I have been reading this thread with great interest as I live in an area where there is a lot of daylight hours in the summer and only 4-6 hours in the winter. Trying to sleep for 20 hours during the shortest days of the winter months would be impossible here. However, I do find that my energy levels and sleepiness correspond directly with the amount of daylight hours available. During the summer I bounce out of bed at 5 am bright eyed and bushy tailed and now (today) I could barely drag my rear end out of bed at 6:30. Don't know how I'll get through this winter.

One great way (for me) to get back in the rhythm of things is to get away to a different environment a little closer to nature... even a bed-and-breakfast in the country, and even better, camping at a nice mild spot some nice time of the year. Actually being out in the environment where your activities are influenced by being outside helps you sleep like a baby, I find.

Up north, the same goes for skiing!

Nothing I've done at home (melatonin, changing bedtimes etc.) has had as much definite impact on my adjusting to day-night cycles as simply going camping for a single overnight trip... it's been kind of amazing.

I hear you and I feel you!!! I have severe SAD and have spent a lot of time trying to discover a solution. Well, this year I think I've found it!!! It's supplementing with vitamin D!! I'm off antidepressants and popping vitamin D pills like 5 times a day!! It's made a great change in me!!

That's interesting. Can I ask how you usually respond to sunlight - are you an 'I love sunlight' person or an 'I love shade and night' person? Do you tan, are you pale, are you from one of those cold dark parts of Europe as far as ancestry or not?

Thanks. (Also, what kind/variety of vitamin D do you take, if I may ask?)

:D

Be careful. Vitamin D is a fat soluble vitamin and it is possible to overdose.

I've checked original research and it's actually very hard to overdose with natural vitamin D. All vitamin D toxicity cases have been with man made vitamin D. Vitamin D has been proven nontoxic at doses of 50k/day for 6 months and at 25k/day for 4 years.

cbcd
I'm definitely a sun person!!! I'm not a night owl at all!!! I can sit in the sun forever just soaking it up!!! I'm a light skinned African American and I tan beautifully. Funnily enough, the research shows that peoples of African descent and Northern Europeans both have natural vitamin D deficiencies.

It's kinda weird. I'm now going to work in the dark and after upping my vitamin D dose for a few days I actually started enjoying the dark before dawn, lol!!! That is so NOT me!!!

I take vitamin D from fish oils as softgels. Each contains 400 IU of vitamin D and 600 IU vitamin A. Vitamin A has also been found not toxic when taken with vitamin D. I take 6,000 mg per day in five divided doses. I posted a lot of this information in my journal. You can also take cod liver oil.

For those of African or Northern European descent or those with SAD or depression you go a little higher than the suggested dose. The suggested dose of each is as follows:

1 tsp. cod liver oil per 50 pounds of body weight.
800-1000 IUs of vitamin D per 50 pounds of body weight.

It's generally suggested that people should be getting a minimum of 3,000 IU of vitamin D a day from all sources (food, sun, supplements).

There is also a test you can have your doctor order to see if you are vitamin D deficient. That info is in my journal also.

I am totally off anti depression medication and am only taking vitamin D for my SAD and winter depression (I do take a lot of other supplements).

Wow, that's interesting.

>Funnily enough, the research shows that peoples of African descent and Northern Europeans both have natural vitamin D deficiencies.<

Hmm. I wonder if they need the same amounts or if the amounts differ?

I can imagine Northern Europeans simply not getting much at all (but maybe not requiring tons).

And I'd at least guess that there could be two mechanisms at work in people of African descent - maybe because so much of Africa is SO sunny there's some rate-limiting of vitamin D absorption from the sun? Either that or over time because there was so much sun the body adapted to run optimally on more vitamin D than those in other climes... such that just getting a normal 'somewhere in the U.S.' dose of vitamin D from the sun isn't really enough.

Or, neither!

Will go experiment with some natural vitamin D this week. (I'm a very pale-don't-like-the-sun Northern/Western-European-descent person who feels best when it's overcast, storming, or night. So it may be interesting to see what a little extra natural D does for me, or to me.) :) :cool:

Thanks for the tip Zuleikaa. I take a very low dosage of D (via cod liver oil) daily. Perhaps I will up it a bit now that the days are much shorter and getting shorter by the minute. I read an article somewhere about native dark-skinned africans not being able to absorb the vitamin D from sunlight as well as lighter skinned peoples, but for the life of me can't remember where.

A quick check with the "indigenous" side of my family has come up with the opinion that rickets (softening of the leg bones in infants) caused by vitamin D deficiency was unknown amongst traditional Australian aborigines despite a traditional absence of dairy etc in their diet and an often perilously precarious food supply!.

Michael Gardner
Australia

Very nice work at this post about vitamin D: http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=210491

To get us back on track a bit, have you noticed that people on these forums complain either of being tired or snacking at night and no one ever suggests to these folks that they GET MORE SLEEP? All the suggestions revolve around willpower or magic remedies.

The connection is NEVER made between being tired and needing sleep, at least on these forums. Why is that?

After all, who would think to get more sleep if you're tired, huh? It must be a diet or supplement problem :lol:

We've turned around our natural rhythms and then wonder why we get sick or don't function well.

I really enjoyed the Vitamin D link. Thanks for posting it Caveman.

I can't resist adding to this discussion by mentioning an article about skin color I read in some science magazine (can't remember which one). Article stated that dark skin is protective of folic acid stores for people living in low latitudes. Folks indigenous to higher latitudes have lighter skin to allow for better Vitamin D production, but sacrifice in the folic acid area.

I haven't heard before that sun exposure is bad for our folic acid levels. Does anyone know more about this?

My winter sleeping plan is going well so far. Yesterday was autumnal equinox for those of us in northern hemisphere. You guys in the SH can soon start your stay up late time, but here in the NH it's hibernation time. I have been going to bed around 9:30 most nights since about September 9. I have given up pushing myself to get up in time to take a morning walk (started walking in the afternoon - better for Vitamin D production). It's sure paying off - I fall asleep quickly, sleep pretty well, and am in bed for at least 9 hours. I hope to continue this trend as the season of darkness progresses and sleep even more.

It is amazing that people don't link tiredness with the need to sleep. It's like the ideal is to "get by" on 5 or 6 hours of sleep. We cave folk'll show 'em. I just love getting plenty of sleep.

Sweet dreams, everyone

I know I am missing something very important here. Where did you find the original message about this book? Sorry to be so nosy.