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Old Sat, Mar-03-07, 14:38
dina1957 dina1957 is offline
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Posts: 1,854
 
Plan: My own
Stats: 194/000/150 Female 5'5"
BF:Not sure
Progress: 441%
Location: Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mutant

You have a really negative view of what a 'mechanism' is; it's not clear to me that 'mechanism' means that you dont consider the inter-relationship of parts. I imagine most mechanical engineers would disagree.

I have to clarify: when we troubleshoot mechanical system or equipment, we need to isolate one part (or mechanism) at a time to find broken part of failed mechanism, this I beleive all mechanical engineers will agree. I am talking about system that failed to perform. Once the problem is located and broken part or failed mechanism is replaced or fixed, all the parts are put back together to function as integrated system. Unfortuntely, it is not exactly that simple with human body, and problem with western medicine - try to apply principles of mechanical engineering to human body that is not a biomechanical machine but biological system, and is not controlled by a one or two feedback loops, but by hundreds, and all organs interconnected. It can't be broken down into simple parts (although drs use this approach too), and fixing one part mechnically (by-pass surgery) may create hundreds of negative "echos" throught the entire body. same problem is seen in drugs: by treating symptoms of one desease, they create few other.
JMO
Quote:
I think it is pretty clear that the connection between cholesterol and heart disease is poor. I can back up my assertions, can you? (FYI, I won't be moved by a statement of 'doctors say...')

... but the opposite is not clear either.

Quote:
But it is not clear that high LDL is really a problem. Data suggests that LDL with low triglycerides is not a problem. It is NOT LDL that is a problem. Or do you have data to suggest otherwise? (And to be clear, we aren't looking for a mere correlation, as suggested in the data, high LDL with concurrent low triglyceride is not a problem.)

nothing is clear and linear when it comes to CHO and heart desease. it is multifactoral and age does makes difference. What is great for 18 yo, may be detremental for 60 yo.
Quote:
From my side of the fence, it looks like you have a narrow focus on LDL.

I don't focus on anything, I see CAD is a combination of factors, not just LDL as a single cause per se, but given other facrtor that we all agree do play role +high LDL indeed can trigger cardiac event. So I think it is prudent to keep LDL at certain level, but this is JMO. From my side of the fence, it looks like you are fixated on low TRG, which (unless they are really high) have no place in the equation, and choose to ignore LDL all together.
Thanks for the kind words anyway, I got carried away, should not have gotten into this discussion to begin with.
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