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  #76   ^
Old Mon, Oct-12-09, 13:25
skeeweeaka's Avatar
skeeweeaka skeeweeaka is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,154
 
Plan: Moderate Carb...
Stats: 235/195/140 Female 5'3
BF:HELP!!!
Progress: 42%
Location: Ohio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amandawood
Thanks for posting this! I am in exactly the same position and have been getting a bit frustrated by the whole thing. I am trying to up my carbs a bit although it kind of goes against the grain (what a bad pun to use - accident...), but if it gets rid of this dizziness and depression, then I certainly will!

I already have quite an impressive range of supplements round here, but the only thing I don't have is a B-vitamin complex. Most of the ones I see have B1, B6 and B12 in them, but not the other Bs. I am trying to work out why this is and am also trying to eat more food with Bs in, such as sprouted seeds to do something about this.

I shall look into getting some B Vitamins in supplement form, but use up the magnesium oxide with extra Bs added first. Maybe that will help.

I keep re-reading what Dr S says about tiredness, depression and so on being a "normal" part of the transition process and to not give up or go back to your old ways, but, like she says, it is not easy to stick to something that actually makes you feel worse!!!

If anybody wants to pop into my journal and cheer me along (and cheer me up), I'll be more than happy to hear from you! I really feel I'm doing the right thing by finally getting caffeine and alcohol out of my life and, seeing as I managed to give up the smokes in Dec 2001 after having smoked for most of the preceding 22 years, pregnancies and breastfeeding times excepted, I am fairly confident that I can get rid of these addictions, too, but it is hard sometimes...

amanda


I understand the excess of vitamins that you have around, I have those too!

Apparently though, taking just a few of the B vitamins can cause an imbalance in the rest....thus the reason for a good B complex. Also, there is a HUGE B12 deficiency in the US. Apparently, in othe parts of the world, the recommended daily allowance is 2 to 3 times what we get in the states and those places don't have the levels of obesity, neurological, or psychological problems that we have.

When I added the B complex things did get better, but they have greatly improved since adding the B12. Apparently B12 is responsible for MOST of our hormones and if you are already deficient in any vitamin/mineral then the RDA dose will do nothing for you... Jarrows is a great brand because I've tried others and did not get the same results. B12 has greatly improved my chronic fatigue...and I've read good things about B12 and addictions!

Good luck Amanda
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  #77   ^
Old Sun, Feb-17-13, 20:14
lk2094 lk2094 is offline
New Member
Posts: 3
 
Plan: Dr Schwarzbein
Stats: 100/100/100 Female 66
BF:
Progress:
Wink Why some people don't tolerate very low carbs- A response to your question

Dr Schwarzbein's diet is not about low carbs. It is about balanced carbs and balancing the amount of carbs you need according to your energy needs. She is critical of very low carbs because it cause an imbalance on all your hormones which regulate our metabolism (which she defines very well in her book). When our metabolism is not working properly, because the hormones that regulate it are out of balance, then we have many difficulties in the long term. The reason some one with burnt out adrenal glands feels more tired when adding carbs after being on a very low carb diet is because when the hormones become more balanced, the symptoms of low adrenal function becomes more apparent. She discusses this in her book, stating as one improves his/her diet, there true metabolic state becomes more apparent. Many people with burnt out adrenals will use stimulants to feel better. Things such as caffeine, sugar, artificial sweeteners, chocolate, etc. Initially the symptoms seem worse as we come off of the stimulants, but coming off of the stimulants is necessary for the body heals. She recommends a gradual approach to healing to minimize these withdrawal symptoms. As healing occurs and adrenal function improves, one should start to feel more energetic. However, this does take time. How much time? Well this does depend on how much healing is needed. Dr Schwarzbein does not recommend a total daily amount of carbs like some low carb diets do. She recommends balance at every meal based on you energy needs. This makes sense if you understand anything about gylcemic load. Not eating more carbs than you need at any given meal, based on your specific energy needs, to minimize too high a spike in glucose and thus insulin. If your insulin and glucose spike too high, this can upset all the other hormones in your body. In addition to balanced meals, she also recommends small frequent meals. Balanced meals includes a balance of protein, carbs, fats, and non-starchy vegetable at every meal. She never recommends eating protein and/or carbs alone. This again is important to maintain a balance in all your hormones. If you read the Schwarzbein Principle II she had revised the protein recommendation. And while she does state: "the more healthy fats one added.......", you have to understand that a lot of fat for someone use to following the recommendations of Low fat, may not be a huge amount of fat. In her second book, rather than unlimited protein, she recommends balance protein in relation to the amount of carbs per meal. It has been my experience as a Nutritionist, that most people don't get even the RDA for protein and this is usually low for most people. Skipping meals is a vey stressful event for our body, which causes the release of stress hormones, which then causes an imbalance in all our hormones. To prevent this she recommends never skipping meals and eating small frequent meals, especially if your body needs to heal an unhealthy metabolism. Our body structures are mostly made up of protein and fats. carbs are mainly used for energy. When we eat more carbs than we burn for energy, the body needs to store this. When we don't eat enough protein and fats to rebuild our muscles we end up breaking down more than building up. Since lean body mass weight more than fat, we can lose pounds. But it takes up more space, so our bodies take up more space and weigh less. It is the excess carbs on a daily basis, year after year, that causes insulin resistance. By limiting carbs to reverse insulin resistance and providing adequate protein and fats to help rebuild and heal the body we can correct and heal our metabolism. The other portion of her diet focus on the quality of foods, something that is frequently missing from many low carb diets. She recommends whole real foods and undamaged fats to provide all the macro and micro nutrients needed to rebuild the body. There are other aspects to her diet such as stress reduction and exercise, but I will let you read her book if you are interested in these details. Again, the focus is about healing the metabolism and this is a very critical part of the healing process too.
Again, to summarize, Dr Schwarzbein recommends balanced meals to include protein, fat, carbs, and vegetables at all you meals to keep your hormones balanced. When your hormones are balanced, your metabolism is balanced. She stresses over and over again, time is needed to heal and one can feel worse before they feel better. This is often the case when we get off of stimulants which give us a false sense of energy and well being. These stimulants never produce lasting energy or real energy and cause lots of damage, and then we need more and more stimulants to just feel good. Getting off of stimulants can leave us feeling down until the body has time to rebuild and replace the natural stimulants that will give us more balanced and sustained energy. This will always take time irregardless of the approach one uses to heal and why so many people give up when using natural approaches to healing. Hope this help answer the question about Dr Schwarzbein's diet and why coming off a very low carb diet may initially cause more fatigue. By not going through the healing process, while you may initially feel more fatigued when you add in carbs, if you continue on a very low carb diet, you may find you will burn our your adrenals even more, and eventually your will feel more and more fatigued even on a very low carb diet.

Last edited by lk2094 : Sun, Feb-17-13 at 20:36.
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  #78   ^
Old Sun, Feb-17-13, 21:18
lk2094 lk2094 is offline
New Member
Posts: 3
 
Plan: Dr Schwarzbein
Stats: 100/100/100 Female 66
BF:
Progress:
Default B vitamins and depression

Depression is frequently caused by lack of "undamaged fats" (to borrow Dr Schwarzbein's term which I like better than the term healthy fats because it has been distorted by marketing) and a lack of, or imbalance in, our essential fatty acids. By adding undamaged fats to our diet we can improve depression if this is what is causing it. Our brains and nervous system are made up of predominately fats and cholesterol (a fat). We truly are Fat heads (to borrow another term I heard, from where I forgot). This is one of the complications of a low fat, low cholesterol diet. I do disagree with Dr Schwarzbein on canola oil being a healthy oil. Much canola oil is highly refined and also genetically engineered. Healthy fats are a whole discussion that requires more time than I have here. If interested in a resource: read "know your fats" by Mary Enig. In reference to B vitamins. It is best to take a B complex from a whole food source of B vitamins. Lots and lots of vitamins are not well absorbed. Synthetic vitamins can sometimes act as stimulants. B 12 is absorbed differently than the other B vitamins in our body and sometimes not as easily absorbed. It is also common to have more difficulty absorbing B 12 as we age and one may need shots to bring B12 into balance. Working with a good naturopathic doctor could help you determine if this is a problem and how to correct it. They can test for things such as blood counts, homocysteine or even B-12 levels to see if this is needed. One of the difficulties with testing B-12 levels is we don't really have a good way to test for accurate levels. Some times gut healing is needed to increase absorption of all our nutrients, including B-12, but again, this is where working with a qualified Dr will help. Another comment on B vitamins (or any vitamin deficiencies) is to look at the prescription and over the counter medications you take. Many medications deplete our vitamins and minerals in the process of doing what ever they were designed to do in our body or in the process of our body eliminating these medications from our system. Common medications that deplete B 12 are some of the medications used to treat diabetes and insulin resistance. The one that comes to my mind is Metformin. Also, acid lowering medications (prescription and Over the counter) used to treat heartburn symptoms (frequently caused by medications) interferes with the absorption of many vitamins and minerals including B-12. Cholesterol lowering meds commonly cause depression and memory loss because they interfere with production of cholesterol so critical for brain function. We are seeing a trend towards dangerously low cholesterol levels in this country as a result of over use of cholesterol lowering medications. Cholesterol is critical for many functions and without it we die. A good book on Medication and nutrient interactions is "The Side Effect Bible." Again, hope this is helpful. One thing I have learnt in my studies of science and medicine is that everything in the body is about balance. Not too much and not too little. Unlike the all or none mentality, try to strive for balance. This is one of the things I really like about Dr Schwarzbein’s books and diet recommendations. It is a much more balanced approach.

Last edited by lk2094 : Sun, Feb-17-13 at 21:25.
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  #79   ^
Old Sun, Feb-17-13, 23:12
ojoj's Avatar
ojoj ojoj is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,184
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 210/126/127 Female 5ft 7in
BF:
Progress: 101%
Location: South of England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DorianJ
I used a bad word there.
Let's just say that on induction level a relevant number of people will have severe enough distresses, which seem to be relieved by simply upping carb to 30 or 40 carbs during the induction phase itself.


In the 10 years I've been following atkins/low carb and been on many forums and websites, I've never ever heard of that happening - not even once. I know that some folk get, what is known as induction flu, but thats just a headache and a fluey typ feeling for a couple of days - a reaction to their addiction to carbs. Anyway, I'd be interested to know more of this issue???

Jo xxx
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  #80   ^
Old Sun, Feb-17-13, 23:23
Rosebud's Avatar
Rosebud Rosebud is offline
Forum Moderator
Posts: 23,388
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 235/135/135 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Old thread alert...Old thread alert....

Just thought I'd mention to those of you who are replying to him, that the OP hasn't visited this site for 3½ years.
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  #81   ^
Old Sun, Feb-17-13, 23:25
ojoj's Avatar
ojoj ojoj is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,184
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 210/126/127 Female 5ft 7in
BF:
Progress: 101%
Location: South of England
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rosebud
Old thread alert...Old thread alert....

Just thought I'd mention to those of you who are replying to him, that the OP hasn't visited this site for 3½ years.


lol - its early in the morning here, so I'm not awake enough to notice. Its interesting tho

Jo xxx
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