown rice or perhaps navy beans. Something high carb but only moderate glycemic so it doesn't spike my insulin.

Bob
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  #1159   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 08:31
Judynyc's Avatar
Judynyc Judynyc is offline
Attitude is a Choice
Posts: 29,974
 
Plan: SBD->atkins twist->paleo
Stats: 274/000/160 Female 5'6"
BF:stl/too/mch
Progress: 240%
Location: NYC
Default

I'm really loving this entire conversation. I'm in this for the long haul being at my goal weight since 2005. I moved away from the way I was eating back then and have been finding myself not eating fruit or any starches due to my daily reading here as I'm easily impressionable by what others do (hflc).
So, I couple of weeks ago I bought a bag of honey crisp apples and some finn crisp rye crackers. Not only is my weight more stable but I feel so much better! 1 apple and a couple of crackers a day have made a big difference in how I feel.

So, thanks to JEY100!! for the note about the gut flora being effected by what we eat because that made me remember what I ate when I got to my goal weight and it was not HFLC.
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  #1160   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 08:33
Judynyc's Avatar
Judynyc Judynyc is offline
Attitude is a Choice
Posts: 29,974
 
Plan: SBD->atkins twist->paleo
Stats: 274/000/160 Female 5'6"
BF:stl/too/mch
Progress: 240%
Location: NYC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JEY100
So back to my post what if the benefit of cycling is derived from "feeding your gut micro biome"? Giving the little buggers more fiber and more "safe starches" that is beneficial to a diverse population, health and weight loss? That being VLC all the time reduces good bacteria and some version of cycling re-sets them? I don't have the answer, also looking for the answer, but I certainly hear much more about this angle as a criticism of staying VLC Long-term.

Thank you for this post!! The light went off in my head when I read it!!
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  #1161   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 08:49
Seejay's Avatar
Seejay Seejay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,019
 
Plan: Optimal Diet
Stats: 00/00/00 Female 62 inches
BF:
Progress: 8%
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Just to add to the idea of eating more - there's a whole theory called "energy flux" where you eat more and move more, and still have a calorie deficit, and you lose well. It's popular with bodybuilders and athletes and other high-volume exercise people with what sounds like not-broken metabolisms, but if you google "high energy flux" you'll see a bunch of stuff.

Also on calculators overestimating TDEE. If you are way obese or a woman- make sure the calculator uses the Miffin equations which is a better estimate. The Katch-McKardle and Harris Benedict ones can overestimate by up to 30% !!

In my city you can measure your BMR at a clinic for only $75. That seems better than those online calculators which can only be crude estimates for an individual.
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  #1162   ^
Old Mon, Nov-03-14, 09:14
cactusrose's Avatar
cactusrose cactusrose is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,798
 
Plan: JUDDD 4/30/2012
Stats: 154/141/135 Female 54.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 68%
Location: Tucson
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ParisMama: I am not doing low carb anymore. I am finding that any long term restriction for me causes diet fatigue so now I am balancing my intake, looking to get in ~125 g protein daily. Yes I have carbs, fruit and veggies never tasted so good. And I do have sweets sometimes, and don't feel deprived anymore. Score! I have started strength training as well, I want to get stronger and more flexible as I am getting older...

Liz53: Here is the calculator I use, not sure if this forum will let me post it...http://scoobysworkshop.com/calorie-calculator/ but I am giving it a try...that does sound like a lot of calories but if you are tall or young or heavier I believe you can get a higher number. I would have to look into it, but I think as you lose weight, you recalculate. I am within about 20 pounds of goal, so not that familiar with more weight to lose at this point in my life. There are a lot of people out there with lots to lose that have done the Eat More 2 Weigh Less and have their stories online if that is something you would be interested in.

Not JUDDDing anymore either as I just am too hungry on the low days so really trying to see what works best for me day to day so I feel good all of the time! And I do seem to go up and down that much every year with my weight, so looking for a way to stop that trend, as the fluctuation seems to really effect my psyche and how I feel about myself, and I don't want to do this the rest of my life, it's too stressful!!
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  #1163   ^
Old Thu, Dec-18-14, 19:58
Moje's Avatar
Moje Moje is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 62
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 198/184/130 Female 5'3"
BF:
Progress: 21%
Location: Colorado
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http://www.marksdailyapple.com/dear...or-weight-loss/ Covers the issue of leptin and why low carb cycling works.
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  #1164   ^
Old Sat, Feb-28-15, 08:33
vsdbeth vsdbeth is offline
New Member
Posts: 7
 
Plan: Low carb
Stats: 163/151/140 Female 66
BF:
Progress:
Default Hoping someone can help

I started out with low carb diet and then hit that pesky plateau for almost 2 months now. I went back to eating more carbs and still nothing. I am interesting in trying carb cycling. Right now on a normal day I stay below 50 net carbs and eat no more than 1200 calories. I am eat mostly non-processed foods, fresh fruits, veggies, meats, almonds, eggs, etc.

I have 9 more pounds to go until I hit my goal. Any advice would be helpful. What do I eat each day on carb cycling and how many carbs for up and down days. Thanks
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  #1165   ^
Old Sun, Mar-01-15, 16:14
cactusrose's Avatar
cactusrose cactusrose is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,798
 
Plan: JUDDD 4/30/2012
Stats: 154/141/135 Female 54.5 inches
BF:
Progress: 68%
Location: Tucson
Default

vsdbeth: I don't have anything to add about the carb cycling because I have tried it and it was only a temporary fix for me. Not JUDDDing anymore either, although I do think there are health benefits to intermittent fasting.

See my post above. I have seen many people who plateau and then go the Eat More 2 Weigh Less route and do well and start losing again. In general, 1200 cals is just not enough to lose, and the science is interesting and results are there if you look into it. Depending on your age and activities and height, 1200 cals will only meet your body's metabolic demands to keep you alive, so really you may be starving yourself...and I know that is against all the popular information out there. Once again, do the research. Also, check out the link I mentioned above about correct calorie intake to lose weight.

Best to you.
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  #1166   ^
Old Thu, Mar-05-15, 07:24
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 946
 
Plan: Low-Glycemic (low carb)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Florida
Default

I'm still experimenting with it, but so far it isn't doing anything for me, neither in the gain nor the loss department. If I don't find a happy formula soon I'll just go back to my old maintenance plan.

If there was one diet method that worked for everybody, we would only need one diet book.
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  #1167   ^
Old Sun, Apr-19-15, 14:46
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 946
 
Plan: Low-Glycemic (low carb)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Florida
Default

I'm going to give this up.

I'm not losing, and I'm not gaining either. I tried experimenting at different intervals, from once a week to every third day and nothing seems to make a difference.

Since I believe that insulin is as it is called "The Killer Hormone" as soon as the carbs in my pantry are done, it's back to ultra low carb again for me.

Well, it was worth the try anyway.

If there was one diet plan that worked for everybody, there would only need to be one diet book.

Bob
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  #1168   ^
Old Mon, Apr-20-15, 07:12
vsdbeth vsdbeth is offline
New Member
Posts: 7
 
Plan: Low carb
Stats: 163/151/140 Female 66
BF:
Progress:
Default Cycling

I will have to say after weeks of a stall, I finally broke it. I started upping my carbs on Tuesdays and Fridays only. I add in oatmeal for breakfast and either a 1/2 sweet potato or beans for lunch. I also allow myself "fancy" coffee on these days of course still low carb as possible and doing this I finally broke my stall. I lost 6 pounds in a month and thats good for me since I am almost to my goal weight.
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  #1169   ^
Old Mon, Apr-20-15, 08:18
Bob-a-rama's Avatar
Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 946
 
Plan: Low-Glycemic (low carb)
Stats: 230/185/185 Male 5' 11"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Florida
Default

Good for you. I wasn't that lucky.

I'm hovering around my goal weight, I managed to get 5 pounds under it once, and liked myself even better that way. I haven't figured out how to do that again.

I'm happy where I am, just looking for further improvement. Perhaps this is where my body compromises between being overweight and underweight - Actually, I'm on sitting the border between normal and over for my height - and that was my goal.

Bob
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