Odyssey, you may have a point that it sounded like I was pushing a type of weight loss on them, it wasn't my intent but I may have used a poor choice of words to get my message across.

The thing is, NAAFA doesn't only discourage people from desperate unsustainable scrambles to "lose weight quick". If this was the true intent of their message, I would passionately embrace it. I do think people should not feel so terrible that they try to punish themselves to thinness through crash diets that only make them gain more in the end.

NAAFA explicitly states that never, ever, should you try to lose weight, regardless of circumstances method or proceedure. I was told this twice; twice I was told no qualifier can justify the purposeful intent of lowering bodyfat.

It is because of this position I simply can never in my reasonable mind support NAAFA, as much as I wish I could. I do strongly believe NAAFA has the potential to do a lot of good, to change a lot of wrong things in our culture. It is unfortunate that their position on weight loss spoils it for me.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree.

The home page has a mention of a walk against bariatric surgery which says this: "Movement and healthier eating will go a lot longer toward maintaining health than any surgery"

And this link is about a "size 16-18" fitness instructor who can lead classes 6 days a week but doesn't "look" right and so didn't get a job:

http://www.naafa.org/news/fatfitness.html

Which have impressive, positive messages. But then there's this:

http://www.naafa.org/documents/brochures/nextdiet.html

Which is titled "Before you start your next diet" which we all know is a bad word around here. We're supposed to think "lifestyle change."
And then I have issues with some of the things they say on this page:

"Many people say they just feel better at a lower weight. This attitude is primarily a result of internalized oppression against fatness. A healthy dose of self-esteem, an active social life, and a moderate exercise program will make a person of size feel better."

This is encouraging people with aching joints and back pains, or indigestion, that they don't really feel better. That's undermining their decision making, I think.

"DO YOU ENJOY HIGH RISK ACTIVITIES?
You have about as much chance of winning the lottery as you do of permanently losing weight by dieting. Over a five-year period, only 2-5% of dieters succeed in keeping their weight off. and over one-third of all diets result in long-term weight gain. Would you accept a treatment for any other medical condition that had those "success" rates? If you've dieted frequently in the past, what makes you think this time will be any different? You may be wasting time, money, and energy, and risking your health if you go on another diet. Are the odds worth it?

WILL THIS BE YOUR FIRST DIET?
If you're planning to go on your first diet, make sure that you also plan to make it your last. Many of the 2-5% of successful dieters are those who have never dieted before. If you have a particular medical incentive for dieting, this may be just what you personally need to beat the odds. But if you've never dieted before, also be forewarned of some of the possible side effects: tiredness, irritability, mood swings, obsessing about food, and inability to concentrate."

Well, I guess all this is true about dieting. Except when I lost weight with exercise, which was a plus, and I'm doing better with LC, which makes me feel even better.

And here's the section titled: "Admirers"

http://www.naafa.org/documents/poli...t_admirers.html

Once again, there IS a line between being a big girl (I expressed my delight in seeing a beautiful girl on a lingerie commercial who was probably size 16-18) and people whose overweight threatens their health.
The gorgeous big girl needs NAAFA to help make the world recognize her as a person.
The people who must sleep sitting up, who have serious health problems, don't need NAAFA telling them "diets don't work." I was saying NAAFA owes its members full support, which is not only pointing out the ways that DON'T work (it's great they have a consumer protection section) but also actively looking at ways that DO work.

I'm a person who struggled with overweight issues, though maybe not enough for NAAFA. I'm a person whose mother had health issues because of her weight. I'm a person with friends of all shapes.

If they really are an anti-discriminatory organization, anyone on this board should be welcome there.

Adkpam
Where's the lie? It's been proven "diets don't work"!!! The fact that lc and Atkins works as you and I believe is beside the point!!! As far as NAAFA is concerned it's just another diet. As I've said before and before...all obese people are not unhealthy!!! Too, all obese people don't have aching joints and back pains, or indigestion.

Why are you picking on the negative?



As many have found on this board, eating healthily and regular exercise don't necessarily or automatically make you lose weight. We have many members doing so that have been on 3..6..9..12 month stalls. But it does make you feel better and NAAFA does promote that.

Zulieka.. I think you have had a couple incredible posts on this thread...finally making me understand a bit more about why there IS a NAFAA.. I lurked on the message boards there for months and I really felt out of place and like in no way apart of it..yet I was near 300 pounds...obviously its not for everyone and nobody NEEDS to understand the purpose, maybe, except those who DO need it...in general I think the lobby ing they do is in general good and important.

sorry I have a kid on my lap...cant type well

Great post adkpam

Thank you for understanding!!!

Not exactly true, Zuleikaa...those that wish to discuss and promote a high carb way of eating or argue that low carbing is unhealthy are welcome here but clearly asked to restrict their posts on such discussions to the War Zone.
NAAFA is so threatened by the idea that there MIGHT be something that would enable an obese person to successfully lose weight, they ban any and all discussion of it.




That may be true: ALL obese people may not be unhealthy for a time. Can you find me one obese person who has lived past the age of 70 being obese nearly their entire lives and does not have at least one serious health issue? For that matter, what is the average age of a NAAFA member?
Since NAAFA likes to focus on the percentages of diets that fail, it seems a gross disservice to their members to not also discuss the odds of becoming seriously ill due to obesity instead of claiming that it won't happen (obesity doesn't cause disease) and if it does, just move more and eat healthier (I have yet to see them define what constitutes "healthier") and you'll feel better. I work with several people that are 200+ pounds overweight. The amount of excercise that they are capable of is very limited at best; 3 of them cannot walk slowly from their desks to the lunch room (perhaps 100 feet) without becoming out of breath. I'm 50 pounds overweight at least still and not exactly in the greatest shape; I can make it to the lunchroom and back 3 times in the amount of time it takes them to get there once. I seriously fear for their safety and ability to get to safety quickly should there ever be a fire or tornado.
This link goes into the co-morbidities of obesity: http://www.spotlighthealth.com/morb...d_problems.html
For me, those are a lot scarier statistics than the number of people who fail at traditional diets or even fad diets and I feel that it's inexcusable for NAAFA to actively encourage its members to stay in such as state as to give a high probability of their developing one or more of these conditions at a relatively young age under the guise of "it's all society's fault for not loving you as you are". Yes, they should be accepted as human beings and treated with respect and dignity regardless of their physical size, but that is not a reason to encourage them to stay on a path that will likely ruin their health in the name of "acceptance".
I agree with the assesment that they are obesity enablers and worse.

Great posts Red1cutie, Odyssey & Zuleika!

As someone who avoided doctors for Years because so many had insisted that I should diet because THEIR way was the Best, I can understand why NAAFA does NOT want to get involved in the whole diet zoo.

At 350# I had NORMAL blood sugar, NORMAL cholesterol, and NORMAL everything else. You don't have to be sick just because you are overweight.

Even if, however, I had had EVERYTHING wrong with me, its still no reason to think that ANYONE has the right to try to convince me that I need to change my ways. THAT IS A PERSONAL DECISION. It is not license for OTHERS, no matter how Well-meaning, to evangelize about what I need to do to "improve" myself.

NAAFA is there to NOT JUDGE people because of their weight or appearance -- its a safe place to go to when you are overweight and are darned tired of being preached to about what is wrong with you. Its a way find that you are not a freak, and are not alone.

When people are READY to look for a path like Low Carb, they will seek it out -- they dont need it thrown at them.

After all, they ARE on the web -- its not like they are incapable of finding low carb sites if they want them.

Neither does anyone have the right to tell you that if you don't stay as you are that you are being a traitor to yourself and the organization you belong to by "giving in" to societal demands for thinness unless or until you become ill from being obese.
Neither does anyone have a right to make you feel bad for wishing to lose weight and improve your health and actively discourage you from even trying.
Neither do they have the right to harass and badger members who do decide to make an attempt at weight loss despite NAAFA's stance against it.

They're not giving them a choice, they're telling their members they have only one choice and that is to remain obese/become more obese and that doing anything else is destined for failure at best or traitorous at worst.

You are right...now, how about alcoholics and smokers? Do they have the same "rights"? What about drug users? Same rights? To me, the costs to society as a whole, are the same for all these groups...including the morbidly obese. Doctors and our "culture" say these behaviors are unacceptable, their blood work can be "normal" and they can otherwise be healthy - for a time. These people are told to "improve" themselves for their health and given programs to help. (Or jail time!) Should these people be encouraged to continue their lifestyles because they are being made fun of, shunned and being forced out of the workplace? Should they be told to ignore this blatant discrimination? I think not.

Zuleikaa, I just wanted to say I am glad you got good things from NAAFA, that was why I emphasized the good points I thought they were making. So much of what they lobby for is both needed and morally correct.
Perhaps the problem lies in a central paradox.
It's a strange analogy they make: it's true that African-Americans shouldn't torture their hair or their bodies to look like something they are not. Likewise, people in general should not torture their bodies to look like someone they are not.
If NAAFA can keep children from being teased on the playground, or keep an aerobics instructor her job, I think that is great, and I support that.
But African-Americans, to continue the example, cannot find themselves removed from the NAACP or other anti-discriminatory group because they find they are no longer African-American.
Yet someone who does lose weight will not be welcome at NAAFA. That is what I find a little odd.
In every other field of human endeavor, any anti-discriminatory group celebrates those who manage to triumph over the adversity. They are held up as an example of what CAN be done. They are still members of the group, AND role models.
Since NAAFA's mission is to promote acceptance of people of large size, it is perhaps inevitable that someone can shrink out of their member pool.
Yet I think that is regrettable: doesn't anyone who has lost a considerable amount of weight still remember what it was like to be disrespected? Can't they march in the solidarity parades, attend the functions, keep their friends?
Doesn't the moral issue still apply?
Or have they lost their credibility since they are now Former Fat People? No LONGER discriminated against? And they now will make the NAAFA members feel badly about themselves?
When the whole point of the organization is that people can be happy whatever size they are?
The point about the women's movement was equal rights for women. There was some friction during the past decades when there was disrespect for women who CHOOSE to stay home with the kids.
The point of the women's movement was choice, and it has matured so they can accept both women who choose to stay home, and women who choose to work, and their ability to move between those worlds.
Maybe NAAFA can do that too. But that does not seem their present goal.

Well, time for me to leave this conversation.
i am now being blamed for costs to society.
Sorry I am such a burden for you.

Thank God for a place like NAAFA where
i am not treated like i am subhuman because
i have been overweight since birth.

Be well all.

I re-read all the posts and I didn't see one that was about you, odyssey. They were all referring to the stand NAAFA has taken on members losing weight. Why do you think you were being singled out?