Eating carbohydrate causes blood glucose to rise. That looks like an "initial loss of blood sugar control" to me. I fail to see why it doesn't look like that to you.

So what is diabetes then? Let's see. It's not contagious. It's not genetic since even the healthiest individuals develop it in later years. It must be environmental, i.e. outside the body yet not an infectious agent like bacteria or virus. I vote for whatever is most directly affected by diabetes: Glucose metabolism. Well then, if diabetes is merely the disruption of glucose metabolism, then I vote for glucose poisoning as the cause of this disruption.

You are not living up to this standard.

Diabetes is not occurring in Asian populations getting over 90% of their calories from carbohydrates. It didn't occur in the rural Thai that got 80% of there calories from white rice.

Reading a bit more on this so deleted my comment. Will add more in a few.

From http://www.westonaprice.org/traditi...s/thailand.html on the Cornell study you quote. You really should read the whole page.

It can be argued that even among poor families, fat consumption is higher than the accepted 15% figure. The Cornell investigators made their own determinations of the amount of fat supplied by coconut milk, because "use of figures now available in food value tables, for coconut milks as prepared in Bang Chan, would lead to gross overestimate of caloric value and fat content of the diets." What an amazing confession!

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MY comment -- it is pretty apparent that the researchers DID fudge the data a bit. They wanted to prove that the diet was low fat, but adding in the actual fat from coconut would have made the 85% carb comment false, so they just decided that the coconut fat was somehow different. And you are relying on this study to prove your point.

And I was referring to that which is used to build the body. So, it's the same thing whether it's a runner or a lifter: The diet will determine the body's structure.

First rule of bodybuilding: Eat more to grow, eat less to shrink. Notice it says nothing about type or exercise.

Let's not make it about me, please.

The data you rely on is incorrect.

THERE !!! This right there shuts down this thread. Glucose is inflammatory! So even if inflammation causes obesity, carbs causes the inflammation in the first place.

I don't understand why some people want carbs to be good at all costs and tries to make excuses for it. I'm not a real ZeroCarber like Martin, because I will eat some carbs from time to time for social reasons, but I do not try to make excuses for carbs.

There is absolutely no need to eat any carbs at all.

Patrick

I do not want to sound insulting, but I've read this whole thread and I don't think you live up to the standard either Daniel. Anyone can find studies supporting their viewpoints, it's just stats, it's barely useful. You can orient your scientific experiments with the help of these studies, but the studies themselves is not science. The process does not stop there.

Please no more stats. I propose that we cite real scientific experiments to support our arguments.

For example. Most studies that concludes against a high-fat diet forgets about this very important fact here: “The deleterious effects of fat have been measured in the presence of high carbohydrate. A high fat diet in the presence of high carbohydrate is different than a high fat diet in the presence of low carbohydrate.” -- Richard Feinman, PhD.

So please everyone, proper science is needed to resolve obesity. Let's drop the useless correlation studies and read up about the results of real well performed experiments.

Patrick

This is just false. Most cells are perfectly ok with burning fatty acids directly. Most of the rest is happy with ketones. And the small amount that can only use glucose can indeed get it from gluconeogenesis of the excess protein and even a little bit (10%) from the glyceride part of Fat (triglyceride).

http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/fat-not-protein.html

http://www.medbio.info/Horn/Time%20...rch%202007a.htm

Patrick

Overeating does NOT cause Diabetes, it can exacerbate it.
We see more Diabetes because we are able to diagnose it. There are many thin diabetics.
Overeating can be a symptom of Diabetes, as can obesity.
This is a horrid myth you push that Diabetics around the world are just astounded by. There are body builders, athletes, people who never ate a lot of garbage (me), people who exercised...who became diabetic.

This MYTH that
"if you took care of yourself, you wouldn't have Diabetes" is an awful lie because it blames the person who has the disease.

This is not alcoholism.

You have to understand what causes the pancreas to malfunction.

tudiabetes.com

Again, the body uses glucose as fuel.
Diabetes is a problem with the cells, not the glucose.
And yes, Adult Onset Diabetes is very popular.
Please read up on Diabetes.

go to www.tudiabetes.com

A rise in blood sugar isn't always bad. It is HOW MUCH the blood sugar rises. Blood sugar rises in normal individuals after eating.
This is what diabetics try to control, because ours goes too high or too low. The pancreas is not working properly and sometimes, the beta cells become so bad off, insulin is needed.

Too much sugar is bad for a diabetic, because the body cannot handle it.

This is what I have been trying to tell them.
When we eat proteins and fats, aka Low carb diet, it takes more to break them down into energy, hence we stabilize the blood sugar for a longer time. Hence a high protein meal will "stay with us" longer, and a Snickers candy bar will give someone that quick energy rush, but also will peak downward too.